ChrisRedmond Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) EDIT- Are Pvp SPECS viable in Ops? I've got a Mercenary and also a Gunslinger, and on both toons hate the Middle DPS trees due to lack of maneuverability (sic?), and much prefer the right hand side tree (The PvP tree), due to the greater movement allowed. Are these 'PvP' builds viable in Hard Mode Flashpoints and Ops? Edited December 9, 2012 by ChrisRedmond Incorrect question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazchem Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 For Flashpoints & lower to mid tier Operations it really doesn't matter all that much what your build is. However, if you are talking about end-game operations, you want a talent build focused on putting out as much DPS as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonbgone Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 The middle tree for a gunslinger is useless. DF and SS are both viable in the endgame PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ms_Sunlight Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 I've got a Mercenary and also a Gunslinger, and on both toons hate the Middle DPS trees due to lack of maneuverability (sic?), and much prefer the right hand side tree (The PvP tree), due to the greater movement allowed. Are these 'PvP' builds viable in Hard Mode Flashpoints and Ops? What makes you think the "right hand tree" is the PVP tree? I run a Lethality sniper in end-game ops - the mirror of the Dirty Fighting gunslinger - and it's not only viable, it's got the edge on Marksmanship (the equivalent of Sharpshooter) in my opinion. You might distribute your points slightly differently within the tree for a PVE rather than a PVP build - as an example, a PVE slinger has no use for Flash Powder, Dirty Trickster and Dirty Escape whereas in PVP they're key survivability skills - but the right 5/5/31 build will make for super effective single target damage on operations bosses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyronamics Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) Depends on the fight. I've done virtually every ops as an assault commando. Only fight I've used gunnery on is kephess EC NiM because there really is no time to be mucking about fishing for procs. Edited December 9, 2012 by Gyronamics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) You can do all flashpoints as well as operations EV, KP on SM, HM and Nightmare as well as EC SM and TFB SM with the normal Engineering/Saboteur pvp specc, however on EC HM, Nightmare and TFB HM you need better DPS then that specc can give you. However it's all about your team. If you have three top DPS in your ops then you will be able to do EC HM + TFB HM and get off with it. Edited December 9, 2012 by RikuvonDrake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydexlic Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Pony up for field respec, be a subscriber, respec on the spot to fit the job at hand..profit etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisRedmond Posted December 9, 2012 Author Share Posted December 9, 2012 Thanks for the feedback guys. You have collectively answered my question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elear Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 You might want to rephrase question or even change name of thread, since many people don't read anything else(and I think you meant 'PvP specs", not builds). While skill tree on right side tends to have more pvp-related skills than other, it's not restricted to pvp, or better for it than any other(generealy speaking). If you want to have any other name for it, it's 'shared spec' as both AC of base class have access to it. As far as I know, all shared specs are viable, in some bases they are better than alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uniz Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 for dps generally you will have some wasted points for pvp in a pve build and visa versa. both trees are viable if geared, speced and played correctly. play style also plays a important role too. generally any hybrid healer build is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lord-durpp Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 what about those hybrid tankasin builds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchangelLBC Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 what about those hybrid tankasin builds? Awful for operations. Hybrid Tankasin builds in PVP are all about utility. Utility which doesn't really matter in PVE. In PVE you want full kinetic if tanking. If DPSing you'll want WAY more DPS than you can output in Hybrid spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xGBox Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) You just have to look at the skill tree and see if it's viable. Imagine fighting an operations boss. Because these are the fights that actually matter in PvE, you have to see if the skill points you've applied will actually make you more effective in a boss fight. For example, anything that grants or improves anything about slows, stuns, speed, sleeps, and stuff like that is, more times than not, useless in a PvE environment. While it's definitely useful in PvP, most boss fights in PvE will have immunity to such effects, which make your skill points worthless and could be better invested in other places. Please don't follow cookie-cutter builds from places like Noxxic to the T. Actually read what the skill does, then make a judgment call. That's how you get good. Edited December 10, 2012 by xGBox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonbgone Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 . Please don't follow cookie-cutter builds from places like Noxxic to the T. Actually read what the skill does, then make a judgment call. That's how you get good. This. You need to make your own judgement call. Places like Sithwarrior.com (part of MMO-mechanics) encourage discussion and make you think about what would be best in a big melting-pot of ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lord-durpp Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Awful for operations. Hybrid Tankasin builds in PVP are all about utility. Utility which doesn't really matter in PVE. In PVE you want full kinetic if tanking. If DPSing you'll want WAY more DPS than you can output in Hybrid spec.i was just wondering on that.. no that i have to worry, im full deception:rak_03: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anstalt Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I think the maximum DPS needed to beat a hardmode Ops boss is something like 1350/1400 DPS for the 4 main dps players (except on bosses like fabricator / kephess in tfb which both have massive debuffs). As far as I'm aware, every single DPS talent tree in the game is capable of reaching that level of DPS. However, some trees will have a harder time than others so at that point it's going to come down to gear/player skill. Good example of this is infiltration spec for shadows. Balance spec has higher sustained dps so is the usual go-to build for raiding, but infiltration is more bursty so is more for pvp. However, inf can pull 1600dps+ if played and geared correctly so it is more than capable of clearing all bosses in the game, it would just be easier if you respecced to balance. My advice would be the same as others though: fork out for field respec, be a subscriber and just respec depending on what content you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonMo Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 The middle tree for a gunslinger is useless. DF and SS are both viable in the endgame PvE. How is it useless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infalliable Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) Generally, any non-gimmicky PVP build will be okay for PVE. It's not optimal, but you can clear most content with it. The important thing is you're specc'd to fullfill one specific role and not be a hybrid (like a tank/dps hybrid), in general. How is it useless? It's not useless. It does tend to have lower single target damage than the other two though, but it's not that bad. Edited December 10, 2012 by Infalliable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonbgone Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 How is it useless? It's not useless. It does tend to have lower single target damage than the other two though, but it's not that bad. You're right, my use of the word useless was a hyperbole. The spec is awful compared to Marksman/Sharpshooter and Lethality/DF because it has not been able to put even close to the same numbers on the board in PvE Endgame. If you're a Sniper/Gunslinger and you're not close to the top then you're doing something wrong. I will say though that the spec does offer the highest energy regeneration rate out of any of them. Incendiary grenade is an 18 second stationary dot, bosses usually move around. There's also a lot of lost points to defensive stats. It does offer more survivability, but if you can do the mechanics at least halfway right in most of these operations then you don't need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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