Hmmmm....this proposed change to overload/force wave may be about skill for some Sorcs/Sages but it will, in my opinion, impact healers more than DPS Sorcs/Sages. See, our knockback is an EXTREMELY important part of our defensive abilities when healing given that we usually have to contend with 2 to 4 enemies on us on an almost constant basis. DPS Sorcs/Sages usually have no more than 1 or 2 enemies on them, if even that. As such, positioning for the 120-degree knockback won't be as difficult for them as it will be for healers as some enemies will almost certainly not be knocked back no matter how much 'skill' positioning we do. With timed and staggered stuns preventing us from using the new heal and the new changes to force speed, this change will be problematic for healers.

Yeah, if huttball was the only wz, this wouldn't be an issue. The issue is that this was a range-creator against classes with leaps. Run/jump/spin/cast/spinback/land/"continue running in same dir" isn't an option in getting overload to connect after leaps that root the caster. Before, you could just overload/root/strafe/attack. They've basically overload into a multitarget force push, which isn't something sorcs and sages really needed.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=5120773&postcount=352

-Force wave change from 360 animation lag KB to 120 degree kb: honestly, this sucks, why limit it at all? Nobody complains, its a moderate kb at best, and trust me, I fully intend to hit everyone in that 360 radius.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=5120854&postcount=10

The major problem I have with the change is ;

Most of the enemies I wish to hit with this skill will be behind me. I can hook jump turn cast when not stunned but I would prefer the cone to be behind me....

 

but much like other skills changed to suit metrics, some will take it off the skill bar entirely, some will use it and some will leave the game shaking their heads in disbelief.

 

For me I will try it out. I would advise the balance team to play the game alongside actual players a few hours and ask their opinions though.

 

I would also like to see ALL Aoes changed to 120 degrees frontal as well and check to see if the same posters jump in saying " good move increases skill factor".

This is how I feel.

 

Knockbacks were a little 'derp' if you asked me. Sure even in Huttball you kinda had to position yourself. But more often than not you just gotta pop your KB and everyone is gone.

 

This change will make it more about skill.

 

- Not only will the person with the knockback have to position himself before he can successfully knock everyone off

- But if an attacker can manage to stay behind him/to the side, then he wont be effected by the knockback

 

I also think this will make scoring in huttball a lot harder. . .but that's probably balanced out by the change to stuns. Having a KB with a 15m directional 'cone' to knock someone off the goal line 'ledge' is going to be super easy to do. Of course this is assuming that your team is not dumb enough to white bar him(which lets face it, happens WAY too often in pugs lol)

and this would be fine if all knockbacks got this change. But only sorcerer/sages did. Troopers/Bounty Hunters is still the same and I believe Snipers didnt change either. But at least they made it instant so no more wasting a cooldown on it just to be sent flying backwards cause of the animation delay

Instant knockback more than makes up for it.

This.

You can turn around instantly like an FPS. I'm not too worried about the overload. The range on the stun concerns me more. That 30m stun has caused more:

interceptions

Failed pass receptions

saved more lives so I have time to swing my guard

interrupted that heal till I get in interrupt range

Killed people in the fire/acid pit

Stopped range dps on my ball runner when I'm stuck on another level.

Stopped people short of getting the heal/dps powerup

Just the things I can think of off the top of my head.

A player's class gets 3 buffs and 1 nerf...

Complains about nerf.

Will ball carriers be affected by this knockback? Just imagine all the times someone is going to mess up, many times as the outcome of latency, and send the carrier into their own goal when in reality they were trying to send them the other way or down into the pit. There are going to be a lot of angry team mates.

Or let's say that everything is on CD except Force Wave and you're trying to slow down a carrier before he/she reaches the goal line. With this change we now have to be infront of the carrier, a carrier that often is an assassin with sprint too that makes it impossible to get on the right side. Other classes might have a chance through raw burst but that's not really an option for a sage/sorc.

A player's class gets 3 buffs and 1 nerf...

 

 

Complains about nerf.

Will ball carriers be affected by this knockback? Just imagine all the times someone is going to mess up, many times as the outcome of latency, and send the carrier into their own goal when in reality they were trying to send them the other way or down into the pit. There are going to be a lot of angry team mates.

 

Or let's say that everything is on CD except Force Wave and you're trying to slow down a carrier before he/she reaches the goal line. With this change we now have to be infront of the carrier, a carrier that often is an assassin with sprint too that makes it impossible to get on the right side. Other classes might have a chance through raw burst but that's not really an option for a sage/sorc.

We got a heal that probably won't even make up for 50 % of a normal crit and a lower CD on sprint, things no one asked for and won't make a difference. The other changes were for deep-spec healers and TK, no sane person brings a TK into PvP. The nerf on the other hand, the 10m range on electrolute, is a gamebreaker, especially since the other ranged class, sniper/gunslinger, still has 30 m and much bigger crits. The changes to FW is pretty big too and is IMO only giving maras/sents a free leap on us. Where is the real buff, the buff to dps, that people have been asking for?

I like how you play down all the buffs like they don't matter at all. As if they have zero effect on the game. Get real. Especially the free heal! You can't just play down the buffs like they don't exist.

You'll adapt to the tiny nerfs you got.

The problem with the cone push that is going to happen is that often times the game lags thus creating misses. I did not see one post about overpowered knock backs. I use the knock back to get an annoying CC locking operative off my back. I believe ops got multiple buffs now.

