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Dear Story Team, What Year Are We Currently In?


Ylliarus

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Thanks but you would be surprised at the slack we have received because of it. In the beginning, people told us we were doing it wrong even when we explained that we didn't expect everyone to rp like this and that everyone has their own style. We were not even using the planets in game when we started our roleplaying. Ours was started as a forum roleplay at first because at the time we were waiting for the game to be released and we just sort of game together and interesting that is how our guild was eventually formed which in my opinion was great. Had some great roleplaying with them even though eventually we lost one of the ladies we roleplay with because of a brain aneurysm.

 

I am so sorry to hear that, both that you did get slack for it and that you lost one of your members.

 

The Heavy RP community can be like that at times, yeah. Often its members will think that the RP they do is the better form of it and other ways are lesser. But I think that slowly attitudes are changing and that roleplayers start to see there's various different ways to RP! At least, I hope that is the case :)

 

And especially considering that you started your RP before the game on the forums. It makes a lot of sense to want to continue that instead of timejumping to the recent era. Tbh, I had always wanted to play/roleplay in the years before the Sacking of Coruscant. The Great Galactic War sounds like an amazingly interesting era to RP in!

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The highest possible praise :) Thanks!

 

Really enjoying the conversations, please keep your thoughts coming!

 

You're welcome! I do have a question/remark though:

 

On the SWTOR site it is said that - within the in-universe lore - the Galactic Senate adopted the BTC (Before the Treaty of Coruscant) and ATC (After the Treaty of Coruscant) calendar system. While that event would of course be a massive victory for the Sith Empire, it would seem somewhat... unpatriotic if the Empire adopted a calendar system that was created and introduced by the Galactic Senate of the Republic, their mortal enemies.

 

Would it be possible that the Sith Empire used a different dating system, one that is still recent but more geared towards the Empire's priorities and values? For example, the Sith Empire could have adopted BRK (Before the Reclamation of Korriban) and ARK (After the Reclamation of Korriban). The Battle of Korriban in which the Empire reclaimed its ancient homeworld seems like a really significant date, one that Imperial propagandists may want to emphasise on by turning it into a calendar system.

 

If the Sith Empire reclaimed Korriban in 28 BTC, that would mean that is 0 or 1 ARK for the Sith Empire, the start of that calendar. As such, the current year 27 ATC (After the Treaty of Corusant) would be 55 ARK (After the Reclamation of Korriban) in the Sith Empire (because 28 + 27 = 55).

Edited by Ylliarus
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Would it be possible that the Sith Empire used a different dating system, one that is still recent but more geared towards the Empire's priorities and values? For example, the Sith Empire could have adopted BRK (Before the Reclamation of Korriban) and ARK (After the Reclamation of Korriban).

 

I'm sure the Sith Empire has some sort of timing convention of its own, but I think introducing another one into the lore just for the sake of it might get confusing. Considering the direction SWTOR has taken since launch, the whole Before / After Treaty of Coruscant thing was never utilized that much, so at this point the whole calendar thing is more for the benefit of us observing the game than for the unseen masses living in the world of the game themselves. It's already kind of amusing when you look up specific events on Wookieepedia and there's like several different time measurements included in that date.

Edited by BenKatarn
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I'm sure the Sith Empire has some sort of timing convention of its own, but I think introducing another one into the lore just for the sake of it might get confusing. Considering the direction SWTOR has taken since launch, the whole Before / After Treaty of Coruscant thing was never utilized that much, so at this point the whole calendar thing is more for the benefit of us observing the game than for the unseen masses living in the world of the game themselves. It's already kind of amusing when you look up specific events on Wookieepedia and there's like several different time measurements included in that date.

 

I don't disagree with you, as you make a very valid point and counter-argument :) However, in terms of lore, a different calendar system for the Sith Empire might make the story experience more immersive. Even if it was only a codex entry as a sort of lore trivia, that would be great for roleplayers who RP Sith or Imperials. They would have an officially recognised date on the Imperial side to use and reference. Aside from the codex entry or site mention, the calendar system could largerly be left untouched, just like BTC and ATC are rarely if ever referenced in the story. The codex entry would just have to mention a few dates and the rest of the calendar timeline could be figured out by way of deduction. For example, the Battle of Serenno took place in c. 7 BTC, that would be c. 21 ARK (After the Reclamation of Korriban) within the Sith Empire calendar. Darth Malak was killed in 303 BTC, so that would be 275 BRK (Before the Reclamation of Korriban) in the Imperial calendar. The Great Hyperspace War started and ended in 1347 BTC, so that would be 1319 BRK on Impside. The class stories start in 10 ATC, so that would be 38 ARK (After the Reclamation of Korriban) for the Sith. The Battle of Ilum takes place in 13 ATC, so 41 ARK for the Empire. Just mentioned a few dates like this within such a hypothetical codex entry would be enough to let the ways of logical deduction take over afterwards :)

