Enough is enough! This is getting ridiculous.

 

Bioware has been buffing mobility since 3.0. Snipers have gotten roll, holotraverse, countermeasures speed, entrench speed. Mara predation was buffed from 25% to 50%. Pt's hydrolics got buffed. Lightning sorc's force speed CD was reduced, every heal now gives them increased speed, certain abilities give them increased speed..... holotraverse...

 

To fix this Bioware is now buffing the amount of slows and roots in the game. Pts got a 90% slow on shatterslug. Sorcs slow and root you to 90% every time they cast chain lighting. They even created tacticals that spread slow and give two charges to slows.

 

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

 

The game can't handle all this movement change. Every time a mara predations my FPS drops 10 frames, and everyone starts dsyncing. Every time a sorc chain lightnings he disappears. Every time an operative rolls he dsyncs.

 

You buffed movement too much. You can not fix that by implementing more slows, like you have done. Instead just nerf the movement abilities or take them out of the game. As an operative I am either eternally rooted, eternally slowed, or rolling. As a PT if I am not moving with speed hacks on (hyrdolic overirdes), I am moving at 20% speed. I am either all over my target, or no where near my target. There is no in between anymore. THIS IS DUMB. ITS MAKING THE GAME UNPLAYABLE. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

Edited March 6, 2022 by septru

No argument from me, I’ve been saying this for years, but it seems they don’t know any other way to change up a meta besides adding more slows, roots and extreme mobility. Add in a few too many passives that negate all of those and the whole thing is completely whacky.

 

I’d like to see them take most of that back to 1,2 version of slows and mobility. Plus only some classes should have specific abilities. Now it feels like every class is becoming generic with all the same types of abilities.

Depends in which movement abilities and roots. If you made a through list that would help.

totaly agree. btw, mara pred starts at 50% and is buffed to 70%. same goes for their camo movement speed.

It is one of the many reason I stay away from regular PvP. With 16 people running and spamming fireworks all over, my poor computer screams for merciful death. These days I get my PvP fix in lowbies and ranked. Honestly I mostly play FPs these days...

In a game designed and focused mostly around PVE there is no way to have proper balance....

 

This new season will be about chain stuns and dying during one hard stun. How many years till they fix or balance it ? 3 ?

 

As for the lags, yes, they are horrible... Ability animations on some maps make my computer blow up. The hamster cannot take it anymore. It gets worse and worse with every update.

 

FPS is abysmal sometimes especially in prime time when server is full of people. I mad dash after a player and i am teleported back to my initial position, in other words I glitch out... I see people show up on platforms and leap to them only to find out that in fact they were below the platform... and the list goes on.

 

I am forced to que ranked for arenas because that one at least is playable.

Holotraverse seems so insane to me, it's like Snipers have no weaknesses now compared to pre-kotfe. xD

 

Kinda makes me want to dust it off.

Depends in which movement abilities and roots. If you made a through list that would help.

 

Sure... although I don't think I'll get all of them.

 

(these are all the ones I think are excessive and could be toned down, their CDs could be increased, or their movement ehancing effects could be decreased)

 

Movement Enhancers

Predation (% decreased)

Force Speed (CD increase)

Hydrolics (% decreased)

Hololocate (get rid of it entirely)

 

Movement Reducers

Shatterslug slow (% decrease a lot)

Chain Lightning root and slow (% decrease)

Pyro slow (% decrease) (tbh I don't know what the slow is. It might be shatterslug. But if I'm not wrong there is a slow on their dots that decreased ur speed by 60%).

Flame sweep (% decrease)

Edited November 27, 2019 by septru

Signed.

 

Like, a general nerf on slows, roots and mobility should both improve desync issues, and make the few slows and roots that survive the nerf a lot more impactful. That's what's needed instead of this weird arms race of kiting tools and chasing tools we have right now.

Thundering blast slow (% decrease)

Pyro slow (% decrease) (tbh I don't know what the slow is. It might be shatterslug. But if I'm not wrong there is a slow on their dots that decreased ur speed by 60%).

 

I am fairly certain you mean telekinetic wave and chain lightning. lightning bolt also has a slow but I believe TB doesnt actually have any slow. simply an autocrit effect and dual hit. which then procs instant chain lightning.

 

and the slow on pyro pt is their flamethrower or whatever its called now. they get up to 2 stacks on it and it slows everyone hit by it.

