FFXIV is currently the largest MMO on the planet and it’s playable on console. So I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make?

Otherwise, what has been BioWares ultimate goal in pruning and redesigning the ability setup. What about the brand new UI system? And trying to simplify or what like to call dumb down parts of the games systems? All at the expense of more content.

If it’s not to eventually port to Xbox or steam deck, then they’ve wasted a great deal of resources that could be better spent adding playable content to keep people playing longer.

The main things that 7.0 seems to focus on are technically upgrades or rebuilding systems and simplifying them when they didn’t need changing in the first place.

If BioWare have done all of this and there isn’t a port in the future, I’ll be amazed at the total waste of funds.

OP did not argue that because another MMO did it, that means that this one will. My point is that there has been no indication whatsoever that this will ever be the case with this game and that its been something that has been tossed around since launch. DCUO also has been on console for well over a decade now with many skills, abilities and controls mapped for ease of use, but it was made with console in mind. You want to tell me that this game and its combat resemble anything of the sort?

Your following points are assumptions that, again, aren't actually based on anything substantial. Why should we assume that because they are making us choose between 3~ abilities per class that it alongside a UI revamp means that they're undertaking a port? Can it not just be them reinventing the wheel like they always seem to do? Simplification is nothing new to this game, you of all people know this. If we weren't getting a gush of content, what else could they do for a 10th anniversary expansion? Reinvent the wheel.

Overall, much of what we're getting is fluff. Yes, there are practical uses for combat styles, but we already had an option for those: Alts. Only difference now is we can have 2 different advanced classes within 1 toon. Fluff. Fluff is what you get when there is a lack of content (they said they have more to roll out for the anniversary throughout the year, so there's our 'anniversary'). It makes more sense than a team consisting of 3 devs and the janitor quietly prepping to port a 10 year old game barely held together by scotch tape to console with all of its performance inconsistencies.

If anything, I'm surprised you of all people would be surprised by a waste of funds on something like this. New coat of paint to bring in more new blood while they rake in profits to remain serviceable as a 'live service' cash cow. I'll admit now that I could be wrong, but I also have seen nothing that indicates that they've been moving toward a console port because they already seem to have a hard time with the PC client already. If that is what they are doing, I guess 2022 will be the year to find out.

OP did not argue that because another MMO did it, that means that this one will. My point is that there has been no indication whatsoever that this will ever be the case with this game and that its been something that has been tossed around since launch. DCUO also has been on console for well over a decade now with many skills, abilities and controls mapped for ease of use, but it was made with console in mind. You want to tell me that this game and its combat resemble anything of the sort?

 

Your following points are assumptions that, again, aren't actually based on anything substantial. Why should we assume that because they are making us choose between 3~ abilities per class that it alongside a UI revamp means that they're undertaking a port? Can it not just be them reinventing the wheel like they always seem to do? Simplification is nothing new to this game, you of all people know this. If we weren't getting a gush of content, what else could they do for a 10th anniversary expansion? Reinvent the wheel.

 

Overall, much of what we're getting is fluff. Yes, there are practical uses for combat styles, but we already had an option for those: Alts. Only difference now is we can have 2 different advanced classes within 1 toon. Fluff. Fluff is what you get when there is a lack of content (they said they have more to roll out for the anniversary throughout the year, so there's our 'anniversary'). It makes more sense than a team consisting of 3 devs and the janitor quietly prepping to port a 10 year old game barely held together by scotch tape to console with all of its performance inconsistencies.

 

If anything, I'm surprised you of all people would be surprised by a waste of funds on something like this. New coat of paint to bring in more new blood while they rake in profits to remain serviceable as a 'live service' cash cow. I'll admit now that I could be wrong, but I also have seen nothing that indicates that they've been moving toward a console port because they already seem to have a hard time with the PC client already. If that is what they are doing, I guess 2022 will be the year to find out.

You may be right and I could be wrong. Like you said I’m assuming many things. But I’m just trying to use logic to understand their business plan.

As someone whose run businesses in their life, what BioWare are doing with 7.0 only makes business sense if they believe they are going to get a great deal more players than they will ultimately drive off with many of the design decisions.