 

Of course, this is just an idea and suggestion to help the story's experience feel more immersive when playing within the Sith Empire. As I said before, it feels odd to think the Dark Council of the Sith Empire adopted a calendar system commission and introduced by the Galactic Senate. The Empire would choose something more patriotic, I believe, it terms of calendar systems :p

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Of course, this is just an idea and suggestion to help the story's experience feel more immersive when playing within the Sith Empire. As I said before, it feels odd to think the Dark Council of the Sith Empire adopted a calendar system commission and introduced by the Galactic Senate. The Empire would choose something more patriotic, I believe, it terms of calendar systems :p

 

Would it be more immersive? Definitely, but so would strictly separated GTNs (wasn't that a thing at launch?) and the Sith Empire having it's own currency and a strict no-trade rule with people who aren't Imperial. That could certainly benefit immersion, but at the cost of quality of life in the game itself. There has to be a balance. I'm not saying that having an extra time unit for the Sith Empire itself wouldn't be cool (Before / After the Reclamation of Korriban, or Before / After the Exodus after the Great Hyperspace War or Before / After Settling of Dromund Kaas), but I believe it to be unnecessary. That goes a little too deep I think and can easily just be set up by roleplayers themselves.

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Would it be more immersive? Definitely, but so would strictly separated GTNs (wasn't that a thing at launch?) and the Sith Empire having it's own currency and a strict no-trade rule with people who aren't Imperial. That could certainly benefit immersion, but at the cost of quality of life in the game itself. There has to be a balance. I'm not saying that having an extra time unit for the Sith Empire itself wouldn't be cool (Before / After the Reclamation of Korriban, or Before / After the Exodus after the Great Hyperspace War or Before / After Settling of Dromund Kaas), but I believe it to be unnecessary. That goes a little too deep I think and can easily just be set up by roleplayers themselves.

 

As I said, no disagreement from my side, as you raise valid points :) Mainly I was just throwing out an idea into the open, nothing more. It is already amazing that we have a specific calendar for this era, even if it isn't referenced that much in the story.

 

That said, I do hope the current in-universe year can somehow be included into the game in its ATC format. For example, the in-universe year could be included into the mission description of the first story mission text. Or it could fade in along the story update title when the first cutscene starts to play. Of course, this doesn't need to be added retroactively (albeit that would be nice). If future story updates contain it, that would be neat.

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The thing that struck me most about Charles’ comments was that the eight original class stories are presumed to take place over the span of three years. Based on my own timeline and having played through all eight class stories myself at least a few times, I always excepted that the in-game events certainly probably took place over the course of several months, and three years does seem quite extensive to me personally.

 

Three years doesn't sound extensive at all, if you ask me. The fact that our characters go from Jedi Padawan to Jedi Master in the span of 3 years is exceptionally short, when normal characters and NPCs need decades to reach masterhood. The same applies for the Inquisitor and Warrior, they go from Acolyte to Darth in only three years. That's incredibly short, but considering the classes are meant to be special and unique characters, it is acceptable. But the fact all of the class story events happen in only 3 years is really short and fast-paced.

 

I agree with the camp of thought that the game appears to start in the year ATC 13. Like Charles, I arrived at this by using the Star Wars: The Old Republic Encyclopedia as my primary source. In the book’s timeline (p. 19), it states the Cold War ends c. 3,640 BBY, or ATC 13. The book’s galaxy map (p. 284, 285) also contains a note saying that the galaxy as depicted on those pages is recent as of ATC 13.

 

Small correction: the game's class stories end in 13 ATC, not begin. As Charles Boyd has noted, the game's story begins in 10 ATC. Otherwise, 13 ATC is indeed the year the Cold War ends and the Galactic War starts.

 

Some of the dates I provide on my timeline do conflict with some as Charles’ statements, but I am hopeful at his tease that perhaps BioWare will address the in-game timeline more formally in the future.

