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BioWare, GTN prices are insane, its time to do something


ShieldProtection

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I myself am a subscriber and i have abit of mixed feelings about this

I mean, with some things that a player wants, you're just gonna have to subscribe in order to get it.

However... That does'nt change the fact that items are ridiculously overpriced in a way where i'm thinking to myself

"Who do those sellers think i am? Bill Gates? Vince McMahon? Donald Trump?" I am not a friggin billionaire nor should i be in order to buy certain items.

 

Fact is: BioWare made this game. It's their game and only they can make adjustments / changes to it.

and while they were quitte succesful when they released this game by achieving 1 million subscribers within the first 3 days, it's because of us, their customers, their players that made the game succesful. And quitte frankly... Making a game ain't too hard neither is getting people play it. But keeping the players, staying succesful is the REAL challenge and i truly believe that staying succesful, requires to listen to what your customers, the players of your game wishes.

 

Now ofcourse, some of those wishes aren't really beneficial, i will admit that.

But there are also wishes that alot of players have and pointed out but BioWare did'nt seem to listen to, which is such a shame, because with some of those "wishes", it "can" cost them players.

 

This is ofcourse how i see it, how i feel about it.

Edited by TriceraNL
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I still think (I posted this before) that making it possible to put things on the GTN as "Bind on Pickup"** would allow people to put items on the GTN at reasonable (or even, cheap) prices without having scalpers buy them up to resell.

 

** key word, "optional". You put an item on the GTN and choose to make it BoP. This way, those people who wish to help the less fortunate can actually do so.

 

** or Bind to Legacy on Pickup (BtLoP?) would be even better. 🙂

 

I’d support that as long as it was implemented as you suggest and is voluntary because I often find scalpers will buy slow moving stuff if you need quick credits and you lower it a bit. Plus, I make a tidy sum scalping CM dyes and I’d hate to lose that income 😉

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  • Dev Post

Hi folks,

 

As the conversation here started veering off-topic and was not constructive, we removed posts from this thread.

 

We ask everyone to be respectful of each other even if there is disagreement or difference of opinion. Should posts here continue to violate guidelines, we will remove the posts and close the thread.

 

- Community Team

 

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Hi folks,

 

As the conversation here started veering off-topic and was not constructive, we removed posts from this thread.

 

We ask everyone to be respectful of each other even if there is disagreement or difference of opinion. Should posts here continue to violate guidelines, we will remove the posts and close the thread.

 

- Community Team

 

 

Is there any chance you could get the dev team to comment on this topic? Then we wouldn’t need to defend them or second guess what they are planning to do to combat the hyperinflation.

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For anyone interested, the best value CM to credit conversion via the GTN is the Additional Character Slot - CM description or the Server Character Slot - GTN description (just to make it confusing :rolleyes:)

 

600CC converts to between 300,000,000 to 360,000,000 Credits. Which is much better than trading Hypercrates for a Billion credits. You can literally buy 9 server slots from the CM for the same price as 1 hypercrate.

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The game can be played fully and without hinderance, completely ignoring the GTN. The market sets itself, inflated though it may seem.

 

At launch prices were lower but credits were harder to earn.....rewards were small, you had to pay for things like levelling up abilities etc. Now, rewards for activities in game are higher, the activities are esier to achieve etc. so its all relative.

 

If someone cannot afford a fluff item off the GTN, its not the end of the world.

 

Years ago I remember spending 20m on a mount - I thought to myself I must be mad...it almost wiped out every credit I had at the time. All these years later, I've invested a LOT of time into the game and built up a "nest egg" of credits which I feel I deserve to keep. That same mount may now be 200m or maybe way more but my ability to buy it has also increased.

 

The ability to buy straight of the Cartel Market is also a lot easier this year now that you gain a lot of coins doing the galactic seasons, so again you can ignore the GTN for an awful lot of things.

 

Finally, even if they do deflate the economy somehow and reduce down the number of credits in game, the rich will still be relatively rich and the poor relatively poor. Some players have poured 10 years into the game and GTN play and should not be faulted for that and new players should not expect to have everything just handed to them as a right.

 

I do agree that maybe the devs should consider saying whether they intend to do something (without giving specifics necessarily) or whether they intend to do nothing.

 

Its obviously a topic people care about and as such, I feel the community manager should acknowledge that in some way. These are discussion forums after all and without any sort of comment by the developers of the game we are all just talking in a vacuum. It is the ONLY place for Devs and players to converse in a meaningful manner...the players are doing their bit in that regard but Dev participation is much lacking for a game hitting a big anniversary in my humble opinion.

