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Gathering Feedback

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

TheAresian's Avatar

02.22.2019 , 07:22 PM | #71
Quote: Originally Posted by Sarova View Post
Luna, you've made me wish I hadn't spent so much time on my post. You are correct; the only time I felt listened to (not counting beta 8 years ago) was when I gave PTS feedback with screen shots about adding an apartment area to the cliff on Rishi and making the entire stronghold more stronghold-decorator friendly. They listened AND acted and as a result I changed my mind about buying it. Now I love that stronghold (and I see many people running around in my stronghold taking a look so I must have done something right). Just about everything else has been ignored.
Are the so-called "influencers" all Raiders/Ranked PvPers like the Devs? I'm betting they are and if that's the case those of us who are in it for the story are doomed If they are not careful they will find 1000s turning to Barrens chat, falling to death in Undercity, getting eaten by Sons of Arugal and the trauma of Mankrik's wife for entertainment later this year & there will be just raiders/ranked pvpers and tumbleweed left in swtor
Count me among those that will be dwelling in the Undercity. SWTOR isn't a game about players anymore. It's a game of metrics and user hours spent doing what and all of that garbage that business people think will allow them to make a great game. I came back for a few months, ran some alts through the class stories and when my sub runs out I'll disappear until either the class stories will feel fresh again or WoW Classic comes out and I'll likely be gone for a long time. I was going to make a joke about the possibility of a SWTOR Classic, but the sad truth is that I don't think enough people would care.
Quote: Originally Posted by tahol View Post
+1 from me. I have never had any hard feelings for a game dev...and then there's Ben Irving. Him leaving filled my petty heart with joy.

KendraP's Avatar

02.22.2019 , 08:19 PM | #72
To quote a recently unsubscribed friend:
"I would wager the vast number of credits i have in my now un-subscribed account that most, if not all, of the concerns brought up in the post go - in true bioware fashion - completely ignored."

He is right. Just like with the straw that broke the camel's back on not giving me the lightsaber i earned by killing world bosses, the issues will be totally ignored.

Why else would Musco post right at closing time on friday? I do wonder Musco, what a community manager at bioware does. Its obviously not managing this community.

Damask_Rose's Avatar

02.22.2019 , 10:45 PM | #73
I"m going to keep this simple.

Every year or two the CM team says they are going to improve communications with players and then they fall silent shortly after. You'll have to forgive us if we remain skeptical about how genuine you are being.

I doubt you need more ways to gather feedback. What needs real work is paying attention to the feed back you are already getting and responding to it. That's on you, not us.

1. When a controversial change is made, explain why. I mean really explain it, don't be vague. Negative changes are easier to swallow when we understand why they had to be made.

For example, we never got a real explanation on why conquest was gutted. The stated goals didn't match the changes made whatsoever. We are still waiting for "monitoring of the situation" to yield a way to make alt play viable in conquest again.

2. Patch notes need to be accurate. If you make a mistake, add something in, or something gets dropped out, make an addendum so players know about the changes. We rely on those notes to know what was intended and what is a bug.

For example, 5.10 patch notes listed a conquest goal that was supposed to be in every conquest but hasn't been in a single one. Did you change your mind? Is it a bug? Were the patch notes wrong? We don't know!

3. Cruise through the bug forum on a weekly basis and acknowledge those reports. If something is a genuine bug, tell us the right people are looking into it. If it's a known bug, but a low priority, tell us you know about it but it's not likely to be fixed in the foreseeable future. If it's not a bug, but working as intended, tell us that so we don't keep reporting it, and tell us why it's intended to be that way. Keep the "known bug" list up to date and make sure the CS reps are familiar with the state of the game.

For example, low level gear used to be dyeable in outfit stamps even though they didn't have dye slots. This was great for players since a ton of lower level gear didn't get dye slots when dyes were introduced to the game. Then that functionality went poof! No comment from Bioware. If it was a long standing bug that finally got fixed, why prioritize fixing a bug that benefits players when so many harmful bugs exist? If it was an unintended change when something else got worked on, acknowledge that and tell us if you are planning on creating a way to give us that functionality back. If it was a deliberate change, explain why, because no one can figure out a rational explanation for why you don't want us to be able to dye low level gear.


We want to understand why changes are made. We want to know which changes are deliberate and which are actual bugs. We want to know you heard us and understand what we are saying. We want to believe that you care about the quality of your game and the satisfaction of your customers.

DzastinBiberi's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 01:00 AM | #74
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
Hey folks,

With all of that out there… how can we improve? I know our feedback loop is by no means perfect, but being able to gather your feedback consistently for each update on PTS has helped us quite a bit in getting direct feedback from you. Share your thoughts!

