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Marauder and Sentials are Preditorial in nature but...

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Marauder and Sentials are Preditorial in nature but...
 

Vallowen's Avatar


Vallowen
01.25.2012 , 01:58 AM | #11
A marauder with a stun would make me quit the game. its bad enough they're constantly leaping you, pinning you, interrupting you, and tearing chunks off

Radiatonia's Avatar


Radiatonia
01.25.2012 , 02:13 AM | #12
Marauders tend to be a bit underpowered compared to the channel and charge spam of certain classes at the end game. Their utility in a fight is also still kind of lacking.

Speaking as someone who's played one to fifty, I have to say that I have a much easier time playing certain other classes like Powertechs, and being successful at DPS and other meta-roles, then I do a Marauder, which requires many bars of skills slotted and easily activatable in order to be competitive.

Nevermind a much greater awareness of nearby fights in order to not be useless, since our two big things are a periodic few second long buff we give to people who are actually in our group (Doesn't seem to count the entire team. Just people we've invited beforehand.), and our ability to DPS while intermittently applying an attack that reduces incoming healing by 20 percent.

This is coming from someone who regularly does very good DPS, too. However, that DPS is coming at least partially from the fact that i'm over-geared in PVP gear compared to many players, and I typically run with a team that knows to compensate for the huge flaws this class tends to have in the sustainability department.

Also, watchman/annihilation is pretty weak in terms of DPS and utility compared to carnage/the other mirror. Watchman just requires less skill to play in terms of advanced game mechanics, and is much more approachable as a result.

Carnage tends to be really crazy in terms of requiring you to never make a mistake, and having almost literally every skill we get slotted, outside of core stuff for other trees like Rupture. However, it's also by far the best tree out of the bunch when it comes to DPSing if you can figure out how to play it properly. It also requires a proper understanding of the stats system to get the most out of it, since it's very multi-attack heavy.

Rage is just flat out broken in terms of putting out reliable DPS from encounter to encounter. Prior to 40, it's also incredibly useless. Once you are 40, it becomes very situational in its usefulness, ranging from "amazingly good" to "absolutely worthless".

The core DPS mechanic of the class is building up about 4 ticks of one buff, and 2 buffs all in all from skills, so you can use a smash that will automatically crit for insane damage. Problem is, you don't get a reliable way to trigger this until 40 due to one of the core skills being in the tree at that tier. Furthermore, one of the core methods of DPSing is easily interruptible, and is a channel. Adding onto that, smash itself is very hit or miss in terms of usage. If a large number of players or mobs aren't nearby, you're not really getting the bang for the buck out if that you should, given the huge charge-up time for the 5 buffs you need.

I figure i'll get flamed for pointing this out, but it really does need to be said.


Slight edit: The complaint that we can "leap and pin you" constantly is fallacious. A marauder has two roots. One is leap. Which lasts only for maybe 3 few seconds, which, combined with the travel time to the target means we get like one second of time to attack you before you can start running again. The other is ravage. Which requires you to talent heavily into carnage to unlock it, and also seems to remove the ability to stun standard tier mobs when using it too. It is also a channel, which means you can just smack us and remove it. Also, we can't actually do anything to you other then use ravage on you while we're rooting you with it.

Choke is a channel, and as a result, isn't really that useful outside of a delaying tactic or an impromptu interrupt. It's mostly a gimmick skill for rage's core tree mechanic, with some uses in stopping enemy channels that are a threat.

Our slow requires us to be in melee range to apply. Which means if we're using it, we're probably already focused on trying to kill you, instead of applying a slow, which we would preferably need before we can use our main attacks.

Compare this to other classes. Which have numerous ways of CCing people down at range, stunning them, or otherwise making their lives miserable. Marauders, instead, get things like Obfuscate, which lowers accuracy for a few seconds, or a number of abilities that are defensive based, and are on fairly long cooldowns.

The idea of the class seems to be a glass cannon centered around actively applying buffs to yourself to stay alive. However, this concept is also kind of new from what I recall. Most of the utility was only added in towards the end of beta due to the (very valid) complaints that the class was underpowered, and probably could do with a bit of tweaking to make it more effective.

eeCyaJ's Avatar


eeCyaJ
01.25.2012 , 03:57 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Hizoka View Post
Powertechs/Vanguards are a ranged class yet they have more ways to close a gap then the MELEE classes
Play a vanguard. You have to stay within melee range for your heavy attack to hit. You do have ranged abilities, but without stockstrike, you're not going to win a 1 vs 1 ranged engagement against anyone who knows their stuff.