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It's not a crazy difficult fix, really.

 

Increase GTN cap to 10 billion. GTN tax for anything 1b and under is 8%. Anything above 1b is taxed 12%.

 

Put a few high end mounts that cost 5b or 10b credits. Bring back an old Cartel Market mount that's been retired and make it available via credits.

 

Same for armor. Bring back some retired cosmetic armor, recolor it, and make each piece cost 500m or 1b. Maybe bring back the old Battlemaster or Rakata gear from launch. Whatever.

 

Just put heavy credit sinks into the game and the market will slowly correct itself. With less freeflowing credits and multiple high end credit sinks, prices will slowly fluctuate downward if people want to sell their goods.

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It's not a crazy difficult fix, really.

 

Increase GTN cap to 10 billion. GTN tax for anything 1b and under is 8%. Anything above 1b is taxed 12%.

 

Put a few high end mounts that cost 5b or 10b credits. Bring back an old Cartel Market mount that's been retired and make it available via credits.

 

Same for armor. Bring back some retired cosmetic armor, recolor it, and make each piece cost 500m or 1b. Maybe bring back the old Battlemaster or Rakata gear from launch. Whatever.

 

Just put heavy credit sinks into the game and the market will slowly correct itself. With less freeflowing credits and multiple high end credit sinks, prices will slowly fluctuate downward if people want to sell their goods.

 

This wouldn't really fix the problem for a couple of reasons.

 

1a) The character cap is 4.2 billion (roughly), so raising the GTN cap to 10 billion won't work.

1b) If you want 1a to work, then BW would have to make it possible to either raise the character credit cap (which I do not believe is needed), or allow the GTN to take it directly out of our Legacy storage. I'm 100% against this.

 

2) Those that have been playing for years and have gotten billions of credits generally don't spend them on cosmetics as much since that is the only thing in the game that costs much, So adding Cosmetic items for massive costs won't do much against the inflation, just take more credits from those that don't have as much.

 

The only good idea I'd suggest is to raise the GTN tax (and remove the guild perks that lower it). The problem with this is that people will just start using trade chat and completely stop using the GTN which will bypass the GTN tax completely making it useless as well.

 

With your idea, the rich will just keep getting richer, and those with less credits will continue to have less credits.

Edited by Toraak
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This wouldn't really fix the problem for a couple of reasons.

 

1a) The character cap is 4.2 billion (roughly), so raising the GTN cap to 10 billion won't work.

1b) If you want 1a to work, then BW would have to make it possible to either raise the character credit cap (which I do not believe is needed), or allow the GTN to take it directly out of our Legacy storage. I'm 100% against this.

 

2) Those that have been playing for years and have gotten billions of credits generally don't spend them on cosmetics as much since that is the only thing in the game that costs much, So adding Cosmetic items for massive costs won't do much against the inflation, just take more credits from those that don't have as much.

 

The only good idea I'd suggest is to raise the GTN tax (and remove the guild perks that lower it). The problem with this is that people will just start using trade chat and completely stop using the GTN which will bypass the GTN tax completely making it useless as well.

 

With your idea, the rich will just keep getting richer, and those with less credits will continue to have less credits.

 

1a) I still don't see the problem. Raise the character credit limit. People are more inclined to spend more money when they have more cash on them. Point of sale goes down dramatically if there is any difficulty in acquiring funds.

 

2) If you're saying rich people never spend money on cosmetics and that cosmetics are the only thing that costs a lot, then why is there a current problem? That would mean rich people never buy anything expensive, which would cause lower demand and lower prices. In addition, your generalization is not based on any fact whatsoever, as you have zero data to back up your claim. However, there is historical precedent both in the real word and gaming community that people enjoy status symbols, even if they're ridiculously expensive. Showing off wealth has been a human behaviors for thousands of years. Thus I'm willing to bet there will be plenty of people who would drop 5b or 10b for an awesome, unique mount.

 

Your assumption that people will use trade chat is also relatively unfounded. No one wants to sit around for hours at a time trying to sell something. It defeats the purpose of playing the game. The vast majority of sellers choose the GTN because it simply saves them time. This is true of any in-game market...free and instant advertising 24/7. It won't suddenly cease to exist because a handful of people don't want to pay an extra 4%.

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You are both right.

 

1. BioWare don’t need to increase the player credit limit as it keeps a lid on inflation at 4 Billion because players can’t trade more than 4 billion.

 

2. Increase the GTN credit cap to 4 billion and add a gradual tax increase from 8% to 12%. But start at 500 million and add 1% to the GTN tax for every billion after.

