But, you missed SWTOR didn't you! Here you are, back on SWTOR!

 

P.S. What class are you going to play now that PTs and Ops are both top of the heap?

 

I didn't miss swtor at all, i returned back because i was banned in wow for flaming and swearing (multiple times kek). Now iam forced to return to this junkyard with dead team ranked, bots, dsync, buggs and incompetent class balance (did they really nerfed merc's set bonus? And running heal tactical? Lmao). I see devs also decided to add deserter to regs which only proves how far away from their own game they are.

The biggest problem in this game is that devs aren't playing it. If they actually played their own game they would see that nerfing merc or viru sniper wasn't necessary, adding deserter to regs is a bad idea and that team ranked needs to be returned back to season 10 state. They also would see how many buggs this game has. But they won't play. When i played wow i think i saw some of swtor crew members playing it too not sure but wouldn't be surprised if it happened

So did they add the deserter timer?

 

I’m away from my PC at the moment and can’t check on the game

So did they add the deserter timer?

 

I’m away from my PC at the moment and can’t check on the game

 

Not in lowbies at least, so I guess not.

Nope, there is no penalty for leaving.

I think I'm starting to love you guys.

Legacy tokens is great to here I'm so happy to see that change after campaigning for it for so long, would you guys be able to confirm whether we are getting legacy tokens before the replicas are re released because if that is the case I will not have to q all my games on my jugg dps and I can have more freedom with what I play.

So if you’re a player who dislikes one particular mode, particularly if that mode is OPG, why should you be forced to play it?

 

Why can't we just pick a match like PVE can pick a flashpoint? It seems like such a simple solution.

Edited July 16, 2020 by Dlegofan
edited extra text

Hey Friends,

 

Just wanted to follow up on some of the conversations happening around the changes we’ve talked about in this thread, and what action we’re taking over the short and long term to address a couple concerns.

 

First, let’s start by talking about the change that has driven the most discussion: The extension of the Deserter debuff to Unranked for those that leave a match early (coming in patch 6.1.2d).

 

The premise of this change is in-line with our goal of PvP being a fun, fair place to play. When a player leaves a warzone (or afk’s), they are affecting the experience for the other 15 players in the match. This sort of behavior artificially adds friction to the experience, and disproportionately affects the ‘fun’ and ‘fairness’ for everyone else. We will not support this behavior with our systems, but we must ask ourselves why players are motivated to use this type of action?

 

Well, y’all have been very clear and vocal about many of these reasons. So let’s get into it:

 

Performance

 

We hear you that performance in warzones continues to be an issue, especially since the 6.0 update. In particular, you have all indicated performance in the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps are especially egregious.

 

What we’re doing about it: In the short term, in the upcoming patch 6.1.2d, we will remove the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps from rotation until we can solve the performance issues with those particular maps.

 

Longer term, we are profiling the root of performance issues in general (de-syncs, hitches, slide show experiences) across the board in order to provide you with a smooth, fun experience. No ETA on this, but we have already begun in earnest and are committed to fixing it.

 

Preference

 

We hear you that you would rather choose which maps or modes to play, to avoid the ones you don’t like and play what is the most fun for you. In particular, Odessen Proving Grounds comes up often as one of the least popular modes, in particular in Unranked since it can be difficult to coordinate team play in a random queue situation.

 

So let’s talk a bit about the map rotation. Currently, and for some time now, we favor map variety over match type variety.

 

We categorize match types into 5 categories, plus arenas:

• Capture Point
  
  • Alderaan Civil War
    
  • Novare Coast
    
  • Yavin Ruins
    

  [*]Huttball

  • Nar Shaddaa (Original map)
    
  • Quesh
    
  • Vandin
    

  [*]Odessen Proving Grounds (OPG)

  [*]Ancient Hypergates

  [*]Voidstar

 

In favoring map variety, each map has an equal chance to pop once a match is created.

 

One note about Arena maps - they are not in the regular rotation, and will only pop when there is insufficient population to support an 8v8 match. So you will most often see these in lower level brackets or when the queues have low population in general. An arena match should be relatively rare.