And when you consider the game is 10 years old and already been released on Steam, the only new cohort of players they can target are console players. Remember no one thought they were going to put swtor on Steam either.

Of course, doing a proper console port would usually include Play Station and I agree that is very unlikely to ever happen. But an Xbox port shouldn’t be too difficult when you realise that it’s basically just a Windows 10 PC with the ability to use a hand controller.

As for steam deck. Well I’m not sure, but I’m assuming if other Windows PC games can run on their custom Linux system using an emulator, then swtor should technically be able too as well. So long as BioWare make some changes that allow the use of a hand controller.

I honestly think that’s BioWares end game or at least what Keith has pitched to EA in his 5 year plan. If not, then they will lose more people this time than they bring in and the game will struggle to recover or continue by this time next year.

Hold up, there are games from 1998 still running?!? Like, live games like this one? Or is it different. Cos that is insane insane longevity if it's a game like this. Imagine catching up on 24 years of story lol

EQ, The Realm, UO, RS, OSRS, probably a Meridian 59 server here and there.

Warhammer AOR has a server, and there are unlicensed WoW servers.

So yeah, lots of late 1990's, early 2000 games.

Others said the same thing about WoW years ago. While SWTOR has fewer abilities (by a wide margin) making that portion easier to port, there is a cost to doing such. Also, and this is more of a rhetorical question - will Console players "play" simply because a 10-year old MMO is suddenly available?

Don't fool yourself with this "less ability" thing.

FFXIV some classes has 40+ skills and it works perfectly on consoles.

The thing is: Square Enix did the port right, they really worked on the console port to make it very good.

You may be right and I could be wrong. Like you said I’m assuming many things. But I’m just trying to use logic to understand their business plan.

 

As someone whose run businesses in their life, what BioWare are doing with 7.0 only makes business sense if they believe they are going to get a great deal more players than they will ultimately drive off with many of the design decisions.

 

And when you consider the game is 10 years old and already been released on Steam, the only new cohort of players they can target are console players. Remember no one thought they were going to put swtor on Steam either.

 

Of course, doing a proper console port would usually include Play Station and I agree that is very unlikely to ever happen. But an Xbox port shouldn’t be too difficult when you realise that it’s basically just a Windows 10 PC with the ability to use a hand controller.

 

As for steam deck. Well I’m not sure, but I’m assuming if other Windows PC games can run on their custom Linux system using an emulator, then swtor should technically be able too as well. So long as BioWare make some changes that allow the use of a hand controller.

 

I honestly think that’s BioWares end game or at least what Keith has pitched to EA in his 5 year plan. If not, then they will lose more people this time than they bring in and the game will struggle to recover or continue by this time next year.

Can I ask since you seem to be in the know, what exactly are you talking about that's being radically changed with 7.0 in terms of abilities and stuff.. Cos I can't find info on it at all tbh. Although I've only read the sticky posts in the forum concerning 7.0. That stuff really all seems like small changes or too vague for me to really know what any of it means. The main things I've seen is the whole combat style stuff and then some vagueness about fixing the borked economy somehow. Care to be the first to fill me in on what else is happening...? Cos I'm not really getting it lol. oh and I know gear will change, somehow, but I'm not clever enough to understand the hows or whys of all that. And I'm crap at gearing anyways, story solo player

Can I ask since you seem to be in the know, what exactly are you talking about that's being radically changed with 7.0 in terms of abilities and stuff.. Cos I can't find info on it at all tbh. Although I've only read the sticky posts in the forum concerning 7.0. That stuff really all seems like small changes or too vague for me to really know what any of it means. The main things I've seen is the whole combat style stuff and then some vagueness about fixing the borked economy somehow. Care to be the first to fill me in on what else is happening...? Cos I'm not really getting it lol. oh and I know gear will change, somehow, but I'm not clever enough to understand the hows or whys of all that. And I'm crap at gearing anyways, story solo player

:csw_yoda:The PTS forums you must search padawan.

