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SWTOR May Still Be Headed Down a Dark Path (LONG POST)

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
SWTOR May Still Be Headed Down a Dark Path (LONG POST)

MOPSFounder's Avatar


MOPSFounder
09.30.2012 , 06:05 AM | #101
Quote: Originally Posted by Goretzu View Post
The PvP is terrible in SWTOR, and that's not comparing it to WoW (which is also terribile).

If they ditched the resolve system and got something fit for purpose it would be a lot better, but then they'd still need some RvR (or better RvRvR) and even then really collision detection.

Which is a shame because the classes are well built for PvP and the SW universe in general was build around RvR.
Agreed. I love playing PvP in SWTOR (because I'm a PvP junkie), but the way it works in this game is utterly terribad.

The game's Resolve now takes LONGER to fill-up if multiple stuns are hitting you. Some players (like myself) have experienced being stunned to death with our Resolve not taking affect. This game is a massive stun-fest in PvP. The stuns and CC feel like they were meant more for PvE instances, and that just might be the case.

It's a shame this game is PvE-centric because Star Wars revolves around RvR (or RvRvR). You have the good guys, you have the bad guys, and you have every other type of faction (Hutts, Mandos, Pirates, Neutral affiliations) in between. Too bad this game's OPvP is nothing but a massive zerg- and lag-fest.

MOPSFounder's Avatar


MOPSFounder
09.30.2012 , 10:38 AM | #102
Quote: Originally Posted by Knockerz View Post
The pvp in game would be fine had ilum worked and rated warzone launch on patch 1.2 not patch 1.3. Unfortunately, BW was not able to fix ilum and shutdown ilum until they could fix it. This reminds of sony and how they disabled battlegrounds until they could fix them, but never fixed battlegrounds. To my recollection sony never fixed battlegrounds in swg. Thus, never turn them back on. I was lucky enough to activate a battleground in the early days after launch for swg.
Ilum was nothing but pure failure from BioWare, sadly. They did NOT do their homework on basic MMO OPvP 101.

Goretzu's Avatar


Goretzu
10.01.2012 , 03:46 AM | #103
Quote: Originally Posted by Knockerz View Post
The pvp in game would be fine had ilum worked and rated warzone launch on patch 1.2 not patch 1.3. Unfortunately, BW was not able to fix ilum and shutdown ilum until they could fix it. This reminds of sony and how they disabled battlegrounds until they could fix them, but never fixed battlegrounds. To my recollection sony never fixed battlegrounds in swg. Thus, never turn them back on. I was lucky enough to activate a battleground in the early days after launch for swg.
Nah, the resolve system isn't fit for purpose - the designed something too complex for a simple job - i.e. an all in one system over a series of simple timers (which works).
Real Star Wars space combat please, not Star Wars Fox! Maybe some PvP and flight too?
Goretzu's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving "Entitled" approaches 1

NemesisSupreme's Avatar


NemesisSupreme
10.01.2012 , 07:26 AM | #104
I agree the PvP could be much better in this game. Right now the PvP is serviceable at best. I also agree we should have RvR open world PvP. They have DAoC and WAR. They should attempt to incorporate something as close to those game's PvP as possible, IMO. And for all the people saying this game isn't about PvP. You are right it isn't for PvP on your PvE and RP servers, but for those of us that understand that different factions in the Star Wars universe actually do fight each other, we just want PvP that works right and isn't limited to tiny skirmishes. Personally i think if they improved the PvP it would bring in a loyal player base that would pay money, and that would allow EA to put some money into PvE content. I personally enjoy both PvP and endgame PvE. I think the story aspect of this game is amazing. There simply needs to be more to do once you hit the lvl cap. RvR would be a huge step in the right direction IMO

MOPSFounder's Avatar


MOPSFounder
10.01.2012 , 01:08 PM | #105
Quote: Originally Posted by NemesisSupreme View Post
I agree the PvP could be much better in this game. Right now the PvP is serviceable at best. I also agree we should have RvR open world PvP. They have DAoC and WAR. They should attempt to incorporate something as close to those game's PvP as possible, IMO. And for all the people saying this game isn't about PvP. You are right it isn't for PvP on your PvE and RP servers, but for those of us that understand that different factions in the Star Wars universe actually do fight each other, we just want PvP that works right and isn't limited to tiny skirmishes. Personally i think if they improved the PvP it would bring in a loyal player base that would pay money, and that would allow EA to put some money into PvE content. I personally enjoy both PvP and endgame PvE. I think the story aspect of this game is amazing. There simply needs to be more to do once you hit the lvl cap. RvR would be a huge step in the right direction IMO
Might I add that those of you who'd respond by saying "re-roll another character", let me remind you that many of us did NOT signup for this game to do just that.

