This is a proposal aswell as an open question for anyone who'd like to give their thoughts on this idea.

In the same sense that the upcoming Force classes will be able to switch to their respective imperial/republic counterpart after obtaining the required darkside/lightside rank, would it be possible for Tech classes to also be able to switch between their respective mirrored classes.

My thought is that the impact on class choices when it comes to the Tech classes has much more weight to it than the Force ones.

Wheras the Force classes shares the same weapons and (mostly) the same animations with their mirrored counterparts, the Tech classes (although sharing the same abilities) gives a completely different feeling in my opinion when you play their respective mirrored class.

I also believe this could open up the pontential for a greater demand for the various different ranged weapons available. Wheras the Sniper can only be wielding by on singular class, if you allowed Gunslingers to swap to their mirrored class, it would make the various different weapons more available to a greater number of players.

All in all this idea is just for aesthetics, to allow a Sniper Trooper to become a lightly clad Double blaster wielding gunslinger or a blaster wielding Scoundrel to take up a Blaster as an Operative once in awhile.

Would love to hear everyone elses' thoughts on this, and if you could expand on this aswell it would be much appreciated, i'm too lazy to write anything more .

Yes, but what I was referring to was the ability to switch to your respective mirrored class. All force classes will be able to switch to their mirrored class once they meet the criteria (Sorcerer to Sage etc.)

But from what I can tell Tech classes will be stuck with that singular class once chosen, since they said on a stream that your class choice will be locked, and from what they've said tech classes will not have the ability to switch to their mirrored class.

Yes, but what I was referring to was the ability to switch to your respective mirrored class. All force classes will be able to switch to their mirrored class once they meet the criteria (Sorcerer to Sage etc.)

But from what I can tell Tech classes will be stuck with that singular class once chosen, since they said on a stream that your class choice will be locked, and from what they've said tech classes will not have the ability to switch to their mirrored class.

Can they actually switch, or just take the mirror class (or another opposite-faction class) as their second combat style? My understanding has been the latter, but I admit I'm not sure on that. And being able to switch would be a nice way to avoid "I wanted to play a sorcerer but had to start as a sage and now that's both my combat styles locked in" (whereas if you want to be a sniper you can just choose that from the start).

Can they actually switch, or just take the mirror class (or another opposite-faction class) as their second combat style? My understanding has been the latter, but I admit I'm not sure on that. And being able to switch would be a nice way to avoid "I wanted to play a sorcerer but had to start as a sage and now that's both my combat styles locked in" (whereas if you want to be a sniper you can just choose that from the start).

My understanding was that when you hit the dark or light side requirement, the game gives you a yes / no choice to make. If you click yes, your combat style gets swapped with that of their dark or light mirror. If you click no, it doesn't. Either way your choice becomes permanent and you can't swap it again later.

Due to the way in which it was said and the topic being talked about on the stream, it's possible that Chris Schmidt was just referring to the new player experience and that only new players would get this choice. Since new players only have one currently active combat style there wouldn't be an issue of having to give the mirror swap choice for both combat styles.

Having it work for everyone as a one time choice would be massively beneficial to those who at least semi-roleplay their character and want to see a progression from dark to light or light to dark. Hopefully it does work that way and not just for new players.

In terms of whether it would work for tech or not, I highly doubt it because tech combat styles are not tied to dark or light in the same way that force based combat styles are. It makes far more sense for your trooper to be using a sniper, mercenary, operative or powertech combat style at level 1 (ignoring the names to an extent) than a sith warrior using a sage combat style at level 1.

Ultimately, this is still one of the many things we need clarification on from the devs themselves because there are definitely justifiable arguments for it working both ways, working for just force or working for force and tech styles.

Yes, but what I was referring to was the ability to switch to your respective mirrored class. All force classes will be able to switch to their mirrored class once they meet the criteria (Sorcerer to Sage etc.)

But from what I can tell Tech classes will be stuck with that singular class once chosen, since they said on a stream that your class choice will be locked, and from what they've said tech classes will not have the ability to switch to their mirrored class.

Fussy: there won't be classes any more once 7.0 drops.

You pick an origin story (Trooper, Consular, etc.) when you begin, and you pick a combat style (derived from today's advanced classes).

Initially, a new account can only pick one of the "home" styles that match the origin story - a Bounty Hunter origin character will be able to pick Mercenary or PT, for example.

Once you finish an origin story (up to the end of Corellia before going to Ilum), you will be able to pick *it's* two styles on other characters of the same general sort: the example of BH would allow you to pick BH styles on other gun class types (Agent, Trooper, Smuggler) regardless of faction.

For Force User stories, it's more complicated. Initially, completing the story on one of them allows you to pick that origin's "home" styles on the other on the same faction. Example: finishing Sith Warrior allows you to pick Sith Warrior styles on a Sith Inquisitor. To unlock any Sith style on a Jedi character, you need to get at least one character do Dark V, (with the story complete), and similarly, to unlock any Jedi style on a Sith character, you need to get at least one character to Light V.