 

3. Reduce the amount of credits a player can trade with another to 999 million. That way it becomes more difficult for players to circumvent the GTN tax and it will stay an effective credit sink.

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You are both right.

 

1. BioWare don’t need to increase the player credit limit as it keeps a lid on inflation at 4 Billion because players can’t trade more than 4 billion.

 

2. Increase the GTN credit cap to 4 billion and add a gradual tax increase from 8% to 12%. But start at 500 million and add 1% to the GTN tax for every billion after.

 

3. Reduce the amount of credits a player can trade with another to 999 million. That way it becomes more difficult for players to circumvent the GTN tax and it will stay an effective credit sink.

 

1. Again though, raising the credit cap increases the ability to spend. And if you can increase the cap and then add certain items that cost an exorbitant amount, that increases spending. I believe the whole purpose is to increase spending.

 

2. I like your way better than the one I suggested. A gradual increase is best, I agree.

 

3. This idea is great conceptually, but doesn't work in practice. A player could trade 999m and then just open another window to trade another 999m.

 

I still think cosmetic credit sinks are enormously helpful for the situation. Make some really cool mounts, outfits, and decorations cost huge sums of money.

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I still think cosmetic credit sinks are enormously helpful for the situation. Make some really cool mounts, outfits, and decorations cost huge sums of money.

 

And then BioWare would have to deal with complaints from players who don't have huge sums of credits to spend on really cool mounts, outfits, and decorations. This may help resolve one problem but it would also create a new problem.

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It's not a crazy difficult fix, really.

 

Increase GTN cap to 10 billion. GTN tax for anything 1b and under is 8%. Anything above 1b is taxed 12%.

 

Put a few high end mounts that cost 5b or 10b credits. Bring back an old Cartel Market mount that's been retired and make it available via credits.

 

Same for armor. Bring back some retired cosmetic armor, recolor it, and make each piece cost 500m or 1b. Maybe bring back the old Battlemaster or Rakata gear from launch. Whatever.

 

Just put heavy credit sinks into the game and the market will slowly correct itself. With less freeflowing credits and multiple high end credit sinks, prices will slowly fluctuate downward if people want to sell their goods.

 

Agree, generally.

 

0. Increase character and guild bank caps to 100 billion as well (legacy bank already is at 100b)

 

1. Some quibbles with the suggested prices. 500m per set will pull some credits off the game; 500m per piece will not do as much. Not many will pay 3.5b for a set, a lot more will pay 500m. But this is details; I support the the main idea.

 

2. I oppose the higher tax; the price will just adjust higher to account for the tax.

Edited by mike_carton
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You are both right.

 

1. BioWare don’t need to increase the player credit limit as it keeps a lid on inflation at 4 Billion because players can’t trade more than 4 billion.

 

2. Increase the GTN credit cap to 4 billion and add a gradual tax increase from 8% to 12%. But start at 500 million and add 1% to the GTN tax for every billion after.î

 

3. Reduce the amount of credits a player can trade with another to 999 million. That way it becomes more difficult for players to circumvent the GTN tax and it will stay an effective credit sink.

 

I oppose all of these. BW should just let the players trade as they see fit, reducing the artificial limits and controls (increase caps to 100 billion). The only things they should do that will help players with fewer credits:

 

1. Make augments and augmentation kits available at more reasonable prices since they are needed for playing the game well; they should do this my carefully calibrating everything related to crafting these items so crafters can put them on GTN for lower (than now) prices. Currently, it costs 100+ million to fully augment a set. This is augments, not amplifiers.

 

2. Reduce the 1 million credits part of the price for each set bonus item. Newer players - who should still be able to play the harder content that requires set bonus items - should be finding it difficult and very expensive now to buy the set bonus gear, buy kits and augments and apply them, buy consumables needed and so on. Reduce the burden on them by reducing the prices the game charges.

 

3. Consider eliminating the BioChem 700 pre-requisite for using MK-2 non-consumable medpaks, stims, and adrenals.

 

All of the above are required for playing some parts of the game but are currently expensive. Changing that will help newer players and players with fewer credits. There is no NEED to artificially reduce the prices of aspirational goods on the GTN or to otherwise import bad policies from the real world into the game.

Edited by mike_carton
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My 2c.

 

Inflation exists, but has been over-stated by many. Just because item <xyz> sold for 50M a year ago, doesn't mean it now selling for 1B = the sky is falling. There are MANY items that have remained stable / moved very little. People like to cherry pick the prestige items that will sell for a lot under any level of inflation and not look at the economy as a whole.

