Would this even make sense? I imagine you'd want an espionage agent to be sort of run of the mill, or at least able to blend in and I just can't picture someone navy blue with red eyes really fitting in with the Republic.

Chiss IA actually got their own special dialogue options in some cases.

Because people are aloud to RP or make any type of character they want?

I understand that and fully accept it, I could care less if someone plays whatever. It's just that I myself am having problems rationalizing it.

Chiss IA actually got their own special dialogue options in some cases.

Yeah, that's part of the reason I am thinking about making one.

Would this even make sense? I imagine you'd want an espionage agent to be sort of run of the mill, or at least able to blend in and I just can't picture someone navy blue with red eyes really fitting in with the Republic.

It wouldn't make sense for the reason you stated, but even more so because I don't see how could Chiss (a member of little-known civilisation) get into the most entrusted ranks of an isolationist, human-centred Empire.

When it comes to imperial agent (story-wise/lore-wise) I think that human is the only reasonable option.

It wouldn't make sense for the reason you stated, but even more so because I don't see how could Chiss (a member of little-known civilisation) get into the most entrusted ranks of an isolationist, human-centred Empire.

 

When it comes to imperial agent (story-wise/lore-wise) I think that human is the only reasonable option.

Actually Chiss isn't too bad an option for the Agent, the Chiss Imperium is active in this point in time, and only withdraw from galactic affairs because their allies the Sith are defeated. They only become isolationist later.

PS. How can they be human-centred, they are near-humans(very blue skin, pupil-less red eyes) not humans.

Would this even make sense? I imagine you'd want an espionage agent to be sort of run of the mill, or at least able to blend in and I just can't picture someone navy blue with red eyes really fitting in with the Republic.

They already broke the EU lore where Chiss were only discovered some years before the Clone Wars

Well, on Alderaan you can present yourself as adopted child of noble house. And it actually works.

Also, chiss are really rare in the Empire, and even more in Republic. For most of pub's you are just another weird alien. And Intellegence will probably give you good cover, actually explaining why you are not with imps (like on Balmorra).

And no, as long as you get results, Intellegence don't care about your species. Seriously, they have duros working in Citadel.

They already broke the EU lore where Chiss were only discovered some years before the Clone Wars

The Republic in TOR barely even knows the Chiss exist, only extremely high level officials know, so it could be conceivable that a minor(to the Republic) species information could be lost over the almost 4000 years.

Plus, for all we know there could have been obscure information in the Republic library Jorj and the others wouldn't have been privy to.

The Republic in TOR barely even knows the Chiss exist, only extremely high level officials know,

That and midranking Republic military personel stationed in tiny outposts in the middle of nowhere on Hoth, apparently.

Actually Chiss isn't too bad an option for the Agent, the Chiss Imperium is active in this point in time, and only withdraw from galactic affairs because their allies the Sith are defeated. They only become isolationist later.

 

PS. How can they be human-centred, they are near-humans(very blue skin, pupil-less red eyes) not humans.

I said that there is no way a Chiss could attain such a high rank (i.e. Cipher Agent) in an isolationist, human-centred Empire. I think it is pretty clear which empire I was talking about... the Sith Empire. A non-human/non-sith could be an informant perhaps, but surely not a Cipher (that is considering the established lore).

Maybe at the time of Makeb, when they released the restrictions, but the Imperial Agent in this game is pretty much from the "old school".

I said that there is no way a Chiss could attain such a high rank (i.e. Cipher Agent) in an isolationist, human-centred Empire. I think it is pretty clear which empire I was talking about... the Sith Empire. A non-human/non-sith could be an informant perhaps, but surely not a Cipher (that is considering the established lore).

 

Maybe at the time of Makeb, when they released the restrictions, but the Imperial Agent in this game is pretty much from the "old school".

Imperial Intelligence doesn't seem to possess the speciesism of the rest of the Empire quite so much; I think this might be because they generally act fairly independently of the Sith and their thing about blood purity, having to have enough freedom of action to clean up the messes the Sith make.

Imperial Intelligence doesn't seem to possess the speciesism of the rest of the Empire quite so much; I think this might be because they generally act fairly independently of the Sith and their thing about blood purity, having to have enough freedom of action to clean up the messes the Sith make.

Well if you observe throughout Agent storyline, the Imperial Intelligence uses a lot of alien informants and associates (Kaliyo for example). But those are not actually members of Imperial Intelligence they are merely disposable tools. Once you walk into the Imperial Intelligence headquarters on Dromund Kaas, you can't see a single alien. Also other agents you meet in the field (not just IA storyline) are exclusively human (Watcher X, Doctor Lokin, Watcher 8, Agent Veld, Fixer 66 and so on).

