Point is that none of us have any idea about the nature of Tenebrae's mysterious power either; so possibility remains that this mysterious power can bypass formal defensive abilities as well. After all, 11 most powerful Sith Lords in the Galaxy [barring him (Tenebrae)] had no answer to this kind of power and dropped like flies. No formal offensive Sith application is this much effective unless power disparity is too enormous; this kind of feat can be accomplished with most potent dark side talents only (techniques too great to defend against formally).

 

In addition, very little is known about Tenebrae's capabilities in general. Their is lot of room for "creative liberties" for Tenebrae as per his story. Therefore, keep an open mind.

Sidious acquired the "necessary condition" to make it possible for him to unleash such kind of power without serious consequences. By the term "necessary condition," I am implying immortality coupled with gigantic supply of reserves to fuel personal power. It wasn't safe and/or possible for Sidious to unleash this power in his former mortal condition.

Don't expect too much more from him. I expect his story is pretty much over. Makeb seemed to imply that the Emperor is gone and isn't coming back.

Seriously?

Their is still 45 levels more to go for existing storylines. Also, Makeb represents in-game POV of "supposed" demise of Sith Emperor:

Besides, their is over a 1000 years span of story of Tenebrae to be told in detail yet. His story leaves immense room for "creative liberties" as I pointed out earlier.

Have we not already gone over this? Immortality does not increase your capabilities in the Force in any shape or form. He was only able to use Force storm because he was younger and Vitiate only grew more powerful because he consumed the life force of 8,000 Sith Lords. See here for details - #300.

I have read that post and I will respond soon. Immortality itself is not the argument but the "whole condition."

Tenebrae was immortal and siphoning energies from countless life forms to fuel his power; he gained immortality in such a manner that it vastly increased his capacity as a practitioner of the Force (this doesn't means that this would be the case with everybody since sole immortality can be accomplished through different methods). With such kind of power, possibilities are endless for a Force-user and also risk-free to a great degree. Mortal beings do not have such liberties.

Seriously?

 

Their is still 45 levels more to go for existing storylines. Also, Makeb represents in-game POV of "supposed" demise of Sith Emperor:

 

 

His essence is not yet destroyed and his Children continue to feel his connection.

 

 

Besides, their is over a 1000 years span of story of Tenebrae to be told in detail yet. His story leaves immense room for "creative liberties" as I pointed out earlier.

Nor can I really see any writers picking him his story pre-SWTOR. I just don't see any potential there.

And expecting another 45 levels to be added is a little optimistic. We shall see.

EDIT: That said I am expecting some closure to his story. But closure being the key word here, I think the main act of his tale ended when the JK struck him down (which I believe was the Emperor) he might make a brief reapperance, but only to be done away with forever.

I have read that post and I will respond soon. Immortality itself is not the argument but the "whole condition."

 

Tenebrae was immortal and siphoning energies from countless life forms to fuel his power; he gained immortality in such a manner that it vastly increased his capacity as a practitioner of the Force (this doesn't means that this would be the case with everybody since sole immortality can be accomplished through different methods). With such kind of power, possibilities are endless for a Force-user and also risk-free to a great degree. Mortal beings do not have such liberties.

I am approaching this from an out-of-universe point of view however. And it seemed to me that they wanted to get the Emperor out of the way to push forward their new stories which will likely revolve around the Dark Council and Darth Marr as the new face of the Empire.

 

Nor can I really see any writers picking him his story pre-SWTOR. I just don't see any potential there.

And expecting another 45 levels to be added is a little optimistic. We shall see.

Tenebrae has lasted more then 1300 years in the mythos; it would be bad-decision to put him out of commission so soon during the existing storylines. Canonical sources (including the Encyclopedia) offer hints for his survival.

