Hello,

I have seen many players here on the forum, Reddit, discords and decided to write this TLDR. As closer we get to the release of an "expansion" we get less excitement and more hate, criticism towards it. Not one post from the developers adressed this issue, as if they were following this philosophy:

"Let's go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for this all to blow over."- If you know, you know.

I am amazed, truly by the lack of any acknowledgment for the real issues. I am a founder player and I have witnessed this many times in the past. But never before I have seen such negativity being poured over the developers and the team behind swtor, and for the right reasons too.

Usually it's the cry of either Raiders, pvpers or casuals and the constant war of who should be prioritised. But this time it's a unison of all the community against the sheer ignorance and lack of content we will be getting in 7.0

Here are a few examples:

1. No daily area at launch. As we are getting only one new( realistically old, refreshed ) planet to enjoy some gameplay it is being pushed back to 7.1

2. No operation at launch. - Big no no.

3. Non modable gear until at least 7.2/ 7.1.5. That is when The master mode for R4 will come out and we will get mods.

4. No weapon in designer. With a combination of lack of mods, this is something that got the biggest outrage. Who fought it would be ok? You just shanked yourself in the gut with this as cartel market will see a downfall in usage.

5. Change of gear progression- casuals went crazy, 80 % stating that they will unsubscribe if this go live. Some of the changes are good, some abysmal. Get your own opinion on the type of content you are playing.

These points mark the biggest controversies among the players and dissapointment overall.

We have been nothing but fair to the developers. They stated that we don't get anything new and exciting because of covid for 2 years. As universal as this excuse is in every branch of business and services, it can't be used forever. Now after 4th or 5th wave the office life has gone back to normal. Everybody are sitting in their cubicles again and should be doing their jobs.

What is the excuse now? How can you announce an expansion In mid 2021, with a fixed date for December, than postpone it to February( which was good call, last resort type of situation ) and still not deliver a bare minimum for an expansion to be called as such.

This is an utter disgusting managing your own plans and materials. False promises and shouts of amazing content. Where is it Then?

Launch is in 2 weeks and so far, apart from story which most of us will devour in one sitting that evening there is nothing. Yes people will still play the old content with gear changes but you call that expansion? Shame on you really. I have been trying to defend some of the points made by others too.

I actually like how the gearing will work in theory. I was tired of getting bis from hammer station or toborro and amassing millions of useless mods in my inventory. I was looking with an open mind to class pruning, that could potentially increase the difficulty of operations and pvp. I feel dumb now, because of the fact that you take away everything you promised us and you won't even show us the middle finger. Instead we get cold shoulder and complete silence.

I will quickly mention the 10th year celebration. The day came and went without an echo. We got a vague post and more false promises with nothing solid, no dates and praising how amazing combat styles are. Vendor has nothing new, there is no event, no message in the screen, no npc shouting, zero. Just shoot me now please.

So community of this game, do you agree?

Have you also grown tired of this treatment?

How long til the game is dead, because every month, it is spiralling out of control and rocking downhill.

I encourage you to post your opinion, your anger, happiness, rant, praise. Anything really that would get attention of the team. This is me, fighting for what I love, as should you.

This game gave me lots of great memories. I don't want to end my journey with a sour taste as I currently have.

May the force be with you.

I feel you. I don't know how much I have left in me to say, I've posted my complaints a lot lately on here, but I'll try to talk some of the specifics for me:

I think everything I'm even tepidly looking forward to is ruined by other things. For example, yay combat styles, but with class changes and reports on leveling experience, idk if I'd enjoy leveling, and I'm concerned the changes to the character creator (I guess in part to accommodate the new thing of picking styles at creation?) are going to kill some of the game's unique art style; from what I've seen, it's pretty bland now and I've heard reports it's harder to tell accurately how a character looks. I have similar concerns about the changes to the UI. Also, the thing about a 2nd combat style being sub only ruins it as well. I mostly play as a sub when I do play, but it's just another way where it shows their priorities are punishing people for dropping sub instead of making a fun game.

Another example is mob tagging sounds nice, but without other dynamics forms of open world group work and the crowding people into the same areas weekly they are planning to do, it won't save us from issues with clicking the same objectives and killing mobs that die easily, so it's like a tiny improvement in exchange for an overall downgrade. Which I guess sums up how I feel about this expansion in general... tiny improvements in exchange for overall downgrades. I'd almost rather they just stop updating the game and do bug fixes and maintenance and that's it, than get what's coming. At least I can say I get some enjoyment out of the game as it is now. Judging by the coming changes, I'm not confident that'll still be the case come 7.0.

We don't have enough threads about this! (this is sarcasm, in case it wasn't obvious).

I play for the story. Everything else is just something I do to pass the time.

I'm still excited to get SOME new story and hopeful that we will get more this year.

