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Mercenary Feedback Thread

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DougTheNoob's Avatar


DougTheNoob
11.20.2021 , 06:16 AM | #71
Quote: Originally Posted by velvet_illusionZ View Post
that is the core of the problem- mercs are ranged, range is kinda a def in itself, which means that they got too many dcds + tools on top of being ranged. but the same goes for other ranged classes as well...range classes should always do less damage and be more squishy than melee, which they do not atm. this needs to change fundamentally. especially considering the amount of slows and roots ranged class have to make life miserable for a melee trying to get to ranged...
That would be true if melees didnt have tons of gap fillers to approach ranged,and so many control and immunity. Also all the melee classes have either stealth abilities or better defenses than ranged. U play a jugg,a class that have tons of dcds that if rotated well,can make a huge impact in pvp;tons of CC,stuns,slows etc;and u are a good dps class,if played correctly. With that being said,I agree that some of the changes were to harsh and shouldnt go live. But that dosent mean mercs didnt get nerf too,and need to get even more nerf.They should just give mad dash back to juggs not as a choice and change back the grit teeth effect and nerf skank tanks dps. And thats all

I already said that,and I'll repeat: snipers have more control,dps and immunity to control than mercs,plus they have phase,and melees cant jump or teleport to em while they are in crouch And sorcs have more mobility and dps than us,plus they can also phase. So, ye,thats why mercs have their dcds. Keep in mind that energy shield(blue shield) mitigates only 25% of dmg taken,while warriors shields mitigate 40%-50%.And while the melee mitigation works for every kind of dmg,the merc ones only works for direct dmg.

velvet_illusionZ's Avatar


velvet_illusionZ
11.20.2021 , 08:19 AM | #72
saying that juggs only need mad dash back und grit teeth change undone and they will be fine disqualifies you from a serious conversation, cause they are not fine in 6.0 at all. ED isn't scaled properly scince 5.0 days, endure pain is completly useless, mad dashs cd is way to long compared to cds of other escapes, sabre ward doesn't negate damage it gives u dodge chance, reflect is capped, doesn't work against melee, we don't have 30% aoe reduction build in as you guys do in 6.0, etc, ppp.lets look at you, you got a self heal on all your defs, you can safe heal yourself on top, you got double rocket out, hydros, way too many slows and roots, freaking net+ a hard stun, heavy armor, you are ranged, solid burst, a knockback on half the cd as force push etc, ppp..... but yeah mercs are fine-lmao....

Kri-gal's Avatar


Kri-gal
11.20.2021 , 08:05 PM | #73
A DPS spec Merc's heals are pretty worthless LOL. I'm pretty good with my Merc but I have a hard time beating even an average Jug in PVP... and most of the time it isn't even close. It's very hard to kill a Jug in PVP 1 on 1. You usually need 2 people to gang up on them.

And, in PVE, any group would take a Jug over a Merc for DPS any day unless they actually needed a ranged, and even then they would prefer a Sniper. So, talk about the abilities all you want, they still leave Mercs lacking in PVP and PVE.

TheVoyant's Avatar


TheVoyant
11.23.2021 , 12:46 AM | #74
Quote: Originally Posted by Kri-gal View Post
A DPS spec Merc's heals are pretty worthless LOL..
My rapid scan as an Arsenal currently heals on a mid level crit for 22k, high end just under 40k in PvP/Uncapped. It averages about 10% of my health per heal.

Just finished a 4v4, Healer had 0 dmg and 500k heals. I had 1.2mil Dmg and 700k heals.

I'm not sure how you're spec'd but Arsenal esp with such low alacrity breakpoints are very effective utility atm and can off heal probably better then any other spec. So I'd hardcore disagree.

And they'd be wrong to pick a Jugg over a Merc atm, but if you're following guides I can see that being a popular misconception due to the incorrect stat breakdowns most people use.

Currently only seen PTs pull more consistent DPS vs. a perfectly spec'd Apex build in PvE. Viru comes close, but with zeal and inherit alacrity 3% allowing 1.3 gcds at 514 stat gives too much free stats to move into crit.

Also not checked on the PTS in a few. Have they said what those mysterious choices are yet?