 

Well, the statements that Charles Boyd made are really accurate I believe, even if Bioware is working on a more official timeline release or something of the sort. I would suggest to change any dates in your timeline to what Charles Boyd has stated, as he has the clearest view of the entire picture, I believe. I'd say his statements would be the more accurate ones, even if they aren't entirely super official yet ;)

 

I had a lot of fun developing my own timeline back in April, event despite vague and conflicting sourcing. In the course of attempting to flesh out this history, my love of Star Wars and SWTOR lore only grew. While developing this project, I found myself curious about gaps in SW lore that could prospectively be addressed in SWTOR in the future. For instance, the last of the seventeen Alsakan Conflicts we know of that took place before the events of SWTOR was the Tenth Alsakan Conflict which started in approximately BTC 6,347 in the Ductavis Era; the first of the conflicts to take place after the events of SWTOR is the Seventeenth Alsakan Conflict (the final one) which occurs in ATC 636; that leaves a considerable gap during which six of those conflicts had to take place (I presume at least one of those conflicts would take place during the SWTOR era. How epic would that be to see in the game!?). Another fascinating aspect of the project was to see just how many important galactic events took place during the reign of the Sith Emperor of the hidden Empire on Dromund Kaas. It really calls into question to what degree Vitiate was aware (and prospectively involved) in some of those events. It was also during this project that I had to critically reexamine the place of Iokath in the game's lore; having spent time endeavoring to place events to ancient civilizations such as the Rakata, Gree, and Kwa, it really called into question for me whether the Iokathii could be thrown into this same category of ancient, powerful species.

 

While it would be really awesome to see one of the Alsakan Conflicts happen within the game, if it occurred it would have to happen in the scope of the renewed war between the Republic and Empire. The Jedi vs Sith and Republic vs Empire conflict has always been at the core of this games story and we only got that part of the story back a short while ago. I wouldn't want an Alsakan War to overshadow the Third Galactic War, atm. Sure, the potential Alsakan Conflict could happen as a part of the Third Galactic War, though.

 

A potential scenario could be that Alsakan believes Coruscant's position to be weakened as a result of the war with the Empire and the resource crisis, so they want to exploit the ongoing turmoil and chaos to challenge Coruscant again in a new conflict. The Sith Empire would obviously want make use of such a conflict and seek to stir things up (much alike they try to do on Dantooine). That is a way how an Alsakan Conflict could become part of the game's story.

Edited by Ylliarus
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I am so sorry to hear that, both that you did get slack for it and that you lost one of your members.

 

The Heavy RP community can be like that at times, yeah. Often its members will think that the RP they do is the better form of it and other ways are lesser. But I think that slowly attitudes are changing and that roleplayers start to see there's various different ways to RP! At least, I hope that is the case :)

 

And especially considering that you started your RP before the game on the forums. It makes a lot of sense to want to continue that instead of timejumping to the recent era. Tbh, I had always wanted to play/roleplay in the years before the Sacking of Coruscant. The Great Galactic War sounds like an amazingly interesting era to RP in!

 

Thanks and yea it is interesting. We don't do as much as we used to because of real life commitments right now.

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Thanks and yea it is interesting. We don't do as much as we used to because of real life commitments right now.

 

That makes sense, yeah. Real life has called me away from RP numerous times as well, so I definitely get the sentiment.

 

Tbh, I would love to see more RP guilds that RP within other parts of the timeline. The Great Galactic War could inspire a lot of great storytelling. Things like the Battle of Alderaan or the Invasion of Serenno would be damn neat to witness in RP.

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What a surprise! You got an answer from the devs and people are still not happy. I'm shocked! 😂 😍

 

Uh... have you even read the responses since Charles Boyd's post? Because it seems you haven't. I have yet to see someone in here who isn't happy with the incredible and elaborate answer Charles Boyd gave. In fact, many have expressed their joy at receiving a clarification, especially players from the RP community I am a part of. The only thing is that people have additional questions. Surely it is not a crime to have additional questions? In fact, Charles Boyd urged us to post suggestions, questions or contradictions we noticed.

 

You're looking for a problem where there is none, mate. I suggest you create problems in another thread.

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  • Dev Post

Some more quick answers here, but it looks like folks are generally feeling good with what we’ve put together – we’ll stick with this going forward and look for opportunities to present it more “formally” sometime down the road. Huge thanks to all of you for joining in the discussion!

 

Question for the story team as well, at the current point that in-game lore is at, what age would you say the 8 classes are, if you had to guess?

 

I don’t like to give any “canon” age for the player characters; that should be left up to the player themselves as much as possible IMO :)

 

Are the ages for the companions as stated in the Encyclopedia their ages at the time we meet them in game (For example, is Risha 21 when we meet her in the Prologue?) or their ages around the time of 13 ATC/ 3640 BBY?

