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Same gender relationships clarifications?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Same gender relationships clarifications?

Uluain's Avatar


Uluain
01.31.2012 , 06:56 PM | #501
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
So, while I'd personally LOVE them to address the imbalance of [flirt]s between genders, and the current lack of SGRAs, it's a mistake to say that this stuff "makes the game" - when, in fact, it only makes the game for some of us.
The point is that their exclusion breaks the game for some of us. Why should it, from a company that prides itself on its alleged commitment to diversity?

And a huge part of my MMORPG expectations are Roleplay - so yes, I can collaborate with other players to create my own story content. But SGC should not be DIY where other players are afforded other opportunities.

It is easy to say there is a commitment to inclusiveness. But what is actually sold shows otherwise - particularly so long as the company remains mute on this issue.

DarthEpitaph's Avatar


DarthEpitaph
01.31.2012 , 07:25 PM | #502
At some level, any content that is put in the game is only going to affect certain people. There will be people who never play one faction or the other; people who never PVP; people who don't go through the OGRAs. For me, it doesn't really matter if there is content which will affect a higher percentage of people. They included OGRAs, they should darn well be able to include SGRAs too.

I have plenty of conspiracy theories about why SGRAs aren't in the game (hint: It's not due to "the constraints of a fully-voiced MMO") but what I am really here to point out is this:

I got an email from "The Old Republic Community" today requesting my feedback/opinion on the game. I think this would be a good avenue for us here to voice our desire for at least some information on SGRA content.

I don't imagine this is some secret thing, so in case you didn't see it:
Quote:
Hi DarthEpitaph,
Now that you have been playing Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ for a while, we'd love to get your feedback and hear about your experience so far. Are you having fun? What are you enjoying in the game? What could we improve? Send us a quick note at: FeedbackSWTOR@SWTOR.com.

Uluain's Avatar


Uluain
01.31.2012 , 07:44 PM | #503
Thank you, Darth Epitath - that is indeed a useful contact address.

Bioware and EA can't sit the fence on this one. They publicize themselves as committed to nondiscrimination and diversity. They are proud of the recognition they receive in this regard as an employer. They know what is right. To exclude it, deliberately, from the products they sell is inconscionable.

I am waiting for Bioware to offer us a reasonable explanation, and to propose a reasonable, equitable solution to this situation. I am tired of still having to ride at the back of the bus in 2012.

Nozybidaj's Avatar


Nozybidaj
01.31.2012 , 08:05 PM | #504
Quote: Originally Posted by Uluain View Post
As an example of our commitment to equality, EA was recently very proud to receive the accolade of having a perfect rating based on lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender workplace policies and benefits according to a major study released by the Human Rights Campaign Foundation, the USA's largest lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender civil rights organization.
That's pretty hilarious considering the current situation we are in having same gender content excluded from the game and them making references to the fact that "gay and lesbian doesn't exist in Star Wars".

Maybe the folks here on the forums need to start spreading this issue to other sites and making organizations aware of the current situation in the game. It is easy to ignore the voices in a thread buried in a Lore forum but if other LGBT websites starting highlighting the current backtracking on the issue by BW and who knows maybe even running some stories about it BW will finally start taking the issue seriously.

wotzaname's Avatar


wotzaname
01.31.2012 , 08:18 PM | #505
Thanks Darth Epitath, I also have sent an email requesting an ETA on this patch. I am not too concerned about how they go about it, I trust they know what they are doing and will not let us down - after all, they have done an amazing job with mostly everything else.

Zandilar's Avatar


Zandilar
01.31.2012 , 08:32 PM | #506
Quote: Originally Posted by Uluain View Post
The point is that their exclusion breaks the game for some of us. Why should it, from a company that prides itself on its alleged commitment to diversity?
Hey, it breaks it for me too you know.

I'm not saying they shouldn't fix it, I just think some people on this thread have unrealistic expectations about what Bioware can do. We are not going to get full on branching storylines and really in depth characterization - because Bioware has neither the time nor the resources to devote to such a massive undertaking. Think about it, the more companions the more resources, increasing the number of branches for each companion increases the complexity, the amount of voice work, the size of the client or the amount that needs to be downloaded from the server, and their load times are already almost unacceptable. They have to draw a line somewhere, especially as this will be an ever growing game.