 

Back to map variety, you would be right to note if each map is equally weighted, you are three times as likely to get a Capture Point or Huttball match type than any other, since there are three times as many maps in those modes.

 

So if you’re a player who dislikes one particular mode, particularly if that mode is OPG, why should you be forced to play it?

 

What we’re doing about it: In the short term, in the upcoming patch 6.1.2d, we will adjust the map rotation to favor match variety over map variety. What this means is that you will have an equal chance to have a Capture Point, Huttball, Ancient Hypergates, or Voidstar match type pop.

 

The exception is OPG, which we hear from y’all is the least popular match type currently. We aren’t removing it completely from the rotation for now, but the likelihood that match type will pop will be very small. Longer term we will take a hard look and address the issues with OPG that makes it less popular.

 

Longer term, we agree that a welcomed and healthy addition to the game would be the ability to choose which match types and/or maps you want or do not want to play. As with any new feature, this requires investigation and an assessment of the scope of work before we can commit to a timeframe, however that work has already begun. We are committed to this feature and will update y’all with more information, especially on timing, when we have it.

 

Miscellaneous

 

A couple of other topics that were asked about:

 

The currency for the remaining Replica Rewards will not be Season specific tokens, but the non-seasonal Ranked PvP Reward Tokens. We will also convert this currency into a Legacy currency in a future update, so feel free to earn tokens on whichever character you like until then.

 

We intend to bring back Replica versions of the remaining mounts as well. Stay tuned for the rollout plan there.

 

Thanks again for engaging in discussion around these topics. I look forward to updating everyone on our progress in the future!

 

-Chris

 

Stop ignoring the fact that your changes won't be enough to save team ranked. Return back to season 10 model in order to prevent team ranked trasformation into wintrading/bot nest. And OPG wasn't that bad, only few players disliked it...now you simply preventing those who actually likes OPG to play it. It is much easier to give every player a choice to cross out 1-2 warzones they dislike so they never get a pop into it.

 

About deserter in unranked- i never saw anyone crying about leavers in regs. I saw many criers in ranked since every single player in 4v4 matters but in regs - never. Besides even if someone leaves in regs, almost instantly someone else joined that team instead of a guy who left regardless how much time have passed since match have started (unlike in ranked where if any player left after the match started, his team won't get anyone instead). Bringing deserter into ranked - good. But in regs - NO.

 

P.S. return back OPG, ffs

these are really good changes

We will not support this behavior with our systems, but we must ask ourselves why players are motivated to use this type of action?

 

My only real question here is why now? Just seems odd after all these years to implement a lockout timer. 9 years of people just being used to bouncing with no repricussions and then this gets thrown in....its gonna have some pretty bad pushback. Just seems odd and out of nowhere to me.

 

Performance

 

We hear you that performance in warzones continues to be an issue, especially since the 6.0 update. In particular, you have all indicated performance in the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps are especially egregious.

 

What we’re doing about it: In the short term, in the upcoming patch 6.1.2d, we will remove the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps from rotation until we can solve the performance issues with those particular maps.

 

Can definitely appreciate this.

 

Preference

 

We hear you that you would rather choose which maps or modes to play, to avoid the ones you don’t like and play what is the most fun for you. In particular, Odessen Proving Grounds comes up often as one of the least popular modes, in particular in Unranked since it can be difficult to coordinate team play in a random queue situation.

 

Personally I'm not in favor of people being able to select a map, however I have mentioned in the past many years ago of maybe a map vote situation where the queue pops and 2 maps show up under the queue and players vote on the map they want to play and then the game queues up the map that gets the most votes. I feel like that would be the best scenario here to deal with the map issue.

 

So let’s talk a bit about the map rotation. Currently, and for some time now, we favor map variety over match type variety.

 

We categorize match types into 5 categories, plus arenas:

• Capture Point
  
  • Alderaan Civil War
    
  • Novare Coast
    
  • Yavin Ruins
    

  [*]Huttball

  • Nar Shaddaa (Original map)
    
  • Quesh
    
  • Vandin
    

  [*]Odessen Proving Grounds (OPG)

  [*]Ancient Hypergates

  [*]Voidstar

 

In favoring map variety, each map has an equal chance to pop once a match is created.