Say what you mean ,resolve absolute sht in this game.fckers get globaled way easier every year.:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

1. Remove the vast majority of DCD's

 

2. Remove the vast majority of generic stun / charge / CC / etc abilities and keep each class specialized.

 

3. Remove passive CC immunities.

 

A lot of the major mechanics that make fights interesting are trivialized in this game.

 

Ranged classes should never be face tanking. Melee Dps should not be healing themselves.

Only certain classes should be able to stun to resolve.

Etc

Edited November 27, 2019 by RookStryfe

Only certain classes should be able to stun to resolve.

 

I’m curious, which classes?

 

And removing DCDs are just going to lead to people stacking crit, power, mastery like before.

I am fairly certain you mean telekinetic wave and chain lightning. lightning bolt also has a slow but I believe TB doesnt actually have any slow. simply an autocrit effect and dual hit. which then procs instant chain lightning.

 

and the slow on pyro pt is their flamethrower or whatever its called now. they get up to 2 stacks on it and it slows everyone hit by it.

 

You're right about both. My b.

 

Although it just occurred to me that powertechs can also spec into a slow on flame sweep. While the slow itself is weak (25%) (and I generally do not support nerfing utility slows/roots because a player is actively giving something else in order to spec into the slow/root), I'm going to add flame sweep slow to the list. Since flame sweep is basically spammed in pyro and the whole dps rotation of PT tanks, you're basically always going to have flame sweep slow on you. In all hindsight, the slow wouldn't be bad if PT's didn't get a whole list of other slows, but it would be nice to see one go.

I’m curious, which classes?

 

And removing DCDs are just going to lead to people stacking crit, power, mastery like before.

 

No. Don't be curious. Don't dignify his post with a response. It's **** like this that makes people laugh at the forums. Radical, out of the world ideas, that are not practical, cannot be implemented, have no merit, and are just plain wrong. The poster is either a troll or just dumb.

I’m curious, which classes?

 

And removing DCDs are just going to lead to people stacking crit, power, mastery like before.

 

Deception Assassins are an obvious candidate. Concealment Ops as well.

 

Chain stunning or taking players out of a fight via CC should be the specialty of certain classes and not a generic tool for every class.

 

Having classes like a heal sorc being able to CC like a champ with electrocute and whirlwind is just ridiculous.

 

 

The DCD's need to go. They turn so many of the tactics and combat elements that make combat fun into an utter joke and draw out every fight far longer than is necessary.

 

When you get attacked by melee while playing a ranged class like Merc as an example, high on the list of priorities should be creating some distance between you and the melee.

 

Instead, you can just

Pop Responsive Safeguards

LOL at the melee

Pop your choice of Kolto Overload, Energy Shield, Adrenals, Determination, Heal Pots, Self heal, Jet Boost

LOL some more at the melee

Pop whichever of those you haven't used

LOL some more

CC him with an Electro Dart + Concussion Missile

LOL some more

then finally

you have to actually consider kiting this melee that jumped your ranged merc 20 or 30 seconds ago

 

Or not. Because by the time all those defensives are on CD, the battlefield will likely have completely changed and you've probably been reinforced by teammates from the other end of the map who will kill off that nasty melee for you.

 

Many of these DCD's are just a joke and should be removed.

 

 

 

And yea Septru if you're an Op who finds himself being eternally rooted and slowed I can see how these changes might seem a bit too complicated.

Stuff like this is always is an attempt to manipulate the game to ones on benefit. If a few ***** enough....well they get what they want to make themselves better! It makes me laugh....

snip

 

Dumb. Just dumb.

Edited November 28, 2019 by septru

When you get attacked by melee while playing a ranged class like Merc as an example, high on the list of priorities should be creating some distance between you and the melee.

 

Instead, you can just

Pop Responsive Safeguards

LOL at the melee

Pop your choice of Kolto Overload, Energy Shield, Adrenals, Determination, Heal Pots, Self heal, Jet Boost

LOL some more at the melee

Pop whichever of those you haven't used

LOL some more

CC him with an Electro Dart + Concussion Missile

LOL some more

then finally

you have to actually consider kiting this melee that jumped your ranged merc 20 or 30 seconds ago

 

The only ranged class that still has to kite is sorcerer/sage. That is why every class with a charge/leap will gang leap to sorc first... years later.

 

The other two ranged classes can sit there for a while without moving and can also dish out damage while under focus, like a melee class is designed to do.

 

Sorc is really the only ranged class still true to its original vision. Kite and stay ranged, keep enemy between a certain distance between 10m and 30m and just keep at it. If under pressure damage suffers and you need to get moving.