 

Oof… I’m actually not sure what everyone’s intent was when we put that together. There were numerous authors on the encyclopedia, and all class writers were consulted, but I forget if we made this specific distinction when presenting the information.

 

Giving it a quick look, I’m going to say that the companion ages in the encyclopedia are probably intended as their ages when they’re recruited, not at 13 ATC. For example, I don’t think Kira is intended to be younger than Nadia, but Nadia is listed in the encyclopedia as 22 while Kira is listed as 20.

 

We can make it relatively simple: is Annihilation / Battle of Duro supposed to be set the same year as Ilum, or the year after?

 

Since Drew said pretty explicitly that he intended it for 13 ATC, I’d prefer not to override that if there isn't some glaring conflict to resolve (it doesn't seem like it currently). I can’t recall – do any characters in Annihilation mention Malgus’s uprising?

 

My main problem with all this is that it would mean that the Alliance takes down the Eternal Empire in the same year that it was established, which just rubs me the wrong way.

 

I’ve seen people here and elsewhere saying that it feels wrong in both directions – some, like you, feel it’s too fast; others feel like it couldn’t possibly take that long based on how the chapters themselves feel. I suspect the timing here will never please everyone, but in your specific case I would personally look to the fact that the Alliance is made up of staggeringly powerful and skilled people who (until it was formed) were unable to combine their efforts. Once they could, it doesn’t seem like such a stretch to me that things took a turn within a year, IMO.

 

is there an IRL month that corresponds to the change in a year in the game?

 

Again, for simplicity’s sake, I use the IRL year rollover (December->January) to mark the in-game year rollover. I admit this is arbitrary, but IMO it’s just one more area where the vagueness of time in Star Wars doesn’t actually hold up to scrutiny because it was never meant to. What month was the Treaty of Coruscant signed? Was it coincidentally the same exact month as the Battle of Yavin, thousands of years later? Wouldn’t there be times where Event A could be in 13 ATC, and Event B is in 14 ATC, but they’re both in 3640 BBY? Or vice versa?

 

That way lies madness, so let’s just all pretend Malgus was crashing the Jedi’s new year’s party in Deceived and not dig any deeper into this hole :p

 

Would it be possible that the Sith Empire used a different dating system, one that is still recent but more geared towards the Empire's priorities and values?

 

I think that would totally make sense, but I’d personally prefer not to introduce even more complexity into all of this. Furthermore, a new calendar system would constitute new lore, and therefore be something to discuss with our LFL partners; it’s not something I could simply declare in a forum post. So I wholeheartedly support roleplayers using that idea, but I can’t make it an official “thing” at this time :)

 

 

And as long as I'm here, there were a few questions that aren’t really on the topic of the thread, but I’ll indulge real quick ;)

 

What is the relation between our HK-51 and the HK-50s and HK-51s from Knights of the Old Republic II, and where does HK-55 fit into that line? Is he a repurposed and modified HK-51 built specifically for Lana, or is he a one of a kind creation by the Empire after we recovered HK-51 from Section X?

 

I was under the impression that HK-51 was only in deleted content for KOTOR II? As for HK-55, our intent was that he’s his own new and improved model created by the Empire, but only produced in very limited quantities (which is why we haven’t run into any others yet).

 

You know, I would still like to know why you decided to "uplift" a character such as Savik, who had exactly one appearance and didn't even speak back then.

 

I chose her precisely because she was unmemorable in her first appearance. I wanted a character that players were likely to have fought, but unlikely to remember, so that they could experience that feeling of having a huge impact on a character’s life without ever having considered it at the time.

 

Regarding the role of Kira and Scourge in ending Vitiate, did they know about the Alliance at that point?

 

I’d hesitate to get into too much “official” detail on stuff like that, since leaving it open a bit leaves room for a cool short story or something in the future. But what you go on to suggest is more or less what’s in my head at the moment – they were focused on their own thing in obscure corners of the galaxy, and not all that connected to galactic events. But consider that unofficial for now.

Edited by EricMusco
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Since Drew said pretty explicitly that he intended it for 13 ATC, I’d prefer not to override that if there isn't some glaring conflict to resolve (it doesn't seem like it currently). I can’t recall – do any characters in Annihilation mention Malgus’s uprising?

 

Yes, actually. Darth Karrid was Malgus' apprentice and one of the reasons why the Dark Council is hesitant to accept her as a new member of the Council is because she was Malgus' apprentice and he tried to seize the Imperial throne for himself. So, the novel does actually states its events occur after the Battle of Ilum and Malgus' uprising.