 

Inflation is normal, and should be expected in a game of this vintage. Some people have had 10 years to build their wealth. Inflation isn't a bad thing, it's normal in every economy.

 

Many solutions proposed don't address the root problems.

(1) There aren't enough cash sinks in this game - at least not ones desirable for many to drop coin on. With no effective means to remove currency from the game (outside of players quitting while holding onto their wealth), inflation will go unchecked. Taxes IRL (especially estate taxes) can keep this in check. A graduated or progressive GTN tax could indeed address part of the issue here. Additional options could include raising repair bills, vendor prices (especially on new ones introduced in 7.0 and lowering credit rewards across the board. Not saying any one of these is the option, but demonstrating there are mechanisms to remove currency from the pool.

 

(2) Cartel Coin supply has decreased overall. I suspect this is due in-part from players waiting for the expansion and investing less IRL$ in the game, perhaps even a drop in over-all player numbers as well. Also I attribute this to the removal of the refer-a-friend program which added CC into circulation and devalued CC overall. The moment less CC were available, prices started to increase.

 

Offering players a way to earn more CC for "free" would help drive prices down.

A currency exchange, CC for Credits or vice-versa would also address these issues. Though the cynic in my suspects neither of these options are something big E.A. is interested in.

 

(3) F2P and Preferred credit caps have not followed inflation. They have been set at levels appropriate for a new game, not one that's 10+ years old. I fully believe this limitation is partially to blame for the hostility many have towards the economy. Not that I believe F2P should get unlimited access to everything paid players receive access to, but they are left artificially impoverished by a system that hasn't kept pace with the times.

 

This is especially troubling if a solution of increasing cash sinks (vendor prices, repairs, etc.) is introduced.

 

What we're left with is a smaller percentage of the player base that can access wealth, and as such the wealth is artificially in the hands of fewer that is likely good for the economy. At which point sales are just happening between wealthy with money not being distributed as widely or freely as it should.

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I oppose all of these. BW should just let the players trade as they see fit, reducing the artificial limits and controls (increase caps to 100 billion). The only things they should do that will help players with fewer credits:

 

1. Make augments and augmentation kits available at more reasonable prices since they are needed for playing the game well; they should do this my carefully calibrating everything related to crafting these items so crafters can put them on GTN for lower (than now) prices.

 

2. Reduce the 1 million credits part of the price for each set bonus item. Newer players - who should still be able to play the harder content that requires set bonus items - should be finding it difficult and very expensive now to buy the set bonus gear, buy kits and augments and apply them, buy consumables needed and so on. Reduce the burden on them by reducing the prices the game charges.

 

3. Consider eliminating the BioChem 700 pre-requisite for using MK-2 non-consumable medpaks, stims, and adrenals.

 

All of the above are required for playing some parts of the game but are currently expensive. Changing that will help newer players and players with fewer credits. There is no NEED to artificially reduce the prices of aspirational goods on the GTN or to otherwise import bad policies from the real world into the game.

 

You didn’t offer a reason why you oppose the suggestions myself and others have made

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(3) F2P and Preferred credit caps have not followed inflation. They have been set at levels appropriate for a new game, not one that's 10+ years old. I fully believe this limitation is partially to blame for the hostility many have towards the economy. Not that I believe F2P should get unlimited access to everything paid players receive access to, but they are left artificially impoverished by a system that hasn't kept pace with the times.

 

is this, bad? f2p having a low credit cap means they cant access the more expensive cartel market cosmetics and other items from the gtn, resulting in less competition for subscriber and that they end up buying cosmetic items directly from the cartel market or subscribe to sort out their credit cap

 

all the stuff on gtn that they cant afford is just the most cosmetic items anyway, is it really a big deal? there is still plenty below a mil

Edited by RikuvonDrake
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is this, bad? f2p having a low credit cap means they cant access the more expensive cartel market cosmetics and other items from the gtn, resulting in less competition for subscriber and that they end up buying cosmetic items directly from the cartel market or subscribe to sort out their credit cap

 

all the stuff on gtn that they cant afford is just the most cosmetic items anyway, is it really a big deal? there is still plenty below a mil

 

It’s not a big deal if you look at it that way. But the flip side for sellers is you’re removing or negating part the buyer base. Which isn’t a huge drama at the moment, but it could become an issue if the “subscriber” population drops vs F2P/preferred.

Also, as CM cosmetics have gone up in price, so have the non CM prices. So eventually even those will be out of reach of F2P/Preferred.

As an example, I don’t bother selling any crafted items below 1 million credits these days. Of course people could always craft instead of buying my stuff. But if that’s the argument, why even have a GTN for non CM items.