Well if you observe throughout Agent storyline, the Imperial Intelligence uses a lot of alien informants and associates (Kaliyo for example). But those are not actually members of Imperial Intelligence they are merely disposable tools. Once you walk into the Imperial Intelligence headquarters on Dromund Kaas, you can't see a single alien. Also other agents you meet in the field (not just IA storyline) are exclusively human (Watcher X, Doctor Lokin, Watcher 8, Agent Veld, Fixer 66 and so on).

Actually there is One alien in the Imperial Intelligence HQ, and he says they have a policy against aliens who can't speak basic, which is why he isn't a watcher. (I doubt they would promote an alien to watcher though)

On the whole they do see aliens as disposable tools, but Ciphers are dispossable tools too, just a bit less dispossable and a lot better trained. The way it's set up aliens have a harder time reaching any rank, but they prefer having skilled alien sabatours working for them, rather than against them. And at the beginning in the agency, Cipher is probably the highest rank any alien attains, they would never be watchers for example.

The main issue is whether the Sith and Imperials would allow an alien to gain any rank (also an issue with the Sith Inquisitor line), and it has to be said that unless they allow some to climb the ranks a bit, they could never build their empire. The numbers of Sith and Humans in the Empire is too small to fulfil every role, let alone with competent people, so they have to allow aliens to have some positions, but usually ones that will kill said alien (like a Cipher agent, not many survive long enough to retire).

I said that there is no way a Chiss could attain such a high rank (i.e. Cipher Agent) in an isolationist, human-centred Empire. I think it is pretty clear which empire I was talking about... the Sith Empire. A non-human/non-sith could be an informant perhaps, but surely not a Cipher (that is considering the established lore).

 

Maybe at the time of Makeb, when they released the restrictions, but the Imperial Agent in this game is pretty much from the "old school".

Obviously you are not attuned with the lore of SWTOR's time period. The Chiss are allies to the Empire, not slaves. Surely some Chiss would be made agents and officers in the Empire as a token of good will. Chiss aren't other aliens. They are allies. Get that straight.

Obviously you are not attuned with the lore of SWTOR's time period. The Chiss are allies to the Empire, not slaves. Surely some Chiss would be made agents and officers in the Empire as a token of good will. Chiss aren't other aliens. They are allies. Get that straight.

Not to mention, if the chiss are as xenophobic as in time of the movies, they most certainly wouldn't ally themselves with humans who think them as anything less than equals. Even if the Empire's leaders think that chiss are disposable alien scum, they better not let the chiss know about that, or the chiss would probably say "screw you" and go back to their Ascendancy - or worse, ally themselves with the Republic instead.

A quest on Balmorra more or less proves this. You have to cover up a muder of a chiss because the Empire can't let the chiss find out about it. The Empire doesn't want to anger the chiss, so the chiss get some positions in places like Intelligence and the chiss feel appreciated and respected, like they would be an expection to the "aliens are scum"-rule the Empire has going on.

Obviously you are not attuned with the lore of SWTOR's time period. The Chiss are allies to the Empire, not slaves. Surely some Chiss would be made agents and officers in the Empire as a token of good will. Chiss aren't other aliens. They are allies. Get that straight.

Well they are allies but that doesn't mean the Empire would take them into their own ranks. For example, two countires might be allies but they still don't let each others agent into their own ranks. That would be, quite frankly, stupid. On top of that, I see no reason why would a Chiss apply for a job in Empire in the first place... other than to spy on them for the Chiss. Not to mention the Empire saw its "allies" pretty much as pupets... Mandalorians and Chiss alike. At the end we can throw in the Empire's strong anti-alien policies and the case is closed.

Well they are allies but that doesn't mean the Empire would take them into their own ranks. For example, two countires might be allies but they still don't let each others agent into their own ranks. That would be, quite frankly, stupid. On top of that, I see no reason why would a Chiss apply for a job in Empire in the first place... other than to spy on them for the Chiss. Not to mention the Empire saw its "allies" pretty much as pupets... Mandalorians and Chiss alike. At the end we can throw in the Empire's strong anti-alien policies and the case is closed.

That is wrong. There are tons of Chiss NPC's that work in the Empire. Chiss is a race that is specifically in the game for Imperial Agents. They are the ones that get special dialogue options. And comparing to the Chiss and Mandolorians just proves you do not know what you are talking about. The Chiss are the Empire's only ally. They are the only one with independent home rule.

No, the case is not closed. You can say the Empire has anti-alien policies, but until you can directly relate that to the Chiss, your argument is built on sandstone.