Can I ask since you seem to be in the know, what exactly are you talking about that's being radically changed with 7.0 in terms of abilities and stuff.. Cos I can't find info on it at all tbh. Although I've only read the sticky posts in the forum concerning 7.0. That stuff really all seems like small changes or too vague for me to really know what any of it means. The main things I've seen is the whole combat style stuff and then some vagueness about fixing the borked economy somehow. Care to be the first to fill me in on what else is happening...? Cos I'm not really getting it lol. oh and I know gear will change, somehow, but I'm not clever enough to understand the hows or whys of all that. And I'm crap at gearing anyways, story solo player

If you mean the things that are going to drive some of the currents players away, then I’ll list some in point form.

1. Conquest Changes

* Doubling personal conquest totals

* Total removal of credits as rewards

2. New gearing system

* Linking gearing to weeklies (that will reset each week if you don’t complete them)

* Removing moddable gearing (until you reach 334 ilvl, which will only be available to OPs players for months)

* Reinventing the gearing system back to an early life of the game (removing horizontal gearing)

3. Making current dailies and weeklies reset if you don’t complete them

* Funnelling people into all playing specific weeklies and dailies that BioWare choose or you don’t get gear rewards

* This will make some areas over crowded and take longer to complete

* Will probably reduce games performance in those areas so we get FPS drops and lag effects

If you are asking what things are they changing that lead me to think they are porting the game to console in the future.

1. Ability Pruning

2. Simplification of the Utility tree

3. Total redesign of the UI panels in the game for cargo, character and others to be determined

4. Over Simplification of gearing (non moddable gear)

5. There are others, but I just woke up and I’ve a hang over. Scroll through the PTS forums and you’ll see.

Anyone else think BioWare could just as easily pop into this thread or the forums to end this speculation and deny a console port is being planned.

We can see from other Threads that JackieKo is reading the forums. If BioWare wasn’t planning a port, they could easily put this topic to bed by stating they aren’t.

So Jackie, if you are reading this, are you able to comment?

Anyone else think BioWare could just as easily pop into this thread or the forums to end this speculation and deny a console port is being planned.

Swtor is not the first mmorpg that had consistent threads about speculations like literally remaking the entire 10 years worth of content in a new engine, outside of how absurd the idea is, they cant be bothered debunk this because this isnt the first thread, there have been multiple threads over the years talking about it so you cant really expect them to keep telling people that this aint happening.

I am sure they must have answered that question in some older interview so repeatedly asking or hoping for it is silly, and expecting them to come and officially tell you it aint happening every single time is silly.

Plus the fact that there are risks, even saying there's no plans to do the absurd and impossible remaking the entire game in a new engine thing is gonna lead to some clueless people into thinking that swtor is not gonna make any updates to its engine ever which clearly suggests its gonna be shutting down soon, we ll see stupid articles like "no more updates for swtor" because a CM told that they wont do the specifically impossible task of remaking 10 years worth of content in a new engine.

Engines get updated all the time by a bit because it is what they use to create the world, the average person does not understand what an engine is and thing it can be replaced and can confuse things like engine updates with "omg they are making a huge graphical rehaul"

Swtor is not the first mmorpg that had consistent threads about speculations like literally remaking the entire 10 years worth of content in a new engine, outside of how absurd the idea is, they cant be bothered debunk this because this isnt the first thread, there have been multiple threads over the years talking about it so you cant really expect them to keep telling people that this aint happening.

 

I am sure they must have answered that question in some older interview so repeatedly asking or hoping for it is silly, and expecting them to come and officially tell you it aint happening every single time is silly.

 

Plus the fact that there are risks, even saying there's no plans to do the absurd and impossible remaking the entire game in a new engine thing is gonna lead to some clueless people into thinking that swtor is not gonna make any updates to its engine ever which clearly suggests its gonna be shutting down soon, we ll see stupid articles like "no more updates for swtor" because a CM told that they wont do the specifically impossible task of remaking 10 years worth of content in a new engine.

 

Engines get updated all the time by a bit because it is what they use to create the world, the average person does not understand what an engine is and thing it can be replaced and can confuse things like engine updates with "omg they are making a huge graphical rehaul"

Are you even following the conversation? Because at NO POINT did I say they were going to port to a new engine or upgrade the engine. I actually agree they aren’t going to port to a new engine or upgrade this one.