 

This explains sooooo much about the map rotations and why sometimes it feels like I can go a week without ever seeing a map like Voidstar while I'll get Yavin and Novare back to back over and over or a ton of huttballs back to back. Glad to read you guys are chaning it up to shake up the variety of maps. I still think a map voting feature would be the best, but this is still great.

 

The exception is OPG, which we hear from y’all is the least popular match type currently. We aren’t removing it completely from the rotation for now, but the likelihood that match type will pop will be very small. Longer term we will take a hard look and address the issues with OPG that makes it less popular.

 

This kinda makes me sad. I'm definitely one of the rare players that really likes this map, but I totally understand the disdain for it, especially since it can be confusing for newer players.

 

Longer term, we agree that a welcomed and healthy addition to the game would be the ability to choose which match types and/or maps you want or do not want to play. As with any new feature, this requires investigation and an assessment of the scope of work before we can commit to a timeframe, however that work has already begun. We are committed to this feature and will update y’all with more information, especially on timing, when we have it.

 

Hopefully you all take into consideration a map voting feature as well.

 

Also, while we hopefully have your attention in here, what are the odds of you guys giving 8v8 ranked a second chance? I would really really REEEALLLY love to see 8v8 ranked come back. To this day I think its unfair that the old dev team never even gave solo 8v8 ranked a chance and instead just scrapped 8v8 ranked entirely for arena ranked system....which they did less than a month after opening server transfers and so many people moved to a server like pot5 to get 8v8 ranked going and it was awesome....until the announcement of 8v8 ranked being removed and pvp guilds disappeared in droves......I'm still pretty bitter about thatr.

 

Please, please, pleeaase consider giving 8v8 ranked a second chance.

This update post makes me so happy!

Overall the changes to ranked make sense. The addition of a unique armor set + a chance at the most coveted replica gear and legendary embers should spur good activity in solo ranked.

 

As someone who has all the main ranked rewards going back to 8v8 ranked, I've never liked the idea of replicas. I understand why the team has gone that route though, and I appreciate that you all have not indicated any desire to re-release top 3 titles, which would be a major mistake and anachronistic.

 

While season 13 looks like it'll be in a great spot for solo ranked, there's not much here to encourage participation in team ranked. Frankly team ranked balance is the worst I've ever seen (main issues: forcebound set, absurdly high AP PT burst & sustained damage through the powerlode tactical) and that may be outside your scope, but it's worth mentioning that team ranked has little to no class diversity right now due to the state of balance - nor incentive to play the format in the first place.

Edited July 16, 2020 by EnzoForMe

The premise of this change is in-line with our goal of PvP being a fun, fair place to play. When a player leaves a warzone (or afk’s), they are affecting the experience for the other 15 players in the match. This sort of behavior artificially adds friction to the experience, and disproportionately affects the ‘fun’ and ‘fairness’ for everyone else. We will not support this behavior with our systems, but we must ask ourselves why players are motivated to use this type of action?

 

There are many different reasons why someone might want to leave.

 

Personally, most of the time I'm leaving matches it's one of the following:

 

• I don't want to play the map. Either due to me not liking the game mode, or it becoming repetative.
  
• I don't like the cooperation I'm getting from my team. This most often happens in huttballs. A lot of the time people simply don't care to play the map and deathmatch it out somewhere totally irrelevant. If there are then 2 enemy players really trying and me alone.. I won't be able to make a dent. Rather than straining myself through this experience I'd prefer to just go ahead and find a game where people do want to win.
  
• The whole game has been an uphill battle. I've been trying my best but despite my best efforts I've not been able to make even as much as a dent in any enemy defenses. The game is a sure loss and other people on the team either don't care enough to win or simply don't posses the experience to turn the game around. Rather than staying in the game and psyching myself out for the remainder of it.. I prefer to just leave and go find a good game instead.

