Disciples of the Galaxy and Illuminatus merged.

We are now Illuminatus - so if you want to change the names it'd be cool.

Also we have completed Toborro's Courtyard HM 8man

And we've completed Toborro's Courtyard SM 16man

UPDATE: We are Republic side

Updated, sorry for the delay, i totally spaced you can't post/edit on the forums unsubbed

PS: Loggus, **** you

Corrupter Zero. Full mechanics kill too (no mine cheesing). Video coming. Forgot to start mine. :-S

Didn't realize there was a way to do the fight by cheesing mechanics. Would it be possible for you to elaborate on that?

Grats on your Server 3rd!

Updated, sorry for the delay, i totally spaced you can't post/edit on the forums unsubbed

 

PS: Loggus, **** you

Thanks Nollie, love you too.

Didn't realize there was a way to do the fight by cheesing mechanics. Would it be possible for you to elaborate on that?

The main differentiating mechanic in nightmare mode for CZ is the double mine, which causes a raid wipe if not cleansed one at a time. Nearly every guild that has cleared this fight (with the very outspoken exception of Hatred) cheeses this mechanic in some way. Some guilds stack everyone in melee range to eliminate the mine altogether. Most guilds stack almost everyone but put one person out, eliminating the second mine and the raid wipe mechanic but taking the first (basically turning the fight into hard mode with boss immunity on the adds).

We didn't stack on the boss primarily because we don't like using the group to LoS the adds. Thus, we had the double mine. Thought it was worth mentioning, since it's a very different strat.

The main differentiating mechanic in nightmare mode for CZ is the double mine, which causes a raid wipe if not cleansed one at a time. Nearly every guild that has cleared this fight (with the very outspoken exception of Hatred) cheeses this mechanic in some way. Some guilds stack everyone in melee range to eliminate the mine altogether. Most guilds stack almost everyone but put one person out, eliminating the second mine and the raid wipe mechanic but taking the first (basically turning the fight into hard mode with boss immunity on the adds).

 

We didn't stack on the boss primarily because we don't like using the group to LoS the adds. Thus, we had the double mine. Thought it was worth mentioning, since it's a very different strat.

(melee DPS perspective, so you can't really see the mines, but you can catch the debuffs in the raid frame).

It's a different strat, but I don't think it should be considered a "better" kill or "full mechanics" comparted to other strats. That's like saying that having someone grab Tyrans crystal and pointing Thundering Blast away from the raid is cheesing the cleave I didn't even realize you could stack everyone on the boss to clear both at once. I figured that would trigger the instakill. Anyways, enjoyed the vid. I always like watching different groups and their communication/coordination. G/L with Brontes!

It's a different strat, but I don't think it should be considered a "better" kill or "full mechanics" comparted to other strats.

Certainly not a "better" kill in any sense of the word.

It is "full mechanics" though in the sense that we actually have to deal with the raid wipe, whereas stacking everyone (or even all-but-one) on the boss simply deletes that mechanic from the fight. I think stacking on the boss falls somewhere between holding Gharj in the cave entrance (deleting the platform mechanic) and stacking your ranged DPS in the "sweet spot" for EC Kephess (avoiding the purple badness). Obviously, neither of those work anymore, but you get the idea. In other words, it's nothing I would consider to be unethical or dishonorable (any more than sitting in Kephess's sweet spot is unethical), but it most definitely removes a mechanic.

In any case, I'm not pointing fingers here. Different strats work better for different groups, and there are most definitely things you need to deal with in the stacking strat that you don't need to in our strat (e.g. the group needs to move as a whole to LoS the adds; also, the Anti-Grav circle of bad is harder to deal with).

The main differentiating mechanic in nightmare mode for CZ is the double mine, which causes a raid wipe if not cleansed one at a time. Nearly every guild that has cleared this fight (with the very outspoken exception of Hatred) cheeses this mechanic in some way. Some guilds stack everyone in melee range to eliminate the mine altogether. Most guilds stack almost everyone but put one person out, eliminating the second mine and the raid wipe mechanic but taking the first (basically turning the fight into hard mode with boss immunity on the adds).

 

We didn't stack on the boss primarily because we don't like using the group to LoS the adds. Thus, we had the double mine. Thought it was worth mentioning, since it's a very different strat.

(melee DPS perspective, so you can't really see the mines, but you can catch the debuffs in the raid frame).

If you'd like to consider that strat full mechanics, then I applaud your efforts!

That said, the devs clearly did not program the NiM mine to be truly random. If the developers didn't want people to have 100% control over which two people it lands on, then why would there be the proximity mechanic? It could just be programmed to hit any 2 people in the raid and be pure RNG.

Until the developers come out and say that one method exploits fight mechanics and that method proceeds to get patched out, no guild/individual in the game, including Hatred, should claim one method is "full mechanics" as opposed to another because they are not privy to what the devs intended.

Anyways, just voicing my opinion on the matter for the sake of a healthy, friendly progression debate (like I am sure you were) without any subtext.

Token Trandoshan of Compassion & Community:

Now onto clearing Brontes!

That said, the devs clearly did not program the NiM mine to be truly random. If the developers didn't want people to have 100% control over which two people it lands on, then why would there be the proximity mechanic? It could just be programmed to hit any 2 people in the raid and be pure RNG.

