Well one part of the solution would be that Bioware reverts their silly 1.x change where stacking stuns would no longer whitebar you.

 

I.E. If two people stun you at the same time right now, resolve only gets applied for one of them and the other one is pretty much forgotten about. With only a tiny resolve penalty.

 

Its really silly that people can make a colossal mistake like stunning one target simultaneously and not be punished for it.

I always thought that was a silly change anyway. Designed to facilitate poor play.

Edited May 23, 2020 by Evolixe

 

My guildies even joked that you sound like the type of person who, after dying through a stunlock, would rage whisper "I see you can't kill me without all those stuns."

 

now that was funny

Lhancelot, you can't really put PT's and Sins in the same bracket. AP PT's burst and dmg is literally crazy and it's a "3 button" class.

 

I'm playing this for 6 years and recently I've made PT 1st time in "my life", it took me maybe 2-3 wz's to "master" it and even in wz's where I don't do much or anything, I can still pull 7-8k dps in 8v8 like it's nothing.

 

Like I said, 3 button class, insane burst, easy dps.

Well one part of the solution would be that Bioware reverts their silly 1.x change where stacking stuns would no longer whitebar you.

 

I.E. If two people stun you at the same time right now, resolve only gets applied for one of them and the other one is pretty much forgotten about. With only a tiny resolve penalty.

 

Its really silly that people can make a colossal mistake like stunning one target simultaneously and not be punished for it.

I always thought that was a silly change anyway. Designed to facilitate poor play.

 

100% agree

This is a mainstay concept of all decent MMO PvP. Unfortunately, the SWTOR devs don't understand this. I would love to see a dev answer this question:

 

What percentage of time do you expect to be controlled during a normal warzone?

 

15% of the time? 20% of the time?

 

It's more like 90% of the time right now. In a WZ, you are constantly under some kind of control ... stun, mez, root, slow, push, pull.

 

I realize BW does not care about PvP and will not put the time into the effort of fixing all the problems the game has, but slow and root should be added to the Resolve system. This will allow melee a chance to have a little bit of time in a WZ not under some kind of controlling influence.

 

If you wana be technical, the most you can be controlled in a warzone is 50% of the time because of Resolve. Slows aren't really a form of control since you can actually control your character and use defensive abilities/maneuvers while slowed. A Root could be considered controlled though since it stops some defensive abilities from being activated (like an operatives roll).

Edited May 24, 2020 by Jinre_the_Jedi

Well one part of the solution would be that Bioware reverts their silly 1.x change where stacking stuns would no longer whitebar you.

 

I.E. If two people stun you at the same time right now, resolve only gets applied for one of them and the other one is pretty much forgotten about. With only a tiny resolve penalty.

 

Its really silly that people can make a colossal mistake like stunning one target simultaneously and not be punished for it.

I always thought that was a silly change anyway. Designed to facilitate poor play.

 

This works as intended, because if two people stun you at the same time, you only ever sit for the duration of the longer stun. Like, if I Electrocute you, and another Inquisitor also Electrocutes you at the exact same time, you should only get 800 resolve because you are only actually ever stunned for 4 seconds. Now if I slightly overlap my stun with yours in such a way that would cause you to sit in the stun for a longer duration than normal, you will gain resolve for every second of stun over that overlap. I.E: I stun you for 4 seconds, and then another Inquisitor stuns you for 4 seconds, but applies their stun 1 second after mine. This will cause you to sit in the stun for 5 seconds, and you *will* gain an additional 200 resolve for being forced to sit that additional second.

 

There's really no way to abuse resolve in this game by overlapping stuns, because every second you are stunned beyond the overlap will cause you to go over the 1,000 resolve cap and gain even longer CC immunity. Meaning, it's possible to be 1,500/1,000 resolve, which would give you 15 seconds of CC immunity.

 

I go over all of these scenarios here:

 

Now there is an interaction with resolve that's a bit interesting in regards to mixing Mezzes and Hard stuns, but that's not the same as overlapping two hard stuns.

 

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Edit: I re-read your statement and misunderstood your issue. You're saying that people should be penalized for throwing a stun into an already stunned target, not that there's an issue with resolve. Sorry.