Quote:
And a huge part of my MMORPG expectations are Roleplay - so yes, I can collaborate with other players to create my own story content. But SGC should not be DIY where other players are afforded other opportunities.

It is easy to say there is a commitment to inclusiveness. But what is actually sold shows otherwise - particularly so long as the company remains mute on this issue.
I agree with your first paragraph completely.

I never said we should give them a pass on this issue. I just think we need to be realistic in our expectations.
Zandilar, an Australian, IN SPAAAAAAAACCCCEEEEE!!
Too many characters, most of them Chiss.

Nozybidaj's Avatar


Nozybidaj
01.31.2012 , 08:38 PM | #507
Quote: Originally Posted by Zandilar View Post
Hey, it breaks it for me too you know.

I'm not saying they shouldn't fix it, I just think some people on this thread have unrealistic expectations about what Bioware can do. We are not going to get full on branching storylines and really in depth characterization - because Bioware has neither the time nor the resources to devote to such a massive undertaking. Think about it, the more companions the more resources, increasing the number of branches for each companion increases the complexity, the amount of voice work, the size of the client or the amount that needs to be downloaded from the server, and their load times are already almost unacceptable.
Well the good news is there isn't really any need for any of that. All the content needed is already in the game today (aside from maybe the PC VO work). The only thing missing is the dialogue option showing up on the wheel for same gender characters.

Wonder if any of those datamining sites can see if the PC VO is already in the game? Even if it is not I would bet the farm it is already recorded.

MusedMoose's Avatar


MusedMoose
01.31.2012 , 08:52 PM | #508
Quote: Originally Posted by Nozybidaj View Post
That's pretty hilarious considering the current situation we are in having same gender content excluded from the game and them making references to the fact that "gay and lesbian doesn't exist in Star Wars".
[Citation needed] on that quote, please. I would like to see it, because I find it difficult to believe. Thanks.

Quote: Originally Posted by Nozybidaj View Post
Maybe the folks here on the forums need to start spreading this issue to other sites and making organizations aware of the current situation in the game. It is easy to ignore the voices in a thread buried in a Lore forum but if other LGBT websites starting highlighting the current backtracking on the issue by BW and who knows maybe even running some stories about it BW will finally start taking the issue seriously.
Could you explain what you mean by "backtracking"? I understand getting upset about the lack of news, but not getting any news or responses does not mean that BioWare has changed their stance on this issue or decided not to implement what they said they'd implement. We just had a post a few pages back requoting BW's previous comment on the issue, and I haven't seen anything running counter to that.

Please understand that I'm not trying to be confrontational here, I just would like to know when a BW employee referenced what you quoted above and why you think BW is "backtracking".

Nozybidaj's Avatar


Nozybidaj
01.31.2012 , 08:58 PM | #509
Quote: Originally Posted by MusedMoose View Post
Please understand that I'm not trying to be confrontational here,
Quite understood.

Quote:
I just would like to know when a BW employee referenced what you quoted above and why you think BW is "backtracking".
The quote is from way back I don't have any link to it. That response came out when they first said the same gender content was not going to be included in the game and there was a general uproar about it. The backtracking is the very fact that the content is not in the game. BW as a company seems quite proud of their previous inclusiveness and are not afraid to mention it when trying to hype themselves and now in what was meant to be their flagship game the content is no where to be found.

MusedMoose's Avatar


MusedMoose
01.31.2012 , 09:20 PM | #510
Quote: Originally Posted by Nozybidaj View Post
The backtracking is the very fact that the content is not in the game. BW as a company seems quite proud of their previous inclusiveness and are not afraid to mention it when trying to hype themselves and now in what was meant to be their flagship game the content is no where to be found.
A fair point, but I think part of the issue is that because this is an MMO, BW can and will continue to add things as the game goes along. Hell, that's even possible with single-player games these days, with DLC becoming more and more common. I don't think it's fair to say that BW is backtracking because of something that hasn't happened yet; if they had said SGRs wouldn't be in TOR at all, I would agree with you completely.

But I think we'll have to just agree to disagree on this one, lest we drag things further off the intended topic.

I also think long years of playing WoW have made me (usually) very patient about waiting for features that are promised to come "Soon(TM)." Still feeling somewhat upset about the utter lack of news about this, though.