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Why only show love (literally) for non-class related romances?


Drachehexe

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After a hiatus I have returned to the game to catch up on the latest content drops. For most of my characters that means starting at "Meet Jekiah Ordo" and moving on from there.

 

While all the contenet from there on is expectedly short, I couldn't help but feel the attention to any romances, specifically during "Echoes of Oblivion", are only given to non-class related romances. From all the characters I have done this with the only romances that got any attention were from Lana, Theron, and Arcann. Characters not in a romance with eithe rof those three got nothing. I don't like that at all.

 

While I don't place great importance on the romances in the game (and there are many that do) this feels incomple and unbalanced. I still have some classes to do but I expect the same; only characters who are romantically involved with either Lana, Theron, or Arcann get that extra little bit.

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Seems pretty obvious why. There are 19 class story romances, so bringing them all back means 19 voice actors, 19 scenes to write, and so on. Or they can just have the expansion romances which anyone (class or gender) can romance, so it's just the few required.
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Seems pretty obvious why. There are 19 class story romances, so bringing them all back means 19 voice actors, 19 scenes to write, and so on. Or they can just have the expansion romances which anyone (class or gender) can romance, so it's just the few required.

 

In terms of voice actors, it would actually be 57. The game is recorded in 3 languages, so 19 x 3 = 57.

 

That's one of the often-overlooked elements of the amount of time required to create new story content for the game. Not only do you have to schedule and record those 19 actors in English but you have to do the same for the other languages as well because they all ship out with the same update(s)

 

Another issue is that I don't believe the actors for the vanilla companions were/are signed to multi-year contracts like the class actors are. The class actors are/were signed to 5 year contracts and those contracts get renewed because they're always going to need the class actors. The vanilla companions not so much.

 

For those wondering why Lana and Theron are in so much story content it's probably because their actors are signed to multi year deals combined with the fact they typically use them for exsposition dumps instead of having the story be told amongst dozens of other characters.

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As said previously, not only would that mean having 57 voice actors to work, there's also the fact that there are 16 player characters (8 classes x 2 genders), the non class specific romances are available to all 16 characters, while the class romances are in most cases available to only 1 of them when they're strictly heterosexual, 2 when they're made playersexual, out of the 16 PCs.

 

So while i'd also like to see more love for the other LIs, it's quite logical that they focus more on the ones who are available to all classes and genders.

Edited by Goreshaga
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Because class romances, like class stories are a thing of the past and they're done with them. It's not just SWTOR but pretty much all MMOs don't look back to old content. Problem for SWTOR is that generally speaking this game's best feature is the older stuff. Edited by Tsillah
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They don't need the voice actors. A cinematic would satisfy no dialogue needed. You finish the Adventure. You go to your ship to reflect and remember the simpler times. You go to your quarters. Your spouse sits on your bed waiting for you. Door closes. Fade to black.
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Because it's cheap for an mmo. And the devs don't really give a crap about class identity anymore (since RotHC, as others so passionately remind me), so jump ship while you can if you don't like this direction. I'm planning to soon. Edited by OriusPrime
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Problem for SWTOR is that generally speaking this game's best feature is the older stuff.

Which is why so many of us (me included) moan about the lack of focus on our original LIs in later content. The class stories are still the best part of this game and LIs are a big part of that. I think BW was hoping back in KotFE that everyone would accept them dispensing with our original companions and move onto the new ones. The opposite happened; they weren't expecting as big a backlash as they got, so much so that they sent out questionnaires to many of us to ask what they'd got wrong and how to improve. Whilst many of my original class companions can go to hell (looking at you Gus Tuno, Risha and Skadge), my class LIs should have been left untouched.

 

They don't need the voice actors. A cinematic would satisfy no dialogue needed. You finish the Adventure. You go to your ship to reflect and remember the simpler times. You go to your quarters. Your spouse sits on your bed waiting for you. Door closes. Fade to black.

Not for me it wouldn't. If they needed to up the sub to afford the voice actors, I'd pay it.

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Whilst many of my original class companions can go to hell (looking at you Gus Tuno, Risha and Skadge), my class LIs should have been left untouched.

 

To each his own, I guess. I'm playing through the Smuggler class story right now, and originally, I was gonna romance Akaavi 'coz 1) my female red-skinned Zabrak Sith Warrior is still my favorite toon/character roleplay so far, and 2) a female Zabrak romance is just far more interesting than a boring human. But theeen, I actually got to meet Akaavi, who turned out to be this vengeful and humorless stiff totally incompatible with my charismatic and wisecracking playboy Smuggler, unlike the saucey and dangerous femme fatale Risha who at least cares about profit over principles as much as my Smuggler, and twice as sarcastic too. Her ice-cold demeanor is the perfect dynamic to my Han Solo-ish scoundrel gunslinger, almost like Leia's cold reaction towards Han at the start.