So yes, Gun types have it easier than Force User types because there's no obstacle imposed by the alignment thing.

And, of course, nobody will be able to change the origin story of an existing character.

Fussy: there won't be classes any more once 7.0 drops.

 

You pick an origin story (Trooper, Consular, etc.) when you begin, and you pick a combat style (derived from today's advanced classes).

 

Initially, a new account can only pick one of the "home" styles that match the origin story - a Bounty Hunter origin character will be able to pick Mercenary or PT, for example.

 

Once you finish an origin story (up to the end of Corellia before going to Ilum), you will be able to pick *it's* two styles on other characters of the same general sort: the example of BH would allow you to pick BH styles on other gun class types (Agent, Trooper, Smuggler) regardless of faction.

 

For Force User stories, it's more complicated. Initially, completing the story on one of them allows you to pick that origin's "home" styles on the other on the same faction. Example: finishing Sith Warrior allows you to pick Sith Warrior styles on a Sith Inquisitor. To unlock any Sith style on a Jedi character, you need to get at least one character do Dark V, (with the story complete), and similarly, to unlock any Jedi style on a Sith character, you need to get at least one character to Light V.

 

So yes, Gun types have it easier than Force User types because there's no obstacle imposed by the alignment thing.

 

And, of course, nobody will be able to change the origin story of an existing character.

Actually from what I understand this isn't exactly correct. Any character will have the ability to have only two Combat Styles. But you are limited to those two styles. So for instance if I want my Juggernaut to be able to switch to Assassin, I won't be able to also switch it to Sorcerer. Similar thing if I want my Powertech to be able to switch to a Gunslinger.

See:

Or https://swtorista.com/articles/new-combat-styles-information-from-interview-by-the-escape-pod-cast-and-swtors-game-design-director/ for a summary.

Actually from what I understand this isn't exactly correct. Any character will have the ability to have only two Combat Styles. But you are limited to those two styles. So for instance if I want my Juggernaut to be able to switch to Assassin, I won't be able to also switch it to Sorcerer. Similar thing if I want my Powertech to be able to switch to a Gunslinger.

 

See:

at about 34 minutes or so.

 

Or https://swtorista.com/articles/new-combat-styles-information-from-interview-by-the-escape-pod-cast-and-swtors-game-design-director/ for a summary.

Correct, but the range of styles you can choose from to fill those two slots is as I described.

Initially, a new account can only pick one of the "home" styles that match the origin story - a Bounty Hunter origin character will be able to pick Mercenary or PT, for example.

 

Once you finish an origin story (up to the end of Corellia before going to Ilum), you will be able to pick *it's* two styles on other characters of the same general sort: the example of BH would allow you to pick BH styles on other gun class types (Agent, Trooper, Smuggler) regardless of faction.

The way I've understood it is as follows:

New players who have never played before can choose any tech combat style on any tech origin story. No limits.

New players can pick any of the light side force based combat styles on any republic force origin story.

New players can pick any of the dark side force based combat styles on any sith empire force origin story.

In each case, you pick one combat style during character creation.

Then, at some point in or after act 3, you may pick your second combat style following the same restrictions as detailed above.

If during your story, you unlock the dark and/or light 5 achievement, you immediately unlock the ability for any character (including your current one if you haven't picked your second combat style) to pick any of the light or dark side based combat styles on either republic or sith empire force origin stories. This can even be done during character creation on a new character so that a jedi knight starts as a level 1 sith juggernaut - even if they haven't played the sith warrior storyline. Further, that character then gains the option to permanently swap their current combat style to the opposite mirror style - this is allows you to roleplay your jedi knight Guardian falling to the dark side and becoming a jedi knight Juggernaut for e.g.

For tech users, there are no restrictions. You simply pick your second combat style from any of the tech combat styles.

Then on your second character, if you have unlocked dark 5/light 5, you can pick from any of the force combat styles as any of the force origin styles regardless of light or dark alignments. You may then immediately pick your second combat style as soon as you enter the game at level 1.

For each case, there are no limitations based upon origin styles. Combat styles, though derived from current advanced classes, are different from advanced classes in that they have absolutely nothing to do with the base origin styles. The entire point of creating combat styles is that they become completely separate from the story. I haven't seen or heard any mention of combat styles being restricted until you finish the origin story that the combat style used to be attached to. If that is the case, it goes entirely against what this new system is supposed to be promoting.

The only restrictions that have been mentioned are those for new players (can only pick one combat style initially) and force based combat styles (can only pick dark styles on a republic character until you unlock the light 5 achievement at which point any character in your entire legacy can do so for e.g.).

If you have official sources for the supposed origin style based restrictions, please link them because I haven't seen any official news stating as such and I'd love to read through them.

The whole 2nd combat style is only if you are sub not sure if you are going to be able to keep it active if or when you go preferred but subs get 2 combat styles upon completing any act 3 of class storyline arcs and f2p and preferred before expansion get only 1 combat style as it stands right now which maybe subject to changes or cartel market changes if they feel they can market off it later on but will still be limited. Yes I do see them eventually coming out with maybe a item that you can have upto 3 combat styles per character that you could unlock 1 per use. And i also see them releasing a potential item that may undo a combat style choice later on down the road (it is doubtful but it is possible when it comes to the power of real money).