While Bioware has consistently failed when it comes to this game, this "expansion" and the mis-management of everything is the ultimate of failures.

They took everything good about 6.0+ and threw it out the window, while creating more terrible convoluted systems.

How many currencies are there now for gear? That you can o ly use with certain vendors? And now they make 8 million static pieces of gear so you can customize stats...WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT MODDABLE GEAR IS FOR. It really is baffling.

I really wonder how we got to this point. If I was this bad at my job, I would have been fired a long time ago.

Oh well. At least they posted this stuff a few days before my sub runs out so I could cancel my sub just in time.

While Bioware has consistently failed when it comes to this game, this "expansion" and the mis-management of everything is the ultimate of failures.

 

They took everything good about 6.0+ and threw it out the window, while creating more terrible convoluted systems.

 

How many currencies are there now for gear? That you can o ly use with certain vendors? And now they make 8 million static pieces of gear so you can customize stats...WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT MODDABLE GEAR IS FOR. It really is baffling.

 

I really wonder how we got to this point. If I was this bad at my job, I would have been fired a long time ago.

 

Oh well. At least they posted this stuff a few days before my sub runs out so I could cancel my sub just in time.

First let's not act like this is anything new expansions for Swtor have always been like this even back when they were paid for seperately from the actual game we were still actually getting content like this and people were complaining they actually paid for that and paid sub when it was not worth that. People can say oh well if you pay for expansion it would be so much better than what we have been getting. Not exactly true on that it should be in theory but EA/Bioware's practices for expansions on Swtor have always been the same. condensing the game down gradually, little story content, a raid may pop up at launch or it maybe released later (on yeah wow did that for yrs releasing raids after expansion launches), changing classes constantly not the first we have had a pruning of abilities in this game wont be the last either. It happens with other games well but let's face it Swtor is not a true MMO it never has really been its has been RPG with MMO features at most.

Honestly I was not as impressed with 6.0 as a lot of people Dxun was fun, was cool to see onderon but it completely unincentivized doing anything beyond getting to 306 and set geared out once you hit that there was literally no incentives to do anything in Swtor other than to play alts. Raids were completely unincentivized, maybe just getting achievements but there was not much incentives for doing those unlike past expansions. Gearing actually was suppose to increase beyond 306 in waves originally with Onslaught but the virus prevented them from fully working in office to do much with Onslaught. It may have given the players that did nothing but just play story and do a bunch of alts got them geared up with everybody else but that actually is kind of a fail when it comes to players actually wanting to do content and rewarded for doing harder content. The play as you like was pretty lazy overall when it came to the gear system there were people fully geared in Onslaught in the first 2-3 days of the expansion. I know a lot of players that said the same thing.

People's expectations of something go so sky high on everything these days not saying Bioware is not at fault in manner they do have some blame, EA has a lot of blame for not actually fully funding things the way they should. But the higher the expectations the great the failure of anything is in the world goes true for video games as well. People were expecting several things and continously look like fools when they get their hopes up. Bioware has a set way of doing things people should have learned that from classic-shadow of revan yet people still seem so surprised by how they handle things. Do I wish they would do things differently? absolutely. Do I wish they would invest more money into this game and actually fix the things that have plagued this game and actually end up giving us proper expansions we should been getting all along? yes. Do i think they are ever going to change their methods? not a chance.

The only thing, I mean the only thing I like in 7.0 is the Loadout.

I think if they released only the loadout for now and delayed the 7.0 by 6 months people would be happy.

I decided after a few days of unsubscribing that I would resubscribe but the basic solution is "play less but focus".

I probably won't even play the new content for awhile as I realign to focus on finishing the BH story and then the Consular. Sure, at some point, I'll, at least, take the SW and the Trooper through but I feel that, given how much of a hail mary 7.0 is, I should really devote myself more to finishing the last 2 class stories before 2023 hits.

I’ve given BioWare plenty of feedback on the PTS and forums as well as Discord. They say they hear us, but they don’t listen properly or have difficulty in understanding what 90% of players are telling them. BioWares whole attitude towards the feedback stinks of arrogance.

BioChris did explicitly say on Discord a few months back:

We're not a request line.

I will quickly mention the 10th year celebration. The day came and went without an echo. We got a vague post and more false promises with nothing solid, no dates and praising how amazing combat styles are. Vendor has nothing new, there is no event, no message in the screen, no npc shouting, zero. Just shoot me now please.

 

.

Imagine you've been married 10 years. The spouse is getting excited because you're telling them:

"Spouse! I have BIG plans for our 10th year anniversary! BIG !"

You do this for six months. The excitement is palpable.

"Our 10th year anniversary celebration will last ALL YEAR!", you exclaim.