Inflation is affecting the whole GTN and while some less popular or over supplied items are still cheap, the other poster is correct when they say F2P credit cap hasn’t kept up with the hyperinflation.

Edited by TrixxieTriss
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is this, bad? f2p having a low credit cap means they cant access the more expensive cartel market cosmetics and other items from the gtn, resulting in less competition for subscriber and that they end up buying cosmetic items directly from the cartel market or subscribe to sort out their credit cap

 

all the stuff on gtn that they cant afford is just the most cosmetic items anyway, is it really a big deal? there is still plenty below a mil

 

In isolation? No.

 

As was pointed out below however, that severely limits the pool of players able to purchase goods, which is a contributing factor to the current state of the economy. Also noted was how this isn't exclusive to cosmetic items, as the price of CC items goes up, so does the price of other items. The entire GTN is riddled with high priced, low level items that are just out of reach for F2P players. Drive them away, and the player base is worse off in the long run.

 

Additionally, I suggested increasing cash sinks, including repairs and vendor prices. Unless the F2P credit cap is increased, that would adversely affect these players.

 

I firmly believe that the game is more free to try but it's evident to everyone that prices have increased over 10 years. F2P credit cap should get with the times.

Edited by MsTickle
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As was pointed out below however, that severely limits the pool of players able to purchase goods, which is a contributing factor to the current state of the economy.

 

How do you figure? If the "pool of players able to purchase goods" is severely limited, you'd expect the prices to actually trend lower, not go up.

The entire GTN is riddled with high priced, low level items that are just out of reach for F2P players. Drive them away, and the player base is worse off in the long run.

 

That should not be a problem. None of those things is actually needed to play the game; they're mostly cosmetic. Excepting for a few items I wrote about (and had suggestions for.) No reason for F2P players to leave. Besides, as F2P players they're not contributing to the development or even maintenance of the game; where is the bite to their threat to leave?

Additionally, I suggested increasing cash sinks, including repairs and vendor prices.

 

Repair costs are bad credit sinks; they will negatively impact players with fewer credits; long-term players with larger balances will not feel it. In a progression group, I might spend 500K in repairs from my pocket in a single session and not even feel it; not every player can or should have to, which is the reason we make repair funds available from the guild bank.

 

Good credit sinks are like Yarvok's Gratitude; completely cosmetic items that offer a means to show off.

I firmly believe that the game is more free to try but it's evident to everyone that prices have increased over 10 years. F2P credit cap should get with the times.

 

I firmly believe that the F2P implementation should not give away the house; it should offer just enough for F2P players to enjoy the promise of the game but should ultimately encourage the F2P players to subscribe. An F2P set up where most of the F2P players are happy with the limitations and continue to play F2P for years on end is a failed implementation of the model.

Edited by mike_carton
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You didn’t offer a reason why you oppose the suggestions myself and others have made

 

I did not want to repeat myself. As I wrote in a previous post in this thread,

I believe that there is no real problem here to solve.

 

and I agree with this suggestion:

Instead of looking on at our riches with envy, try doing what we did, work hard, or buy your way in.

 

Increases in prices of non-essential items do not constitute a problem, so I'm opposed to solutions for this non-problem. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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Additionally, I suggested increasing cash sinks, including repairs and vendor prices. Unless the F2P credit cap is increased, that would adversely affect these players.

 

I would definitely support an increase in repair costs. Not only is it’s good credit sink, but it also encourages smart play and teaches players to improve their skills. I would go as far as even adding it to pvp in some format.

Edited by TrixxieTriss
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I would definitely support an increase in repair costs. Not only is it’s good credit sink, but it also encourages smart play and teaches players to improve their skills. I would go as far as even adding it to pvp in some format.

 

Getting farmed in regs by players that have played for years? Get better 4head (it would be optimal to just /stuck it if you are going to lose to dodge the repair. Moophy knew all along)

 

I like it. Positive change.

 

The fact that most items cant even be sold on the GTN anymore if you dont want to rip yourself off is hilarious. Items going for character credit cap is clearly a sign of a healthy game economy. Bioware cant fix the credit problem? Welp cough up that 50$ in cc for that platinum saber.

 

This is not a problem for veterans who have played for years. This is a MASSIVE wall to new players when they look at the player market and see items going for 100s of millions and everyone is telling you thats cheap. Sadly this credit inflation problem doesnt hurt Bioware since it just forces more people into the CM and away from the GTN. I dont see this problem ever going away. It is just going to get worse and worse as the months go on.

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