It is all kinda confusing with the whole darkside 5 lightside 5 switching to the opposite class of your original class. Some say it is automatic others are saying it takes your 2nd combat style slot. Seems like a lot of people have different interpretations of that livestream interview. Until we get it in PTS or live we will not really know for sure what exactly they are going to do with it.

I think it might be because my post wasn't very clear on my suggestion, but I am not looking for freely exchangeable classes. They were quite adamant on the stream that the class (and secondary class if you're a subscriber) you pick will be permanent, similarly to how it is now in the game.

My suggestion is that if, after reaching a certain criteria, force wielders will have the option to switch to their mirrored class, again which is purely an aesthetical change if you want your jedi to shoot lightning instead of rocks for instance.

In the same sense, let's say a character who picked the gunslinger class for their character but along the line would like the aesthetics to change to that of a sniper which in my opinion seems perfectly reasonable since they both have the same abilities, just mirrored, and the only real difference is that the animations, ability names and looks and the weapon would change, but gameplay-wise they would remain more or less the same.

Now one reason why this couldn't be implemented would be if the idea of mirrored classes is going to be a thing of the past and Snipers and Gunslingers are going to have vastly different abilities and stats in the future, but considering how they're implementing the upcoming Force classes and the switch from Light to Dark as far as I can tell will be purely for aesthetics, and have no consiquence on the gameplay, allowing similiar aesthetical mobility for the Tech classes in case a Pistol wielding Powertech wants to use a Blaster as a Vanguard now and then (Thinking of a recently released cartel market blaster rifle with a bounty hunter theme ;3).

It was suggested in the stream that this new system will allow the developers to add new classes in the future, which may be the case but I don't really see this, if implemented, implemented in any forseeable future, so my suggestion is based on the here and now, and the classes which will be available in 7.0.

So just for confirmation for anyone who might've been confused with this thread. I'm suggestion the ability to change between respective mirrored classes (Powertech/Vanguard, Gunslinger/Sniper). I am not suggestion the ability to being able to freely switch between any Tech class arbitrarily (Powertech to Operative or Mercenary to Sniper).

This would be a purely aesthetical choice, in case there are some Players (such as myself) who likes playing Powertech but sometimes wish they could see them using a blaster, like a Vanguard.

Again, apologies if this thread and my post was unclear on what I was trying to suggest and I hope to hear what you guys think on aesthetical freedeom betweeen mirrored classes.

Keep in mind we haven't received a testable build for this feature. It's possible that this is how BW plans for it to work already.

Mirror Classes are an issue for tech classes. A Sniper easily turning into dual-wielding Gunslinger, a cannon-wielding Commando choosing to go Mercenary small with pistols, or a pistol-whipping shotgun Scoundrel choosing to Operate with a rifle and a knife instead. One could argue it would make less sense than a force user switching to the dark side (or vice versa) and another could say it made more sense, both would be valid.

Immersion/Lore/Sense aside, there's also the issue of players picking two mirror classes as their two combat styles. A new player wouldn't know the zero utility gain from going Sniper+Gunslinger but it would just seem like a "cool concept" to him. And a heavy RP player might actually not care about utility and really just want to have a character swap between two guns and a sniper rifle.

Unlocking the mirror style automatically would be the best way to go, and I hope that's what the devs already have in mind.

You are already going to get this. Subs on 7.0 launch will be able to select a new Combat style from all available options. In the case of tech classes, you will have them all available, whereas Jedi/Sith will have all available in accordance with their alignment history.

If you have an Operative today and you want to make them a Commando/Gunslinger in 7.0, you will be able to do that at launch.

You are already going to get this. Subs on 7.0 launch will be able to select a new Combat style from all available options. In the case of tech classes, you will have them all available, whereas Jedi/Sith will have all available in accordance with their alignment history.

 

If you have an Operative today and you want to make them a Commando/Gunslinger in 7.0, you will be able to do that at launch.

This part isn't clear to me:

- You can only have up to 2 Combat Style choices per character

- Combat Style choices are permanent

- If you've unlocked Dark V, you can choose Dark Side Combat Styles on your Jedi character, and vice versa

Basically, my question is: If you have Sage and Shadow as your two permanent combat styles, and have Dark V, do you essentially have not just 2, but 4 Combat Styles available to you (Sage, Shadow, Sorcerer, Assassin) to cater to a player character "turning to the dark side" scenario?

If not, will Bioware then prevent players from having two Mirror classes as their two permanent Combat Styles? And if they do get their mirror counterparts, do the Tech choices also get their mirrors available?

If you have an existing character with the alignment already unlocked, you will be able to choose either. For new characters you will start with the faction choice and then when the option becomes available you would be able to swap to the mirror AC

I don't think it is clear whether you would be able to pick Sage and Sorc for your two classes though, whereas you will be able to pick Commando and Merc.