 

I mean, I'm someone who finds the dangerous Kaliyo f-ing hot even though I also heard that she would also stab me in the back like Risha, so maybe it's just me that's weird, but I do love my women dangerous and spunky, especially in stories of noir and intrigue like the Smuggler and IA class stories. Risha especially so considering that she's not just a clean and sparkly princess like Leia, but more crude and vicious than that. Yum.

 

Same goes for Skadge. He's the only one who could stand my psychopath Bounty Hunter's DS actions while everyone kept moaning about me killing people, ugh. Wish Skadge joined earlier so I didn't have to put up with the other sissy crowds.

 

Haven't met Guss yet, but he seems like such a wet towel that he's probably the only one I agree that I would hate him.

Edited by OriusPrime
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To each his own, I guess.

And hers. I'm a her and I see things in this game from a different perspective. Though I agree with you about Akaavi Spar; she never made sense to me as a companion for a smuggler. I always thought they should have had her return but not re-join as a companion

it would have been better if Akaavi was off doing her own thing like the Trooper companion Tanno Vik. His return made perfect sense to me.

 

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she never made sense to me as a companion for a smuggler.

 

Yeah, well, this game and its strange choices for companions. Probably a result of the leftovers from the beta stage, when you could still dispose of companions you find unlikable. These "incompatible companions" were probably a result of their attempt to give player choices, but after the whining about killed companion healers, they couldn't be bothered to fix the companions' personality, so you get scraps like Akaavi and Skadge (though, again, I can't judge too harshly on Skadge). You also get someone like Ashara who couldn't be corrupted (or killed anymore). You also get Mako who cringes at killing in the face of a BOUNTY Hunter, so go figure.

 

Strange companions everywhere.

Edited by OriusPrime
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Which is why so many of us (me included) moan about the lack of focus on our original LIs in later content. The class stories are still the best part of this game and LIs are a big part of that.

 

The later content simply can't match the vanilla content or keep up with the expectations it created.

 

A problem that Bioware created for themselves was the sheer volume of characters they created that fans/players expected to see continually evolve given how much attention they got in the vanilla story but honestly, even if the game had originally been more successful I still don't see how they eventually wouldn't have to this point due to the number of characters that they need to give attention to or expected to give attention to with story updates.

 

I think BW was hoping back in KotFE that everyone would accept them dispensing with our original companions and move onto the new ones.

 

It was more like Bioware knew they couldn't continue the story of 40 different companions + our own characters + whatever other characters the stories required going forward.

 

From an economical and logistical stand point separating our characters from the vanilla companions while introducing a new smaller cast of companions made absolute sense given Bioware's situation and limited resources. The way they handled it all was executed poorly though.

 

What does Bioware always have to work with for any and every update? The class actors and existing art assets. The class actors are signed to multi year contracts and the art assets (characters, ships, etc) all already exist.

 

What don't they always have to work with for every update? All 40 voice actors for the companions.

 

So then how does Bioware address this or make the best use of what they have already?

 

If the idea or need is to separate our characters from the vanilla companions then narratively they (Bioware) needed to give them some kind of send off or establish new positions for them in the story/galaxy.

 

For example, KOTFE starts off with both factions completely ravaged by the Eternal Empire, a war has broken out, both sides have lost a lot. As a result all avaialbe military personal are reassigned to new locations, ie Rusk, Iresso, Quinn, Talos, etc. All force users are recalled or reassigned to train new Padawans now that many experienced Jedi/Sith have been wiped out by the Eternal Empire. This gets rid of Kira, Jaessa, Nadia, etc. From there it's not hard to come with reasons how and why the rest of the companions could or would be needed in other parts of the galaxy.

 

Some people might say well what about the characters that are more attached or sworn to our characters like Bowdarr, Broonmark, Khem, etc? Well I'd remind those people that it's a good thing that those characters don't require any new VO when it comes to dialogue and thus can stick around without the same issues that the other English speaking companions present.

 

Now how does Bioware go about doing this in the most efficient cost-effective way possible? In the intro cutscene you'd have our characters walking around the ship (just as they are in other expanion intro cutscenes) narrating what happened to everybody. So for the Jedi Knight it would be "Kira was called back to Tython, Doc's medical services were required..." and so on but T7 (a character that needs no new VO) would have stayed by the Knight's side.

 

That is what they needed to do before separating everybody from their companions because at least that way the player knows where they are, what happened to them, why they're not on the ship anymore, part of your party, etc.

 

Is it what people would want? No, but it at least works within the limitations Bioware and their storytelling has. It's also at least something to give players instead of not knowing what happened to X,Y, and Z companions for months on end.

 

Not for me it wouldn't. If they needed to up the sub to afford the voice actors, I'd pay it.