 

Merc and sniper lost this vision ages ago. They're some kind of a hybrid now with ranged damage and melee class cooldowns.

 

And sniper I almost understand, almost.

 

Merc is just a result of years of bads crying about not knowing how to play their class. And now we're here.

Its a lagofest and dsync-cancer. I don't want ever play this cancer game. I'm talking about dcd's, mobility buff since 3.0, u broke everything in this game, PvP became lagodrome. Everyone flying on the map and dsync in 10-15 FPS with AOE spazm.

I subbed for 2 month, but my patince ended after 2 weekends PvP. Go to hell.

 

P.S. Special thanks for trash gear from PvP and Korean FP 24/7 grind.

Edited November 29, 2019 by helpmewin

Its a lagofest and dsync-cancer. I don't want ever play this cancer game. I'm talking about dcd's, mobility buff since 3.0, u broke everything in this game, PvP became lagodrome. Everyone flying on the map and dsync in 10-15 FPS with AOE spazm.

 

I agree with this. The amount of movement boosts that have been added to the game has made PVP worse.

 

Adding to the mess is how many roots, slows, DCDs have compounded over the years as these kind of abilities just keep adding up in the game.

 

My least favorite thing they added was then due to the laughably large amount of slows and other CC-type abilties; IMMUNITIES to CC and enemy slows/stuns.

 

Naturally, all this did was grant the classes given the best movement boosts and most immunities dominance in the WZs.

 

The added bad side of them adding ridiculous movement abilities on top of more ridiculous movement abilities is that all the WZ maps have been compromised.

 

It's like having a jungle gym built for a child. As the child grows up getting stronger and faster, eventually that tiny jungle gym that used to be so daunting and challenging will become a joke.

 

Present day SWTOR classes are on steroids now compared to how they were when the game was first launched. The WZs have not been changed to accommodate for such drastic differences in class performance, however.

 

This is really noticeable in HuttBallz. Used to be it took work to score, now with so many leaps, teleports, rolls, etc. most classes can individually score in a matter of seconds. The map isn't supposed to be this easy to traverse, for any class.

 

Present day SWTOR classes are on steroids now compared to how they were when the game was first launched. The WZs have not been changed to accommodate for such drastic differences in class performance, however.

 

This is really noticeable in HuttBallz. Used to be it took work to score, now with so many leaps, teleports, rolls, etc. most classes can individually score in a matter of seconds. The map isn't supposed to be this easy to traverse, for any class.

 

Thing is that most of the steroids are usually not given equally to everybody at the same time, and not everybody deserves them imo. I mean, dps PT has been trash when compared to others for the vast majority of 5.X and still is a bit like that now in 6.X

 

Buffing one class is good, but making sure it's balanced against all others is better. This wasn't the case with 5.X mercs/sniper/mara who dominated the whole expac. Now, and take this with a grain of salt as I just got back here and am not geared at all, it seems to be sins/oper who got an insane opener in order to make up for the absurd Dcds that some other class still have from 5.X. even tho most of this should have been removed.

 

But BW will never think that they have to remove something in order to repair what's broken sadly. Except PhaseWalk in 5.0 because that made sins "too op" at the time (yeah still salty about that)

 

I really wish for a PvP mode where there wouldn't be slows on every ability. Only slows in the game should be Force Slow and the thing that roots/slows from mara and snipers.. And maybe the aoe slow on juggs they need that. Then movement bonus wouldn't be as needed. Hydrolics only on mercs, roll for sniper, force speed for sorc. Oh and make every dash ability work for melee lmao. PT/Sin/Oper have it the worst imo because the ability is bugged most of the time (speaking only about gap closer here).

 

Maybe with only these changes we could begin to see an increase in smoother PvP, and a decrease in "did he just phase walk/die or am I just fully d-synced"

Thing is that most of the steroids are usually not given equally to everybody at the same time, and not everybody deserves them imo. I mean, dps PT has been trash when compared to others for the vast majority of 5.X and still is a bit like that now in 6.X

 

Buffing one class is good, but making sure it's balanced against all others is better. This wasn't the case with 5.X mercs/sniper/mara who dominated the whole expac. Now, and take this with a grain of salt as I just got back here and am not geared at all, it seems to be sins/oper who got an insane opener in order to make up for the absurd Dcds that some other class still have from 5.X. even tho most of this should have been removed.

