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P2W is bad?


Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.13.2012 , 05:44 AM | #31
Quote: Originally Posted by Eggsalicious View Post
P2W is wonderful. It warmeth my cockles.

I think it's insane to pay rent to live in a virtual world and neglect reality, but it's even more insane to pay for cosmetic goods that are only of questionable use in that world. I have a hard enough time rationalizing the former; there's no way I would do the latter.

However, since I've already done the former, I like the idea of people dumber than me spending real money on useless virtual things so I don't lose my investment in my pastime. Good PvP teams will always smear bad P2W teams, and no-one cares what bad players do as long as inject money into SWTOR.

If you P2W in PvE, then LOL@U--you probably had a Tamogotchi as a kid and your loserdom is almost complete.

~Sig
While I deplore your lack of principle, I applaud your clear reasoning.

Still wrong because it devalues the game, and opens the door to your good PvP team being outgunned by bad P2W teams if ("when", under those circumstances) better and more expensive gear is available quickly through real money purchase, but funny. And I buy the points, figuratively speaking, about paying for pixels.

It's actually largely status people are buying anyway, and the status depends on the items representing excellence (or at least effort). Once they can be bought for real money then the game-status devalues so it's self-defeating and trashes the game in the process. If people proposing P2W were really interested in a non-serious (fairly) equal contest where they didn't need top gear, they could simply run lowbie PvP. Job done. Only that probably wouldn't be as ego-strokingly pleasant as swanning about in the top gear, would it?
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

DaedalusV's Avatar


DaedalusV
11.13.2012 , 05:44 AM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by falcon_Xtreme View Post
strawman. i said nothing of the sort.
Lies. Your argument opens up for exactly that argument.

You want to be able to leverage your paycheck to get ahead of the gear curve.

I want to leverage my knowhow of software to do exactly the same.


(still waiting to get a reply on my original argument on why P2W shouldn't be implemented.. Namely the fact that two wrongs does make it right)
"you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."
Arwyn Sage Blitzkrieger Sentinel Sk'ye Guardian

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
11.13.2012 , 05:49 AM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by falcon_Xtreme View Post
its a game. if I work 40-50 hours a week and cannot invest as much time as someone with no job who plays 24/7. does that mean I have to still invest a certain amount of time to aquire the gear (through a gear grind) just to make it somehow fair for the person who aquired it that way? ... no if theres an option thats suitable for me (and others ) then we will take it. my game experience is my game experience.
Yes, it means exactly that. I'm working from 8 am to 6 pm every day, too.
I'm guessing you don't care about the side effect of your game experience and how P2W will affect the larger community. Read up a bit to see how the process of going P2W destroyed several other games already.

Don't get me wrong, I don't like gear progression either. (Personally, I think separating PvE and PvP gear progression was one of the stupidest thing BW ever did.) But if I had to choose between gear grind and P2W, then gear grind all the way with all the negative side effects. Why? Because P2W is not a stable market model in the long run.
BEING A GOOD SOLDIER COMES DOWN TO ONE THING, ONE SINGLE QUESTION:
WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO SACRIFICE?

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.13.2012 , 05:52 AM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by Atramar View Post
6 queens is a bad example.
if 6 queens can be obtained by gridning , game wouldn't be chess any more. and you can't buy skill.
I agre it's not hard to gear up, and I won't pay for gear either, but if some one want's to pay or $ or for augumented WH, let them. if they suck, they wil still suck, diff between BM and WH is not so big any way. bah, if a guy can't play, recruit player will smash them.
Actually, it's fine. You can get extra queens in chess by getting a pawn to the back line, if you play well.

Only in shiny new "P2W Chess 9000" you don't have to make the effort of getting them through there by being better than your opponent, you can start with a bunch of extra queens. Because your time is too valuable to actually, you know, play the game: now you can simply pay to win. How rewarding. If you pay more, it's even more rewarding!