Tenebrae seems to have suffered a temporary set-back just like Sidious did when he was presumably killed on the Death Star. It took Sidious more then 1 year (with aid of several other Sith spirits) to find a suitable host to possess and then additional time to fully recover. So Tenebrae may not come back so soon during existing storylines. I mean, 45 remaining levels leave room for huge amount of content to be added. And no, this is not optimistic since Bioware's project has not been axed as per my understanding; company have invested millions in this project and it is unlikely to be ended soon. If I am missing something about future of SWTOR project the enlighten me.

New Sith emerged after 2000 BBY and eventually formed Brotherhood of Darkness which was then destroyed in 1000 BBY.

EDIT: That said I am expecting some closure to his story. But closure being the key word here, I think the main act of his tale ended when the JK struck him down (which I believe was the Emperor) he might make a brief reapperance, but only to be done away with forever.But it wasn't him becoming immortal that did that, simply him consuming the life-essence of 8,000 Sith Lords. Basically the word 'immortal' is just a meaningless word.

Therefore, I prefer the word "condition."

Tenebrae has lasted more then 1300 years in the mythos; it would be bad-decision to put him out of commission so soon during the existing storylines. Canonical sources (including the Encyclopedia) offer hints for his survival.

 

Tenebrae seems to have suffered a temporary set-back just like Sidious did when he was presumably killed on the Death Star. It took Sidious more then 1 year (with aid of several other Sith spirits) to find a suitable host to possess and then additional time to fully recover. So Tenebrae may not come back so soon during existing storylines. I mean, 45 remaining levels leave room for huge amount of content to be added. And no, this is not optimistic since Bioware's project has not been axed as per my understanding; company have invested millions in this project and it is unlikely to be ended soon. If I am missing something about future of SWTOR project the enlighten me.

 

 

The war with predecessors of ancient Sith lasted till 2000 BBY, as per canon.

 

 

New Sith emerged after 2000 BBY and eventually formed Brotherhood of Darkness which was then destroyed in 1000 BBY.

And 2000 BBY is when the Sith reemerge under Darth Ruin. As per current canon the Jedi and the Republic have experienced a long period of peace. I'd say that this war ends 3,500 BBY at the latest. Because it is at that point that an extension is made to the Jedi Temple - which is currently in ruin and far from top priority. I can't imagine this war going on for over 1,000 years...

And when was it stated that SWTOR would reach Lvl 100? I'm not sure even WoW has reached that level. Is this just your assumption based on the nature of MMOs?

But as a plot device, I feel he's pretty much done. He's built up his Empire, filled the holes in KOTOR I and KOTOR II, pushed SWTOR in to action, attempted his master plan, and acted as a final boss for the Jedi Knight. All I see left for him to do is become 'everyone's enemy' and be destroyed for a final time. Then its over for him, in my opinion.

 

And 2000 BBY is when the Sith reemerge under Darth Ruin. As per current canon the Jedi and the Republic have experienced a long period of peace. I'd say that this war ends 3,500 BBY at the latest. Because it is at that point that an extension is made to the Jedi Temple - which is currently in ruin and far from top priority. I can't imagine this war going on for over 1,000 years...

 

And when was it stated that SWTOR would reach Lvl 100? I'm not sure even WoW has reached that level. Is this just your assumption based on the nature of MMOs?

That and he doesn't really do anything(as far as I recall, I mean aside from what he already has done which is more personal things), the Dark Council is what runs the Empire and has been doing everything, Vitiate just seems like a shut in and away from everyone else, he built the Empire sure but he doesn't seem to run it. So him not being around, doesn't really make any difference other then power grabs....which were happening anyway.

But as a plot device, I feel he's pretty much done. He's built up his Empire, filled the holes in KOTOR I and KOTOR II, pushed SWTOR in to action, attempted his master plan, and acted as a final boss for the Jedi Knight. All I see left for him to do is become 'everyone's enemy' and be destroyed for a final time. Then its over for him, in my opinion.

I also think that Tenebrae is likely to go down due to sum of multitude of reasons; "everyone's enemy" as you put, is a possibility since he is a threat to the entire Galaxy now. The Force is no longer with him. It shall be kept in mind that many individuals in the Sith Empire are still loyal to Tenebrae, as per current scenario, since Darth Malgus was not accepted by them as Sith Emperor.