Thanks all.

I don't wanna sound rude, but this is the hard truth.

I've been playing SWTOR since 2014 and time and time again BW showed it's incapability to listen to it's player base.

Before Command system, on PTS, you were told many times that the whole system is a bad idea, result, you guys still went with it and made it a grind fest.

The most recent example of non listening our feedback is with Osuss update, even before the patch, we asked why are mods etc bound to slot, result, zero response and you still went with it , thus pushing your playerbase into enrage mode on forums yet again.


It took you guys a year to nerf Mercs, ppl were literally crying on forums for a nerf, year after,
"yeah, we'll nerf 'em a bit", by that time it was kinda pointless, 'cause every player already had at least 1 toon merc fully geared, 'cause why not, everyone played a merc/mando class since it was far superior to other classes.

Tanks...I mean, should I even begin with that thread? Some ppl got beaten by skanks, "LETS NERF EM"

Good luck finding players who still find playing tanks fun. Slight nerf would be ok, but you guys only know extreme hammer nerfs.

Deception sins

I'll quote you on this one, since many of us are still laughing.

"We felt that Deception sins were OP, so we nerfed their dps"

and in doing so you destroyed their burst which was on pair with Fury Mara's/Sentinel's and made their rotation, RNG.

You want feedback?

For a change, ask players who do play certain classes religiously for a long time, what's best and what's not for certain class they play before you destroy that class.

Hatred sins

I've tried sending you a message, suggestions on what could be improved in order to give that spec a bit of a better survivability but it fell on deaf ears, as always. Second attempt was opening a thread with a long wall post, engaging pvpers from my guild to participate and keep it alive in hope that you'll see it and again, it was in vain. So much effort only to get zero result. Over the time, all classes and specs got something added, but Hatred is still in 55 lvl Oricon timeline, stuck in the past.

Whoever made a decision back then to spread dots via lacerate instead of Death Field, had no clue on how that class works, because you can't go with such a weak survivability class into slaughter and expect to spread your dots with spamming Lacerate, try sending Dot Sorc into the same situation, remove heals and phase walk, and let it spread his dots via saber, see how long will that Sorc survive.

I can go on and on but there's no point in it, since this post won't be noticed by anyone in the BW Dev team.

It's always has been "Hey guys" (bye guys) only to return again if there is something that needs to be posted.

Because of this, SWTOR is were it is now, far from what's has been and what it could have been.



Batwer's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 01:12 AM | #75
You look at the state of the game now. Only the story is high quality, even if you could get more out of it. You should concentrate more on the feedback of the players and implement them, do not remain stubborn in the matter.

You want to improve the game? There are enough suggestions and there are many good ones:
You! Yes, exactly you! Click me:

Khaleg's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 01:25 AM | #76
Quote: Originally Posted by snave View Post
It's 100% what's happening here.

Focus for this game is now virtually all based around marketing, you cannot make the argument they're trying to use a product based solution when the product is receiving small irregular updates that are pushed with as much hype as possible.

The CM team is a marketing extension which means they are concerned with the public perception, not the reality. Why do you think we've had little to no community management? Once 6.0 is announced that will change and the CM team will work in conjunction with the assigned influencers to push whatever narrative they feel will sell the game.

Ossus is a time-gated mess implemented to keep people busy repeating the same content over and over until they can drop the next hype bomb that will keep you subbed for 3 months more. It's the most obvious use of loss aversion and time gating I've ever seen in any video game that isn't mobile based.

BTW I'm not against marketing approaches, but they need to be balanced if you want to succeed in more than just the short term.

We have no innovation, we have regression.
I pretty much agree with both of your postings. I think there were even 3 of them including a shorter one. :-)
Also, does anybody else feel as well that Eric's second posting in this thread is, sorry Eric, just another bunch of rather more than less empty marketing phrases and platitudes, and oh so "coincidental" promises?!
Just one example "...we MAY get to a point of having him step more into the forums..." - marketing bs aside this translates into there are no actual plans to do so at that point, at least there were none until now - and this is just ONE example from this posting. Read between the lines guys, and in addition precisely for that matter.

Ossus is a very cheap play out time game, blowing up not much (gfx design is very nice though) into something "enormous" with empty marketing blah blah that can't stand reality, filled with mindless grinding and blatant playerbase harassment (mod/enhancements slot bound even in combination with multiple drops of the same f... item over and over to name just one example from the harassments).