Seriously dude, if you are going to respond to my posts, at least read them properly so you don’t go off on a tangent that has nothing to do with what I wrote.

I suggest you go back and read my posts and then edit this one so it makes sense.

Others said the same thing about WoW years ago. While SWTOR has fewer abilities (by a wide margin) making that portion easier to port, there is a cost to doing such. Also, and this is more of a rhetorical question - will Console players "play" simply because a 10-year old MMO is suddenly available?

STO & Neverwinter (Cryptic Games Studio) launched for Console, they did that almost 3 maybe 4+ years ago. While some play on Console for sure it initially launched to great success. Yet today remains perhaps only a 1/3rd of player base across both Consoles, and both Consoles have players on different SERVERS as well and no game play between either Consoles or PC. Also if you purchase something on PC, it requires purchasing again on Console, or both depending what you play because XBOX and PlayStation STORE want their cut of everything as well. Lifetime subs on Console also in STO didn't get their 500 ZEN (Our Coins) each month, so they also had to reduce the price they asked as that take money away from the STORE. You'd still get other Lifer only benefits however, yet again it was a separate purchase.

Though Direct X didn't really improve that much initially, it did allow in time allow for improving the graphics quality, or renders of stuff. It also taxes slightly older Video Cards far more, than even what we see. Video Cards are getting stupidly expensive too, and the video cards on many Consoles while good, aren't as high as many PC's. So Cryptic always has to TEST their BUILDs then retest on various consoles, and consoles receive updates 2-3 months later than PC. Because XBOX and PlayStation each have different range of SPEC's, depending on Console that requires additional time to ensure it supports them or is modified to.

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Still I find myself having less FUN in STO, because they lost focus on what keeps players interested. I see 7.0 as the start of Bioware doing the same, does it mean they are going to Console--hope they aren't. Also Sub cost will be less on Console as they likely won't offer COINs, as it would take revenue away from XBOX or Playstation Store!

Cryptic had to kept Consoles separate with XBOX or PlayStation STORE, and each on their own Server as a result. They want to ensure they receive their CUT of things sold in STORE, so that means you won't get anything SOLD on PC, if you start a Console version of the game. Perhaps Bioware will just sell Subscriptions thru their Store's to avoid that? Still you'll just have to start everything from Scratch, and buy everything over.

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So it doesn't actually mean more players, just more divided in fact. I also hope that's NOT the reason they are taking away so much from us, just so they can PORT it to consoles. Whom we won't be able to play with, nor will XBOX be able to play with PlayStation players--each has separate STORE, rules, and likely SERVERs.

They'd be better to merge West Coast & East Coast Server's together, if you want to see more players. Even though they technically all exist in the same location. Yet doing that require some Guilds, &/or Players that require changing names...

SWTOR will get engine upgrade in 2022/2023 and will release on consoles.

 

They keep mentioning laying out the foundation for the future with this xpac and they teased engine upgrade next year, we also get pvp revamp next year, we get some UI overhaul this year with more to come next year, we get combat styles this year, and they are pruning abilities.

 

This all combined screams console release because it feels like they are getting ready for new release.

 

I honestly hope they pull it off because more players = more money = bigger budget for new content and more frequent updates, and lets not forget to release on consoles they need 64bit client and DirectX upgrade so pc players would heavily benefit.

I do not think they will upgrade the engine. I also don't think they need to.

Now I know right now I got a ton of people giving me the side eye, but hear me out.

ESO ALSO uses the hero engine, and is GORGEOUS. And while what SWTOR has is a Frankenstein of the beta of the hero engine, ESO still shows what's possible.

So while I just said they will not upgrade, the engine, that does NOT mean they won't update the visuals.

I think they will continue to optimize the existing engine, and I can see them moving to higher rez and more detailed textures. The overall effect will be drastically improved visuals WITHOUT needing to upgrade the engine, which at this point is next to impossible.

I do not think they will upgrade the engine. I also don't think they need to.

 

Now I know right now I got a ton of people giving me the side eye, but hear me out.

 

ESO ALSO uses the hero engine, and is GORGEOUS. And while what SWTOR has is a Frankenstein of the beta of the hero engine, ESO still shows what's possible.

