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Why lowbie PVP > 50 PVP for fun factor.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Why lowbie PVP > 50 PVP for fun factor.

criminalheretic's Avatar

01.24.2013 , 02:25 PM | #31
Lowbie PvP is kind of a pain in my opinion. Abilities aside, just too many people that really have no idea what they are doing. I get that lowbie is for learning, so I don't rage at anyone, (I don't talk smack to people in WZs as a matter of personal policy) but it does get to me a bit.

What I dislike the most about it is leveling mirrored classes, but that is just me being an idiot. Leveling a Sorc, and I keep trying to use abilities that I would use on my 50 Sage, which of course I don't have yet since my Sorc is level 21.
What we don't understand, we can make mean anything.
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Washingtoon's Avatar

01.24.2013 , 02:40 PM | #32
My opinion: Lowbie has more balance between a lvl 10 and a lvl 49, regardless of AC, then there is between different min/maxed WH AC'es at 50.

Reason. You can, even as a lvl 10, play an important role in the game's outcome. In some cases even single handedly win games. There is no room for great individual performances at 50, it's just a matter of your class. Some things that factors in:

1. Much less stuns. It allows even a low level to use his/her abilties, situational awareness and mobility.
2. While it is possible to really gear out a smasher in lowbie you don't see those big hits that often. Hence, itäs not a big problem there even if you encounter 4 x lvl 48 smashers.
3. Some classes "bloom" later than others and that's a slight disadvantage (although I've personally managed to top the dps chart on every AC I've played in one of my first games) BUT they also seem to scale pretty well compared to eachother. You don't have one class that all of a sudden becomes a power house. At 50 it's the complete opposite., as a sorc you see little to no change in output and survivability while gearing up while for instance smashers go from good to God mode. Is it really reasonable that an AC can hit another AC, despite that this AC is in BiS PvP gear, for more than 1/3 of its' health? To make things worse it's an AOE.

And I don't buy the BS about lowbie being filled with new and/or clueless people. It's just the same as at lvl 50 and while leveling my latest alt I had to play premades, from the better lvl 50 guilds, in more or less every game. My opinion has always been that their geared AC'es have done the job for them at 50 and leveling against them really confirmed this theory.

ArchangelLBC's Avatar

01.24.2013 , 04:52 PM | #33
I disagree that there isn't any opportunity for individuals to shine at 50, but seriously the significant difference in amount of CCs is unreal.

Do coordinated teams still stomp full PUGs in lowbie? Yes. This happens. You just probably won't see them again later because of the bigger queue pool.

Are the players often bad or clueless? Yep! Sure are. I don't see how this is different at 50, except in my experience this appears to be more of an equal opportunity affliction which leads to a lot of weird games where teams which should win get triple capped or something and lose. It's definitely more exciting, but that's like comparing college football to the NFL. College can be more exciting because skill caps are all over the place and makes for some crazy games.

Is there a gear gap? There can be and it can be steep but the amount of people with fully up-to-date blues vs the lazy people is much more tenable. You rarely have a team full of them, whereas in 50 PVP you should just expect that most people have full war hero at least so if you have 2 people rolling in recruit gear it's gonna probably be the game unless the other team is similarly handicapped.

Is there less CC? yes. much less. I feel like this makes all the difference.
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Z-ToXiN's Avatar

01.25.2013 , 03:48 AM | #34
I find lowbie PVP to be quite enjoyable. The above two posts do a good job of summing it up (minus the smash comments).

ts a nice break from 50s, a very different pace and often a lot more fun. Though you do often see insanely aggravating or bad things people do a bit more, that stuff still happens at 50 often anyway.

Asvarduil's Avatar

01.26.2013 , 01:59 PM | #35
I prefer Lowbie PvP to Endgame PvP for the following reasons:

1 - The challenge is better in my opinion. In Lv.50 PvP, we're really fighting the other guy's gear; in 10-49 bracket, the gear can in many cases be counted on to be sub-par; we're also fighting that player's skill and determination to play to the tactical objectives of the map. Further, each player may or may not have their full kit of skills to use, which leads to some interesting tactical decisions.

2 - The lowbie PvP community is nicer than the endgame PvP community. After games, I regularly have /say conversations with defeated opponents, where we swap ideas on plays, and keep queuing to try to beat that other player who now knows I am a [Insert Role Here].

3 - My last point touched on it, but to me the lowbie community provides a better sense of friendly competition. There are big names to watch out for on every server - while no one will really take that as some kind of revelation, in the lowbie brackets it gets more interesting, because sometimes taking a break will yield either that name having gained some levels, augment slots, and skills, or more interestingly the absence of that player as they've made the choice to go compete in 50s bracket.

4 - My last point touched on this, but despite a certain legacy representing a truly good, thought-inspiring player, the per-server dynamic is always in flux. It's never boring, and being a good teammate is rewarding because potentially anyone can bring something awesome to the table.

5 - I feel that 50s bracket not only limits who you can expect to see, but as BioWare has set things up such that some classes have a 'right' and a 'wrong' set of possible PvP specs, sometimes a person just can't contribute meaningfully to a game, whether attempting to experiment, actually bad at PvP, or merely ignorant. In 10-49, I have greater latitude to experiment and invent new ways of playing my character.