 

I still disagree though because overlapping stuns can be useful if used skillfully, specifically when overlapping otherwise short stuns, like spike, or overlapping stuns and mezzes.

Edited May 24, 2020 by Jinre_the_Jedi

I never say this, but this seems like a genuine "learn to play" issue.

Edit: I re-read your statement and misunderstood your issue. You're saying that people should be penalized for throwing a stun into an already stunned target, not that there's an issue with resolve. Sorry.

 

I still disagree though because overlapping stuns can be useful if used skillfully, specifically when overlapping otherwise short stuns, like spike, or overlapping stuns and mezzes.

 

I'm saying people should be penalized for throwing 2 stuns of equal strength on 1 target simultaneously.

 

You toss a stun on someone that adds 800 resolve at the exact same time as someone else, that person should be whitebarred because you clearly made a mistake.

 

It used to work that way, way back. It was changed because people especially in regs would often make this mistake of adding one stun almost directly on top of another. Like I said, it facilitates poor play. It won't make any difference for intentionally stacking stuns. Except that peoples resolve all around might fill a bit quicker since the game will always assume maximum resolve value. Then again, that's kind of what we're after anyway.

This is a mainstay concept of all decent MMO PvP. Unfortunately, the SWTOR devs don't understand this. I would love to see a dev answer this question:

 

What percentage of time do you expect to be controlled during a normal warzone?

 

15% of the time? 20% of the time?

 

It's more like 90% of the time right now. In a WZ, you are constantly under some kind of control ... stun, mez, root, slow, push, pull.

 

I realize BW does not care about PvP and will not put the time into the effort of fixing all the problems the game has, but slow and root should be added to the Resolve system. This will allow melee a chance to have a little bit of time in a WZ not under some kind of controlling influence.

 

I used to play a lot...never experienced what you're experiencing. Sure, it's annoying when y ou're trying to do something...but if we all just beat on one another it would be nothing but a mass brawl.

 

Evolixe put it best. Now, I have not played pvp in about 4 years, but hopefully again soon. I am told gear is absolutely essential even in regs now.

CC in this game is a primary part of PvP strategy so no matter what anyone wants it's always going to be "Too much" or Too little". Tab target Makes any other form of counter play impossible. DCD(s) and CC take the place of positional targeting and dodge (I-frames).

 

Basically without a medium to high degree of CC with the current (long) CD's for defensive abilities PvP would just be a DPS mosh pit AKA boring.

 

I think they should focus more on "I-frame" type abilities to add a higher skill cap to PvP. Basically make abilities like Rocket Out, Force Run, Leap (One low CD movement/escape ability for each class) all provide a 1 sec invincibility frame. Basically a small window to dodge any key ability including CC. The I-Frame duration would need to be tested but it would add a large degree of skill based counter play to the game while maintaining the current CC system.

 

I don't think the answer is to keep swinging the hammer at the current system but rather add to it.

Some specs absolutely need heavy CC to pull off their big combos. There just no way my operative has a chance against a big fat power tech without using my cc. I will get crushed every time. The CC is so important, you throw off your opponents game plan, thats the point. Now when theres 8 v 8 in the middle and everyone is blowing each other up, your likely going to be perma CC'd. If there was half the CC time/spells in this game, it would just be which team gets rushed down first.

I think they should focus more on "I-frame" type abilities to add a higher skill cap to PvP. Basically make abilities like Rocket Out, Force Run, Leap (One low CD movement/escape ability for each class) all provide a 1 sec invincibility frame. Basically a small window to dodge any key ability including CC. The I-Frame duration would need to be tested but it would add a large degree of skill based counter play to the game while maintaining the current CC system.

 

Now that would be really awesome. I like that idea alot.

Lhancelot, you can't really put PT's and Sins in the same bracket. AP PT's burst and dmg is literally crazy and it's a "3 button" class.

 

I'm playing this for 6 years and recently I've made PT 1st time in "my life", it took me maybe 2-3 wz's to "master" it and even in wz's where I don't do much or anything, I can still pull 7-8k dps in 8v8 like it's nothing.

 

Like I said, 3 button class, insane burst, easy dps.

 

PTs are one of those classes I’ve never like playing. But your post has me intrigued enough to have a go for some fun.