The day comes, and your spouse comes down to find the old vacuum cleaner wrapped like a Christmas present, and a photo album of the past 10 years.

In fact, you don't even bother to fix the step on the back porch they've been mentioning for five years. They look at you with confusion in their eyes.

Off you go to work.

You'd come home to divorce papers, or getting smothered in your sleep.

I play for the story. Everything else is just something I do to pass the time.

Same.

I'm still excited to get SOME new story and hopeful that we will get more this year.

The thing I'm afraid is that we'll get the story of Malgus looking for another McGuffin and us (unsuccessfully) trying to stop him, with nothing being resolved at the end. Just like the "new war" we got in 6.0 that wasn't touched since then.

Imagine you've been married 10 years. The spouse is getting excited because you're telling them:

 

"Spouse! I have BIG plans for our 10th year anniversary! BIG !"

 

You do this for six months. The excitement is palpable.

 

"Our 10th year anniversary celebration will last ALL YEAR!", you exclaim.

 

The day comes, and your spouse comes down to find the old vacuum cleaner wrapped like a Christmas present, and a photo album of the past 10 years.

 

In fact, you don't even bother to fix the step on the back porch they've been mentioning for five years. They look at you with confusion in their eyes.

 

Off you go to work.

 

You'd come home to divorce papers, or getting smothered in your sleep.

Thanks for the LOL

Funny, but also helps to illuminate the situation.

BioChris did explicitly say on Discord a few months back:

We're not a request line.

Curious what the context was. I mean, if that's the attitude of the decision-makers with this game in general, it would explain a lot. I don't expect any developer to be sitting there primarily filling requests, it's just not feasible with an audience of significant size and not exactly fun or fulfilling, but if that's the attitude you have toward requests in general? That's a different thing to me. It sounds like the attitude I'd expect from an unpaid modder who just wants to make stuff sometimes and be left alone, not a giant corporation who rakes in the dough from paying customers. I wonder if this company's culture has never grown up past the fact they are no longer just making one-and-done single players RPGs.

BioChris did explicitly say on Discord a few months back:

We're not a request line.

Which supports my assumption that it’s institutional and personal arrogance as to why BioWare refuses to listen to constructive feedback that “they ask for”.

Imagine you've been married 10 years. The spouse is getting excited because you're telling them:

 

"Spouse! I have BIG plans for our 10th year anniversary! BIG !"

 

You do this for six months. The excitement is palpable.

 

"Our 10th year anniversary celebration will last ALL YEAR!", you exclaim.

 

The day comes, and your spouse comes down to find the old vacuum cleaner wrapped like a Christmas present, and a photo album of the past 10 years.

 

In fact, you don't even bother to fix the step on the back porch they've been mentioning for five years. They look at you with confusion in their eyes.

 

Off you go to work.

 

You'd come home to divorce papers, or getting smothered in your sleep.

LoL, that’s a good analogy 😂

Imagine you've been married 10 years. The spouse is getting excited because you're telling them:

 

"Spouse! I have BIG plans for our 10th year anniversary! BIG !"

 

You do this for six months. The excitement is palpable.

 

"Our 10th year anniversary celebration will last ALL YEAR!", you exclaim.

 

The day comes, and your spouse comes down to find the old vacuum cleaner wrapped like a Christmas present, and a photo album of the past 10 years.

 

In fact, you don't even bother to fix the step on the back porch they've been mentioning for five years. They look at you with confusion in their eyes.

 

Off you go to work.

 

You'd come home to divorce papers, or getting smothered in your sleep.

LOL

And you say "I'm not a request line!" when your spouse say you should do your share of house work.

LOL

 

And you say "I'm not a request line!" when your spouse say you should do your share of house work.

You’d want to be a fast runner to deliver that line in my household 🤣

With the level of hate in the forums lately I'm not surprised Chris has turned to discord for feedback on balance. And I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves that too if more people from the forum join that discord just to send him "do this or unsub" messages.

Oh no, we shouldn't bully the developers by asking them to do the minimum of their god damn paid job. Look at them, they are hiding in their little social media community like a scared kitten. Poor baby!

But you're right, I would never be treated with so much hate because if I am such an epic fail at my work, my boss would just simply fire me lmao

With the level of hate in the forums lately I'm not surprised Chris has turned to discord for feedback on balance. And I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves that too if more people from the forum join that discord just to send him "do this or unsub" messages.

Lmao, he’s been on discord for years. And don’t try using the recent forums as an excuse for his non posting here, he’s been absent here for most of his tenure.

 

if I am such an epic fail at my work, my boss would just simply fire me lmao

Isn’t that the truth.

