but you're also ignoring the fact that maybe they don't care about your feedback because these changes aren't meant for you.

 

Now you're starting to make some sense.

 

Keep it up!

Well then me and my sub will go elsewhere, like it already happened with guilds and friends that have already left the game. Pts servers are usually for people that are playing the game, if they want feedback from casuals or future players they don't need people to test end game builds do they?

 

So, according to you, they keep screwing up the game and making mistakes over the past 10 years, BUT THIS TIME, this time is one step too far and will make you leave.

 

I don't believe you.

So, according to you, they keep screwing up the game and making mistakes over the past 10 years, BUT THIS TIME, this time is one step too far and will make you leave.

 

I don't believe you.

 

I don't care that you don't believe me, I stuck with the game when they changed how some classes worked like anni with 4.0 because I had a raiding guild and friends to play the game with plus other classes I enjoyed, but now thanks to the galactic command garbage system guild and most friends left already.

I only keep coming back to do raids or pvp because I like this game's gameplay, sure as hell I don't keep coming back for the 30 mins of story a year. If gameplay is changed how it looks on pts then I am gone for good. Not like I need to justify myself to you either, this is not the first game I will abandon if the direction they take doesn't appeal to me.

You don't believe all the people that have left over the gearing system or the no raids either then?

So, if some people are right and the ability prune is intended to keep new players longer, was it the best choice for retention? I'm betting we would have better new player retention if the funds spent on yet another combat overhaul were spent on upgrading the textures and assets on lower level planets and gear. (And restore the heroic quest givers and give the option to hand in to them so the stories are properly available for those new players.) New players very rarely, if ever, comment on the number of skills, but constantly talk about the low end graphics. Heck, far more new players complain about how easy the game is than complain about having too many buttons to push. Every few years Bioware focuses their limited resources on these combat overhauls that starve the rest of the game, but provide none of the vaunted benefits they are supposed to provide.

So, if some people are right and the ability prune is intended to keep new players longer, was it the best choice for retention? I'm betting we would have better new player retention if the funds spent on yet another combat overhaul were spent on upgrading the textures and assets on lower level planets and gear. (And restore the heroic quest givers and give the option to hand in to them so the stories are properly available for those new players.) New players very rarely, if ever, comment on the number of skills, but constantly talk about the low end graphics. Heck, far more new players complain about how easy the game is than complain about having too many buttons to push. Every few years Bioware focuses their limited resources on these combat overhauls that starve the rest of the game, but provide none of the vaunted benefits they are supposed to provide.

 

Yes but you see the magic metrics that only bioware has access to say we need another "rebalancing" because the last one that allowed a monkey to play the game and still succeed, and has people on reddit saying this game's leveling process is too easy non stop, wasnt enough.

Because having less abilities to use and instead having to press the same ones over and over will magically make the game more fun or something.

Yes but you see the magic metrics that only bioware has access to say we need another "rebalancing" because the last one that allowed a monkey to play the game and still succeed, and has people on reddit saying this game's leveling process is too easy non stop, wasnt enough.

Because having less abilities to use and instead having to press the same ones over and over will magically make the game more fun or something.

 

If this is the case, then why do I keep seeing horrible DPS in MM FP's? If it's so easy a monkey can do it, then every human should be able to. Many clearly can't.

If this is the case, then why do I keep seeing horrible DPS in MM FP's? If it's so easy a monkey can do it, then every human should be able to. Many clearly can't.

 

I did say leveling process didnt I, this game used to have a leveling system that more or less forced you to use your abilities but with the whole bolster and leveling scaling plus op comps that went out of the window.

A lot of the mm woes can be attributed to the whole removal of trinity in fp's and introduction of the kolto stations, who needs to learn mechanics when you can press a button and heal to full.

I did say leveling process didnt I, this game used to have a leveling system that more or less forced you to use your abilities but with the whole bolster and leveling scaling plus op comps that went out of the window.

A lot of the mm woes can be attributed to the whole removal of trinity in fp's and introduction of the kolto stations, who needs to learn mechanics when you can press a button and heal to full.

