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Thanks for listening


Rolodome

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If the multiverse theory is correct, then there is probably a version of reality out there somewhere where you listened to your players all these years and didn't take them for granted, and appreciated the gravity of sitting on exclusive MMO rights to an IP worth billions and a game that invested a couple hundred million in its development, so thanks to that BW for listening.

 

Ah well, the Grebulons probably destroyed the planet in that version of reality, so I spose it's a wash anyway.

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Lmao. The saddest part is that they won't even read the actual first post and just take the title and pat themselves on the back for job done well plactating the playerbase with tiny changes to 70 PTS while everything else is left in the same disastrous convulted mess state it was
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Lmao. The saddest part is that they won't even read the actual first post and just take the title and pat themselves on the back for job done well plactating the playerbase with tiny changes to 70 PTS while everything else is left in the same disastrous convulted mess state it was

Lol I'm counting on it. They might get mad and delete it if they do actually read. I'm just so done with them at this point, everything falls on deaf ears and they are pouring what little resources they have left into actively making the game worse, without even being able to deliver on QoL improvements. I don't like to do prognostications of doom, I'm no nostradamus, but I got a bad feeling about the state this game is in. All signs seem to point to them just announcing the game is shutting down or going into some kind of official maintenance mode within a year. I mean, they can't even handle a guild perk bug outside of releasing the expansion and that alone may hurt the playerbase significantly in the interim time til 7.0 releases. And if 7.0 is poorly received, which it seems like it will be based on feedback so far, they're going to be scrambling the whole of 2022 just to retain what remaining people they have.

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If the multiverse theory is correct, then there is probably a version of reality out there somewhere where you listened to your players all these years and didn't take them for granted, ......

Actually, the "multiverse theory" does not suggest that there are infinite varieties of "this" (our) universe. 😇

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If the multiverse theory is correct, then there is probably a version of reality out there somewhere where you listened to your players all these years and didn't take them for granted, and appreciated the gravity of sitting on exclusive MMO rights to an IP worth billions and a game that invested a couple hundred million in its development, so thanks to that BW for listening.

 

Ah well, the Grebulons probably destroyed the planet in that version of reality, so I spose it's a wash anyway.

 

You don't even need to invoke the multiverse. One consequence of Cosmic Inflation is other "yous," with the nearest being no further than 10^10^29m away.

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If the multiverse theory is correct, then there is probably a version of reality out there somewhere where you listened to your players all these years and didn't take them for granted, and appreciated the gravity of sitting on exclusive MMO rights to an IP worth billions and a game that invested a couple hundred million in its development, so thanks to that BW for listening.

 

Ah well, the Grebulons probably destroyed the planet in that version of reality, so I spose it's a wash anyway.

 

And the game is more successful than FFXIV that had to stop selling copies of the game and restrict free to play trial people. And it also killed off WoW and it shuttered within a year if swtor launching,

Edited by TrixxieTriss
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TBH, I don't think they've ever listened, in any multiverse, or any universe. They do what they do, and to heck with everyone ... /shrug

 

Gotta be honest why would they? When Galactic Command launched in 5.0 I believe it was, there was an exodus of players. With one of the worst systems ever created. RNG loot box gear. Yet despite all that they're still here. Still not giving a ****. And as someone who tried pts and remembers 5.0 all to well, if they survived that, this is nothing.

 

No reason for them to doubt any of their mentally handicapped decisions, because they know no matter how much you guys complain, you'll be here. Maybe a few will leave, but you'll be back, and if not meh. They're doing just fine, hell somehow (and I honestly have no idea how) the numbers actually seem to be slowly improving 🤯

Edited by Setta
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Gotta be honest why would they? When Galactic Command launched in 5.0 I believe it was, there was an exodus of players. With one of the worst systems ever created. RNG loot box gear. Yet despite all that they're still here. Still not giving a ****. And as someone who tried pts and remembers 5.0 all to well, if they survived that, this is nothing.

 

No reason for them to doubt any of their mentally handicapped decisions, because they know no matter how much you guys complain, you'll be here. Maybe a few will leave, but you'll be back, and if not meh. They're doing just fine, hell somehow (and I honestly have no idea how) the numbers actually seem to be slowly improving 🤯

 

Where did you get the part that “the numbers actually seem to be slowly improving from”. Have you got access to the raw internal BioWare data? Because the only data available is Steam and that doesn’t measure subscribers or take into account players migrating from the direct login download to Steam. And it doesn’t take into account those players still using the older login system. So I really hope you aren’t suggesting the Steam numbers represent an increase.

