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My Assassin Suggestions

Toxification's Avatar

01.25.2012 , 10:13 PM | #1
Alright so many people are saying that assassins suck and they're underpowered and they don't do enough damage. There are a couple reasons people say this, however I feel that at endgame fully geared their just a little lackluster. Not MASSIVELY underpowered not worth playing kinda damage, but there's definitely room for improvement.

Skills in general
Shock- The skill should deal 57% more damage over saber strike than thrash and cost 30 force considering
a)It's on a 6 second cooldown = 20% damage increase over thrash - math -
6-1.5(GCD) = 4.5 seconds/1.5 = 1.30 multiplier - square root = 1.14% increase
b)It costs 30 force which is = 38% higher force cost than thrash therefore it should deal 38% more damage

Thrash- Deals sustainable damage, seems to function properly. Good baseline dps

Crushing Darkness-
1.5 second cast, deals 225% more damage over saber strike than thrash, total
a)1.5 second cast = 1.1 multiplier - this is considering risk and return considering interrupts, immobilization due to casting, and when taking damage the cast takes longer.
b)15 second cooldown = 38% damage increase
c)40 force cost = 115% damage increase
d)About 60% of the damage currently is DoT based so
[0.6(6)]/1.5 = 24% - square root = 1.11 multiplier

Personally here's how I think it should be structured
7.5 second cooldown, must be used from behind, 35 force cost, 90% more damage than thrash
a)7.5 second cooldown = 18% damage increase
b)35 force cost = 77% higher force cost
c)Behind the target = 25% multiplier

What do you guys think of these numbers? Glancing at it crushing darkness seems exponential, however the force cost is a huge factor, especially when dealing with burst damage.

So if saber strike deals 200 damage and thrash deals 400 then
Shock = 514 damage
Crushing darkness = 918 damage
Maul = 722 damage

DarthNorik's Avatar

01.25.2012 , 10:29 PM | #2
Couple of things off the top of my head, level 50 madness assassin here.

Shock is fine, mine crits for about 2.2k on a regular basis. There are videos of deception assassins getting 5k crits with it. Nothing wrong with this skill except maybe its cost. If it costed say 35 force instead of 39.

Maul. Yes without the talent its useless, but thats the thing, with the talent its pretty good. Maybe needs like a 10% damage buff if any buff really. Easy 4k crits right now

Crushing Darkness is pretty useless, but amazing for force regen and damage for a madness sin. Good for other specs if you need a dot on someone. I think buffing it would imbalance madness. And removing some of the cost/cast time would imbalance the other trees.

Spike just needs the knockdown time increased to 2.5 secs. Its not meant to be the assassin mirror of hidden strike that OPS/Smugglers get.
Peace is a lie, rejected by all our natural instincts.

Voidhawke's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:02 AM | #3
The ability I would really like changed is Force Cloak because it doesn't remove dot's, 1 second after its used we are out of stealth again making this ability largely useless imo.

Ideologue's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:34 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Voidhawke View Post
The ability I would really like changed is Force Cloak because it doesn't remove dot's, 1 second after its used we are out of stealth again making this ability largely useless imo.
Force Shroud then Force Cloak. You do have to wait until mid-30's for Force Shroud I believe.

Great skill for a 45 sec cd though...

Woncho's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:35 AM | #5
I recently started getting hardmode gear as a deception assassin and I am not having any trouble putting up decent numbers. Honestly the most important thing to do is roll your cooldowns properly in deception and have a crit/surge relic.

In a couple heroic pieces and some artifacts i modded while leveling i am critting with shock for about 3.3k and discharge for 3k. I don't tend to have any force problems either since you can use blackout once a minute and force cloak every 2 to help with force regen.

I would like a bit more sustained dps for when we don't have cooldowns up but I think with the burst that we can have when we pop everything it does even out over the course of a boss fight.

Toxification's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 04:04 PM | #6
Well here's the thing with crushing darkness, and how I'd structure it without off-balancing madness trees.

Crushing Darkness should be changed to either a 1.5 second cast with a range of 15. This doesn't actually provide any massive boost to the madness tree considering one of the key skill makes crushing darkness instant and cost no force. So this would litterally provide no buff to the madness tree besides the range increase. I also think that its force cost should be 35.

I also agree with you when you say shock's force cost is too high, it should be about 35 without any skills. However I still feel its damage should be increased by 25% like the skill says instead of 18%. I'd say lower still but there are a plethora of skills that increase its damage. I'd demonstrate the math but I don't have the raw numbers. With some of the perks from the madness tree it'd be down to 29 force.

Maul personally I'd suggest a 6 second cooldown, same damage as current and a 40 maul cost. Additionally maul would normally get 35% armour piercing. Duplicity would have to be tweaked/changed

Redcoat's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:23 PM | #7
half rakata, half columni. In a raid my shock can crit 4k.

Khaazilla's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:50 PM | #8
Totally agree with all your points.

Even shock isn't viable ability unless you get induction, or a combination of several of the shock improving talents in Darkness and Madness.

My shock damage right now is listed at 1261-1335 and that's with the +15% shock damage from Electrify in the darkness tree and a focus offhand (which increases the damage by a good amount).

Is 1335 damage worth the base 45 energy cost? My maul is listed at 1924 damage for 50 energy which is actually more efficient than shock even with the 15% dmg increase from Electrify.

If i have energize up to make it crit it still only does 2004 damage (crits give +50% damage) for 45 energy which is barely more efficient than Maul.

You have to get chain shock and torment (cost reduction) before Shock really becomes useful and efficient (or induction to reduce the cost to 22,5 force).


But my biggest gripe is with Spike. It does negligible damage, costs a lot of force, and the knockdown barely lasts longer than the GCD so you only have .5 seconds to get an attack off while they're stunned.

They should change spike so that it costs less force, and so that it does at least triple the damage when used during stealth. That way sins will finally have a useful opener but it won't be overpowered when used out of stealth by tanks who can reduce the cd to 20 seconds.

Khaazilla's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 05:55 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Redcoat View Post
half rakata, half columni. In a raid my shock can crit 4k.
I'm sure that's as deception spec with the +50% crit damage talent, +30% damage from voltaic slashx2, and full buffs/stims/adrenals though. 4k damage isn't anything impressive for a dps class specced completely for damage. Snipers, marauders, and operatives crit much much harder than 4k.

Redcoat's Avatar

01.26.2012 , 06:09 PM | #10
yes deception. No adrenals. I've seen as high as 4,200 with surge trinket. i'll get some accurate numbers when I get home. Run some tests on the same mob.