 

even back at launch you didn't need to use most of your abilities while leveling. Yes you used a normal rotation, as well as interuppt on specific abilities, but I never used many abilities back then. Yes leveling has since gotten easier, but that is to push people into max level content faster. To me the ease of leveling doesn't really matter for why the devs need or don't need to prune abilties. (I'm not really for or against it). If it happens I'll adapt, if it doesn't I'm fine with that as well.

even back at launch you didn't need to use most of your abilities while leveling. Yes you used a normal rotation, as well as interuppt on specific abilities, but I never used many abilities back then. Yes leveling has since gotten easier, but that is to push people into max level content faster. To me the ease of leveling doesn't really matter for why the devs need or don't need to prune abilties. (I'm not really for or against it). If it happens I'll adapt, if it doesn't I'm fine with that as well.

 

I did use most of my abilities while leveling because I did fp's back when a trinity was still required or leveled characters via pvp hell even some heroics where really hard and forced you to use all you had. I still remember how my op was the queen of soloing heroics while those were still hard because she had both droid and human mezz, plus a tank comp and she could heal too, that was a class that taught me how to use all I had to my advantage and rewarded learning abilities, now all you have to do is put comp in heals and go watch netflix.

 

It does make sense in a certain way because of the abrupt change in pace people find between leveling and end game content, if they even make that jump.

All of a sudden cleanses arent useless or abilities that buff/debuff stuns and mezzes arent either, they are necessary and the process of learning how to use abilities went from meh while leveling to oh **** I caused a wipe on a fp or I didnt avoid a cap in pvp because I didnt know this ability is actually useful for certain content.

even back at launch you didn't need to use most of your abilities while leveling. Yes you used a normal rotation, as well as interuppt on specific abilities, but I never used many abilities back then. Yes leveling has since gotten easier, but that is to push people into max level content faster. To me the ease of leveling doesn't really matter for why the devs need or don't need to prune abilties. (I'm not really for or against it). If it happens I'll adapt, if it doesn't I'm fine with that as well.

 

Well you see if a good player only had to do a standard rotation at launch with that difficulity-set....

Now we have players who only press AOE and Basic Attack 1 while leveling as thats how easy it is. This is fine because most of these types just want to see cutscenes.

 

However, they then go out to PvP and Endgame PvE group combat and get rekt/kicked from MM Flashpoints.

So, according to you, they keep screwing up the game and making mistakes over the past 10 years, BUT THIS TIME, this time is one step too far and will make you leave.

 

I don't believe you.

 

I agree, seems unlikely. Unlike those of us, myself included, who have never seen them implement in this game quite as foolish sounding as THIS change and actually WILL leave.

I agree, seems unlikely. Unlike those of us, myself included, who have never seen them implement in this game quite as foolish sounding as THIS change and actually WILL leave.

 

Also like to point out the lack or arguments these people have that have to resort to the typical "why are you still playing" garbage to even respond to questions. Can't even give feedback or opinions because ofc the contrarians will just dismiss everything and go for the personal retorts.

 

Think about it like this, why did I, someone that until now has made like 2 posts about cosmetics or past pts comments now all of a sudden made so many posts? I was more or less happy with the game until 5.0 and all it came with it, I kept playing because of the gameplay mostly, but this might be the last thing holding me to this game. Bioware doesnt want players like me anymore? That's fine, I will stop posting cos I wont be subbing or playing anymore. Now if some poster on a forum believes me or cares is of no importance to me.

I’m still wondering who all the magical players are that Omega says Bioware are focusing these changes on.

 

Do they already play the game and if they do, aren’t they considered the player base? And aren’t these changes just as bad for them?

 

And if they don’t, isn’t trying to recruit a whole other player base from scratch stupidly risky considering the game is so old and isn’t even getting a new engine update to refresh it like a new game?

 

The logic behind Omega’s assumptions is so flawed from a business perspective that any sane business manager would laugh you out if their office if you presented such a risky and illogical plan.

Pulls out /whale emjoi...

 

*(TL;DR - Nobody's addicted to SWTOR, push them hard enough and watch revenue evaporate - Oh and Some Executive at EA clearly just ranked up to Dark Side VI by insisting on this 'change')

 

...

 

As an older gamer with wife and several kids... You know if my entertainment becomes hostile to my game play experience, then I just don't pay for that experience. I was heavily invested in World of Warships for years as my PVP (Strategy) entertainment, and then the developer made the game so hostile to my personal entertainment, and I uninstalled and left... haven't been back. I've got better things to do with my time than to fight to have a pleasant experience with your product/service.