 

 

I leave, someone else comes in and fills. They won't really be able to change anything about the outcome but they'll have a relatively quick game at least. Honestly.. with the way that the game is, with the way that the people are.. someone leaving more often than not ends up being more beneficial for a team sooner than being detrimental to it.

 

As such, it's completely nonsensical to discourage people leaving warzones which already honestly only happens in like 30% of the games at worst anyway. It might be more for some other individuals, but I strongly suggest those individuals have a moment of introspection then. They themselves might be the conductor element in that process.

 

 

 

Besides all that, your game has functioned without this punishment just fine for so long now.. why now?

Honestly. I see next to no benefits, but I do see a ton of dangerous pitfalls.

Leavers are next to no issue outside of extremes, let's not make an issue where there is none.

 

 

We categorize match types into 5 categories, plus arenas:

• Capture Point
  
  • Alderaan Civil War
    
  • Novare Coast
    
  • Yavin Ruins
    

  [*]Huttball

  • Nar Shaddaa (Original map)
    
  • Quesh
    
  • Vandin
    

  [*]Odessen Proving Grounds (OPG)

  [*]Ancient Hypergates

  [*]Voidstar

 

Uh, why?

 

What makes NC so equal to ACW and YR while VS/OPG and AHG all have their own classification?

NC is nothing like those other 2 :confused::confused:

Edited July 16, 2020 by Evolixe

 

Just wanted to follow up on some of the conversations happening around the changes we’ve talked about in this thread, and what action we’re taking over the short and long term to address a couple concerns.

 

When a player leaves a warzone (or afk’s), they are affecting the experience for the other 15 players in the match. This sort of behavior artificially adds friction to the experience, and disproportionately affects the ‘fun’ and ‘fairness’ for everyone else. We will not support this behavior with our systems,

 

 

The currency for the remaining Replica Rewards will not be Season specific tokens, but the non-seasonal Ranked PvP Reward Tokens. We will also convert this currency into a Legacy currency in a future update, so feel free to earn tokens on whichever character you like until then.

 

 

 

Thanks again for engaging in discussion around these topics. I look forward to updating everyone on our progress in the future!

 

-Chris

 

Thanks for the very robust post & info. If only u guys/gals were authorized to also communicate this way (and this often) for other aspects of SWTOR too (like GSF, for example) . But i digress.

 

Questions:

1. Why does practically everything PVP related have to always be confined to limited/separate-from-the-galaxy 'warzones' ? Is there really no possible technical way to include OPEN-WORLD pvp somehow too? Ilum Gree zone & Outlaw's Den, at the very least?

 

I mean heck, why can't players like me (who run 99% of the time in PVP 'instances' on all planets) also be rewarded with a small amount Ranked points (less than u get in warzones, obviously) for slaying enemy players? (And please don't say cuz of potential "exploits" cuz nothing can be nearly as exploited as Ranked already is now lol)

 

2. Can you please comment at all about the idea some of us have been requesting since beta, about using the 'Bounty Hunter Event Week' to allow for PLAYER (opt-in) bounties? Has the BioWare team ever considered it? And if not, why not? Is it just a game-engine + instanced phases issue? (And please don't say it's cuz of "griefing" since nothing can ever be nearly as toxic or griefed as Ranked lol )

 

3. Will GSF ever get a mirror-Dev like you to devote some attention to that system & content (PVE as well) before 2022 when EA contract runs out? (Maybe bring it up at the 'LiveStream' ?? --> https://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9863254#edit9863254 )

 

Thanks again for the efforts, Chris. /tip-hat

Edited July 16, 2020 by Nee-Elder

The gear box changes for regs are still incredibly stingy....-_-

 

15 minute match, loss gives you a white gear box with 1 piece of gear which gives you 5 tech frags.....This is seriously insulting since I can run a 9 minute hammer station and get 10x the amount of frags and gear.

So let’s talk a bit about the map rotation. Currently, and for some time now, we favor map variety over match type variety.

 

In favoring map variety, each map has an equal chance to pop once a match is created.

