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Characters (Alts) can't be placed in Strongholds :(

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Characters (Alts) can't be placed in Strongholds :(

Kulyok's Avatar


Kulyok
07.03.2014 , 05:51 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by discbox View Post
Why are the companions holos anyway? They (virtually) exist, they hang arround with my character and in my ship. Why not in my strongold!?

There is no need for a holographic replica of them.
I don't know about other players, but I'm going to take Vette, Jaesa, Elara, and probably Mako, put them in various revealing outfits and place them in the greeting room. Nice and sexy. I hope there'll be something like a musical probe to create a party atmosphere.

(And, speaking as a girl, I wouldn't mind to have a few half-naked muscular Twi'leks around. Malavai Quinn in military uniform just doesn't cut it sometimes).
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Warrgames's Avatar


Warrgames
07.03.2014 , 05:55 AM | #22
I don't get this, could someone please explain to me why you want this? You can't play multi characters at the same times in the same legacy. So all your alts would be just another statue in your stronghold. So there isn't going to be any RP interaction between the your alts. In one of the video there look to be a family tree that you could place in your stronghold.

I think BW logic on this is that your alts are off fighting the good fight or bad fight if they are darksider. That why they aren't laying around moms house all day long. Since they are off saving or burning the galaxy with their companions that why they aren't there when your other alts are in the stronghold. How often does your whole family hang out in the same space together (parents, grandparents, kids, uncles, aunts, close friends and hate enemies)? Do you RP that when you aren't playing your character they are sitting on the couch till you play them? Or are they off on some sort of mini adventure?

I'm one the 1st people to criticize BW but I agree with them on this.
"Such minds. Such fertile grounds." Dread Master Raptus
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Warrgames's Avatar


Warrgames
07.03.2014 , 05:57 AM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by discbox View Post
Why are the companions holos anyway? They (virtually) exist, they hang arround with my character and in my ship. Why not in my strongold!?

There is no need for a holographic replica of them.
Companions are only holo when you are logged on a different char. Vette will be Vette when your on a SW and holo ever other character.
"Such minds. Such fertile grounds." Dread Master Raptus
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Kantaso's Avatar


Kantaso
07.03.2014 , 06:14 AM | #24
Can we get some family pictures to hang on the walls? Or pictures of our best companions?
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Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
07.03.2014 , 06:18 AM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by errant_knight View Post
I don't have a problem with this at all because I never expected otherwise. It would be a little weird to have them all in the same place without any interaction, which would be impossible, of course, since they're all us, lol.
They're all us? I see this inability to disconnect with a computer avatar quite frequently and find it slightly disconcerting. I see characters within story driven games as separate third person identities no different than characters in any other form of story telling medium be it book or film. They are characters with their own identities and I as a player get to guide them.
From this point of view, and bearing in mind when the Legacy patch first launched it did so with a Family tree that allows a player to establish links such as spouse, sibling, child between characters on the same server it makes perfect sense to allow them to be used as 'decorations'.

Quote: Originally Posted by errant_knight View Post
The only point would be backdrop for rp or group photos and that's a lot of work for a picture/backdrop..
The point is to establish that sense of Legacy in a visual form and not as a list or flat 2-D image. The sense of immersion becomes all the greater and the feeling of connection with the characters you have created a little deeper. The appeal of displaying all the Alts in my legacy at one location was the primary interest I had in Strongholds (secondary being the legacy bank). It appeals to those that like the Sims element that housing brings to the game.

Quote: Originally Posted by errant_knight View Post
Between this and the astonishment that legacy cargo doesn't come free with the stronghold, I'm kind of curious about where these expectations came from.
The expectations for this feature came from a basic understanding of the features that appeal to a certain type of player. Player housing is a big thing for those players that are into the backstory, role-playing aspects of their characters. It most likely appeals more to those players that have spent a lot of time in games with a similar style to The Sims. Certainly those players that are likely to spend a lot on the CM elements of Strongholds.
Those gamers more centered on PvP and PvE achievements are most likely to open a single room, or go with the standard subscribers benefit Nar Shadaa Sky Palace and dump all of their trophies.

Personally, I could care less about free placement, I spent a good deal of time in Skyrim Developers Kit modifying player housing and while you can get some unique looks the overall trouble and time taken far outweighs the benefits of such an indepth system in the game environment. The Hook+ system looks like an ideal compromise.

On buying things of convenience to place in the Stronghold such as the Legacy bank, of course it should have a cost. I remember the ridiculous cost of putting a GTN terminal in your starship or the significant outlay in character inventory and bank tabs pre-CM release. This was back in the day when there wasn't a plethora of dailies to run or near end game quality mods to craft or augments for easy money.

But... on this inability to display all the characters of your legacy and their companions in one place at the same time. A complete misunderstanding of a significant section of the player base that would spend time with the Strongholds expansion.

Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
07.03.2014 , 06:32 AM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by Warrgames View Post
I don't get this, could someone please explain to me why you want this? You can't play multi characters at the same times in the same legacy. So all your alts would be just another statue in your stronghold. So there isn't going to be any RP interaction between the your alts. In one of the video there look to be a family tree that you could place in your stronghold.
I want this 'Because' I can't play multi characters at the same time in the same legacy.
Lack of interaction is a significant issue. I wonder if this is the reason that companions that aren't yours only being holograms is also part of this issue. Maybe the location of sound files attached to a companion are locked away on the class files. You know those limited responses you get when you click on companions in a starship. And, of course there would not be any vocals as yet associated with other characters, despite all that wasted vocal talent that's lost once you play through the class quests.
Besides a limited selection of vocal responses from character and companions alike, the ability to attach a looping animation (maybe those emotes that you can unlock in collections as well as those obviously used for NPCs in game) would fulfil all my interaction needs.