 

In fact I remember vividly, receiving a emailed survey asking why I left - and I thought, oh boy someone misses my wallet - so I took their little survey and blasted them whenever there was a comments section.

 

At the end of the day, no matter what Bioware EA does this is 'my' metric for deciding to help fund the profitability of SWTOR or not. I'm a Star Wars fan, not a SWTOR fan - I can bide my time if pushed away until another company does a better job in the Star Wars MMOG space.

 

I won't rage quit, or make hollow threats. I love my characters and I love my experiences to date in this game. But if the game becomes Hostile to my sense of personal entertainment, then my wallet is closed. I have most everything I want after 10 years of playing and can go to Preferred Status and just play story content...

 

SWTOR micro-transactions aren't nearly as necessary as other games that go out of their way to make F2P extremely painful.

 

If EA wants to ruin the mechanics I enjoy, then I'll just set SWTOR to the side and go ride my Ducati Monster 1200S - RL still exists,

 

One last note: This Global Pandemic having happened, this is the WRONG time to be @#$#@'ing with peoples game. Some people are on the verge of getting evicted once the eviction moratorium ends, there are probably people that sooth any mental/emotional distress by playing this game --- and NOW you want to radically alter it?

 

Some Executive at EA clearly just ranked up to Dark Side VI

Edited July 28, 2021 by Kass

If I ever did see a kiss *** thread, pathetic.

 

If a gaming dev does something right, ill support it. If a gaming dev does something wrong I wont. I will not under any circumstance trying to kiss ***

 

Its probably mute. The fact that the devs haven't responded probably means there going to to whatever they plan to do, regardless of feedback. What a fracking surprise.

 

It's quite simple, let them take away what ever they want, just don't be surprised when people leave because they broke the classes they love to play, i hear they are going to make us choose between undying, camo, and mad dash on mara, if this actually happens, i'll just unsub and quit, this is just stupid, how are we supposed to do nim without our dcds?

It's quite simple, let them take away what ever they want, just don't be surprised when people leave because they broke the classes they love to play, i hear they are going to make us choose between undying, camo, and mad dash on mara, if this actually happens, i'll just unsub and quit, this is just stupid, how are we supposed to do nim without our dcds?

 

Here is the real joke, they are just going to nerf NIM boss HP/DPS to compensate. Fight might be similar, you will just have less abilities to play any portion of the game with, Enjoy Seeing player agency removed.

Here is the real joke, they are just going to nerf NIM boss HP/DPS to compensate. Fight might be similar, you will just have less abilities to play any portion of the game with, Enjoy Seeing player agency removed.

 

I dont get it. Every raider is a sub, with many subbing just to raid. Whilst casual players usually dont sub and dont plan to do raids (the amount I talked to during recruiting).

 

They are now trying to piss off actual paying customers in hope to appease and rope in customers who dont want those content.

 

Unless devs actually explain their intension and correct us wrong, I just dont understand, it is so baffling.

I dont get it. Every raider is a sub, with many subbing just to raid. Whilst casual players usually dont sub and dont plan to do raids (the amount I talked to during recruiting).

 

They are now trying to piss off actual paying customers in hope to appease and rope in customers who dont want those content.

 

Unless devs actually explain their intension and correct us wrong, I just dont understand, it is so baffling.

 

Same goes for hardcore pvpers. Most if not all are subs and these changes aren’t good for pvp either.

 

Bioware’s explanation and public justifications don’t add up. Their “more choice” reasoning is absolutely flawed and sounds like a marketing line by someone who doesn’t even play the game. Removing abilities and class utility doesn’t give you more choice.

 

At first I thought it might be to improve the desync and fps performance in pvp and large pve fights, but the abilities they are targeting mostly have nothing to do with speed or anything that causes desync or fps drops. So that obviously isn’t the reason or they’d have targeted other abilities.

 

A few other people across the web have suggested it could be because Steam is launching that hand held console thing and Bioware are trying to make it more console friendly. And unfortunately, I’m starting to think this might be part of the reason. I also asked a few weeks ago if Bioware might make swtor Xbox X/S compatible considering it’s basically a PC with a version of Windows 10. Otherwise why are they also redesigning the UI after 10 years.