Now with new hyper-queens, that can teleport to anywhere on the board, only $100 per use.
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

falcon_Xtreme's Avatar


falcon_Xtreme
11.13.2012 , 05:55 AM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by DaedalusV View Post
Lies. Your argument opens up for exactly that argument.
You want to be able to leverage your paycheck to get ahead of the gear curve.
I want to leverage my knowhow of software to do exactly the same.
your knowledge of software as leverage would be an exploit against the eula and tos. where as paying money is operating within conditions offered by ea/bioware its a ingame store. subscription vs f2p does the exact same thing but on a smaller level. sub =unlimited warzones and f2p limited, thats a gear curve distinction right there, by you guessed it... money.
REDZONE & PROUD!

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
11.13.2012 , 05:57 AM | #36
Quote: Originally Posted by Wainamoinen View Post
Actually, it's fine. You can get extra queens in chess by getting a pawn to the back line, if you play well.

Only in shiny new "P2W Chess 9000" you don't have to make the effort of getting them through there by being better than your opponent, you can start with a bunch of extra queens. Because your time is too valuable to actually, you know, play the game: now you can simply pay to win. How rewarding. If you pay more, it's even more rewarding!

Now with new hyper-queens, that can teleport to anywhere on the board, only $100 per use.
Is that the game, where knights can force leap? Bishops use force speed? Kings stealth and rooks take cover and turn into miniature turrets?
BEING A GOOD SOLDIER COMES DOWN TO ONE THING, ONE SINGLE QUESTION:
WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO SACRIFICE?

Atramar's Avatar


Atramar
11.13.2012 , 05:58 AM | #37
for last time, you can't buy skill, nor you can't buy gear which will give one abilitie to one butto smash everything.
that 'milionare' with full augumented WH will still get smashed by your pro elite skills and team play.
I've played game where few people payed about 2,000$ per month for items from item shop and they were unbeatable. unless you've spent many hours you couldn't touch them. and if you landed a hit, it was for 5 dmg (hp was 20k). That was pay to win. (granted, in time you had items to tickle them and 40 ticklers eventually killed one).
Tracer Legacy, The Red Eclipse.
Not reading colored text, it hurts my eyes. Sorry (unless it's a dev post)
L55:Sniper,Operative,Juggernaut,Assassin,Marauder, Powertech,Guardian,Commando,Scoundrel
to finish:Shadow(41),Sage(53),Merc(39). 29.07.2013

falcon_Xtreme's Avatar


falcon_Xtreme
11.13.2012 , 05:58 AM | #38
Quote: Originally Posted by CommanderKeeva View Post
Yes, it means exactly that. I'm working from 8 am to 6 pm every day, too.
I'm guessing you don't care about the side effect of your game experience and how P2W will affect the larger community. Read up a bit to see how the process of going P2W destroyed several other games already.

Don't get me wrong, I don't like gear progression either. (Personally, I think separating PvE and PvP gear progression was one of the stupidest thing BW ever did.) But if I had to choose between gear grind and P2W, then gear grind all the way with all the negative side effects. Why? Because P2W is not a stable market model in the long run.
tell that to lotro. and SOE with then they had swg tcg. Micro transtractions through ingame stores are vastly becoming the rule not the exception in mmos. its nothing new.
REDZONE & PROUD!

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
11.13.2012 , 05:58 AM | #39
Quote: Originally Posted by CommanderKeeva View Post
Is that the game, where knights can force leap? Bishops use force speed? Kings stealth and rooks take cover and turn into miniature turrets?
I saw someone hacking once, where their King and a rook swapped places. Bioware did nothing.
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

Eillack's Avatar


Eillack
11.13.2012 , 06:00 AM | #40
OP, TOR is not your thing, P2W is a horrible aspect that screws up all sense of gear progression and allows an injustified advantage over other players, damaging any "fun" aspect or a sense of accomplishment.

Go back to where you came from and stop trolling our site.

Thanks.
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