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KwaiKang

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The downside to relationships is that SWTOR forgot that they were simply sidequests, and gave more attention to them instead.

Rather, they completely stopped the concept of "side quests" so any relationships taking place from then on would have to happen during the storyline.

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Rather, they completely stopped the concept of "side quests" so any relationships taking place from then on would have to happen during the storyline.

 

To such an extent, they decided to just make SWTOR a star trek game, that's why the closest thing to a playable alien is the Nautolan.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Swtor didn't forget, it's just that Boyd made the decision to kill off pretty much every class companion (even some non-class companion ones) except the Knights, so effectively most of the class companions are now bricked and will never be used much in the story. Blame Boyd, and also all the people who kept whining for character deaths, instead of simply not using the companions they hated so much, now more than half (nearly all) of the companions can't be used, and now we're stuck with companion list full of bricks. DS players fault.

 

Players opened this can of worms when they started complaining about not being able to kill certain companions after Bioware already took away that ability from the original beta and for good reason it turns out. And once they started complaining about the one, it opened the door for 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6.

 

Funny how that works, last time I was invested in this game a couple years back. The complaints were the exact opposite, and everyone was FOR companions being killable. Now I come back to the game years later in the midst of the wasteland left, with almost all of the companions being bricked. Now there's a different climate and tune in the fandom altogether. Careful what you wish for. :D

Edited by Jaxterone
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  • 1 month later...
I personally do not care about my companions because they don't really fit my characters personality arch. Him being a Sith assassin hell bent on Galactic domination. I never understood the appeal of having Sith/jedi-ish companions, if apprentices naturally seek to kill their masters, why on earth would I have one? Is there a way to kill all your campions?
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I personally do not care about my companions because they don't really fit my characters personality arch. Him being a Sith assassin hell bent on Galactic domination.

Reliable assistants are difficult to find. Say what you like about the Inquisitor's class companions, but they *are* reliable. (Er, well, unless you let Z keep KV's body. Nothing on Earth could make me think that's a good idea.)

I never understood the appeal of having Sith/jedi-ish companions, if apprentices naturally seek to kill their masters, why on earth would I have one?

While the apprentice is biding his time, waiting for the right moment, he's probably more reliable than anyone else(1) as someone to delegate tasks to.

Is there a way to kill all your campions?

All? No. Some are killable, but only some, and none are killable before the beginning of KotFE.

 

(1) There is one exception that you meet after the class stories. If it all goes pear-shaped and everyone is killed, she will be there with you in front of the Gates of Hell, and she will have your back there with unwavering loyalty. She is not an apprentice.

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Such a shame and waste of potential. Initially, I was glad that you finally get a same-sex romance with Jaesa, so much so that I pretty much had my SW abandon Quinn just for her.

 

But now? After reading these posts and thinking about it... nah. I doubt that relationship would bear anything more fruitful than that Ossus kiss. Such a waste. When I first learned about Jaesa's development on Ossus, I was under the mistaken impression that she's gonna get her own extended storyline or something. lol

 

Man, this game is really gonna be dead soon, if not already. Everything's being streamlined into a single storyline instead of having any distinct flavors from each unique class storylines.

 

Except JK and Agents of course. You guys get to have the most fun, what with Scorpio, Firebrand and Kira playing a far bigger role than any other companions combined. Sure, Vette and the other companions had their own chapters in KotFE, but it's usually one or two chapters with insignificant side-plots, whereas Scorpio had like an entire huge chunk of storyline to herself, while Firebrand got to have a far more significant role in the main plot (what was Vette doing again during KotFE? Doing something trivial that I forgot). I get that the IA class is extremely popular, perhaps that's why Bioware showed favoritism towards them instead.

 

What could fix this ultimately is to give the other companions more screentime during this Onslaught event, perhaps having the Jedi padawans like Jaesa and Nadia have more roles to play in the fight against Malgus. But Bioware probably won't risk that. Nah. That would mean they would take creative risk just for better storylines (as opposed to striving for better profits and player-pandering). These gaming corporations, I tell you. You see one of them, you've seen all of them. Predictable af. That's why I don't play a lot of videogames anymore. Once I'm done with the class storylines, I'm outta here. It's a wasteland here. It was a mistake to return here.