DougTheNoob's Avatar


DougTheNoob
11.23.2021 , 02:17 PM | #75
Quote: Originally Posted by velvet_illusionZ View Post
saying that juggs only need mad dash back und grit teeth change undone and they will be fine disqualifies you from a serious conversation, cause they are not fine in 6.0 at all. ED isn't scaled properly scince 5.0 days, endure pain is completly useless, mad dashs cd is way to long compared to cds of other escapes, sabre ward doesn't negate damage it gives u dodge chance, reflect is capped, doesn't work against melee, we don't have 30% aoe reduction build in as you guys do in 6.0, etc, ppp.lets look at you, you got a self heal on all your defs, you can safe heal yourself on top, you got double rocket out, hydros, way too many slows and roots, freaking net+ a hard stun, heavy armor, you are ranged, solid burst, a knockback on half the cd as force push etc, ppp..... but yeah mercs are fine-lmao....
Lets see..juggs have more dps than mercs atm,have too many gap fillers and immunity to push and stuns,have more stuns and slows than mercs,plus their dcds have way more mitigation dmg than merc's dcds. But the problem is the healing effect of mercs dcds,right? Well,they only work on direct dmg,while jugg's enrage defense works on any kind of dmg,and with grit teeth u can use it very often. So...I feel like u just want ur fav class to be better and the others to be easy targets. Thats not gonna happen,bro.
As it is now on live server, its very balanced tho. I'd say only concealment ops and skank juggs are overtuned. But if u look on pts,then ye,juggs got nerfed harder and I think they should get at least mad dash back. That dosent mean mercs didnt get nerf. It just happens that juggs got more screwed than any other class. So go and try to convice devs to make some chages on juggs, instead of trying to nerf mercs more than they got nerfed already.🙂

TheVoyant's Avatar


TheVoyant
11.23.2021 , 08:31 PM | #76
Quote: Originally Posted by DougTheNoob View Post
Lets see..juggs have more dps than mercs atm,have too many gap fillers and immunity to push and stuns,have more stuns and slows than mercs,plus their dcds have way more mitigation dmg than merc's dcds. But the problem is the healing effect of mercs dcds,right? Well,they only work on direct dmg,while jugg's enrage defense works on any kind of dmg,and with grit teeth u can use it very often. So...I feel like u just want ur fav class to be better and the others to be easy targets. Thats not gonna happen,bro.
As it is now on live server, its very balanced tho. I'd say only concealment ops and skank juggs are overtuned. But if u look on pts,then ye,juggs got nerfed harder and I think they should get at least mad dash back. That dosent mean mercs didnt get nerf. It just happens that juggs got more screwed than any other class. So go and try to convice devs to make some chages on juggs, instead of trying to nerf mercs more than they got nerfed already.🙂
Juggs do not have more DPS. An Immortal Jugg in PvP comes close but otherwise beyond a cut to pieces AoE spam'd area with a mob.... They do significantly less damage at end game atm.

PTs, Deception, Merc, and Viru are currently top tier. (And Maras if you know how to use em) Once people understood the breakpoint models were off. Before Venge was in the mix but I've not seen them pulling above 13k dps in capped content like the aforementioned.

Dark-Zero's Avatar


Dark-Zero
11.24.2021 , 02:15 PM | #77
As a since launch merc healer i've seen many iterations of builds come about

one of the things i love about the current system is i can choose to spend my points lower down the skills tree if i choose to, for example i could have three tier 1 skills, 4 tier 2 skills and 2 tier 3 skills. The new system seems to make us choose to have specific either or items on tiers, rather than giving us the ability to select how we want out builds to play.

The majority of players will want the max tier 3, i do feel its nice to have the option to select say two of a level if i chose to rather than my top abilitiy options. It also allows us to fill other roles needed in groups potentially.

I'd love to see the option to have points to spend again and having requirements to get to tiers like in the current system, the layout of the new system im fine with, but i'd rather have more choice for abilities if i want to spend my spec points there.......

Dyne-'s Avatar


Dyne-
11.24.2021 , 11:06 PM | #78
Quote: Originally Posted by DougTheNoob View Post
Lets see..juggs have more dps than mercs atm,have too many gap fillers and immunity to push and stuns,have more stuns and slows than mercs,plus their dcds have way more mitigation dmg than merc's dcds. But the problem is the healing effect of mercs dcds,right? Well,they only work on direct dmg,while jugg's enrage defense works on any kind of dmg,and with grit teeth u can use it very often. So...I feel like u just want ur fav class to be better and the others to be easy targets. Thats not gonna happen,bro.
As it is now on live server, its very balanced tho. I'd say only concealment ops and skank juggs are overtuned. But if u look on pts,then ye,juggs got nerfed harder and I think they should get at least mad dash back. That dosent mean mercs didnt get nerf. It just happens that juggs got more screwed than any other class. So go and try to convice devs to make some chages on juggs, instead of trying to nerf mercs more than they got nerfed already.🙂
This is unequivocally false. A fully geared Merc on average can hit 25k+ dps. Top tier Jugg players might be able to hit 25k, most don't. Immortal Jugg actually parses pretty low. 12-15k on average. They just have a massive Rage Jugg inspired burst window (which makes no mf sense) and they rarely die in regs. It gives the impression that they're a high DPS class. They aren't. Mercs are ranged. Also, no DPS Juggernaut that wants to kill other people is running Grit Teeth in regs. Ranked, sure (they still wont live long enough to get a second ED off), but our DPS drops 2-3k minimum using Grit Teeth over Hemo slash or Cauterized Coronary.