Not to mention, if the chiss are as xenophobic as in time of the movies, they most certainly wouldn't ally themselves with humans who think them as anything less than equals. Even if the Empire's leaders think that chiss are disposable alien scum, they better not let the chiss know about that, or the chiss would probably say "screw you" and go back to their Ascendancy - or worse, ally themselves with the Republic instead.

 

A quest on Balmorra more or less proves this. You have to cover up a muder of a chiss because the Empire can't let the chiss find out about it. The Empire doesn't want to anger the chiss, so the chiss get some positions in places like Intelligence and the chiss feel appreciated and respected, like they would be an expection to the "aliens are scum"-rule the Empire has going on.

Yes, precisely. I often use the example of the Chiss diplomat. If a Zabrak died, basically nobody would care, yet with a Chiss, there is a possible scandal. It's interesting. So, comparing the two species is just not going to work, because they are different.

That is wrong. There are tons of Chiss NPC's that work in the Empire. Chiss is a race that is specifically in the game for Imperial Agents. They are the ones that get special dialogue options.

Give me examples of Chiss inside Imperial intelligence. I gave you example of human agents/fixers/watchers. Inside Imperial Intelligence headquarters there is no aliens. I have finished all 8 storylines and I have good memory. The only time that I saw Chiss inside Imperial Intelligence was on Sith Warrior, the name of that Chiss was Fawste. And even he was a republic spy.

And as I told you, even if they were allies on "equal terms" which they were obviously not... there is no way they would let each other's agents into their own ranks. It is not happening in real life between the allies either.

Give me examples of Chiss inside Imperial intelligence. I gave you example of human agents/fixers/watchers. Inside Imperial Intelligence headquarters there is no aliens. I have finished all 8 storylines and I have good memory. The only time that I saw Chiss inside Imperial Intelligence was on Sith Warrior, the name of that Chiss was Fawste. And even he was a republic spy.

No aliens? No aliens?

...

There is a Duro who is a Watcher. So what you say is false - completely false. There is also Chiss outside the bank in Dromund Kaas who is involved in that one quest where you have to keep meeting people with cryptic messages.

Anyway if I go back to the topic. Chiss agent does not make sense, despite seeing one or two in game. The example of two allied nations in real life, who surely do not let each other's agents into their ranks, alone is enough to safely dismiss this idea.

The way the Sith see it the Chiss imperium is subservient to them, they may be Allies but they are lesser allies who owe them fealty, this allows them to bring Chiss into the ranks.

Bear in mind that the Chiss were one of the original options for agent (you didn't have to unlock them, in fact I unlocked the Chiss race by playing a Chiss Agent). Also you see several examples of alien Agents in the game (not just Chiss), it becomes clear that the empire uses a lot of aliens in this manner.

And finally, this is Star Wars not real life, the force is preposterous, the Star Wars Hyperdrive has been disproven (it's not even theoretically possible), lightsaber defy physics, and the Biology of the various species makes no sense. So don't get hung up on the fact that that's not how we do things these days (although we did do it that way a few hundred years ago, most of Napolean's generals were foreign, including a future king of Sweden)

Well they are allies but that doesn't mean the Empire would take them into their own ranks. For example, two countires might be allies but they still don't let each others agent into their own ranks. That would be, quite frankly, stupid. On top of that, I see no reason why would a Chiss apply for a job in Empire in the first place... other than to spy on them for the Chiss. Not to mention the Empire saw its "allies" pretty much as pupets... Mandalorians and Chiss alike. At the end we can throw in the Empire's strong anti-alien policies and the case is closed.

How Emperor or the Empire sees it's allies isn't important. It's much more about what they let the chiss know. If chiss are similiar to the chiss in the time of the movies, the chiss are a very proud race. You tell the chiss they are alien scum, they laugh, call you human scum and then describe how much better they are than humans or any other alien race. And unless the alliance is placed on mutual namecalling, the Empire has to be on it's best behaviour not only to keep the chiss on their best behaviour but also to keep peace between these two allies.

It could be that the Empire is accepting any willing chiss (as a token of good will) to the lowest ranks and their trainings and the chiss like unnamed chiss officer on DK, Yudrass and IA made their way up from there by simply being better than anyone else. They might be the Thrawns of the Sith Empire.

The chiss inside the Empire could also prove useful as hostages if the Ruling Families of the chiss decide that they're done helping the Empire.

However, I doubt the Empire truly sees the chiss equal to them. In order to fight the Republic, the Empire has to be way bigger than the Chiss Ascendancy. It's not like an alliance between two countries in the eyes of the Empire: it's an alliance between a country and a village. They accept chiss to their ranks to be nice at them but don't necessarily think they're a serious threat. They are an useful ally the Empire don't want to annoy, but it's not like they could annihilate the Empire even if they wanted to.

Inside Imperial Intelligence headquarters there is no aliens.