 

Sidenote: I'm sick of Theron and Lana. I think they're highly overrated. I'd take Jaesa over Lana any day. Even Theran is more entertaining with his Holiday relationship than Theron the whiny "Why bother sabotaging the Imps if people are gonna die anyway?" Like, shut the hell up, Theron. You've played double agent before, you know how much pressure my SW is under. Stop giving her crap.

Edited by OriusPrime
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Such a shame and waste of potential. Initially, I was glad that you finally get a same-sex romance with Jaesa, so much so that I pretty much had my SW abandon Quinn just for her.

 

But now? After reading these posts and thinking about it... nah. I doubt that relationship would bear anything more fruitful than that Ossus kiss. Such a waste. When I first learned about Jaesa's development on Ossus, I was under the mistaken impression that she's gonna get her own extended storyline or something. lol

 

Man, this game is really gonna be dead soon, if not already. Everything's being streamlined into a single storyline instead of having any distinct flavors from each unique class storylines.

 

Except JK and Agents of course. You guys get to have the most fun, what with Scorpio, Firebrand and Kira playing a far bigger role than any other companions combined. Sure, Vette and the other companions had their own chapters in KotFE, but it's usually one or two chapters with insignificant side-plots, whereas Scorpio had like an entire huge chunk of storyline to herself, while Firebrand got to have a far more significant role in the main plot (what was Vette doing again during KotFE? Doing something trivial that I forgot). I get that the IA class is extremely popular, perhaps that's why Bioware showed favoritism towards them instead.

 

What could fix this ultimately is to give the other companions more screentime during this Onslaught event, perhaps having the Jedi padawans like Jaesa and Nadia have more roles to play in the fight against Malgus. But Bioware probably won't risk that. Nah. That would mean they would take creative risk just for better storylines (as opposed to striving for better profits and player-pandering). These gaming corporations, I tell you. You see one of them, you've seen all of them. Predictable af. That's why I don't play a lot of videogames anymore. Once I'm done with the class storylines, I'm outta here. It's a wasteland here. It was a mistake to return here.

 

Sidenote: I'm sick of Theron and Lana. I think they're highly overrated. I'd take Jaesa over Lana any day. Even Theran is more entertaining with his Holiday relationship than Theron the whiny "Why bother sabotaging the Imps if people are gonna die anyway?" Like, shut the hell up, Theron. You've played double agent before, you know how much pressure my SW is under. Stop giving her crap.

 

I agree with you on Scorpio... but I would also like to remind you that for some, she's now dead.

 

As for Firebrand... what are you on about? She only has real importance for one chapter in KOTFE. She does have a background role in a second... but she has to share it with Jorgan. And she can die at the end. But in any case, her relevance ends there. She really doesn't do much beyond her role in her reunion chapter. I don't see how she gets it better than Vette. (In fact, I'd argue Vette gets a bigger role since she actually always survives to KOTET, and plays a role during Vaylin's invasion... where she can potentially die in the end. Yeah... this killing off companions thing has its downsides, as been pointed out earlier.)

 

BTW, to cut BioWare some slack, I've heard somewhere that originally the plan was for expansions to continue the class stories, but when SWTOR's early sales weren't as high as EA liked, they gut the budget. This led to the unified stories in Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Shadow of Revan. I dunno if BioWare still wants to do individual stories, but it's probably safe to say that even if they do have the budget now (I dunno if they do, though), they probably have been entrenched too deep in the hole to dig out now.

Edited by rashencyberspeed
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I agree with you on Scorpio... but I would also like to remind you that for some, she's now dead.

I thought she's uploaded her consciousness to Iokath or something.

 

As for Firebrand... what are you on about? She only has real importance for one chapter in KOTFE. She does have a background role in a second... but she has to share it with Jorgan. And she can die at the end. But in any case, her relevance ends there. She really doesn't do much beyond her role in her reunion chapter. I don't see how she gets it better than Vette. (In fact, I'd argue Vette gets a bigger role since she actually always survives to KOTET, and plays a role during Vaylin's invasion... where she can potentially die in the end. Yeah... this killing off companions thing has its downsides, as been pointed out earlier.)

