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Refund Timer Change

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

foxmob's Avatar


foxmob
05.04.2021 , 10:39 PM | #101
Quote: Originally Posted by karimthejedi View Post
Peace and blessings onto you. Take care
and with your credits as well. what does tech frag heaven look like, I wonder? do the pieces fit together? did any one see them fall away?
Krack

The-Kaitou-Kid's Avatar


The-Kaitou-Kid
05.04.2021 , 11:22 PM | #102
Quote: Originally Posted by karimthejedi View Post
Have you guys even been reading the comments properly?

The writing is plain and simple; the items explicitly said they were refundable for a X amount of hours even before the update took place, without any indication otherwise.

That's in writing. That's a contract. And what BW is doing now is a breach of contract.
Putting aside the fact that writing on an item in game doesn't constitute a contract, there is absolutely no breach here even if it did constitute a contract.

The items state that the item is refundable for X amount of hours. It was refundable for X amount of hours. They just changed it so those hours no longer pause when you're not logged into that character. If anything, it's more accurate now because that X hours is now actually X hours instead of X hours + however long you avoid logging into the character for.
"When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

karimthejedi's Avatar


karimthejedi
05.04.2021 , 11:43 PM | #103
It does.

DarthSpuds's Avatar


DarthSpuds
05.05.2021 , 03:52 AM | #104
Quote: Originally Posted by Exly View Post
So now we have to stop accepting our weekly conquest rewards, and stop getting toons to 50k conquest points until Kai opens for business if we want to maximize our access to the mission that allows us to get the augment mats. That is so user friendly, not.

Once more, the devs have snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. This change could have made me happy if done right, but instead, they chose to piss me off, again!
And this is the crux of it.

What we have here is the following situation:
1) For reasons known only to themselves the Devs set the TF storage cap at 10k.
2) Even relatively casual play can hit that cap quite easily.
3) Players therefore feel the rewards they get after that cap is hit are wasted (a justifiable feeling IMO)
4) Kai Zykken only pops at a time that does not coincide with the likely peak of TF ownership - Conquest Reward Day.
5) So some people found a way around that TF Cap, so they could reap the most benefit from Kai Zykken.

Bioware's Reaction:
1) "Hey look, some of these guys have found a way around our ridiculously low (when compared to earning potential) TF Cap".
2) "We have to find some way to address this".
3) "Let's mess with the refund timer, that'll screw them!"
4) "Yeah, teach them to try and "play the game their way".... ....oh, wait, we said they could"
5) "Well, now they are even less satisfied than they were before, I don't understand it????"


What A Sensible Game Developer Would Do:
1) "Hey look, some of these guys have found a way around our ridiculously low (when compared to earning potential) TF Cap".
2) "We have to find some way to address this".
3) "Let's talk to the players to understand why they feel the need to use this "work around".
4) "It seems they feel their effort is wasted once they reach the TF cap and some of them stop playing when they have done so; and there is no synchronicity between the peak TF Reward day and the ability to use TF on the desired vendor - Kai Zykken".
5) "Well, maybe we can look at making it so that Kai Zykken is available at "Peak TF Reward Day"; we can either move Conquest Reward day nearer to Kai Zykken availability, or move Kai Zykken to nearer to conquest reward day."
6) "While we are at it, maybe we could look at increasing the TF Cap, so that players keep all the rewards of their investment into playing this game, and that will incentivise them to keep playing."
7) "Hey look, it worked, players no longer stop playing when the reach the low TF Cap, and they are happy we listened to them and addressed their valid concerns; player satisfaction is actually increasing".


We all know which route should have been taken, both in terms of common sense and customer satisfaction; but we also all know that Bioware has always seen the Customer base as "antagonists to be defeated" rather than "invested partners in improving the game".

All The Best
#Is-This-As-Good-As-It-Gets?

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Jdast's Avatar


Jdast
05.05.2021 , 06:52 AM | #105
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthSpuds View Post
And this is the crux of it.
Agree with overall thrust of your argument, and certainly agree the cap should be raised particularly now there are items that actually cost 10k Tech Fragments. The cap should have been much higher from the get go.

