Thank you for the update. This is not good news, but it is helpful to know. I was looking forward to swapping my Twi'lek Operative to Scoundrel to reduce clipping, but I don't want Operative AND Scoundrel, so this is quite disappointing.

 

I have one question though: does this apply to swapping Force users to their mirror combat style? My main is a Light V Sith Sorcerer and I've always wished I could swap him to the Sage combat style. This character is at least 9 years old, and I don't think I have it in me to reroll him.

This originally wasn’t the case. Previously only force classes were able to flip. Tech classes already had to select the mirrored tech class as a secondary.

just got a response from Chris . so i guess in the future we need to sign up for discord, and other sites to get the most up to date information

What is this discord?

That basically defeats the purpose of the alignment aspect of Combat Styles for many, as these players are most interested in changing alignment animations for their existing characters, ones that have been played as LS Sith or DS Jedi going back years.

 

Why not push the release date back for 7.0 and work this and other problems/bugs out for the better?

The way it was explained on Discord makes clear 2 things:

1, changing your original combat style completely (ie, Sorc to Shadow) on an existing character has technical problems that they can't (at least currently) overcome, so it's not possible. You have to keep it.

2, changing your original combat style specifically to its mirror (Sorc to Sage) is possible, but is intentionally restricted to only Force characters that have A, not reached Light/Dark V in their legacy yet and B, haven't completed Chapter 3 of their class story arc, to address the fact that new Force characters can't choose the opposite alignment combat styles at creation without having the legacy achievements while not creating a disparity between existing tech and force characters.

The second point was bugged on the PTS, so a character copied over from live could swap to the alt alignment combat style and then still pick another regardless of their legacy progression. I imagine it'll be "fixed" in the final build so that only characters that meet the aforementioned criteria can swap to the alt alignment combat style.

Personally, I think it'd have been cool to allow it, since otherwise it essentially leaves existing characters with a dead combat style if they want to use the alt alignment combat style. I think parity with tech classes could have been achieved by just giving tech classes the same option (give some hand wavey "your already learned skills can be applied in different ways" explanation, I trust that Bioware can make that work in a small cutscene like they did for Force users). Unfortunately it's waaaaaay too late in the game for that, they've made the decision to not allow it, so we're just gonna have to deal with it for now. Maybe in the future.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

Okay, so I apologize for a potentially redundant question here but I want to make sure we're all fully clear since there's conflicting information from Chris on discord (as I mentioned above):

Will existing characters that have finished their story and already meet the alignment criteria be able to change their primary combat style to the mirrored version?

The exact quote from Chris that I'm referring to above is "No, existing characters will never have a swap option, unless they do not already have Dark/Light V unlocked, and they have not completed their Act 3 Origin Story."

And then later, in response to somebody asking if existing Force characters that have finished their story can't pick the mirror combat style, he responded "You can as your second combat style, yes." Implying again that existing characters whose legacies already meet the requirements to make a character with the opposite faction's combat style won't be able to swap their primary combat style to the mirror kit.

Again, I apologize for the potentially redundant question, but I want to make sure that we have the correct information here on the forums and what I'm seeing on Discord seems to be different from what you're saying here, unless I'm just misunderstanding something somewhere.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

So to confirm, my existing DS sentinel who has done the story and has Dark V can swap to the mara playstyle?

Thank you for confirming this because even after typing long posts about it many people still believed they would be able to change their initial combat style even though all signs pointed against that.

Now that people are aware it should hopefully avoid the backlash during launch since they have been officially informed.

Cant wait to start my powertech-sniper trooper on December 14th

So to confirm, my existing DS sentinel can swap to the mara playstyle?

Yes, they confirmed that.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

Interesting. So then it would seem it's limited to the tech abilities. The technical requirements are the tech classes. HA! PUN!

I was wondering since on PTS, the Force classes worked fine, but the tech ones didn't. I hope the hurdle is overcome sooner than later. At least we have the secondary for now, which is better than none at all.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

JackieKo, thank you so much for this addendum. I know there are a lot of folks like me who just want to change our Force users to their mirror style.

EDIT: Oh dear, she didn't exactly say what those requirements were, did she? I sure hope it's still just the Legacy unlocks.

Thank you for confirming this because even after typing long posts about it many people still believed they would be able to change their initial combat style even though all signs pointed against that.