Can you explain (for this PT noob) the 3 button rotation you are using to wreak people.

Some specs absolutely need heavy CC to pull off their big combos. There just no way my operative has a chance against a big fat power tech without using my cc. I will get crushed every time. The CC is so important, you throw off your opponents game plan, thats the point. Now when theres 8 v 8 in the middle and everyone is blowing each other up, your likely going to be perma CC'd. If there was half the CC time/spells in this game, it would just be which team gets rushed down first.

 

It’s not just hard stuns and CCs that are the problem. You can keep the current ones in the game and fix the issue by adjusting resolve to last longer or have other controlling abilities add more or some resolve.

This would make players use their brains and tactics/strategy more when using them. Then we wouldn’t need so many passive immunities in the game or speed / mobility buffs.

The other option is to reduce the CD of stun breaks or add a utility that allows you to choose a double charge (2) on stun breaks (like we have for a 30 sec reduced CD)

Edited May 28, 2020 by TrixxieTriss

It’s not just hard stuns and CCs that are the problem. You can keep the current ones in the game and fix the issue by adjusting resolve to last longer or have other controlling abilities add more or some resolve.

This would make players use their brains and tactics/strategy more when using them. Then we wouldn’t need so many passive immunities in the game or speed / mobility buffs.

The other option is to reduce the CD of stun breaks or add a utility that allows you to choose a double charge (2) on stun breaks (like we have for a 30 sec reduced CD)

 

Or remove the CC breaker all together and add I-Frames to short duration mobility/Escape skills like Jet out, Force Speed, Force Leap so that players can "Dodge" CC and/or high damage abilities while using skills that have a purpose. Having a button with a single function outside of normal fluid game play which you hit after you have already eaten a CC is pretty lame design.

 

"I get CC's Derherp, I hit CC fix it button Derp"... Now I play the game again! Weee! It's pretty sad.

Edited May 28, 2020 by Soljin

The game would be 10x more fun if movement abilities were no longer affected by slows.

50% or higher slows were nerfed to be under that amount.

Instant deaths and falling through the map have been at an all-time high due to the number of slows currently ingame including move speed increases. Desync is likely an unmanageable fix so at least starting with these things would make the feeling a lot better.

 

Resolve, I feel is fine the way it is. The cooldowns of stuns and mezzes being affected by alacrity? That I don't like, it's useful but not all CC is created equally. Force bound for example being currently the strongest form of CC ingame due to being an AoE Mezz into a major accuracy debuff for all damage types. Meaning you can at max do nothing as a DPS for 12 seconds, while they can take cooldown reduction from the utility on intimidating roar (force bound) then also have alacrity lower its cooldown. I think this is more so a force bound issue, but still, it's a great example of how strong it is to have such high uptime on something so strong.

You mean getting double bubble stunned (6 seconds total) and awe'd (another 6 seconds) full duration before getting white barred isn't fun??????

 

Insanity

 

Stuns should be removed from all reg matches. Stuns and mezzes are fine for ranked since it's part of the overall death match strategy, but in regs it's absurd how people use CC as crutches because they don't know how to kite or do damage.

 

Without CC, it'll show who can actually pvp and who can't.

Edited May 29, 2020 by Sepruzzo

Without CC, it'll show who can actually pvp and who can't.

 

LMAO this is the biggest 8head I have ever seen

You mean getting double bubble stunned (6 seconds total) and awe'd (another 6 seconds) full duration before getting white barred isn't fun??????

 

Insanity

 

Stuns should be removed from all reg matches. Stuns and mezzes are fine for ranked since it's part of the overall death match strategy, but in regs it's absurd how people use CC as crutches because they don't know how to kite or do damage.

 

Without CC, it'll show who can actually pvp and who can't.

LOL. toughest talk i've read in awhile.

You mean getting double bubble stunned (6 seconds total) and awe'd (another 6 seconds) full duration before getting white barred isn't fun??????

 

Insanity

 

Stuns should be removed from all reg matches. Stuns and mezzes are fine for ranked since it's part of the overall death match strategy, but in regs it's absurd how people use CC as crutches because they don't know how to kite or do damage.

 

Without CC, it'll show who can actually pvp and who can't.

 

Welcome to pvp! Where you get ganged and stuns that happen for free!