I also play a watchman sentinel and have no problems, 1 vs 1, against any other class. I laugh at Mercs who attempt tracer missile spam. Apply burns, stasis. Pacify. The only thing about the average sent is the amount of keys and the CDs to keep track of. The window for Merciless Slash / Merciless is a little annoying, but we get a 10m finisher.
"Wheel of Morality, turn turn turn, tell us the lesson that we should learn!" - Animaniacs

Tyestor's Avatar


Tyestor
01.25.2012 , 05:48 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Vallowen View Post
A marauder with a stun would make me quit the game. its bad enough they're constantly leaping you, pinning you, interrupting you, and tearing chunks off
Not sure if serious. We have one charge on a 15 sec CD max 30m range 10m min range (obliterate is not a charge), one interrupt (that practically every other class has?) and two pins, both requiring to be speced for, both only in one tree, one requiring a channel and the other only with max 10m range.
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Vesperr's Avatar


Vesperr
01.25.2012 , 08:13 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Ralnity View Post
All this would make more sense if sentinels/marauders weren't already so powerful in pvp.

Next to the incredibly OP scoundrel/operative, they are easily the second best class in the game. I mean, if you spec watchman, you have two cooldowns that basically make you invulnerable.

Add in that sentinels are probably the best dps in the game (barring the burst damage of the previously mentioned OP scoundrels/operatives), and I can't understand what you are complaining about.
This. I fought good maras and they are not only hard to kill, they kick *** and chew healers unlike any other class.
>___<
I used to be a ballcarrier until I got Leg Shot in the knee.
I cant post if my playtime is over? What The Fckk?!

Atamosk's Avatar


Atamosk
01.25.2012 , 09:42 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Ralnity View Post
All this would make more sense if sentinels/marauders weren't already so powerful in pvp.

Next to the incredibly OP scoundrel/operative, they are easily the second best class in the game. I mean, if you spec watchman, you have two cooldowns that basically make you invulnerable.

Add in that sentinels are probably the best dps in the game (barring the burst damage of the previously mentioned OP scoundrels/operatives), and I can't understand what you are complaining about.
your obviously a sorc
running is never a bad thing

Mujina's Avatar


Mujina
01.26.2012 , 07:54 PM | #17
I would be ok with NOT having a stun or knockback/knockdown if we are giving a root/snare breaking ability that lasts say 15 to 20 seconds on a 45 second to 1 minute cd, and another 20+ ranged attack or a way to insta refresh our charge.

Lets be clear here, never said maras or sents were bad at dps but in terms of pvp they need a few tools to be on par with every other class in the game.

Jooji's Avatar


Jooji
01.26.2012 , 07:55 PM | #18
Is the OP really asking for a marauder buff? Marauders are the only class in the game I have trouble with as a healer...

Caelrie's Avatar


Caelrie
01.26.2012 , 08:09 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Tyrpak View Post
You know why I have to pop Saber Ward, Cloak of Pain (-20% damage), Force Camo, Undying Rage (at 20-30% hp) to be able to win a 1v1?

Because sorc and BH opens up with snare from 30m, spams attacks that hit similar as my melee hits, knockback when I'm there, stun me when I'm there again, bubble up, and STILL didn't use any longer then 1 min cd.

Even my 10 meter range skill needs rage that a marauder/sentinel can only get when he is in melee.

So I'm OP, because I had to use up ALL of my defensive cooldowns for 1 fight, where the BH is still pressing Tracer Missile-Tracer Missile and hits what 2.3k?


Problem is this: melee has only 1 way to deal damage, at 4 meter range. Ranged cringes at the thought of being in melee range, so he wants to do everything to get out of it, and cryes, when melee asks for tools to get into said 4m range.

Currently number of tools for ccing melee >> tools for gap closing, staying in range.
Good thing for you most fights don't start at 30m.

Caelrie's Avatar


Caelrie
01.26.2012 , 08:11 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Tyestor View Post
Not sure if serious. We have one charge on a 15 sec CD max 30m range 10m min range (obliterate is not a charge), one interrupt (that practically every other class has?) and two pins, both requiring to be speced for, both only in one tree, one requiring a channel and the other only with max 10m range.
Look at the CD on your interrupt, and now compare it to everyone else's. Notice anything different?

Quote: Originally Posted by Mujina View Post
I would be ok with NOT having a stun or knockback/knockdown if we are giving a root/snare breaking ability that lasts say 15 to 20 seconds on a 45 second to 1 minute cd, and another 20+ ranged attack or a way to insta refresh our charge.

Lets be clear here, never said maras or sents were bad at dps but in terms of pvp they need a few tools to be on par with every other class in the game.
This is a clear L2P issue. That class is deadly in skilled hands and brings unique utility to PvP. If you can't play it, it's you not the class.