 

Cost isn't the issue with the VO it's more to do with the amount of actors they have to work with at any one time, the fact that the game has be recorded across 3 languages which means you're always multiplying the number of actors by 3, there's the fact that scheduling won't always line up for all the existing actors all the same time so you/they need to write around the characters/actors they do have when they have them.

 

There are 19 LIs. Across 3 languages that's 57 actors. Having an update that would give all those characters time, attention, dialogue, etc, would require a significant amount of time to pull together and I don't mean like 6 months or a year but more like years plural and that's not accounting for other actors/characters the updates would (potentially) need like Malgus or whoever.

 

Keep in mind the VO for the vanilla game was recorded over a period of the game's 5 year long development cycle.

 

Again, like I said earlier even if the game had initially been more successful I don't know how they wouldn't have ultimately ended up with these same problems with the vanilla companions after the game had been going for a few years.

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And hers. I'm a her and I see things in this game from a different perspective. Though I agree with you about Akaavi Spar; she never made sense to me as a companion for a smuggler. I always thought they should have had her return but not re-join as a companion

it would have been better if Akaavi was off doing her own thing like the Trooper companion Tanno Vik. His return made perfect sense to me.

Hey i like Akaavi, she's my Smuggler's (future) wife and i love how she could break him if she wanted to, but is actually a big softy inside, which comes out when he behaves like the big goofy idiot that he is.

The romance is fun and one of the very few male PC x female LI from the class stories that i actually enjoy, mostly because there's no creepy power dynamic between the two.

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I was quite annoyed when my Smuggler declined a relationship with Akaavi they made him a bigot for not wanting to be with a woman with horns. That wasn't the reason at all. He was already involved with Risha. The dialogue wheel only said "No". It was the cut scene that made the offensive comment. I never flirted with her.

 

I had to be more careful with my second Smuggler. He hates Risha so no romance there, but he still wasn't interested in Akaavi. In order not to be a bigot I had to be a jerk. I had to accept a couple of flirt options then when she wanted a commitment I was able to get out of it without bigotry, but she was still upset about it.

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Maybe that's dependent on what species your character is. My male Zabrak romanced Risha and didn't get any conversations with Akaavi where he sounded like a bigot. My male twillik romanced Akaavi. (my zabrak is LS, my twillik started out LS and became DS)... I would have done them the reverse just so they'd match if I had known back in the beginning how the story would go. (pair the 2 red zabrak together, and put the twillik with Risha).

 

More than that, Akaavi gets the opportunity to join the Bounty Hunter's crew later on, which she quickly became my (female ) BH's 2nd favorite companion (her first is Torian, her spouse).

 

Gus I enjoy the dialogue, I find it amusing.

 

I'm also not throwing Skadge out the airlock, because sometimes you just need a murderous thug, especially with my Dark Side Sith (being as his quest is available to all). I also find his comments whenever I have him do a crafting mission hilarious.

 

Coming back to Akaavi, I enjoy her as a character because she is a strong female, not wimpy like some of the other dialogue you get with Nadia or others.

 

Going back to the original poster, I think you could possibly have dialogue without the expense of voice actors by doing it KOTOR style like they have in parts of KOTFE and KOTET, and have a romance option so that if you press a button on the bed in your ship (like you can sit in various chairs), your romanced companion would come over to you, sit on the bed, and then have fade-to-black.

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Going back to the original poster, I think you could possibly have dialogue without the expense of voice actors by doing it KOTOR style like they have in parts of KOTFE and KOTET, and have a romance option so that if you press a button on the bed in your ship (like you can sit in various chairs), your romanced companion would come over to you, sit on the bed, and then have fade-to-black.

 

Posted this on the forums a few years ago but taking into account the logistics of trying to get all the actors back while looking at everything they currently have (existing assets, VO, etc) I always thought they should repurpose the existing dialogue they have recorded and make it work like KOTOR, Jade Empire, and Dragon Age where they're are conversation loops still available like so...

 

https://i.imgur.com/UEG4v8a.png

 

[Romance] would open a sub-menu of [Kiss] [Alone Time Together] (your fade to black option)

 

A new feature though could be [spend Time Together] or [Hang Out] in which a random (non-voiced) cutscene plays where you and your companion are hanging out at a bar, at a shooting range, practicing lightsaber combat, etc, while love interests would get a couple exclusive ones like walking along a beach together, staring up at the stars, dinner date, etc.

 

There are already scenes and animations for stuff like this in the game. They'd basically be repurposing a lot of what already exist that doesn't get used outside a single cutscene or two.

 

The bonus to having a framework setup like this is that whenever they eventually do get those actors back in they can record additional dialogue that can be added to it. Over time they can also potentially a larger variety of Hang Out scenes to.

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