 

On page 61 of my copy of Annihilation Darth Marr explicitly says this about Darth Karrid after Darth Ravage had expressed his outrage at the idea of putting her on the Dark Council because she was Malgus' apprentice: "But I will remind you that Darth Karrid turned her back on Malgus when he turned his back on us".

 

That exchange between Ravage and Marr on page 61 explicitly confirms the novel happens after the events on Ilum :)

 

I think that would totally make sense, but I’d personally prefer not to introduce even more complexity into all of this. Furthermore, a new calendar system would constitute new lore, and therefore be something to discuss with our LFL partners; it’s not something I could simply declare in a forum post. So I wholeheartedly support roleplayers using that idea, but I can’t make it an official “thing” at this time :)

 

Of course! That makes perfect sense :) it was more a question that I and a few others were wondering about! But I admit, it would be nice if there was a reference made to an Imperial calendar in the story at some point. It wouldn't have to name any specific dates, but it would be a cool bit of immersive lore if it was mentioned there was another calendar within the Empire!

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I was under the impression that HK-51 was only in deleted content for KOTOR II? As for HK-55, our intent was that he’s his own new and improved model created by the Empire, but only produced in very limited quantities (which is why we haven’t run into any others yet).

 

I know this isn't massively related to the thread, but it's a question I've wondered for a while. Do you guys consider cut content from Kotor II to be canon (in the loose term, since obviously they're all under the legends umbrella)? I always thought yes, considering HK-51 was in the game. I know Dave Filoni considers unfinished TCW scripts to be canon, and Leland Che considers deleted scenes for ROTS/ATOC/TPM canon unless contradicted, but those are examples more of people deciding the projects they were involved with will influence their works. You guys obviously weren't involved with Kotor 2, but do you let its cut content influence your work? If we ever saw Telos, would you consider the HK factory ruins to be there?

 

I'm reminded of this quote by Anthony Davis, who sort of indicates to him that it is:

"One of the things we would talk about as the various Sith Restoration projects went on was just how lucky we were that the game was so well received by some great guys like you two guys, you would fix that which we could not fix. We were not allowed to. We're just - we're really appreciative of that.

 

You helped complete the experience for many people. Many people who get the game for the first time, like from a Steam sale or whatever, their friends are going to tell them, 'Yeah, go get The Sith Lords Restored Content Mod, put that on their first - that's the way it was intended to be.' And that's correct. And just, really, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart, I mean it."[/Quote]

 

Either way, I'd love to know what you thought. I know there wasn't tonnes of deleted content for Kotor 2, but there was enough important stuff that it could still have quite an effect on TOR's lore, 300 years later.

Edited by Selenial
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If we ever saw Telos, would you consider the HK factory ruins to be there?

 

Tbh, I have been wondering for ages what's been going on, on Telos IV. Especially since Star Wars galaxy maps seem to put the planet in what should be Sith Empire space, based on logical deduction of how the borders are described to look in the timeline videos. So, I'd love to see the planet pop-up ingame sometime, either in a codex entry or story mention :)

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Giving it a quick look, I’m going to say that the companion ages in the encyclopedia are probably intended as their ages when they’re recruited, not at 13 ATC. For example, I don’t think Kira is intended to be younger than Nadia, but Nadia is listed in the encyclopedia as 22 while Kira is listed as 20.

About companions ages, how old are Mako and Torian when we meet them ?

I found 19 for Mako and 17 for Torian, but i find it hard to believe he'd be 2 years younger than her. And him being less than 18 would be somewhat odd honnestly.

I also found 17 for Mako and 18 for Torian, so i just don't know...

 

And how old is Lana too ? I'd say she's probably around Theron's age, which would make her around 40 by now, but her age was never stated.

Edited by Goreshaga
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I was under the impression that HK-51 was only in deleted content for KOTOR II? As for HK-55, our intent was that he’s his own new and improved model created by the Empire, but only produced in very limited quantities (which is why we haven’t run into any others yet).

 

This is totally on me. I was under the impression that the HK-51's were mentioned in the New Essential Guide to Droids book, but when I looked back at it, they weren't in there. Knowing me, I based that off of when I first saw the Wookieepedia entry for HK-51 back after he was announced to be coming to TOR. so, ignore my Faux pas, But, I mean an HK with icy blue eyes? How could I not like it?!? Haha

 

But thanks for answering my other questions! The Encyclopedia is always by my desk when I am writing!