It seems like re-rolling was one of BioWare intentions, but I have to say many of the people who left this game didn't want to do that.

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
10.01.2012 , 01:18 PM | #106
Quote: Originally Posted by MOPSFounder View Post
It's a shame this game is PvE-centric because Star Wars revolves around RvR (or RvRvR).
Not during peacetime.

In this timeline, war has concluded, and there is a peace treaty in effect between factions. So, there are cold war skirmishes and conspiracies that fold well into the timeline, but not open faction-faction warfare.

As far as I am concerned, real PvP (yeah, I'm old school DAoC PvPer) must have faction level consequences/benefits to really thrive. Player based benefits/consequences only encourage the same old sanitized instanced set piece PvP that WoW has addicted half a generation of players to.

That said, I'm not even sure faction level incentives/benefits/consequences works anymore. TSW has factioned persistent PvP with benefits/consequences, yet it does not work all that well either. Yeah, the PvP has some flaws in mechanics, but all PvP does... so I honestly think it is more about player tastes now days. Player are not faction warriors, for the faction. They are mercenaries, out for what's in it for them, and you can't have good PvP in that sort of environment in any consistent manner. It's an arena PvP community these days IMO. They might as well just duel 1v1 or 2v2 IMO.

TL;DR: it largely does not matter what game producers do these days, PvPers are a mercenary lot, with no real care of loyalty to a faction. What they want is whatever gets them rewards for the least effort. There are exceptions of course in the players, but this behavior has come to dominate in the 5-6 years.
Judgments are often inaccurate because the brain relies on cognitive biases over hard evidence. Cognitive bias is the tendency to make irrational judgments in consistent patterns. Researchers have found that cognitive bias wreaks havoc by forcing people to make poor, irrational judgments.

Ricktur's Avatar


Ricktur
10.01.2012 , 01:40 PM | #107
the subscription model mmorpg as a whole is going the way of the dinosaur.

dont believe me?

look at THQ's Dark Millennium. investors were too scared to invest in a sub based mmo business model despite the potential and promise.

this game killed it for everyone.
Sgt. Boos Macarrage - Republic Trooper/Vanguard - PVE Tank Spec
Prophecy of the Five - US East PVP
Republic Commandos: First Ones In, Last Ones Out. Never Quit. Never Fail.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
10.01.2012 , 01:45 PM | #108
Quote: Originally Posted by Ricktur View Post
the subscription model mmorpg as a whole is going the way of the dinosaur.

dont believe me?

look at THQ's Dark Millennium. investors were too scared to invest in a sub based mmo business model despite the potential and promise.

this game killed it for everyone.
That's a single player game...

Subs are dead for BAD games. The only people who don't believe in sub fees are bad MMO developers.
All warfare is based on deception If his forces are united, separate them If you are far from the enemy, make him believe you are near A leader leads by example not by force
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Ricktur's Avatar


Ricktur
10.01.2012 , 01:53 PM | #109
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
That's a single player game...

Subs are dead for BAD games. The only people who don't believe in sub fees are bad MMO developers.
lol, man that point went right over your head didnt it?

IT WAS A SUBBASED MMO UP UNTIL TWO MONTHS AGO.

they switched it to a single player with multiplayer element model because investors were too scared to invest in the original sub based mmorpg model.

lol, fanboi power is unlimited isnt it? you just didnt want to do research before you blindly defended swtor. . ..
Sgt. Boos Macarrage - Republic Trooper/Vanguard - PVE Tank Spec
Prophecy of the Five - US East PVP
Republic Commandos: First Ones In, Last Ones Out. Never Quit. Never Fail.

Urael's Avatar


Urael
10.01.2012 , 01:56 PM | #110
Quote: Originally Posted by Ricktur View Post
lol, man that point went right over your head didnt it?

IT WAS A SUBBASED MMO UP UNTIL TWO MONTHS AGO.

they switched it to a single player with multiplayer element model because investors were too scared to invest in the original sub based mmorpg model.

lol, fanboi power is unlimited isnt it? you just didnt want to do research before you blindly defended swtor. . ..
You must not read these forums to accuse TUXs of being a fanboi. He is a conerned player who deftly (if not so subtlely) put a dig in against EAware. Not sure how you missed it.