 

Unfortunately I think Bioware are tying to make the game console friendly for the handheld steam console and not Xbox (which would be an easier port cause you can use mouse and KB on Xbox).

 

Regardless, it feels like a big middle finger to the subscribers who’ve paid to keep this game alive for 10 years.

Edited July 29, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

Same goes for hardcore pvpers. Most if not all are subs and these changes aren’t good for pvp either.

 

Bioware’s explanation and public justifications don’t add up. Their “more choice” reasoning is absolutely flawed and sounds like a marketing line by someone who doesn’t even play the game. Removing abilities and class utility doesn’t give you more choice.

 

At first I thought it might be to improve the desync and fps performance in pvp and large pve fights, but the abilities they are targeting mostly have nothing to do with speed or anything that causes desync or fps drops. So that obviously isn’t the reason or they’d have targeted other abilities.

 

A few other people across the web have suggested it could be because Steam is launching that hand held console thing and Bioware are trying to make it more console friendly. And unfortunately, I’m starting to think this might be part of the reason. I also asked a few weeks ago if Bioware might make swtor Xbox X/S compatible considering it’s basically a PC with a version of Windows 10. Otherwise why are they also redesigning the UI after 10 years.

 

Unfortunately I think Bioware are tying to make the game console friendly for the handheld steam console and not Xbox (which would be an easier port cause you can use mouse and KB on Xbox).

 

Regardless, it feels like a big middle finger to the subscribers who’ve paid to keep this game alive for 10 years.

 

"More Choice"... Being lied to EA style.

 

Feels great don't it? _embarrassed :

 

At least for PVP (and I'm an Unranked novice - full disclosure), with the damage output in the game currently, even if DCD's were pruned across all Classes and Disciplines, people are going to die so fast and sent to respawn that people will be stuck behind the 30 second penalty barrier en mass.

 

Warzone matches will be less fun, and the meta will likely shift to max DPS classes like Powertech Advanced Prototype (AP) and Sorcerer Lightning etc and just steamroll.

 

So is BIOWARE EA going to set up a Match Making system where you can't have 8 Powertech APs on a single team after they prune all these DCD's? Because current Warzone Que seems pretty random to just fill 16 players of any classes?

 

...

 

While we don't know all the details of the combat mechanics they want to change - it doesn't sound like their overhaul of DCD's really takes into account the domino affect this is going to have on how PVP plays. And they may end up evolving a the game into a new meta that they wish they hadn't - and will panic and start nerfing class damage output because of a lack of any true Match Making for PVP.

That would be fair if they just said "Guys, we must left only ~10 active abilities, other should become passive, let us vote and decide which". But.. The worse thing is that there is no need of abilities pruning. A lot of console fightings has so many special moves, its just the way you use them. There no need to bind everithing to direct buttons or some trafitionally combinations, there may be used jump + some btn, or different abilities usage when player is moving or stay still. Edited July 29, 2021 by DragonsKnight_

Yeah, I think they better learn a thing from fighting games and not from other pruned MMO's. All those combos, blocks, specials, dashes are super fun and those can be done by combining a very few basic attacks and moves, more powerful combinations can be unlocked with levels, and that combat would feel more star warsy. With the current system, we can have better combat only with more abilities, but since they want to reduce those they better change the mechanics of it to make it feel not dumbed down but actually improved. *Not saying this should be a mortal kombat in space, but some things those games do much, much better than traditional RPG's Edited July 29, 2021 by Voroschuk

I like blade & soul's combat system more than swtor's, it uses less keys and combos and has been in eSport competitions. But there's no way this game is getting turned into that. What they are doing is making swtor dumber and with a much lower skill cap (and with a lot less players).

Anyone who thinks they're really going to rebalance all PVE content in the game to compensate is living in a fantasy world. Classic Bioware over-promising something they will either never deliver or take literal years to deliver.

Anyone who thinks they're really going to rebalance all PVE content in the game to compensate is living in a fantasy world. Classic Bioware over-promising something they will either never deliver or take literal years to deliver.

 

Exactly this ^^

I have 4 bars containing 31 buttons just for jugg skanktanking. And that doesn't include flags, medpacks, mounts, or anything else I want to put on my bar. There should never be this many abilities for any one class. You can't afford to remove dcds though especially for tanks, so it might be better to condense the rotation and remove useless abilities like freezing force.