And 2000 BBY is when the Sith reemerge under Darth Ruin. As per current canon the Jedi and the Republic have experienced a long period of peace. I'd say that this war ends 3,500 BBY at the latest. Because it is at that point that an extension is made to the Jedi Temple - which is currently in ruin and far from top priority. I can't imagine this war going on for over 1,000 years...

Well, Star Wars canon is continuously improved and updated with passage of time. Their is enormous room for content creation between era depicted in this (SWTOR) game and rise of Darth Ruin so who knows.

Let us count the number of affiliated conflicts:-

- Force Wars (100 years)

- Great Hyperspace War ---------------------> reconstitution of ancient Sith Empire under leadership of Tenebrae

- Great Sith War (Marka Ragnos involved)

- Mandalorian Wars (Tenebrae involved)

- Jedi Civil War (Tenebrae involved)

- Sith Triumvirate (aftermath of Jedi Civil War; Tenebrae indirectly responsible)

- Great Galactic War <-------------------------- reconstituted ancient Sith Empire returns under leadership of Tenebrae

???

RIse of Darth Ruin around 2000 BBY

And when was it stated that SWTOR would reach Lvl 100? I'm not sure even WoW has reached that level. Is this just your assumption based on the nature of MMOs?

This seems to be the case. I mean, why introduce content up to level 55, if level 50 represented the end of current storylines? The war continues....

That and he doesn't really do anything(as far as I recall, I mean aside from what he already has done which is more personal things), the Dark Council is what runs the Empire and has been doing everything, Vitiate just seems like a shut in and away from everyone else, he built the Empire sure but he doesn't seem to run it. So him not being around, doesn't really make any difference other then power grabs....which were happening anyway.

I am leaving you a hint;

The source contains lot more information but this hint might be sufficient. To learn more, I advice that you buy the book; I won't be revealing more.

Vitiate only grew more powerful because he consumed the life force of 8,000 Sith Lords

Not relevant to any ongoing discussion,just shoving something in between.

Imagine if Palpatine ate 8000 Sith Lords+ everything else living on Nathema,thats how powerful Vitiate is.And now imagine dealing with the Dark Side for ONE THOUSAND AND THREE HUNDRED YEARS.Experience matters.Sidious was what ?70-90 when he died (or when he *first* died,if we count post ep6,EU,derp)

There can't be an immensely huge difference between Vitiate and Sidious in episode 1(Plagueis is still alive).Remember .Vitiate could do *advanced* force techinques when he was a small kid,6-12 years old.Not only was Vitiate more talented in the force and has deeper affinity for the dark side,he is also more evil than Sidious.Vitiate is freak.

8000 Sith Lords is what?100 Palpatines?It can't be less than 20 Palpatines.Or 2 if i am super lenient.

Imagine if Palpatine ate 8000 Sith Lords+ everything else living on Nathema,thats how powerful Vitiate is.And now imagine dealing with the Dark Side for ONE THOUSAND AND THREE HUNDRED YEARS.

There can't be an immensely huge difference between Vitiate and Sidious in episode 1(Plagueis is still alive).Remember .Vitiate could do *advanced* force techinques when he was a small kid,6-12 years old.Not only was Vitiate more talented in the force and has deeper affinity for the dark side,he is also more evil than Sidious.Vitiate is freak.

 

8000 Sith Lords is what?100 Palpatines?It can't be less than 20 Palpatines.Or 2 if i am super lenient.

Imagine being the pinnacle of dark side power. That's Sidious.

Can't see it.

I think the Sith Emperor's rule is all but over. The Republic are claiming he is dead and the Dark Council under Darth Marr and moving on without him. I think BioWare are setting up this idea of a new era without the Emperor. He's not longer pulling the strings, he's lost all control.

Well, it is early to bring him back since he is in weakened and vulnerable state. Just like Sidious once was.