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Gotta be honest why would they? When Galactic Command launched in 5.0 I believe it was, there was an exodus of players. With one of the worst systems ever created. RNG loot box gear. Yet despite all that they're still here. Still not giving a ****. And as someone who tried pts and remembers 5.0 all to well, if they survived that, this is nothing.

 

No reason for them to doubt any of their mentally handicapped decisions, because they know no matter how much you guys complain, you'll be here. Maybe a few will leave, but you'll be back, and if not meh. They're doing just fine, hell somehow (and I honestly have no idea how) the numbers actually seem to be slowly improving 🤯

Idk about that. Their arrogance has had material consequences each time. The game is down to 5 servers, their budget is down to a little bit of story and some system changes that are mostly QOL or "change for the sake of change" being called an expansion, and they can't even release an expansion like that on time and on top of that, have delayed one of the most CM marketable features of it, which is essentially just an appearance change QOL feature (weapon designer) since we could already do similar with mods (and they're messing that up too, since we won't be able to mod the newer high level weapons).

 

As far as I can tell, the subreddit is doing pretty well, but that might just be because of more players switching to non-sub. These forums, which are the best representation of sub numbers we have, seem deader than ever and in my memory, it's a big deal the number of long-time familiar faces I've seen who don't even want to give the new expansion a chance after seeing what it's going to be like on PTS. And the newer players who have started in the last year or two, how many are just gonna leave when they see systems they were just getting used to get thrown out and experience firsthand BW's tonedeaf behavior and refusal to do more than placate slowly with tweaks over months.

 

I don't believe for a second they are "doing just fine." If anything, I think it's the very fact they are doing really badly that they have taken on these sweeping changes, thinking they can get a more modern market that way, and because they can't even deliver on that properly, they are just estranging what little people left they still have AND they won't be able to get that modern market at all. So whether intentional or accidental, what they are doing materially amounts to sabotage at this point and no 1 out 10,000 sunk cost fallacy boomerang players are going to save their game. Probably the only thing that would allow their game to grow past 7.0 "consume content and leave" at this point would be a significant investment into backend system infrastructure and an overhaul of their entire company culture and practice for listening to players, and given their history, I think the only way that would happen is if EA fired BW and gave the game to another studio. Though it's hard to say how intertwined the two are (EA and BW), so it may be even that wouldn't work.

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Where did you get the part that “the numbers actually seem to be slowly improving from”. Have you got access to the raw internal BioWare data? Because the only data available is Steam and that doesn’t measure subscribers or take into account players migrating from the direct login download to Steam. And it doesn’t take into account those players still using the older login system. So I really hope you aren’t suggesting the Steam numbers represent an increase.

 

SWtoR launched for Steam a year and a half ago at this point. Most of the people swapping from old launcher to Steam have been taken into account by now, maybe a few stranglers here and there but insignificant at this point. As far as not taking in subscriber numbers, also irrelevant. When SWtor went free to play they had less subscribers than when they did at the start of the game, yet their revenue was on par or better due to the Cartel Market. So neither of your points really matter, the game at the moment for what ever reason is slowly increasing player count.

 

Idk about that. Their arrogance has had material consequences each time. The game is down to 5 servers, their budget is down to a little bit of story and some system changes that are mostly QOL or "change for the sake of change" being called an expansion, and they can't even release an expansion like that on time and on top of that, have delayed one of the most CM marketable features of it, which is essentially just an appearance change QOL feature (weapon designer) since we could already do similar with mods (and they're messing that up too, since we won't be able to mod the newer high level weapons)..

 

Sorry snipped your post, it was really long. Yes the game is down to 5 servers. It's not the same game it was some years back, and in the long run I agree it's doing worse than it was (just my opinion) however in the short term that doesn't seem to be the case. As far as the 5 servers, that does look bad, but let's be honest it's better to have 5 active servers (I believe most are fairly active) than have 15 servers some of which are so dead. I don't remember the exact count of servers when I left a few years back, but there were some dead ones back then. People don't want to log in, cause there's no one to play with and they're bored out their minds and leave. This was just the right move on their part.

 

As far as having a really small budget to where they can't get anything done. Again I argue that, this has more or less always been the case. They've always released stuff with lots of bugs, with minimal story content, and very little in terms or dungeon, raids, etc. For a 10th year anniversary this is a sad, sad expansion. However I think people remember the past way more fondly then they think they do. Those previous expansions weren't a whole lot better either if you compare the start of them to the start of this one. I've seen people compare the whole expansion to just what we're promised in 7.0 / 7.1 and it's like no that's not how it works. You can't compare the entirety of a 2 year expansion to just the launch, and if you compare previous launches to what we're seeing now, it's really more or less the same.