True. Guess I forgot about Jorgan since I haven't played the Trooper class yet. I guess you're right. But I don't know why. There's just something about Firebrand's side-plot that stood out a lot more, the way she has more input on your LS/DS decisions, the way you get to put your trust in her ability to complete the mission in spite of Jorgan's protest.

 

Yes, you do also kinda get to choose between Vette and Torian later... but I don't know, it just didn't feel like the same kind of decision as the one between Firebrand/Jorgan. The decision to choose to save Vette or Torian was a decision forced upon you - you're forced to save either one or the other because they're in danger of being killed (and if you're Sith Warrior, the decision's a no-brainer). I didn't even know Firebrand could be killed in that decision between her and Jorgan if you didn't tell me. Furthermore, the decision to put trust in that psychopathic and volatile Firebrand, that felt like a more personal decision with more weight and carried more meaning than the "Save your favorite companion!" one with Vette. Guess that's why I felt like Firebrand's storyline was more well-written than Vette's in KotFE. Reminds me of the time I decided to put trust in Jack during Mass Effect 2's suicide mission, choosing her to shield the team with her biotic.

 

Like, I haven't even played IA yet and I'm already more invested in Firebrand/Kaliyo as a character than Vette.

 

BTW, to cut BioWare some slack, I've heard somewhere that originally the plan was for expansions to continue the class stories, but when SWTOR's early sales weren't as high as EA liked, they gut the budget. This led to the unified stories in Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Shadow of Revan. I dunno if BioWare still wants to do individual stories, but it's probably safe to say that even if they do have the budget now (I dunno if they do, though), they probably have been entrenched too deep in the hole to dig out now.

Yeah, it's all academic now with EA ruining everything as usual. All the good intentions in the world mean nothing in the world of money, money, money.

Edited by OriusPrime
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I thought she's uploaded her consciousness to Iokath or something.

 

 

True. Guess I forgot about Jorgan since I haven't played the Trooper class yet. I guess you're right. But I don't know why. There's just something about Firebrand's side-plot that stood out a lot more, the way she has more input on your LS/DS decisions, the way you get to put your trust in her ability to complete the mission in spite of Jorgan's protest.

 

Yes, you do also kinda get to choose between Vette and Torian later... but I don't know, it just didn't feel like the same kind of decision as the one between Firebrand/Jorgan. The decision to choose to save Vette or Torian was a decision forced upon you - you're forced to save either one or the other because they're in danger of being killed (and if you're Sith Warrior, the decision's a no-brainer). I didn't even know Firebrand could be killed in that decision between her and Jorgan if you didn't tell me. Furthermore, the decision to put trust in that psychopathic and volatile Firebrand, that felt like a more personal decision with more weight and carried more meaning than the "Save your favorite companion!" one with Vette. Guess that's why I felt like Firebrand's storyline was more well-written than Vette's in KotFE.

 

Like, I haven't even played IA yet and I'm already more invested in Firebrand/Kaliyo as a character than Vette.

 

 

Yeah, it's all academic now with EA ruining everything as usual. All the good intentions in the world mean nothing in the world of money, money, money.

 

Scorpio CAN upload her conciousness to Iokath... or you destroy her in response to her actions up to that point. (It's one of the light-side/dark-side decisions.)

 

As for everything else... well, it's all opinion at the end of the day, so think what you will. (Truth be told, even though I do find reasons to enjoy the new content, I nonetheless do agree that nothing compares to the vanilla story of seeing the galaxy through the eyes of eight individuals going on their own separate adventures.)

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Scorpio CAN upload her conciousness to Iokath... or you destroy her in response to her actions up to that point. (It's one of the light-side/dark-side decisions.)

Regardless, it also means that a companion of IA gets to have such an important and nuanced decision (as opposed to just simple living or dying).

 

As for everything else... well, it's all opinion at the end of the day, so think what you will. (Truth be told, even though I do find reasons to enjoy the new content, I nonetheless do agree that nothing compares to the vanilla story of seeing the galaxy through the eyes of eight individuals going on their own separate adventures.)

I enjoy the content as well, but I wouldn't want to experience them eight times over.