 

Back to map variety, you would be right to note if each map is equally weighted, you are three times as likely to get a Capture Point or Huttball match type than any other, since there are three times as many maps in those modes.

 

So if you’re a player who dislikes one particular mode, particularly if that mode is OPG, why should you be forced to play it?

 

If they're not going to implement a filtering method to satisfy a system that wants a random map selection, they should implement a system like GW2's structured PvP.

 

Where players vote for a map, and it creates a roulette based on vote size, and the system will still pick in random with the voted map having a higher chance. This should satisfy a voting system while keeping the randomness factor.

 

GW2 Structured PvP Selection

Edited July 16, 2020 by atsoul

We intend to bring back Replica versions of the remaining mounts as well. Stay tuned for the rollout plan there.

 

What about the color crystals from past seasons? Is there a reason those are not being added?

 

Also, what about changes to vote kick?

If they're not going to implement a filtering method to satisfy a system that wants a random map selection, they should implement a system like GW2's structured PvP.

 

Where players vote for a map, and it creates a roulette based on vote size, and the system will still pick in random with the voted map having a higher chance. This should satisfy a voting system while keeping the randomness factor.

 

GW2 Structured PvP Selection

 

I agree with this, to me GW2's map selection system is just perfect. If there is no randomness, premades could try to force certain maps, so I always liked the combination of voting and roulette that GW2 has.

Edited July 16, 2020 by Equeliber

Hey Friends,

 

One note about Arena maps - they are not in the regular rotation, and will only pop when there is insufficient population to support an 8v8 match. So you will most often see these in lower level brackets or when the queues have low population in general. An arena match should be relatively rare.

 

 

..........This is such an incredibly stupid design decision, I cant even fathom why a BW Employee would even recommend this to be implemented. Why in gods green Earth would you remove like 6 maps from the rotation ON PURPOSE? No wonder we get so many damn Huttballs

Edited July 16, 2020 by KingDeathII

..........This is such an incredibly stupid design decision, I cant even fathom why a BW Employee would even recommend this to be implemented. Why in gods green Earth would you remove like 6 maps from the rotation ON PURPOSE? No wonder we get so many damn Huttballs

 

Eh excuse me, I for one am very glad that 4v4 isn't a part of the regular unranked warzones queue outside of said extremes

 

All it does is slap any 8 players into a map without any regard for role structure and the experience itself is just awful due to the general lack of knowledge of the players themselves.

 

If you want to play 4v4, just play ranked. That's literally what that is.

Correction:

 

 

We will be extending the Deserter queue lockout to Unranked matches.

 

I'll give my subscription a deserter lockout if this happens.

<snipped but wow to everything>

Let it be known on this day that BW read our feedback and are doing stuff we suggested Especially this:

 

Longer term, we agree that a welcomed and healthy addition to the game would be the ability to choose which match types and/or maps you want or do not want to play. As with any new feature, this requires investigation and an assessment of the scope of work before we can commit to a timeframe, however that work has already begun. We are committed to this feature and will update y’all with more information, especially on timing, when we have it.

I'm so glad I didn't mention eating my hat if they listened to this otherwise my dinner would not be very tasty right now! To hear you're already begun working toward this is great One caveat; have this ready and in place before forcing deserter lockout on unranked please!!

 

Also, where have I been? I had no idea that Odessan Proving Grounds was the most hated of all unranked warzone maps. I love it! It's the only one I do really well in

Edited July 16, 2020 by Sarova

Hey Friends,

 

Just wanted to follow up on some of the conversations happening around the changes we’ve talked about in this thread, and what action we’re taking over the short and long term to address a couple concerns.

 

First, let’s start by talking about the change that has driven the most discussion: The extension of the Deserter debuff to Unranked for those that leave a match early (coming in patch 6.1.2d).

 

The premise of this change is in-line with our goal of PvP being a fun, fair place to play. When a player leaves a warzone (or afk’s), they are affecting the experience for the other 15 players in the match. This sort of behavior artificially adds friction to the experience, and disproportionately affects the ‘fun’ and ‘fairness’ for everyone else. We will not support this behavior with our systems, but we must ask ourselves why players are motivated to use this type of action?