Honestly I was not as impressed with 6.0 as a lot of people Dxun was fun, was cool to see onderon but it completely unincentivized doing anything beyond getting to 306 and set geared out once you hit that there was literally no incentives to do anything in Swtor other than to play alts. Raids were completely unincentivized, maybe just getting achievements but there was not much incentives for doing those unlike past expansions. Gearing actually was suppose to increase beyond 306 in waves originally with Onslaught but the virus prevented them from fully working in office to do much with Onslaught. It may have given the players that did nothing but just play story and do a bunch of alts got them geared up with everybody else but that actually is kind of a fail when it comes to players actually wanting to do content and rewarded for doing harder content. The play as you like was pretty lazy overall when it came to the gear system there were people fully geared in Onslaught in the first 2-3 days of the expansion. I know a lot of players that said the same thing.

True, true and one more time true!

Operations gave nothing in form of incentive except for achievements but that was not enough as we were being used to the old system already. Honestly the only system that makes sense. Bosses need to drop gear/ tokens that are adequate to the level of a challenge. It was bad and it needed to be addressed. The sad part is, we will have to wait another 2/3 months to get that though, as raid is not the part of 7.0 release.

Shame

Coming back to the discussion, the whole Bioware is not at fault and ea to blame. I don't want to throw blame at any particular body. Let them share the responsibility to get us a product we deserve. They are equally at fault or to be praised for their actions.

As it stands right now, 28.01.2022, we have 1/4 th of the expansion being dropped at launch. But it is still called major expansion. I beg to differ though. Nothing screams major really. Class revamp is just another patch they could have done, same with gear changes. And the amount of story is abysmal, even compared to what we were getting past 6.0. Unless they have some hidden gem or ace up their sleeve, there is nothing that could save this xpac from being called an absolute failure.

I had such high hopes, that something would change. That once in the game lifespan we will be treated differently. Just a bit of decency really. I was working in a prison for 3 years and decency is the big part in there. Being human to the other person. Even though someone is A con you try to approach them with decency. More often than not you get it back. Obviously there are coonts ny nature and cant be changed but every place has them. That's how you build relations. I don't get that feeling here. I am far from being touchy - feely type, but what I hate the most is going back on your own word and not delivering on promises.

That is basically what we've gotten. False promises and backing away from changes, content being pushed away for further patches. People in other games would absolutely destroy the developers and publishers of their games for such behaviour. Imagine WoW did not get raid in time, or not getting any new zone for expansion.

How can we not getting anything exciting? And I know lots of people play for the story, but the amount we are shown is not en pair with the name: Expansion.

Alas I will play this game because of the friends I have in the guild and nvause i enjoy spending time with them raiding in star wars universe. Hope is the mother of fools and dies last as they say, but what is there left for us than to hope for better days in a galaxy far far away.

With the level of hate in the forums lately I'm not surprised Chris has turned to discord for feedback on balance. And I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves that too if more people from the forum join that discord just to send him "do this or unsub" messages.

Can you share that discord channel ?, i havent found that Developer's discord.

Would love to get some feedback accross

 

Honestly I was not as impressed with 6.0 as a lot of people Dxun was fun, was cool to see onderon but it completely unincentivized doing anything beyond getting to 306 and set geared out once you hit that there was literally no incentives to do anything in Swtor other than to play alts. Raids were completely unincentivized, maybe just getting achievements but there was not much incentives for doing those unlike past expansions. Gearing actually was suppose to increase beyond 306 in waves originally with Onslaught but the virus prevented them from fully working in office to do much with Onslaught. It may have given the players that did nothing but just play story and do a bunch of alts got them geared up with everybody else but that actually is kind of a fail when it comes to players actually wanting to do content and rewarded for doing harder content. The play as you like was pretty lazy overall when it came to the gear system there were people fully geared in Onslaught in the first 2-3 days of the expansion. I know a lot of players that said the same thing.

From someone who came back to the game after 6.0, I think you're absolutely right though. 6.0 for me has been finishing the story with one character and starting over with another one. Until I got bored of it, after seeing everything in the story I wanted to see, and just logged on for Conquest. I never really had to bother about gearing that much, a bit of grinding here and there when I was getting impatient, but it mostly happened while playing the game (apart from that Apex Predator set I never got to finish - I'll never understand why they gated specific sets behind raids). I actually really liked Galactic Season as a change of pace, but that season 2 didn't follow right away was a disappointment for me. The last few months have been very boring.

I'm just not sure that the changes in 7.0 are really going to change that. The classes will play differently, and might not be as much fun, gearing will be slower because of the caps, and in the end it's really a small portion of the player base that will see max gear from raids - which means that for all the other players, the gear grind will stop sooner. So for the majority of the players, it's not really going to change much in the end. Galactic Season should help with that, but even then... unless season 3 comes soon after and they really hold up to their promises of frequent updates in 2022, they're not doing their non-raiders playerbase much of a favor.