 

Now that people are aware it should hopefully avoid the backlash during launch since they have been officially informed.

although to be fair, we were also right in our thinking. the plan was for us to change our original combat style. and all signs pointed to that being the case, until I asked Jackie to jump into the thread. So I guess congrats you were "right", but so were we

and they'll still receive backlash, even though it's the official channel, I can't even begin to describe how many times I've had to tell people to go red the dev tracker for updates. but they refuse...

having the ability to at least swap our force users on our first combat style makes this better overall than having to have your mirror class as second style.

 

Not directed at you Jackie: But waiting until a few days before launch to announce is not smart as this is something that reflects badly on BW, as this is how they tend to handle things they know people are going to get upset about.

Anyone else think BioWare have known for months they wouldn’t be able to do it and kept it silent?

To me it just confirms my suspicions that this expansion isn’t for existing players. It’s for new players they mean to attract next year. And a yet to be confirmed or denied Xbox /Steam deck console port.

There is really nothing in this expansion for existing players. And a whole lot of negatives that will grossly affect the enjoyment of existing players.

Im sad for myself and my fellow players that have been loyal subscribers for 10 years.

Anyone else think BioWare have known for months they wouldn’t be able to do it and kept it silent?

 

To me it just confirms my suspicions that this expansion isn’t for existing players. It’s for new players they mean to attract next year. And a yet to be confirmed or denied Xbox /Steam deck console port.

 

There is really nothing in this expansion for existing players. And a whole lot of negatives that will grossly affect the enjoyment of existing players.

 

Im sad for myself and my fellow players that have been loyal subscribers for 10 years.

Honestly, I don't know what to say anymore. yes it seems like they've known for months. but i feel like if i say anymore I'll just be banned. but i feel you and i'm sad too

Interesting. So then it would seem it's limited to the tech abilities. The technical requirements are the tech classes. HA! PUN!

 

I was wondering since on PTS, the Force classes worked fine, but the tech ones didn't. I hope the hurdle is overcome sooner than later. At least we have the secondary for now, which is better than none at all.

How much do you want to bet it’s because most tech class mirrors use a different type of weapon.

Ie, sniper uses sniper rifle and gunslinger uses 2 hand guns, Merc uses to hand guns and Commando uses a canon.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

Yay!!

Anyone else think BioWare have known for months they wouldn’t be able to do it and kept it silent?

Of course they knew. I'm just wondering what else they haven't told us that they already know about and are intentionally remaining silent on, and will leave up to us to have to discover for ourselves when 7.0 launches.

Anyone else think BioWare have known for months they wouldn’t be able to do it and kept it silent?

 

To me it just confirms my suspicions that this expansion isn’t for existing players. It’s for new players they mean to attract next year. And a yet to be confirmed or denied Xbox /Steam deck console port.

 

There is really nothing in this expansion for existing players. And a whole lot of negatives that will grossly affect the enjoyment of existing players.

 

Im sad for myself and my fellow players that have been loyal subscribers for 10 years.

No, i think they intended to, but felll short, thats obvious isnt it?

I just wish they had been a litle more honest about that so i wouldnt have invested the time i did in some of these characters that are now bascially worthless or will have to be re-done.

Anyone else think BioWare have known for months they wouldn’t be able to do it and kept it silent?

Yes, but I don't think it's the conspiracy you make it out to be. I think they were probably trying really hard to figure out the problem and wanted to make sure that they couldn't fix it before announcing it.

Yes, but I don't think it's the conspiracy you make it out to be. I think they were probably trying really hard to figure out the problem and wanted to make sure that they couldn't fix it before announcing it.

I agree that they probably tried, but I also think that they knew for a while that they couldn't do it, and decided not to say anything until now. The only thing that surprises me is that they didn't remain silent longer.

To clear up some confusion we're reading, Force users will be able to change their first Combat Style to its mirror if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so. That has not changed.

If that's the case can you guys at least consider letting tech classes do the same?

Hi all,

 

For transparency and context for those who are reading the dev tracker only, the choosing your Combat Style for existing characters text being referenced in this thread is from the Separating Story and Gameplay article that was published a while go.

 

There's been an update to this. We originally planned to allow players to switch their primary combat style with existing characters upon loading up 7.0, unfortunately we discovered some technical hurdles that will prevent us from supporting that. So upon login, existing characters will maintain their existing Advanced Class, which will be converted into their first Combat Style. And eligible players will still be free to choose their second Combat Style.

 

The original article has been updated to reflect this.