 

Well, y’all have been very clear and vocal about many of these reasons. So let’s get into it:

 

Performance

 

We hear you that performance in warzones continues to be an issue, especially since the 6.0 update. In particular, you have all indicated performance in the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps are especially egregious.

 

What we’re doing about it: In the short term, in the upcoming patch 6.1.2d, we will remove the Vandin and Quesh Huttball maps from rotation until we can solve the performance issues with those particular maps.

 

Longer term, we are profiling the root of performance issues in general (de-syncs, hitches, slide show experiences) across the board in order to provide you with a smooth, fun experience. No ETA on this, but we have already begun in earnest and are committed to fixing it.

 

Preference

 

We hear you that you would rather choose which maps or modes to play, to avoid the ones you don’t like and play what is the most fun for you. In particular, Odessen Proving Grounds comes up often as one of the least popular modes, in particular in Unranked since it can be difficult to coordinate team play in a random queue situation.

 

So let’s talk a bit about the map rotation. Currently, and for some time now, we favor map variety over match type variety.

 

We categorize match types into 5 categories, plus arenas:

• Capture Point
  
  • Alderaan Civil War
    
  • Novare Coast
    
  • Yavin Ruins
    

  [*]Huttball

  • Nar Shaddaa (Original map)
    
  • Quesh
    
  • Vandin
    

  [*]Odessen Proving Grounds (OPG)

  [*]Ancient Hypergates

  [*]Voidstar

 

In favoring map variety, each map has an equal chance to pop once a match is created.

 

One note about Arena maps - they are not in the regular rotation, and will only pop when there is insufficient population to support an 8v8 match. So you will most often see these in lower level brackets or when the queues have low population in general. An arena match should be relatively rare.

 

Back to map variety, you would be right to note if each map is equally weighted, you are three times as likely to get a Capture Point or Huttball match type than any other, since there are three times as many maps in those modes.

 

So if you’re a player who dislikes one particular mode, particularly if that mode is OPG, why should you be forced to play it?

 

What we’re doing about it: In the short term, in the upcoming patch 6.1.2d, we will adjust the map rotation to favor match variety over map variety. What this means is that you will have an equal chance to have a Capture Point, Huttball, Ancient Hypergates, or Voidstar match type pop.

 

The exception is OPG, which we hear from y’all is the least popular match type currently. We aren’t removing it completely from the rotation for now, but the likelihood that match type will pop will be very small. Longer term we will take a hard look and address the issues with OPG that makes it less popular.

 

Longer term, we agree that a welcomed and healthy addition to the game would be the ability to choose which match types and/or maps you want or do not want to play. As with any new feature, this requires investigation and an assessment of the scope of work before we can commit to a timeframe, however that work has already begun. We are committed to this feature and will update y’all with more information, especially on timing, when we have it.

 

Miscellaneous

 

A couple of other topics that were asked about:

 

The currency for the remaining Replica Rewards will not be Season specific tokens, but the non-seasonal Ranked PvP Reward Tokens. We will also convert this currency into a Legacy currency in a future update, so feel free to earn tokens on whichever character you like until then.

 

We intend to bring back Replica versions of the remaining mounts as well. Stay tuned for the rollout plan there.

 

Thanks again for engaging in discussion around these topics. I look forward to updating everyone on our progress in the future!

 

-Chris

 

This is nice, all changes for the better that I can see.

 

Even better, someone from BW has inserted themselves into our thread with actual communication. I almost don't know how to respond. Sorry I don't remember you, Chris.

 

Anyway, thanks for the acknowledgement and I hope these changes are implemented sooner than later.

..........This is such an incredibly stupid design decision, I cant even fathom why a BW Employee would even recommend this to be implemented. Why in gods green Earth would you remove like 6 maps from the rotation ON PURPOSE? No wonder we get so many damn Huttballs

 

Because people complained about getting arenas all the time in regs when they wanted to just play 8v8 so they changed it to only pop when the population is low which is why you only ever see arenas late at night/early morning.