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Tbh, I have been wondering for ages what's been going on, on Telos IV. Especially since Star Wars galaxy maps seem to put the planet in what should be Sith Empire space, based on logical deduction of how the borders are described to look in the timeline videos. So, I'd love to see the planet pop-up ingame sometime, either in a codex entry or story mention :)

 

I know that there was a mention of an Onasi Station (Which according to the Wookieepedia article, is located near Telos), same with Telos, in one of the crew skill missions, but I don't remember off hand which missions mention them.

 

But, I agree, I'd love to see a return to Telos! And it would be a good excuse to add more KotOR armors to the game! :p

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Hm, considering Annihilation was released in 2012 and happens in 3640 BBY/13 ATC, wouldn't that make all the game updates of this IRL year (2012) in the same IG year (13 ATC) ?

 

Which could give :

- Game release in 2011 IRL = from the Prologue (begining of 10 ATC) to Illum (end of 12 ATC)

- 2012 IRL = Annihilation + game updates of 2012 (from KUS to Section-X) in 13 ATC (which would give our characters things to do while Theron's busy with Operation End Game)

- 2013 IRL = Makeb, CZ-198 and Oricon in 14 ATC

- 2014 IRL = KDY, Forged Alliances and SoR in 15 ATC

- 2015 IRL = Ziost + KOTFE 1 in 16 ATC, then timeskip to KOTFE 3 to 9 in 21 ATC

- 2016 IRL = from KOTFE 10 to the end of KOTET in 22 ATC

- 2017 IRL = Uprisings, Iokath (+ the machine gods), Umbara and Copero in 23 ATC

- 2018 IRL = Nathema + JUS in 24 ATC

- 2019 IRL = Dantooine, Hearts & Minds, Mysterious Observers and Onslaught in 25 ATC

- 2020 IRL = Task at hand and the rest of what's to come this year in 26 ATC

Edited by Goreshaga
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Hm, considering Annihilation was released in 2012 and happens in 3640 BBY/13 ATC, wouldn't that make all the game updates of this IRL year (2012) in the same IG year (13 ATC) ?

 

Which could give :

- Game release in 2011 IRL = from the Prologue (begining of 10 ATC) to Illum (end of 12 ATC)

- 2012 IRL = Annihilation + game updates of 2012 (from KUS to Section-X) in 13 ATC (which would give our characters things to do while Theron's busy with Operation End Game)

- 2013 IRL = Makeb, CZ-198 and Oricon in 14 ATC

- 2014 IRL = KDY, Forged Alliances and SoR in 15 ATC

- 2015 IRL = Ziost + KOTFE 1 in 16 ATC, then timeskip to KOTFE 3 to 9 in 21 ATC

- 2016 IRL = from KOTFE 10 to the end of KOTET in 22 ATC

- 2017 IRL = Uprisings, Iokath (+ the machine gods), Umbara and Copero in 23 ATC

- 2018 IRL = Nathema + JUS in 24 ATC

- 2019 IRL = Dantooine, Hearts & Minds, Mysterious Observers and Onslaught in 25 ATC

- 2020 IRL = Task at hand and the rest of what's to come this year in 26 ATC

 

That wouldn't fit with what has already been established by the lore, especially in the SWTOR Encyclopedia. That book explicitly states that the Cold War ended in 13 ATC, so that means that's during chapter 3 of the class stories, I believe. If so, then Ilum cannot happen in 12 ATC, but it happens in 13 ATC. And since Annihilation happens after Ilum (what with all the Karrid and Malgus references) it happens in 13 ATC as well.

Edited by Ylliarus
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That wouldn't fit with what has already been established by the lore, especially in the SWTOR Encyclopedia. That book explicitly states that the Cold War ended in 13 ATC, so that means that's during chapter 3 of the class stories, I believe. If so, then Ilum cannot happen in 12 ATC, but it happens in 13 ATC. And since Annihilation happens after Ilum (what with all the Karrid and Malgus references) it happens in 13 ATC as well.

Yeah, dunno, i just feel like puting both Ilum and Annihilation at the end of the same year is a bit too much, with everything tha happens during Annihilation.

And then our characters don't have that much to do during the follownig year, while it's supposed to be an all out war between the Empire and the Republic.

 

That being said, official sources also contradicts themselves sometimes. Annihilation is during 13 ATC / 3640 BBY according to Drew Karpyshyn and he also states Theron is 30, which is impossible as he'd have to be born in 3670 BBY.

 

But, according to Wookieepedia :

The Journal of Master Gnost-Dural indicates that the Battle of Alderaan occurs four years after the Battle of Bothawui. According to Timeline 5: The Battle of Bothawui the Battle of Bothawui occurs eighteen years before the Treaty of Coruscant, which, as seen in The Old Republic: Deceived, is proposed and ratified in 3653 BBY. Thusly, the Battle of Bothawui takes place in 3671 BBY, and the Battle of Alderaan occurs four years later, in 3667 BBY.

