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Bad Batch retcon

xordevoreaux's Avatar


xordevoreaux
05.12.2021 , 03:04 AM | #1
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phalczen's Avatar


phalczen
05.12.2021 , 07:43 AM | #2
Yeah, I read that article last night, but its very misleading.

Caleb Dume/Kaanan Jarus died before the end of Rebels which occurs before Rogue One. Ezra Bridger, whom I don't recall the article mentioning, disappeared when the Purrgil jumped to hyperspace with him and Thrawn in tow, and he wasn't a Jedi either, he was still Kaanan's padawan.

Ahoska, even during season 7 of clone wars when she comes back to help free Mandalore and capture Maul, is not considered a Jedi. The Council refers to her as citizen and Rex even tries to use her status as justification for the clones not to execute order 66 on her. She even tells Vader, during the fight on Malachor on season 2 of Rebels, that she is "no Jedi." Later, in season 2 of The Mandalorian, when she is talking to Djarin about Grogu, Ahsoka doesn't actually say that she is a Jedi (after all, Djarin and Bo Katan don't really make a distinction between Jedi and light-side Force-sensitives), she just says there are so few left.

And, Grogu wasn't a Jedi either ... he was a youngling, not even a padawan.

It's easy to explain Yoda's statement to Luke in RotJ, "The last of the Jedi, will you be" ... he is merely referring to Luke being the last person to be trained to full Knighthood by a member of the official/original Jedi order. Technically, Yoda says Luke isn't a Jedi [Knight, presumably] until he faces Vader a second time. Now, that's one heckuva Knight trial, to face the second most powerful Sith lord in the galaxy!

To me, this was an article grasping at straws, trying to make a news story about nothing.
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MadDutchman's Avatar


MadDutchman
05.12.2021 , 04:28 PM | #3
It's obvious the author of the article is unfamiliar with the old EU

There were plenty of Jedi running around after Order 66, it's complete lunacy to think that with 10000 Jedi Knights running around, none of them would have survived.

Fast forward 19 years though, with the Emperor's and Vader's efficiency, wiping them out (mostly) isn't that far fetched anymore.

Also Ahsoka never "self identified" as being a Jedi as the article claims. Closest she comes saying "I've seen what such feelings can do to the best of us" (past tense). For that matter, she never made it to the rank of Jedi Knight either (despite being more powerful than most Masters by the end of TCW)
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ceryxp's Avatar


ceryxp
05.12.2021 , 06:51 PM | #4
I take Yoda's, "The last of the Jedi, will you be," line in a similar vein to Atris' assertion that they are the last of the Jedi in KotOR 2. Atris spoke that line from a place of hubris. Atris felt that those Jedi who remained following the Katarr incident had turned their back on the Order, had fallen, and were no longer Jedi. Atris, in their arrogance, believed that they were the only Jedi to remain true to the Order, which is funny considering what Atris did on Katarr.

I think that Yoda meant something similar but was not speaking from a place of arrogance. This requires a short tangent into the realm of Grey Jedi.

All too often when I hear arguments against the existence of Grey Jedi it concerns the first meaning of the term: someone who is able to walk the line between the light and dark without succumbing to the dark. There was something just recently were, again, Lucasfilm was saying that Grey Jedi are not canon because it is not possible for someone to walk that line, to use the dark side, without falling to the dark side (which contradicts their own lore: Father and Bendu). But there is a second usage for Jedi who had separated from the Jedi Order and lived outside of the Code. These are not necessarily Jedi who are flirting with the dark side, or trying to walk a fine line between the light and the dark, but Jedi who either no longer live as Jedi or who have distanced themselves from the High Council and do not strictly adhere to the Jedi Code.

Kanan Jarrus was a Grey Jedi. They did not fall, they did not succumb to the dark side, they did not try to balance the light and the dark, they had merely turned from the Order and lived as a non-Jedi following Order 66. Ahsoka Tano was a Grey Jedi. Jolee Bindo was a Grey Jedi. I think, in this context, we could also say that Qui-Gon Jinn was a Grey Jedi. In Legends we know there were a number of Jedi who survived Order 66 and, in order to survive, had to turn away from being a Jedi. New canon is likewise establishing that there are a number of Jedi who survived Order 66 and turned away from the Order.

I take Yoda's statement in this context. Yes, there were a number of Jedi who survived Order 66. Yes, a number of Jedi yet live in the galaxy, but they live as Grey Jedi. Yoda's meaning was that Luke will be the last person living who lives as a Jedi.

Yes, it could also be said that my viewpoint is nothing more than a retcon because Lucas really did not have any clue what they were doing and the world they were build and since all of this was added later then we have to retcon it for it to make sense. Yes, that is true, too.
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