 

The only reason I even bothered to play this game in spite my feelings about video games (and especially MMOs and multiplayers) is the separate adventures you get to have with each class, each adventure having its own roleplay and decisions. Now that Bioware (or EA) has taken that from me from future content, the main reason to play it is gone. Back to experiencing TV shows and binging Netflix. Loki's spin-off is not bad, certainly more interesting than another "Pubs vs. Imps" storyline. Disney's future content looks to be brighter now than Bioware's ironically (whereas it was the reverse prior to the expansions and maybe SoR). Even The Mandalorian and The Bad Batch look to be more interesting than Onslaught. You could tell Bioware ran out of steam the moment the Emperor returned for the zillionth time. Though to be fair, that Echoes of Oblivion ending was certainly better than The Last Skywalker and Palpatine's fate.

Edited by OriusPrime
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Regardless, it also means that a companion of IA gets to have such an important and nuanced decision (as opposed to just simple living or dying).

 

 

I enjoy the content as well, but I wouldn't want to experience them eight times over.

 

Neither would I, honestly. (I haven't touched any of my characters aside from my Jedi Knight and Sith Inquisitor since the Eternal Empire story.)

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Neither would I, honestly. (I haven't touched any of my characters aside from my Jedi Knight and Sith Inquisitor since the Eternal Empire story.)

 

In fact, I'm not even sure if it's worth doing all the other expansions since they too feel samey regardless of which class you play - Makeb, SoR, etc. Minus the difference between the Pubs and Imps of course.

 

And if you're someone who doesn't do ops like me, dailies for planets like Oricon lose their flavor because the meat of the story on those planets are in the ops.

 

There's a lot of post-class stories content that's easily skippable once you've played them once, it seems. False Emperor will always end with you fighting Malgus; Shadow of Revan will always end with you teaming up with Shan and Marr against Revan. The differences are trivial and insignificant. You could easily experience most of the important story content in a few months or so, and then it's goodbye! No more subs.

 

It's another story if your choice of class actually matters in the expansions or the main story. Hint: it doesn't.

Edited by OriusPrime
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In fact, I'm not even sure if it's worth doing all the other expansions since they too feel samey regardless of which class you play - Makeb, SoR, etc. Minus the difference between the Pubs and Imps of course.

 

And if you're someone who doesn't do ops like me, dailies for planets like Oricon lose their flavor because the meat of the story on those planets are in the ops.

 

There's a lot of post-class stories content that's easily skippable once you've played them once, it seems. False Emperor will always end with you fighting Malgus; Shadow of Revan will always end with you teaming up with Shan and Marr against Revan. The differences are trivial and insignificant. You could easily experience most of the important story content in a few months or so, and then it's goodbye! No more subs.

 

It's another story if your choice of class actually matters in the expansions or the main story. Hint: it doesn't.

 

I think it does matter... but I also want to play SWTOR, not Dragon Age Origins.

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I think it does matter... but I also want to play SWTOR, not Dragon Age Origins.

I wouldn't have minded if it's more like Dragon Age: Origins, which I considered to be a far superior game, even more so than KotOR.

 

Then again, the class stories in this game do have more variety than DA:O, so I don't think it's an accurate comparison to begin with anyway. The "class stories" of Origins only last about a few hours (less if speedran), then it intersects with the main quest like what SWtOR did with the expansions. Arguably, Origins did a better job intersecting the different classes since it has more nuances between each class' involvement, but still.

 

As it is, these expansions are a bane to roleplaying. What would my Bounty Hunter be doing fighting Revan and saving Makeb anyway? He'd be too busy making motherf***ing money! Because it's all about the mothereffing money, baby. lol So yeah, becoming an Alliance Commander, saving the galaxy from Revan, these expansions can sod off. They're ruining my roleplaying experience.

 

Like you could tell immediately from SoR's FPs (Legacy of Rakata stood out) how rushed and mediocre they were, not to mention how your toon gets default dialogue without you choosing your own dialogue wheel options. It's probably around that time, or even earlier since RotHC, that Bioware just rushed everything out for a quick dime, sacrificing class individuality and replacing it with default dialogue that's cheaper and faster to produce.

Edited by OriusPrime
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Careful what you wish for. :D

One thing that is still beyond my understanding, why did they make reunited Khem Val romancable. Rly someone wished it? Or Devs have sick fantasy.