This is what I saw in the forums about CCs: DAMN STOP THE CCs FROM HAPPENING SOO MUCH

Changes decided on

- Proposed change makes CCs happen more removing resolve maxes on multiple ccing at once

- CCs must be close now... (bad for sorcs an already nurf batted class 2x from the start of this game) They wont be playing close around a fight with out a DC except a small self heal and a cone AOE knockback that will be hard to target anyone when you have lag.

- assassins will be able to sprint most of the game with a hybrid build

The game is too fragile in its current state to handle nurfs... what are they thinking? Just buff the classes that need it.

I felt every buff was needed in the notes but I am sure others have an opinion.

They are not going to reconsider or take anything you have to say into consideration. They do not care and are going to do what they want. The ability should be renamed, since it's more like a force push now. Quite sad.

You people are knocking on Stalin's door.

Move on.

You people are knocking on Stalin's door.

Move on.

So true.. Did they take out insurance on this game? I love it but its so weird.

I like how you play down all the buffs like they don't matter at all. As if they have zero effect on the game. Get real. Especially the free heal! You can't just play down the buffs like they don't exist.

 

You'll adapt to the tiny nerfs you got.

And no, a 2K heal won't have any effect because if you, as a sorc/sage, are in a position where you need to use a medpac it's most likely already too late. Not to mention that medpacs, that probably will heal for more than the new heal ability, already are in the game. So you save a few credits?

Lastly, you admit that the update is a nerf? Sorcs/sages have already fled in masses and from the look of the forums this is going to be the last nail in the coffin for a class that requires much more from the player than atleast three other dps AC'es for it to be competitive on a high level.

And on top of that all 2-3 melee classes need to do is make sure that they come to consulars at >120 degree away from each other. The Consular is pretty dead.

yes because you should not die if 3 people are on you :/

A player's class gets 3 buffs and 1 nerf...

 

 

Complains about nerf.

Pretty much this ^

Despite all the whining about how fragile the Inq/Cons class is, you guys really have it pretty easy vs. melee classes. The buffs you got MORE than make up for this. Most of the good coordinated PvP teams that I see are full of this class cross-healing each other and chain spamming Force Wave while they hold down nodes and being nearly invincible. I'm glad to see that there might actually have to be some thought into playing this class in 1.4.

Despite all the whining about how fragile the Inq/Cons class is, you guys really have it pretty easy vs. melee classes. The buffs you got MORE than make up for this.

Yes 2-3 sorcs holding a node vs 1-2 melee should hold down the fort... now put 3 sorcs focus healing with a cast time dependent heal (or go out of mana using the fast lower number one) vs 3 maras attack focusing the same target. Yup we are a great support class and that is all we are with a now 3x nerf bat hitting us since the start of the game.

Just start buffing classes and not nerfing. I've said that over and over.

So true.. Did they take out insurance on this game? I love it but its so weird.

Sigworthy.

This is how I feel.

 

Knockbacks were a little 'derp' if you asked me. Sure even in Huttball you kinda had to position yourself. But more often than not you just gotta pop your KB and everyone is gone.

From a person who's listed two characters in their signature, both of which are melee with no "charge" or "leap" type ability, I'm not surprised you think that 360° knockbacks are a little "derp".

From the point of view of a ranged class who needs to do significant damage to an assailant before they get into melee range, I think Force Leap on a 15s cooldown to get into melee range is a little "Derp". I also think stealth is a little "Derp". It's all about perspective.

/signed

I can't count the number of times I've been stunned then the player runs behind me to attack.

or the number of times i've been surrounded both in PvE and PvP and simply needed the space to survive.

frankly if this go through my sage and my sorc are both done.

Pity I was starting to like them

It won't be to hard to sidestep, turn camera, knock back, turn camera and run. Or for gods sake BACKPEDAL 2 steps, KB, turn and run. Better yet, if you have a teammate they can come in, knock them all off you. Crazy talk, I know.

I am concerned about being in leaping range but I need to try it first before I judge.

It won't be to hard to sidestep, turn camera, knock back, turn camera and run. Or for gods sake BACKPEDAL 2 steps, KB, turn and run. Better yet, if you have a teammate they can come in, knock them all off you. Crazy talk, I know.

 

I am concerned about being in leaping range but I need to try it first before I judge.

Sorcerer is already the hardest class to play well, increasing the skill cap is the exact opposite of what they should be doing right now.

Factor in the INSANE amount of client/server lag and you can bet that most of your Overloads will be 100% wasted since that guy in front of you isn't really in front of you.

It won't be to hard to sidestep, turn camera, knock back, turn camera and run. Or for gods sake BACKPEDAL 2 steps, KB, turn and run. Better yet, if you have a teammate they can come in, knock them all off you. Crazy talk, I know.

 

I am concerned about being in leaping range but I need to try it first before I judge.

Dont worry man assuming your a sorc you have a 2k-3k heal with a cooldown that does not use mana because we all know in the games that you need a good knockback your completely OOM. You will be fine. Just knock them back.. backpeddle at half speed.. rotate your camera and sprint away praying no CC after your first CC breaker not filling your resolve up. Better yet run at them all kamikaze style. Don't forget your bubble and your 19 sec dot to truly burn them down in your 1 min 1v1 fight hoping they dont push the right 4 buttons.

I am happy I have multiple 50 toons. I just miss my sorc.

Factor in the INSANE amount of client/server lag and you can bet that most of your Overloads will be 100% wasted since that guy in front of you isn't really in front of you.

^^ exactly this

Overloads will be 100% wasted since that guy in front of you isn't really in front of you.

I have considered that flaw, but refused to mention it in my previous post hoping it will be dealt with in 1.4. (I hope, but I doubt)