 

What bothers me the most is Imps (not all) but these guys (2 juggs and a healer) do 46 kills in a game (I was the victim) and when grouped with us decide to do 16 kills and give away win...ok ok maybe having a bad game...

 

The goes to the nest game and they are doing 46 kills again , the best part...was watching these guys get spanked by a live streamer...I get small victories where I can!

This must be the biggest troll post in history of this game......

People whining about slowes affecting movement (sounds logically) and about cc's while whitebar is a thing everyone knows.

 

Big learn to play issue here , i advise most of these people complaining to relearn their classes and check whitebar system and other class cc's and immunity's.

 

edit : Btw most classes have cleanses for these slows, roots and others can cleanse u too , and don't start with yea but they don't cleanse others etc. This is a l2p issue

Edited May 30, 2020 by Warrioroffhell

If you remove control from the game (stuns, mez, knockbacks, roots) you remove a lot of what makes team-based pvp in this game so interesting. Lining up the perfect control combo (1 player knocks the tank out of guard range, 2 chain a hard stun on the kill target, 1 mezzes the healer) and getting a kill is the most satisfying feeling in pvp, and is the result of teamwork and utilizing all the mechanics this game has to offer.

 

What you are essentially asking for is that control be taken out of pvp, leaving only output (damage, prot, heals) and defensive cooldowns. That would be near-identical to PVE, minus boss mechanics. If you like the idea of going in and doing your rotation without control from other players making you adapt and think on your feet, I highly suggest you make the switch to PVE instead.

 

Thing is, rotations in this game are easy. The buttons that you are supposed to press light up. PVP would be VERY mechanical and rotational without the player control. Sounds boring.

Leave CC alone it adds a degree of strategy and timing to PvP... the problem is the lack of counter play for focus fire/burst and chain CC.

 

It's not CC that's a problem its that you cannot avoid it with skillful play...If someone wants to CC you it will happen (except once every two minutes and you will likely just get hit with the second CC they were setting up w/ the first).

 

Take one low CD ability from each class and add a 1 sec Invincibility frame (test and adjust the duration before implementing). This would allow for CC and Focus fire counter play all in one shot on abilities that are already in the game and designed for "escape".

 

When you add a short I-Frame to one short CD(12-15 secs) Escape ability for ever class...The I-Frame escape severely diminishes the excessive CC Problem.

 

At least this way if you are forced to use your long CD CC breaker you can use your I-frame escape ability after and dodge the second CC if you time it well.

 

Think of the Imperial Agent/Smuggler Dodge Roll ability but make it 100% chance within the I-Frame window (1 sec) instead of an RnG chance to dodge an incoming attack.

Edited May 30, 2020 by Soljin

Leave CC alone it adds a degree of strategy and timing to PvP... the problem is the lack of counter play for focus fire/burst and chain CC.

 

It's not CC that's a problem its that you cannot avoid it with skillful play...If someone wants to CC you it will happen (except once every two minutes and you will likely just get hit with the second CC they were setting up w/ the first).

 

Take one low CD ability from each class and add a 1 sec Invincibility frame (test and adjust the duration before implementing). This would allow for CC and Focus fire counter play all in one shot on abilities that are already in the game and designed for "escape".

 

When you add a short I-Frame to one short CD(12-15 secs) Escape ability for ever class...The I-Frame escape severely diminishes the excessive CC Problem.

 

At least this way if you are forced to use your long CD CC breaker you can use your I-frame escape ability after and dodge the second CC if you time it well.

 

Think of the Imperial Agent/Smuggler Dodge Roll ability but make it 100% chance within the I-Frame window (1 sec) instead of an RnG chance to dodge an incoming attack.

 

What the?

 

No.. itll turn into a question of who wasted the least amounts of CC by accident.

You really cant account for random 1 second cc immunities to not waste any.

What the?

 

No.. itll turn into a question of who wasted the least amounts of CC by accident.

You really cant account for random 1 second cc immunities to not waste any.

 

Honestly I can't make sense of your response. It seems like you don't like the idea because you will no longer be able to guarantee a CC on your target due to the low CD immunity taking away your ability to track the opponents vulnerability easily.... Which is the point.

 

Feel free to clarify I may have misunderstood you.