Current scenario paves way for the developers to focus upon Satele Shan, Darth Marr and other prominent characters for a while since Sith Emperor overshadowed them otherwise.

Imagine being the pinnacle of dark side power. That's Sidious.

Pinnacle of dark side power would be the incarnation that Tenebrae planned/prepared to accomplish. Nothing else comes close.

Can't see it.

Pinnacle of dark side power would be the incarnation that Tenebrae planned/prepared to accomplish. Nothing else comes close.

I must agree. Vitiate is much more powerful than Sidious. In the title it says "powerful". Not sneaky and tricking people, powerful. Vitiate obviously knew much more of Sith sorcery and powers than Sidious. Heck, he made himself immortal of disease. Sure, Sidious might have been smarter with his plan but let's face it; Vitiate was much more powerful than Sidious.

No, Sidious is more powerful.

...

On the other hand you might be right,because Vitiate is kinda beyond adjectives that can be used to describe normal Sith and Jedi.And Sidious is first and foremost a Sith Lord,even if arguably the most powerful one.

From a certain pov Vitiate is not part of the Sith Lords familiy or tradition.

No, Sidious is more powerful.

No, he's not. Vitiate took down an entire Jedi strike team and they didn't even touch him.

No, he's not. Vitiate took down an entire Jedi strike team and they didn't even touch him.

Sidious destroyed an entire fleet and a nigh-indestructable Super Star Destroyer.

No, he's not. Vitiate took down an entire Jedi strike team and they didn't even touch him.

Yes he is, and just how powerful was this Jedi strike team hm? It consisted of 1 Jedi Master and 4 Jedi Knights, ya really impressive. I am sure Sidious would be shaking in his boots..

Guys, we should move past "who did what kind" of arguments.

Sidious, Tenebrae and Nihilus all specialized in mass-destruction tactics on the basis of their talents.

It is obvious that a single dark side power such as Force Storm will make its wielder look godly in comparison to others but this isn't the BIG PICTURE or is it? By same token, Nihilus takes the cake then.

In the BIG PICTURE, both Tenebrae and Sidious are the greatest and most powerful Sith Lords yet introduced in the mythos.

Yes he is, and just how powerful was this Jedi strike team hm? It consisted of 1 Jedi Master and 4 Jedi Knights, ya really impressive.

Ranks do not mean much; they are among the strongest and most resolute Jedi of the Order.

Guys, we should move past "who did what kind" of arguments.

 

Sidious, Tenebrae and Nihilus all specialized in mass-destruction tactics on the basis of their talents.

 

It is obvious that dark side power such as Force Storm will make its wielder look godly in comparison to others but this isn't the BIG PICTURE or is it? By same token, Nihilus takes the cake then.

 

 

Ranks do not mean much; they are among the strongest and most resolute Jedi of the Order.

I wouldn't call him comparable to anything other than natural phenomena.

No, he's not. Vitiate took down an entire Jedi strike team and they didn't even touch him.

Tenebrae did even better; destroyed 11 Dark Council members simultaneously once. Combat prowess wise, he is arguably the most overwhelming Sith Lord yet introduced.

EDIT: For mass destruction, Tenebrae followed the route of Sith Sorcery. While not as direct and feasible as Force Storm offensive Sith application for the said purpose, this route can be far more destructive nonetheless. Tenebrae needs a certain amount of minions to unleash such a destructive Sith Sorcery but then he can mentally dominate many in to submission. Most importantly, Tenebrae cannot be destroyed by Force Storm application, if directly exposed to it; will loose his physical body only.

Nihilus long-since ceased to be a man. He was a force of nature.

 

I wouldn't call him comparable to anything other than natural phenomena.

I know but then Tenebrae also moved past Sith ambitions.

Tenebrae did even better; destroyed 11 Dark Council members simultaneously. Combat prowess wise, he is arguably the most overwhelming Sith Lord yet introduced.

Power takes many different forms, looking at the bigger picture tells us that Sidious could achieve similar results if it ever proved necessary.