 

So for Theron to be 30 in 3640 BBY, he'd have to be born 3 years before the Battle of Alderaan, while Jace and Satele started their 6 month affair which led to him being born after that battle.

Edited by Goreshaga
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I don’t like to give any “canon” age for the player characters; that should be left up to the player themselves as much as possible IMO :)

 

Maybe you can tell the team again that we'd like to have access to an age slider in character creation then, that would be great. While I consider all of "my canon's" characters to be between 18 and 22 when starting out in the game, I've got a lot of characters who are older, from the previous generation, parents and mentors to certain characters etc. Don't want all of those to look just as fresh-faced as the main people, and there's only so much you can do with faces, complexions and beards to make people look older. We need some wrinkles ;)

 

Oof… I’m actually not sure what everyone’s intent was when we put that together. There were numerous authors on the encyclopedia, and all class writers were consulted, but I forget if we made this specific distinction when presenting the information.

 

Giving it a quick look, I’m going to say that the companion ages in the encyclopedia are probably intended as their ages when they’re recruited, not at 13 ATC. For example, I don’t think Kira is intended to be younger than Nadia, but Nadia is listed in the encyclopedia as 22 while Kira is listed as 20.

 

My thoughts as well. This also meshes well enough with your timeline of things and given the fact that the codex entries for Imperial Agent companions also list an age, which you don't get until you've recruited them.

 

Since Drew said pretty explicitly that he intended it for 13 ATC, I’d prefer not to override that if there isn't some glaring conflict to resolve (it doesn't seem like it currently). I can’t recall – do any characters in Annihilation mention Malgus’s uprising?

 

Yes, it does. There is dispute among the Dark Council with regards to Darth Karrid to replace the recently deceased Darth Hadra (died on Corellia during the freeing of the Legislature, same quest that Republic players run into/over Savik), because Karrid is a former student of Darth Malgus. Because of this, I'd feel it better to situate Annihilation in the year following Ilum, otherwise the end of 13 ATC gets much too crowded with big events, which is one more reason why I personally advocate that the at-launch-content with Ilum ends in 12 ATC and everything released post-launch gets placed in 13 ATC onwards.

 

I’ve seen people here and elsewhere saying that it feels wrong in both directions – some, like you, feel it’s too fast; others feel like it couldn’t possibly take that long based on how the chapters themselves feel. I suspect the timing here will never please everyone, but in your specific case I would personally look to the fact that the Alliance is made up of staggeringly powerful and skilled people who (until it was formed) were unable to combine their efforts. Once they could, it doesn’t seem like such a stretch to me that things took a turn within a year, IMO.

 

I think this is probably also an issue because, as you told us long ago, the whole Zakuul thing was originally supposed to be spread across three expansions, but the reception of KOTFE caused it to be scaled back to 2 (1.5 really, when you think about it). This also brings up an interesting question. I somehow doubt that any of the stuff that ended up on the cutting room floor will still find its way into the game, so could you maybe share some tidbits of what we would have seen, had the story progressed the way it was originally envisioned?

 

Again, for simplicity’s sake, I use the IRL year rollover (December->January) to mark the in-game year rollover. I admit this is arbitrary, but IMO it’s just one more area where the vagueness of time in Star Wars doesn’t actually hold up to scrutiny because it was never meant to. What month was the Treaty of Coruscant signed? Was it coincidentally the same exact month as the Battle of Yavin, thousands of years later? Wouldn’t there be times where Event A could be in 13 ATC, and Event B is in 14 ATC, but they’re both in 3640 BBY? Or vice versa?

 

I get your point. That is why I'm not exactly a fan of this whole thing of a set of events starting in one year and then ending in the middle of the next. If everything was relegated to one year (Year 1 for Prologue / Chapter 1, Year 2 for Chapter 2 and Year 3 for Chapter 3), it would have been simpler and cleaner, in my opinion, especially if an in-universe calender system does not commit to the usage of smaller units of time, like months.

 

I think that would totally make sense, but I’d personally prefer not to introduce even more complexity into all of this. Furthermore, a new calendar system would constitute new lore, and therefore be something to discuss with our LFL partners; it’s not something I could simply declare in a forum post. So I wholeheartedly support roleplayers using that idea, but I can’t make it an official “thing” at this time :)

 

Would definitely be nice. We haven't had any meaty blog posts or short stories in a while.