 

But BW will never think that they have to remove something in order to repair what's broken sadly. Except PhaseWalk in 5.0 because that made sins "too op" at the time (yeah still salty about that)

 

I really wish for a PvP mode where there wouldn't be slows on every ability. Only slows in the game should be Force Slow and the thing that roots/slows from mara and snipers.. And maybe the aoe slow on juggs they need that. Then movement bonus wouldn't be as needed. Hydrolics only on mercs, roll for sniper, force speed for sorc. Oh and make every dash ability work for melee lmao. PT/Sin/Oper have it the worst imo because the ability is bugged most of the time (speaking only about gap closer here).

 

Maybe with only these changes we could begin to see an increase in smoother PvP, and a decrease in "did he just phase walk/die or am I just fully d-synced"

 

Yes, some classes get big advantages in PVP while others get very little, particularly when it comes to CC and/or immunities to CC. Classes without such immunities are garbage in PVP, while those who enjoy high mobility are wrecking balls.

 

Just look at Maras, the spec with most CC immunities (Fury) is viewed as the best for PVP, while the other specs are viewed as either garbage, or at best only good in certain situations. The main reason comes down to Fury being less susceptible to being kited, slowed, stunned into uselessness.

 

The thing that always irked me was how inferior some sub classes performed compared to others in PVP, and how long such scenarios exist.

 

I mean, it's funny thinking about it now, but Mercs were garbage for YEARS before they got smacked with the FOTM card by BW.

 

[That's partially why I think they let Mercs sit on top for the past 3 years, to try to make reparations for how poorly BW treated the Merc class for so many years.

 

Point is, some specs remain inferior for years before they get any improvements while others sit at the top for years.

 

Why? How hard is it to adjust statistics on class abiltiies?

 

How hard is it to determine that a class' practical application with healing or damage abilities in PVP doesn't match what it can do in PVE and thus abilities might need to be adjusted?

 

How hard is it, just for the sake of changing the meta occasionally would it be for BW to increase or decrease class ability performance?

 

That's what gets me, how LONG a class can sit at the top of the power pyramid before other classes get improvements in performance making them better, or even sometimes putting them at the top of the power pyramid.

 

BW could liven things up a bit in PVP just by altering class ability percentages, or making minor tweaks and additions to some abilities like adding a snare component, or dot component to something that once did not have a dot affect, etc.

 

For little effort, I think there are many ways BW could make PVP more interesting and fun without having to alter the entire gameplay of a class.

 

This reminds me when they asked us about 3-4 years ago if we would prefer small frequent updates versus large infrequent updates... unofficially asked by Eric Musco IIRC, and when responded to by players on the forums who overwhelmingly expressed wanting smaller MORE FREQUENT updates and NOT large infrequent game changing updates we got told...

 

Wait.

 

You know what we got told by Eric and Co.?

 

 

 

 

That's right, it was as if we never were asked this question, and their MO since that question was posed at us on the forums has been to only do the exact opposite of what people expressed wanting.

Point is, some specs remain inferior for years before they get any improvements while others sit at the top for years.

 

Why? How hard is it to adjust statistics on class abiltiies?

 

Probably because Bioware is simply unaware of which classes are at the top. The metrics that they look at tell them that all the classes are within an acceptable range of damage, so they call it a day on balance. They clearly have no conception of how dcds affect ranked pvp in particular.

 

For example, I'm sure it was easy for them to look at dps juggs and dps mercs and say: "meh, they do about the same amount of damage and they both have good dcds, next," without comprehending that juggs are much, much easier to tunnel and kill than mercs, etc.

 

I don't think they should make changes just to shift the meta. But fundamentally, I completely agree that they should be making frequent balance patches, like most other games do, which will naturally lead to shifts in the meta.

Edited November 29, 2019 by JediMasterAlex

I don't think they should make changes just to shift the meta. But fundamentally, I completely agree that they should be making frequent balance patches, like most other games do, which will naturally lead to shifts in the meta.

 

This. But I think that with the current crew they have, (which tbh I don't expect to be more than 20 peoples at best, and I don't even know how many are on CM stuff lmao) it seems that they don't have anybody to work on a balance patch on a regular basis.

 

And tbh even if we could have some insight from them about the current state of balance and why they want to change this or that (or not change things) would help greatly, both in terms of reassuring the playerbase and gathering feedback.

 

I really like FinalFantasy14's way of doing this, with regular dev updates about the upcoming changes in balance, and why they do these changes.

 

In a game with such disparities in class/spec effectiveness, having a dev team that can provide details and informations about why they're changing stuff (or not in that case) is mandatory imo.

Edited November 29, 2019 by supertimtaf