We don't have more immunities than Merc, especially not Rage Spec. Our DCDs do not mitigate more damage than Merc. Pretty well balanced on paper, but at every opportunity the advantage is given to the non force using classes. Pretty much why Mercs can face tank better than Juggs and you have an answer for every gap closer we have.

Personally I think melee should mitigate damage better than ranged and ranged should have more control. Bioware just has something against melee ever having any advantages period, unless you're an Operative player.

Just here to keep it honest.

Mercenary DCDs:
Energy Shield: 57.5% DR / 40% DR and the cooldown can be reduced with energy rebounders.
Responsive Safeguards: Complete nullification of all incoming damage types aside from AOE / DoTs. Heals you on damage received. The code is a simple boolean true / false flag. They didn't even have the decency to utilize a percentage value lol.
Kolto Overload: can heal up to 60% of your health.

Mercenary CC:
Jet boost / 360 knockback. You basically have an AOE force push.
Electro Dart: 4 sec hard stun.
Concussion Missile: Mez
Electro Net: lol.
Not going to get into built in slows / roots.

Mercenary Escapes:
Rocket out x 2
Hydraulic Overrides: Movement speed increase + immunity to push pull. (Longer than force leap immunity btw).

DPS Juggernaut
Enraged Defense: Self explanatory. Potential to heal for another health bar. You can be bursted down through it.
Saber Ward: 50% melee / range defense increase, 25% absorb.
Saber Reflect: negates incoming force, tech, and range damage only. 3 seconds unless you spec it to 5.
Endure Pain: Worst DCD in the game. 30% fake health which is removed after a certain amount of time.

DPS Juggernaut CC:
Force Choke: 4 sec hard stun.
Force Push: self explanatory.
Intimidating Roar: Mez.
Chilling Scream: soft slow.
Not getting into possible roots.

Juggernaut Movement:
Force Leap
Mad Dash

velvet_illusionZ's Avatar


velvet_illusionZ
11.25.2021 , 12:09 PM | #79
Quote: Originally Posted by Dyne- View Post
This is unequivocally false. A fully geared Merc on average can hit 25k+ dps. Top tier Jugg players might be able to hit 25k, most don't. Immortal Jugg actually parses pretty low. 12-15k on average. They just have a massive Rage Jugg inspired burst window (which makes no mf sense) and they rarely die in regs. It gives the impression that they're a high DPS class. They aren't. Mercs are ranged. Also, no DPS Juggernaut that wants to kill other people is running Grit Teeth in regs. Ranked, sure (they still wont live long enough to get a second ED off), but our DPS drops 2-3k minimum using Grit Teeth over Hemo slash or Cauterized Coronary.

We don't have more immunities than Merc, especially not Rage Spec. Our DCDs do not mitigate more damage than Merc. Pretty well balanced on paper, but at every opportunity the advantage is given to the non force using classes. Pretty much why Mercs can face tank better than Juggs and you have an answer for every gap closer we have.

Personally I think melee should mitigate damage better than ranged and ranged should have more control. Bioware just has something against melee ever having any advantages period, unless you're an Operative player.

Just here to keep it honest.

Mercenary DCDs:
Energy Shield: 57.5% DR / 40% DR and the cooldown can be reduced with energy rebounders.
Responsive Safeguards: Complete nullification of all incoming damage types aside from AOE / DoTs. Heals you on damage received. The code is a simple boolean true / false flag. They didn't even have the decency to utilize a percentage value lol.
Kolto Overload: can heal up to 60% of your health.

Mercenary CC:
Jet boost / 360 knockback. You basically have an AOE force push.
Electro Dart: 4 sec hard stun.
Concussion Missile: Mez
Electro Net: lol.
Not going to get into built in slows / roots.

Mercenary Escapes:
Rocket out x 2
Hydraulic Overrides: Movement speed increase + immunity to push pull. (Longer than force leap immunity btw).

DPS Juggernaut
Enraged Defense: Self explanatory. Potential to heal for another health bar. You can be bursted down through it.
Saber Ward: 50% melee / range defense increase, 25% absorb.
Saber Reflect: negates incoming force, tech, and range damage only. 3 seconds unless you spec it to 5.
Endure Pain: Worst DCD in the game. 30% fake health which is removed after a certain amount of time.

DPS Juggernaut CC:
Force Choke: 4 sec hard stun.
Force Push: self explanatory.
Intimidating Roar: Mez.
Chilling Scream: soft slow.
Not getting into possible roots.

Juggernaut Movement:
Force Leap
Mad Dash
even this comparison won't make mercs change mind in believing they are not overtuned und got nerfed way harder than anyone else....

Xhuuyaa's Avatar


Xhuuyaa
11.25.2021 , 01:18 PM | #80
Quote: Originally Posted by velvet_illusionZ View Post
even this comparison won't make mercs change mind in believing they are not overtuned und got nerfed way harder than anyone else....
when I play regs with my Mara and get frustrated after a couple of games I switch to my Merc because of this... its nice to be unkillable.