 

So while I just said they will not upgrade, the engine, that does NOT mean they won't update the visuals.

 

I think they will continue to optimize the existing engine, and I can see them moving to higher rez and more detailed textures. The overall effect will be drastically improved visuals WITHOUT needing to upgrade the engine, which at this point is next to impossible.

I actually FIND this to be GOOD news, still I see the LOGIC your using makes sense...

...also porting to console means separate SERVERs for each, as well as a % of all sales thru XBOX or PlayStation Stores. So anyone playing on PC would have to BUY everything all over again at the very least, not to mention create new Characters! And likely wouldn't play with those on PC either.

Just sad with 7.0 mostly we've lost 2 of 3 former abilities, and lost Combat Proficiency that used to vastly customize our Characters!

I do not think they will upgrade the engine. I also don't think they need to.

 

Now I know right now I got a ton of people giving me the side eye, but hear me out.

 

ESO ALSO uses the hero engine, and is GORGEOUS. And while what SWTOR has is a Frankenstein of the beta of the hero engine, ESO still shows what's possible.

 

So while I just said they will not upgrade, the engine, that does NOT mean they won't update the visuals.

 

I think they will continue to optimize the existing engine, and I can see them moving to higher rez and more detailed textures. The overall effect will be drastically improved visuals WITHOUT needing to upgrade the engine, which at this point is next to impossible.

Just want to point out something you may not realise. Yes, ESO “used” the Hero engine. But it’s not the actual live games engine. They only used Hero in the very early days of the development. Kind of like a draft version to work out what they planned to make. Then they moved to an in house developed game engine that has nothing to do with Hero.

ZeniMax Online licensed the HeroEngine in November 2007. It was used as a whiteboard for the game in early development while the production engine was in development

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls_Online

I support new avenues for people to play SWTOR on. Still never got a Mac client, and WoW, ESO, and FFXIV all have that.

If they ever made an in house Linux launcher, I would dump Windows in a heart beat.

I support new avenues for people to play SWTOR on. Still never got a Mac client, and WoW, ESO, and FFXIV all have that.

They'd likely be wise to get a MAC client, yet just like Console's they'd likely require everything PURCHASED again thru APPLE STORE. Just like XBOX & Sony require it thru their STORE, and won't honor what was not sold thru their Marketplace either.

So it likely be people playing on More not LESS Separate Server Farms, only further dividing the players more than we have today. We wouldn't even likely see their server listed on PC. Though it may at least OPEN up more revenue streams for them... ...if the cost for extra testing, porting, makes it worth while. Still I'd expect other platforms likely be 2-3 months behind PC, for releases as a result.

I mean always a few advantages, and some disadvantages if that's what they are thinking of doing...

They'd likely be wise to get a MAC client, yet just like Console's they'd likely require everything PURCHASED again thru APPLE STORE. Just like XBOX & Sony require it thru their STORE, and won't honor what was not sold thru their Marketplace either.

 

So it likely be people playing on More not LESS Separate Server Farms, only further dividing the players more than we have today. We wouldn't even likely see their server listed on PC. Though it may at least OPEN up more revenue streams for them... ...if the cost for extra testing, porting, makes it worth while. Still I'd expect other platforms likely be 2-3 months behind PC, for releases as a result.

 

I mean always a few advantages, and some disadvantages if that's what they are thinking of doing...

Two things, one while I’ve heard of separate servers for console vs PC like in eso the PC server includes the mac client they have. And two no where have I ever seen any mmo that offers a Mac client purchase from or forced to use the apple store, not in ESO, not in ffxiv and not in WoW.

I thought there was talk of a Mac client way back, and if you look up SWTOR Mac client on twitter it still gets buzz, people have guides on how to finesse boot camp or do your own port like it seems worthwhile to me if BioWare does enter the including more clients game (ie: consoles like the OP stated) that they also do a Mac client or even like the above poster mentioned Linux.

But yes I do agree with you it would be beneficial if they did add a mac client, (never played it but I think..? GW2 has one as well) so it kinda leaves swtor as one of the ones that stands out with a lack of avenues for players to access. I rather like the pro console / pro Mac client etc, like eso and ffxiv.