 

As far as why the delay, idk maybe they'll blame covid, setting them back from a year+ ago, and never really having caught up to meet their deadline as intended. Maybe something else is the reason for it, either way I'd rather them take an extra 2 months and get things to a playable level, than release what was the ptr to live servers, again just the right thing for them to do. Truth of the matter comes down to, they survived worse expansions than this, they'll be fine for a while to come still.

Edited by Setta
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Sorry snipped your post, it was really long. Yes the game is down to 5 servers. It's not the same game it was some years back, and in the long run I agree it's doing worse than it was (just my opinion) however in the short term that doesn't seem to be the case. As far as the 5 servers, that does look bad, but let's be honest it's better to have 5 active servers (I believe most are fairly active) than have 15 servers some of which are so dead. I don't remember the exact count of servers when I left a few years back, but there were some dead ones back then. People don't want to log in, cause there's no one to play with and they're bored out their minds and leave. This was just the right move on their part.

 

As far as having a really small budget to where they can't get anything done. Again I argue that, this has more or less always been the case. They've always released stuff with lots of bugs, with minimal story content, and very little in terms or dungeon, raids, etc. For a 10th year anniversary this is a sad, sad expansion. However I think people remember the past way more fondly then they think they do. Those previous expansions weren't a whole lot better either if you compare the start of them to the start of this one. I've seen people compare the whole expansion to just what we're promised in 7.0 / 7.1 and it's like no that's not how it works. You can't compare the entirety of a 2 year expansion to just the launch, and if you compare previous launches to what we're seeing now, it's really more or less the same.

 

As far as why the delay, idk maybe they'll blame covid, setting them back from a year+ ago, and never really having caught up to meet their deadline as intended. Maybe something else is the reason for it, either way I'd rather them take an extra 2 months and get things to a playable level, than release what was the ptr to live servers, again just the right thing for them to do. Truth of the matter comes down to, they survived worse expansions than this, they'll be fine for a while to come still.

Someone did a breakdown in another thread recently and no, the content amount comparison by expansion is not remotely the same. I mean, you're just factually wrong here, idk what to say.

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Someone did a breakdown in another thread recently and no, the content amount comparison by expansion is not remotely the same. I mean, you're just factually wrong here, idk what to say.

 

You know what thread? I'd be interested to take a look at it. If I'm wrong I'll admit it, ****'s happened before, but somehow I don't see it being far off the mark.

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Someone did a breakdown in another thread recently and no, the content amount comparison by expansion is not remotely the same. I mean, you're just factually wrong here, idk what to say.

 

I did this one recently. This is a breakdown of playable content, system changes are not included.:

 

Unless they have some big surprises for us, what we are getting with LotS is smaller than RotHC by a wide margin. (Every expansion we've had has had content added in later patches, since we don't know what we are getting post 7.0, let's not count those.)

 

LotS:

1 Planet with 2 stories (assuming Imp & Pub are reasonably different).

1 Flashpoint.

 

RotHC:

1 Planet with 2 stories + Side quests + Heroics.

Macrobinocular & Seeker Droid quest series and dig sites.

GSI Dailies.

1 Operation SoV in 3 difficulty modes.

1 Operation Boss TC in 3 difficulty modes.

 

SoR:

2 Planets with 1 story inc. one class specific quest + Side quests.

2 Flashpoints.

2 Operations. Ravagers & ToS in 2 difficulty modes.

 

KotFE:

1 Planet with 9 chapters.

6 Star Fortresses.

15 Companion Recruitments

 

KotET:

2 Planets with 9 chapters in 3 difficulty modes. (Does Nathema count as a full planet? Bioware thinks so, I don't)

HM & MM difficulties added for 16 KotFE chapters.

5 Uprisings.

20 DvL World Bosses

 

Onslaught:

2 Planets 2 stories.

1 Flashpoint

1 Operation Dxun (Just SM?)

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You know what thread? I'd be interested to take a look at it. If I'm wrong I'll admit it, ****'s happened before, but somehow I don't see it being far off the mark.

 

We can do it here:

RotHC - 1 planet with daily area and single boss operation followed by: dreadseed and Shroud questlines, Oricon arc (daily + 2 operations)

GSF - new game mode + 1 FP

SoR - 2 planets (one with daily area), 4 FPs, 2 Ops followed by 1 planet with daily area and 1 single boss Ops

KotFE - 9 chapters followed by 7 more chapters, companion recruitment missions, year-long event

KotET - 9 chapters + 5 uprisings followed by 5 more uprisings, 2 planets with daily areas, 3 FPs, 1 Ops, 1 singe boss ops

Onslaught - 2 planets (one with daily area), 1 FP, 1 Ops followed by 2 FPs and 1 story instance (Echoes)

LotS - 1 planet + 1 FP (with promise to add daily area to the planet and 1 Ops soon after)

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