Quote: Originally Posted by Warrgames View Post
I think BW logic on this is that your alts are off fighting the good fight or bad fight if they are darksider. That why they aren't laying around moms house all day long. Since they are off saving or burning the galaxy with their companions that why they aren't there when your other alts are in the stronghold. How often does your whole family hang out in the same space together (parents, grandparents, kids, uncles, aunts, close friends and hate enemies)? Do you RP that when you aren't playing your character they are sitting on the couch till you play them? Or are they off on some sort of mini adventure?
I don't RP that the characters I'm not playing from my legacy are loafing around on the couch, but they may be in the Warroom planning their next push for galactic domination, or on the balcony scanning the horizon for incoming threats, or in the workshop putting together some specialised weaponry, or in the garage fine tuning the lateral thrusters on the magnus, or throwing some wild shapes on the dance floor of the party room, or catching up with some much needed research in the datacron archive, or slopping out the pens of the animal mounts (all though that's usually a task reserved for Malavai Quinn), or... I think you get the idea that the options are more than just sitting on a couch.
From my point of view this is a major missed opportunity to bring that sense of legacy together and truly integrate the characters. And, when I get together with all of my family for special occasions it does tend to take place at someone's home.

Quote: Originally Posted by Warrgames View Post
I'm one the 1st people to criticize BW but I agree with them on this.
A valid opinion, but I disagree with them. It's a major weakness of the stronghold launch and alongside the apparent lack of customisable mannequins (either as guards/NPCs or as statics) a contributing factor to me not investing additional CM revenue.

Vhaegrant's Avatar


Vhaegrant
07.03.2014 , 06:52 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by eartharioch View Post
And the "just for fun" question -- which companions do you get to see [in holo form]? Like, if I have two Sith Warriors, can I show both Vettes, do I have to choose, or is there a separate "Stronghold Vette" that only exists if I have at least one Sith Warrior, but that I can clothe/decorate independently from their separate per-alt customization/equipment?
While they didn't really show the Companion placement in great detail on the Twitch stream (A rather disgruntled Blizz was stood on the naughty step) I would imagine each character slot on the server has it's own linked companion slots. I doubt there is any distinction placed on the Class and associated companions linked to that slot.
So, the companions from character slot one have a unique identifier from those in the other 21 slots (if you've fully expanded your character slots) and means that should you chose to have 22 Sith Warriors you will have 22 Vettes to place in the stronghold.
It does suggest a significant amount of data storage when you consider the number of companions currently available per character sits at 8. So a full total of 176 companions :O Not all of which would have full customisation options though.
I can see this as being one reason that may be given for not allowing the 'real' companions to be present but instead their holograms, although I imagine the hologram is an image effect applied after the customisation details have been applied so there is no reduction of storage here, in effect it's an additional process.
It is also a sort of work around for not having true Mannequins to display armour sets on, although as it stands they would only be represented as holograms any way

Przemo_No's Avatar


Przemo_No
07.03.2014 , 07:45 AM | #28
I find it strange.
I thought putting your alts in the stronghold would be the major feature. While I really do not care where my "trophies" will be placed, or what color has my carpet I wanted to SEE my all alts in their 3D. Of course I DO NOT expect all of them to be "active" while I play particular one, but at least i should be able to SEE them standing or sitting somewhere in the "house". Of course it would be weird having Sith Inquisitor DS drinking tea win LS Jedi Consular discussing newest fashion - thus the housing could accept alts of the same faction, but NOT having such opportunity at all is really depressing.
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Aries_cz's Avatar


Aries_cz
07.03.2014 , 08:11 AM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Vhaegrant View Post
Lack of interaction is a significant issue. I wonder if this is the reason that companions that aren't yours only being holograms is also part of this issue. Maybe the location of sound files attached to a companion are locked away on the class files. You know those limited responses you get when you click on companions in a starship. And, of course there would not be any vocals as yet associated with other characters, despite all that wasted vocal talent that's lost once you play through the class quests.
Nah, that is not how programming works . All audio files are available at all times, you just need to call them up. However, with existing files, all you would get are responses like on a ship or while in terrain, because everything else is designed fro companion conversations (which would make sense with different characters).
So we would need new companion voiceovers (not that big of a problem), and probably some AI routine that would allow them to use some semi-random animations... neither of those things seems difficult from a armchair point of view, but I have no idea how difficult it actually is
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Warrgames's Avatar


Warrgames
07.03.2014 , 09:12 AM | #30
Vhaegrant thanks for shading some light on this. I do see your point. Maybe it is something they are working or might add due to feedback. They pushed it back release to Aug so it would be released with more features. They might not have thought about it like you guys do. They might want to release a good working base and see how much player use it. To see if it is worth more man power or if its a flop like the customization kiosk. Since we have seen any new character customization since the lease of the kiosk.

I don't care for this feature of the game. Most likely my house is only going to have legacy bank in it and that is it. I need to start a thread and bash BW.
"Such minds. Such fertile grounds." Dread Master Raptus
You were just told you have **** for brains by a Dread Master.