Given that all three healer classes in SWTOR are ranged (at least for their healing abilities), I really wish Bioware had done that. Any group composition, regardless of classes, can afford to put two people away from the boss without hampering the other things they need to accomplish. I would have really preferred it if two mines were forced to go out, preferring the farthest people from the boss. This would give groups a way to prevent the wipe (i.e. put at least one person away) without making the mechanic completely avoidable, since the distant player would still need to wait for the melee mine to get cleansed (about one GCD) before going in.

As it stands, the coordination needed to avoid the raid wipe and cleanse appropriately feels a bit cheap and artificial, since everyone is well aware that there are strats which eliminate the need for it.

Given that all three healer classes in SWTOR are ranged (at least for their healing abilities), I really wish Bioware had done that. Any group composition, regardless of classes, can afford to put two people away from the boss without hampering the other things they need to accomplish. I would have really preferred it if two mines were forced to go out, preferring the farthest people from the boss. This would give groups a way to prevent the wipe (i.e. put at least one person away) without making the mechanic completely avoidable, since the distant player would still need to wait for the melee mine to get cleansed (about one GCD) before going in.

 

As it stands, the coordination needed to avoid the raid wipe and cleanse appropriately feels a bit cheap and artificial, since everyone is well aware that there are strats which eliminate the need for it.

If your idea were to be implemented, then raids would just stagger two people out to draw both mines. As long as there exists some proximity mechanic than can be used to control mines, people will figure out an optimal way to take advantage of it.

The fact that different ways to clear a boss exist shouldn't cheapen or trivialize the coordination checks present in one strat vs. another. All current C-0 strats have both mines go out, and then both mines get cleared. The mechanic is fully present. Until the devs issue a statement or patch that says a certain strat is not intended, all strats that do not blatantly break a mechanic, like the hand exploit on Brontes, should be considered "full mechanics" if they address all mechanics that are present.

For example, is it "full mechanics" if you stack green puddles on Phase 2 NiM DGs so you never get red puddles? For the sake of a "full mechanics" clear on that fight, should the raid clear all greens before phasing to Kelsara to ensure all red circles spawn? Both strats have different coordination requirements, but one fully negates one mechanic (red circles) via control and a bit of luck during the 2nd phase, while the other puts an emphasis on positioning during the final phase.

In any event, grats on your clear with a different strat. The raid awareness and co-ordination will serve your group well.

Different strats work better for different groups, and there are most definitely things you need to deal with in the stacking strat that you don't need to in our strat (e.g. the group needs to move as a whole to LoS the adds; also, the Anti-Grav circle of bad is harder to deal with).

It's funny you mention that specifically cuz in AL we found the stacking and LoS just didn't work well for us. We tried that for a few weeks with little success. We've sense went to just dealing with things basically where they spawn and it's pretty much always a one shot now ... in HM of course.

C-Zero in NiM is easier than Nefra. Fight ain't much different from HM. Old PTS build of it used to be brutal. These days it isn't bad at all, especially since there's a lolburnphase that's basically a dummy kill at the end.

That's the only reason Aisthesis killed it :wink:

Lol jk

A more notable fact than then our silly strat was that we managed to get him up before the third (second?) Surprise leap and laser. That was a bit scary. I half expected him to do his whole 4 lasted thing and then nail us with the surprise laser after it Lol.

That's the only reason Aisthesis killed it :wink:

Lol jk

A more notable fact than then our silly strat was that we managed to get him up before the third (second?) Surprise leap and laser. That was a bit scary. I half expected him to do his whole 4 lasted thing and then nail us with the surprise laser after it Lol.

Regardless of the strats that were used, Grats to everyone on their progression thus far! Brontes is obviously the real test and I wish everyone the best of luck downing her

Freedom Warriors

Republic

5/5 for both 8 man HM Dread Fortress and Dread Palace.

5/5 for 8 man TFB HM

7/7 for 8 man S&V HM

1/1 for 8 man TC HM

Also, 1/5 for NiM Dread Fortress. Will add proof on Wednesday when we run it again.

Freedom Warriors

Republic

5/5 for both 8 man HM Dread Fortress and Dread Palace.

5/5 for 8 man TFB HM

7/7 for 8 man S&V HM

1/1 for 8 man TC HM

 

Also, 1/5 for NiM Dread Fortress. Will add proof on Wednesday when we run it again.

Will update as soon as I get back home today

Also is there a website for the guild?

Updated

Thanks for the update. Sorry I forgot a few things in my post. >.< Didn't see that the guild names were actually links to the guild websites.

Our website: Freedom Warriors

Also, forgot to take a picture with Nefra dead in NiM. I know, we're a mess. Will have to remember for next week.

Thanks for the update. Sorry I forgot a few things in my post. >.< Didn't see that the guild names were actually links to the guild websites.

 

Our website: Freedom Warriors

 

Also, forgot to take a picture with Nefra dead in NiM. I know, we're a mess. Will have to remember for next week.

Thanks for the quick reply, updated

Improper Heroes got Draxus NiM

screen shot: http://imgur.com/9d4OD8k

Republic Honor Guard:

Cleared Raptus on DP HM

Cleared Dread COuncil on DP SM

Cleared Brontes on DF SM