I honestly expected this would be the case when the original announcement was made, can't please everyone no matter what you do tho. Looking forward to switching my LS Juggernaut to its mirrior class for giggles tho.

So Chris has clarified on the Discord again, so I'm going to paste that here so that the information is all in one place. Jackie, if any of this information is incorrect or being misinterpreted, please let us know:

"if they meet the Light or Dark-side alignment requirements to do so" is the key phrase here. You can switch to the mirror if you have not already unlocked Dark/Light V and have not finished your Act 3 story, and complete your Act 3 story with opposite alignment. You could also switch to the mirror if you have already unlocked the Act 3 story but had not unlocked Dark/Light V yet.

And then this exchange:

Player: Just to confirm then, I've got sage who is at Dark V, has finished the Act 3 story and is up to date with the current story (I've sided with the Imps and am playing sabotuer) - to play as a lightning sorc I would have to use it as my second class, because I can't mirror swap at this point?

 

Chris: That is correct. Because you will have all combat styles unlocked when you get to make your second choice.

So again, my understanding, based on the way Chris has explained it, is that existing characters that are past their class story chapter 3 and/or have the Dark/Light legacy achievements will not have the ability to swap to their mirror combat style.

No, i think they intended to, but felll short, thats obvious isnt it?

I just wish they had been a litle more honest about that so i wouldnt have invested the time i did in some of these characters that are now bascially worthless or will have to be re-done.

I’m sure their original intent was to try it. But when they discovered months ago that it wasn’t going to work, they should have told us.

The fact they pushed ahead and used a lot of resources just for new players only emphasises my belief that they expect to get a bunch of new players from somewhere.

haha i automatically assumed this would be the case... the people crying in the thread , its on you. not bioware

Why is it on the players? How is it their fault? BioWare promoted this feature and idea on the official site, live stream, forums, discord and in the media. It’s 100% BioWares fault if people are upset.

In saying that, those of us who’ve been here the longest should have expected problems. But that still doesn’t make it our fault we weren’t cynical enough 😉

So Chris has clarified on the Discord again, so I'm going to paste that here so that the information is all in one place. Jackie, if any of this information is incorrect or being misinterpreted, please let us know:

 

 

 

And then this exchange:

 

 

 

So again, my understanding, based on the way Chris has explained it, is that existing characters that are past their class story chapter 3 and/or have the Dark/Light legacy achievements will not have the ability to swap to their mirror combat style.

Which is not the way they described in the beginning. I even tried to get them to be clear about this in the beginning and those posts were ignored and now they come back a few days before the launch to clear it up. That does not reflect well on them when they have had plenty of opportunities to clear up this miscommunication to the players.

I am not sure why they think people that have tons of alts is just "going" to make a new one with the way they have done the gearing and conquest. Really? I hadn't planned on another alt anyways and had a feeling this was what they were going to do which is the reason I was asking for clarification in the beginning as I know some of my guild did not want to make more alts just for this.

Player: Just to confirm then, I've got sage who is at Dark V, has finished the Act 3 story and is up to date with the current story (I've sided with the Imps and am playing sabotuer) - to play as a lightning sorc I would have to use it as my second class, because I can't mirror swap at this point?

 

Chris: That is correct. Because you will have all combat styles unlocked when you get to make your second choice.

Ok now that just adds to the confusion.

Does that mean that if a force user wants to change to the mirror playstyle they ll only be given the chance at the end of chapter 3? And as long as they have DARK/LIGHT V?

Because based on that it sounds like that change initial to mirror is not available past chapter 3 and will only be available for new characters or characters who have yet to finish the original story chapter 3, so quite limited.

Hell some might get screwed by not having DARK/LIGHT V full by then and not noticing, because I am pretty sure the operative SIS double agent ending also required you to be at some level of light alignment to be available, had to make a new operative simply because of that xD

This lack of clarity will lead to some issues when people realize they arent able to change their force user's initial combat style and without reading choose the mirror as second combat style and then complain that they wasted their 2nd combat style slot.

although to be fair, we were also right in our thinking. the plan was for us to change our original combat style. and all signs pointed to that being the case, until I asked Jackie to jump into the thread. So I guess congrats you were "right", but so were we

Again my main point was that the bioware post everyone linked could be interpreted either way so that excludes it as evidence for either argument, and the most crucial evidence we had was on the PTS, where they by design allowed force users to change but only their mirror instead of anything. Hence why the evidence suggested of intended developer limitation otherwise why wouldnt have included that extremely specific limitation.