Imho it all can be broken down to the elephant in the room:
This game runs on life support with a crew that is so tiny (I made that joke yesterday that the Bioware Austin SWTOR team consists of 3 people staring at an aquarium they have recently bought for the office all work day and I bet that is not so far from the truth) that it couldn't even do much better even if they intended to. This game is economically run by minimization principle and empty marketing bs to virtually blow up that minimum or better said the output a bit. I guess this is the guideline from EA for quite some time now. It's sad but true.

But what makes me really mad is not the fact itself even though it's really sad but that they expect us players to be that dumb and ignorant to not realize this - because it is so damn obvious.
Invest in this game at least with manpower and make a real effort or just close it down - and spare us the empty marketing bs please. There are enough people including me who basically really love this game BUT we want to see some REAL effort, not faked and artificially blown up one with a handful of more or less mortivated people running this game. None of them even playing the game I guess, except Keith, in case he still plays at all.
I mean, look, one more example, EVERY December you release an update with a sh...l.. of serious bugs/issues that are not fixed within almost 3 months now and that every year, and some most likely never based on experience. That is unacceptable for a game that is online 24/7. And it happens EVERY friggin' year for the last minimum 3 years now.
I don't know about you guys but I don't like it that much to be taken as a fool.

Eric, we ALL SEE (at least the more clever ones) that you run this game on minimization principle and we don't like it. Please change that and beg EA for the moniez. :-)
Nal'augh, guild master "The Conqueror Fleet" - Tulak Hord
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limenutpen's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 02:08 AM | #77
Thank you Eric.

Do not forget PvPers, a part of game which in the past and history of the game you have taken a lot of from and in return given a few nuggets.

My suggestion.

- Return of PvP dedicated gear
- Change the small daily (2 game dailty)
- Split Arena Que to that of regular WZ
- RETURN of 8 vs 8 Ranked

Do this and your PvP player base will increase ten fold.

So hopefully when 6.0 come alive we can have all or most of the above.

MSpectre's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 03:52 AM | #78
Can you folks raise the price of your cartel market items please, they're too low.

Can you also get rid off all the inconvenient story content all together and focus on dailies/weeklies.

BIG thanks to all the hard-working and passionate people over at EA for creating such a masterpiece of a game that brings joy to many around the World!

SteveTheCynic's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 04:37 AM | #79
Quote: Originally Posted by MSpectre View Post
Can you folks raise the price of your cartel market items please, they're too low.

Can you also get rid off all the inconvenient story content all together and focus on dailies/weeklies.

BIG thanks to all the hard-working and passionate people over at EA for creating such a masterpiece of a game that brings joy to many around the World!
Needs bigger [SARCASM] tags.
Something you find difficult is a lesson on how to play better, not a punishment for playing badly.
To go to Belsavis, you must go to Belsavis.
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Nmyownworld's Avatar

02.23.2019 , 06:28 AM | #80
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
… how can we improve?
Eric Musco, look at the Rishi SH thread from the PTS forum. Players gave feedback, suggestions. Devs provided responses, explanations, and implemented some changes. That's how it should be done.

Look at how you handled the Influencers thread. Explaining Influencers before a smoldering rumor became a raging flame of anger. That's how it should be done.

Leaving players to post concerns with zero response from devs, allowing anger to build, being silent when there is a large consensus of concern from the playerbase ... that is how it should not be done.

And, no dev started threads that go on for months with no dev response. Speaking for myself, that sort of nonsense leaves me feeling like I've been played, not that my feedback is being considered. It's frustrating. I don't expect every thread to have a dev response. However, there are times when I think a dev response sooner, rather than later, is warranted.

-- When there are game breaking bugs. A quick acknowledgement is needed. I may not be happy with the time it takes to fix a bug, but at least I know that BW is aware and working on the bug.

-- Waves of player dissatisfaction with a change. Please don't wait until player rage reaches a boiling point before stepping in to the conversation.
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
… how can we improve?
Let players in on the conversation. I'm not saying that players need to know every detail. But, more give from the devs would be appreciated. A denied request may make a player unhappy, but an unanswered concern is frustrating. Again, I'm not looking for a hand holding situation with posts; just a regular dev presence in the forums. I believe you folks are working hard. And, yes. I'm asking for a bit more.

A general suggestion: Right now, SWTOR is over a number of social media sites, and the official dev forum thread, and the SWTOR blog, etc. Think about when Paxton Rall as a companion was announced. The information was up for, what? a week?, on the SWTOR news or blog, but wasn't noticed until the information was posted on SWTOR's Twitter. A single source of links to all of SWTOR's social media platforms would be nice.

On a final note, what did you all do with Keith Kanneg?