 

I chose her precisely because she was unmemorable in her first appearance. I wanted a character that players were likely to have fought, but unlikely to remember, so that they could experience that feeling of having a huge impact on a character’s life without ever having considered it at the time.

 

A nice idea, granted. Given the Dark Council's history and high turnover rate in recent years though, I'd have liked some more competent people in the Empire's power structure. Both Malora and Savik didn't exactly fit that bill in my opinion. As previously mentioned, I'd have rather had someone more experienced promoted to the rank, like Darth Numin, Lord Medechas or Darth Rictus (whom we never even saw in the game).

 

I’d hesitate to get into too much “official” detail on stuff like that, since leaving it open a bit leaves room for a cool short story or something in the future. But what you go on to suggest is more or less what’s in my head at the moment – they were focused on their own thing in obscure corners of the galaxy, and not all that connected to galactic events. But consider that unofficial for now.

 

Understood, but if I may ask, what do you think how long Kira and Scourge actually kept looking for the Knight before going off on their quest to destroy Vitiate's original body? Doc mentions he got separated from then on Begeren, while Master Ranos mentioned earlier that Kira ran her own resistance movement for a bit before Arcann cracked down on them.

 

About companions ages, how old are Mako and Torian when we meet them ?

I found 19 for Mako and 17 for Torian, but i find it hard to believe he'd be 2 years younger than her. And him being less than 18 would be somewhat odd honnestly.

I also found 17 for Mako and 18 for Torian, so i just don't know...

 

According to Charles, Chapter 1 ends in late 11 ATC with chapter 2 still beginning in that year. That likely means that seeing Torian in the background of the Great Hunt winner ceremony on Dromund Kaas and then later meeting him during the quest to become Mandalorian means he's the same age then. Since there are no means to pinpoint the specific point in the story where the year shifts in the game, I'd argue that seeing him on Dromund Kaas and then recruiting him on Taris is likely to still fit in the same year, making him 18.

 

And how old is Lana too ? I'd say she's probably around Theron's age, which would make her around 40 by now, but her age was never stated.

 

I believe I asked Charles this a year or so ago on Twitter. As I recall, his answer was basically "near Theron's age", since she's supposed to be his contemporary. According to Drew Karpyshn, Theron is 30 by the time of Annihilation, which he says takes place in 3640 BBY. If this fits with Charles' point of view, then Theron would be

about 44 now, with Lana in a similiar range of late 30s to early 40s. Phew, they sure grew old fast.

Edited by BenKatarn
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  • 1 year later...

 

 

Qyzen Fess ?? → ??

 

 

They should give an optional alliance alert for Qyzen to have a death scene or make it part of the story somehow or something... I mean, he's meant to be entering the final stages of his life during chapter 2 (I think?) of the class story and speaks about how he does not have many years left. How is he still going, what now, 15 years later?!

 

It'd be cool to have him die tbh. It's not like he's a hugely important companion anymore, and it'd be kind of emotional for Consulars to lose their original buddy, their old Master's friend, faithful Qyzen.

 

Obviously, It'd be better to have it be a optional thing though cos of course someone would whine about not having lizard man to follow them around and do the same crap every other companion can already do..

 

But some companions should start dying off either through certain story choices or even simple natural causes for the ones who are getting really old. Give us some powerful scenes saying goodbye to old friends. Not love interests though, where possible, it'll annoy too many people who don't trust you not to brick a character they choose to save. I'd be fine with choices LI's can die from though personally.

 

It makes for good story, when it's done right, like a BH leaving a romanced Torian to save Vette, that worked so well. It wasn't random cruelty or a lack of caring that gets him killed, it's wanting to save the more "vulnerable" person and can be RP'd as such, and the voiceover and writing does the moment justice. On the flip side there's no real explanation for a Warrior to get Vette killed beyond random cruelty, she's clearly the more vulnerable party, Torian has more chance of holding his ground as a Mandalorian, so most Warriors aren't gonna have any incentive to save Torian instead and no way to RP legitimate reasons for the choice to leave your love behind.

 

As long as the person isn't bricked forever afterward if you decide against it though, I'd be pleased. How they've handled Theron has been great imo. My Warrior who romanced him still sees him plenty. A heck of a lot more than my other Warrior sees Vette these days..

 

Also, referring to Charles first post, why can I STILL not do any of the stuff between Ilum and Makeb or the stuff post-Makeb on your "story events" list without a group? Seriously? if it's considered something all player characters have done, MAKE IT SOLOABLE.

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