6 - Lowbie PvP actually rewards me for being a Crafter. If I have a fresh Lv.10, and I've maxed out a character's tradeskills, I can quickly and easily give my character a competitive edge. Best of all, it's often necessary to do just that; many people have Lv 50 characters who have researched various purple-grade recipes! It forces a form of PvP that transcends the warzone, and extends to the server economy, which leads to some really deep implications that the crafter has to consider (what if I make a bunch of Skill Augment 9s, and instead of my Republic buddies buying them, a bunch of snipers load up my wallet instead?)

A lot of this is personal preference - some people who truly love 50s bracket might and probably do disagree with many of my points, and that's OK; play the way you're OK with! But for me, 10-49 is the way to PvP. I wish there was a legitimate way to stay in 10-49.
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Count_Midnite's Avatar

01.26.2013 , 02:08 PM | #36
I always find it funny when people say "OMG Guise! 10-49 bracket is much more unbalanced than 50! Gear Brah!!"
Really? Are you serious? You believe that 10-49 gear matters? To an extent it does, but I mean now it's done. Twinks will always have someone to beat them, plain and simple. 10-49 is fun because no one really gets all technical or be an elitist with their gear or premades as they would in 50 PVP.

Granted, 10-49 is my favorite so far, everything is a slower pace and balanced. (In my Opinion)
It may not be crazy action going on, but at least you can have fun and no one has access to any deadly hybrids or their higher level stims, or their gear being twinked up. Plus you don't have to grind for gear (Gear is Much Much easier to get, but to some people this can be hindering) , you can enjoy it and level while doing it.

PVP in this game however is always fun to be honest, just I prefer 10-49 than 50 PVP

fungihoujo's Avatar

01.27.2013 , 03:49 AM | #37
Quote: Originally Posted by Xerain View Post
The only way 50 pvp is fun is if you're geared and have like 6-8k smash crits all the time and 2-3 shot them. That doesn't make the pvp better than lowbie people just because you're too used to the crutch of having BW's FOTM class.
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fungihoujo's Avatar

01.27.2013 , 03:53 AM | #38
Anyone saying gear/levels makes lowbie pvp imbalanced is out of touch- I've topped charts on every class except sins and guardians below level 20- and guardians by level 30 was doing so as well.

I've had less issue dominating on level 30 characters than 50s in recruit- massively so.

Class balance is simply better low level, since at 50 some classes scale better- not to mention, almost nobody has fully power/surged their jugg at low levels- while at 50 everyone has which just means 7k smashes all game, every game.

Missandei's Avatar

01.27.2013 , 07:09 AM | #39
Quote: Originally Posted by ArchangelLBC View Post
9/10 sorcs/sages aren't using bubble stuns in lowbies.

Sorry if this is obvious, but having my sent go from the lowbie bracket to the 50 bracket, even when dinging into full (admittedly stock) vindicator's gear made this abundantly obvious. Twinks almost make sense to me now.

I mean you can still get burned down in minutes by good teams, pugs are still often very bad, but take away the bubble stuns and life seems so much better.

Oh I guess there's also the issue that you rarely face the same team, or get the same team, over and over if you just keep queuing. I have to admit that aspect is pretty nice too.

lol.. In 1-49 PvP Powerteches and Operatives are in GOD mode..
40+ lvl Powertech are near immortal
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Jjix's Avatar

01.27.2013 , 09:05 AM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by fungihoujo View Post
Anyone saying gear/levels makes lowbie pvp imbalanced is out of touch- I've topped charts on every class except sins and guardians below level 20- and guardians by level 30 was doing so as well.
I was topping the charts on my sin at level 15. The only classes that were rough in the teens were juggs and operatives, both late bloomers.

Seriously though, I think any many ways pre-50 pvp is just more solo casual player friendly. More balance, slower pace, less CC, far fewer premades and less need to be organized. 50 pvp demands that you gear up (which is much easier to do if you have guildmates to help you), play as a team, and be serious. If you prefer casual, you will prefer pre-50, if you are very serious about pvp and getting organized you will prefer 50 pvp.

If you look at people's complaints about level pre-50 pvp -- except for a few clueless people claiming pre-50 pvp is even more imbalanced than 50 pvp -- most of the complaints are about how players are unorganized, just focused on 1v1 rather than the maps objectives, that there are too many newbs in it, that no one plays as a team, etc. All of these complaints center around the same theme: that pre-50 pvp is "too casual".

Conversely, if you look at the complaints about 50 pvp they are just the opposite, they center around the theme of how level 50 pvp is misery for the lone casual player. You need to gear up, you need at minimum to form a premade, preferably you should join an elite pvp guild, you should use voice communication, etc. If you don't do these things, if you just jump in a pug after a long hard day at work because you are bored, you will get destroyed . . . over and over. So 50 pvp is much less casual friendly than pre-50 pvp, and that really is the key difference. People prefer one over the other are people who prefer more solo styled casual play versus heavily team oriented serious play.