 

People are tired of Lana and Theron, but really it is not their fault. After Kotet game is over in ideas. Kotet had a stupid bad developed ending, but rly, after Kotet **** started. I dont blame devs, that they used all their ideas, but since it is mmo, they have to continue and release new and new content till game finally dies.

Edited by Rivazar
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One thing that is still beyond my understanding, why did they make reunited Khem Val romancable. Rly someone wished it? Or Devs have sick fantasy.

 

People are tired of Lana and Theron, but really it is not their fault. After Kotet game is over in ideas. Kotet had a stupid bad developed ending, but rly, after Kotet **** started. I dont blame devs, that they used all their ideas, but since it is mmo, they have to continue and release new and new content till game finally dies.

 

There was quite a few people in the forum requesting Khem to be romancable so yep it was.

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well nice to see I am not the only one that has been frustrated with this for a while. I keep playing through them but I keep edning up more and more frustrated each time. I might be close to breaking point of just not give a freck and maybe take break from game again. Although hope not 6 year break again. But it just feels like all the expanisons is same crap. Doesn;t matter what your character's class is or their decisions in earlier content. Just same dialogue over and over, reguardles of their personality. Yeh after kotfe start getting some more grey options again... but miffs me a bit that a story talking about more than light and dark, stonewalls you into extreme light and dark decsisions with no grey area even considered. And after your been through that wringer... it;s just all screwed up.

 

I used to be excited in kotfe because I thought my characters decisions actually mattered.... but outside of a few key ones it don't. Then Ioketh comes along and other expanisons and all that is ignored anyways.... and there parts where your just force to play along to crap that doesn;t fit the personallity or the skills of the character at all. Post Kotfe as well. Quite a bit as well even within one storyline of dialogue telling you something and then you get stupid dialogue options to ask stupid questions that already been answered or thing you would know if you played the prior stories leading up to it, and no options that would actually make sense or fit the character and their experiences or personality. So many opportunities as well to bring in parts of the characters history that is lost as well. And yes the auto dialogue forcing personality quirks that don't fit the character is annoying too...

 

Anyways I am rambling, not sure I am making sense right now. I've wanted to write something about it for a long time here... but it's hard for me to put the thoughts together and give myself time to. I get so frustrated even thinking about it sometimes.

 

Seems like they tried to cater to people who don't give a crap about story and often skip earlier stories, and gave us who love to rp and enjoy the stories some muddled scrapped together crap that destroys and takes us out of the character and we loos what makes even the classes unique, not just the personalities.

 

Agents ability to infiltrate, stealth, and manipulate no longer get to play on, in fact lot content pulls them out of stealth and has then doing stupid crap they wouldn;t do. Bomb specialists stand around stupidly while some npc leads the way to defuse bombs (in kotfe) Inquistors apparently no longer recall that they used to scour the tombs mroe than others... I hate that perticular chapter in Kotfe with Acina because no matter your character expereinces of choices before, it;s the same frecking dialogue for most part and acina needs to tell you crap you already know and your character is always some great optomist commander no matter if they killed a lot of their origonal people and done a lot of stupid things, and it pretty much lana been holding things together.

 

My agent and jedi consular still ask stupid questions to the voss lady and apparently my agent can;t ever actually have some feeling for the voss he married back in class story, or relate to it... my jedi consular asking about voss mystics being offworld is stupid... actually pretty much every one who been through the illum quest line has seen at least one offworld before.

 

Also not believing in ghosts in the Visions in the Dark Chapter is stupid... you got one in your head.... and you;ve met reven!! Some classes even met more than that... But you can;t ask... why didn;t they kill you? Not every character is afraid of death lol And why is my extreme lightsiders forced to want to go after a super weapon on Iokath?

 

Anyways it seems I got to ranting more again. I probably should go back and clean this up but right now just want to get it out. Not sure i can focus on it at moment.

 

---

 

Anyways all that frustration out on page and aside, I kinda keep thinking it would be nice if they actually considered some expansions that could be divergent paths to the current expansions instead of just tacking on more of the ill fitting attempts of one size fit all stories.

Edited by OdanBaruq
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