For me, however, Kai Zykken is useful only for Sets / Tacticals that drop from NiM Dxun. Tech Fragments are so easy to come by I just buy the item from the regular vendor w/o a second thought. And, at this point, since Onslaught is a year and a half old now, there isn't much out there I need / want.

To me, the crux of the problem is the following and perhaps a subject for a different thread...

Most of the Sets are pretty meh. There has been nothing new to purchase on the regular vendors since the launch of Onslaught. I'm not saying SWTOR should go the route of ESO (which I know you know well) and inundate players with new Amor Sets, but it's probably time to give us something new to purchase besides 1 OEM / RPM per 10k.

And while we both (and many others) agree BW's current 10K TF cap system is too low, they have been very clear about it. Hence the reason my sympathy for the individual most vociferously complaining about the change is zero.

Cheers,

Dasty

GeneralGyro's Avatar


GeneralGyro
05.05.2021 , 07:36 AM | #106
great change thanks

Crystal_Mind's Avatar


Crystal_Mind
05.05.2021 , 07:44 AM | #107
Quote: Originally Posted by karimthejedi View Post
Have you guys even been reading the comments properly?

The writing is plain and simple; the items explicitly said they were refundable for a X amount of hours even before the update took place, without any indication otherwise.

That's in writing. That's a contract. And what BW is doing now is a breach of contract.
As others have said, the in-game refund timer is hardly a contract. But if you want to talk legal, I'd direct you to Section 4 of the ToS, which basically says EA can change things whenever they feel like it, regardless of how it may inconvenience your in-game progression.

You don't have a leg to stand on. Stop beating a dead horse, already.

casirabit's Avatar


casirabit
Yesterday , 10:04 PM | #108
I just finished contract law just a few weeks ago and here is what you need to do for a Breach of Contract, which by the way is not easily to prove and especially in a situation like this.

Proving a Breach of Contract

Although it may be clear to you that someone else breached the contract, you will still have to prove it in court in order to claim damages. A breach of contract case includes four elements of proof, including:

The existence of a legally enforceable agreement,

The fact that you fulfilled your end of the agreement,

The defendant, or other party, did not fulfill their end of the agreement, and

You sustained damages, or losses, as a direct result of the defendant’s breach

For a successful case, you must prove all four of these elements. This is more difficult than it sounds, as there are some common problems associated with proving a breach of contract.

Common Problems Associated with Proving a Breach of Contract

Two common problems often arise in breach of contract cases. The first occurs when the contract was not in writing. According to New York’s Statute of Frauds, most, although not all, contracts must be in writing in order to be enforceable. In total, the statute outlines 10 instances in which a contract must be written.

One instance in which a contract must be in writing is when one person is paying compensation to another for negotiating a loan. Another is when one person is negotiating the purchase or sale of real property in exchange for compensation. When these specific contracts are not in writing, the court will deem the contract unenforceable and therefore, it is difficult to prove a breach of that contract.

Another common problem associated with proving a breach of contract case is when the defendant denies that a contract was ever in place. This commonly occurs when the contract was not in writing, but was an oral agreement between two or more parties. In these cases, you must prove the essential and specific terms of the agreement that your claim is based on.

Unfortunately, these are just two of the most common problems associated with proving a breach of contract case.

In addition, BW has written into their EULA the following:

4. Availability of EA Services and Updates
We do not guarantee that any EA Service, Content or Entitlement will be available at all times, in all locations, or at any given time or that we will continue to offer a particular EA Service, Content or Entitlements for any particular length of time. EA does not guarantee that EA Services can be accessed on all devices, by means of a specific Internet or connection provider, or in all geographic locations.

From time to time, EA may update, change or modify an EA Service, Content or Entitlements, without notice to you. These updates and modifications may be required in order to continue to use EA Services.

EA may need to update, or reset certain parameters to balance game play and usage of EA Services. These updates or "resets" may cause you setbacks within the relevant game world and may affect characters, games, groups or other Entitlements under your control.

Therefore, they have stated that things can change or they can modify their game and since you had to check off the box or boxes before you could play you have already agreed to that and therefore the Court would rule against you.
A girl should be two things: classy and fabulous. A girl should also always be a lady even when arguing.