EDIT:

To clarify, I am mainly seeking understanding. Although I am making some specific suggestions, the intent is to spark a discussion that grants better understanding of the various reasons that people play solo ranked. If you enjoy solo ranked, tell me why. I sincerely do not wish for something that many people enjoy to be taken away.

Foreword: I've been playing SWTOR since launch, first got into pvp during the recruit gear era. I consider myself a pvp player first and foremost (if not for pvp, I would have quit this game long ago), but I don't do ranked. Being that I don't do ranked, please forgive and correct me where I am mistaken. I am thinking on conceptual basis only - I don't pretend to have specific details worked out.

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With all the banter on these forums related to the recently announced ranked rewards, I can't help but wonder: what is the point of solo queue ranked warzones? Other than increased rewards and tracking wins and losses, what differentiates solo queue ranked warzones from regular warzones? Is the level of competition supposed to be higher? Based on all of the complaining about noobs in ranked, I tend to doubt it.

It seems to me that what people really want is balanced competition, even if for no other reward than the thrill of a good match. This can be achieved by two teams agreeing to face each other in an arena (forgive me if I am ignorant, but I believe this is what happens in group ranked). If two teams really enjoy competing against each other, they can do it over and over. This sort of atmosphere creates the potential for setting up pvp tournaments, which if EA/Bioware really want to make some pvp players happy, they could organize it, set up a live stream (for people around the world to watch), and have some unique prizes (sore subject, I know).

Now, the issue of ranked commendations. I don't see why we even need them. It's fine to have a second tier of gear, but just make the second gear tier cost more regular comms. Obviously, the potential for win trading is always there, but that can be eliminated if the only rewards are the thrill of a good match. Yes, I am saying get rid of rewards from group ranked, other than credits. If you want to gear up, run regular warzones. If you want good matches, get friends, put together a team, and go for ranked against teams that you know are on your level.

I'm sure that I have botched some details, but I really don't get ranked solo. Please enlighten me. Thanks!

TL;DR

I don't get solo queue ranked. Why not eliminate it, give the players the ability to set up matches that are for fun only, make it so that comms can be earned via regular warzones only. Set up tournaments, huttball leagues, etc and we may really have something! Give UNIQUE rewards to team winners of tournaments.

Despite raging at the bads in Solo Ranked, even though we're a rare breed some of us simply like ranked arena more than regular warzones.

And what you're suggesting is basically Group Ranked, but not ranked. It would be a good implementation and would train teams to actually queue for group ranked.

It's the USA's new weapon to eventually invade Europe.

By making half the population kill themselves out of frustration first.

I would say, that for the most part, it gives people better competition than the standard queue in warzones do. Let's face it, anyone can queue in unranked, and to be fair, so can anyone in solo ranked, but most people are smart enough to realize there is a gear issue and won't queue. I can't help the dumb ones.

I would also say that at least in terms of solo ranked, you do get consistent enemies. What I mean by this is 4dps vs 4dps, 3 dps 1 heal vs 3dps 1 heal, or the ideal 1 tank, 2dps, 1 heal vs the same.

The only things I would say or suggest are 1) have to be max expertise to queue for ranked solo. 2) remove bolster from ranked. Thus no cheese gear. You'll have to have earned it to be there. 3) make the queues 4v4 and 8v8. I would suggest the same for group ranked as well. Possibly even making a spearate huttball league since we will be getting another huttball arena.

Despite raging at the bads in Solo Ranked, even though we're a rare breed some of us simply like ranked arena more than regular warzones.

And what you're suggesting is basically Group Ranked, but not ranked. It would be a good implementation and would train teams to actually queue for group ranked.

People like arenas?! I've never heard of this before.

People like arenas?! I've never heard of this before.

As I said, we're a rare breed. Though there's quite a few in our guild.

Guess we're just not as vocal as the thousands of crybaby's saying they hate it.

As I said, we're a rare breed. Though there's quite a few in our guild.

Guess we're just not as vocal as the thousands of crybaby's saying they hate it.

Well honestly, no matter how you look at it...Ranked Arenas are better than sitting in a Ranked Novare Coast for 25mins before one team fully caps mid...and I honestly prefer Solo Ranked Queue more than Group Ranked.

Solo Queue actually tests your skill level in a spontaneous situation. It forces you to adapt to whatever situation you may face and also forces players to generally become better at making decisions that will affect the match. In Group Queue, you can tell people and warn them about what you plan on doing, in Solo Ranked it's up to each player to figure our the risks of whatever actions they might take and they'll eventually figure out what to do and what playstyle to adopt based on their allies and enemies.

I find that Solo Ranked, with equally skilled players in both teams, is much more rewarding player experience-wise and skill-wise compared to a Group Ranked.

As I said, we're a rare breed. Though there's quite a few in our guild.

Guess we're just not as vocal as the thousands of crybaby's saying they hate it.

And yes, I expect people to argue that the same thing applies to NiMs but the NIMs are atleast a natural step in raid progression, something more or less every PvE'er participates in, and as levels caps are increased they become accessible to more people. Arenas are due to their nature not part of PvP progression and, once again, highly disliked by the vast majority of players.

So based on the assumption that BW doesnt have one team for Arena and one for 8 vs 8 I'd say that the resources would come to better use in 8 vs 8. Add ranked and rewards to what the majority actually like and play instead of forcing them into grinding a game mode that is a pain, regardless of outcome.

We tried that! Did you? Did you ever try solo queue 8 vs 8 ranked? No, no one ever did. And let me tell you, it would be far more balanced than yolo Q Arena, where it's extremely hard for one talented player to carry but at the same time ridiculously easy for a clueless person to throw the game.

Well honestly, no matter how you look at it...Ranked Arenas are better than sitting in a Ranked Novare Coast for 25mins before one team fully caps mid...and I honestly prefer Solo Ranked Queue more than Group Ranked.

 

Solo Queue actually tests your skill level in a spontaneous situation. It forces you to adapt to whatever situation you may face and also forces players to generally become better at making decisions that will affect the match. In Group Queue, you can tell people and warn them about what you plan on doing, in Solo Ranked it's up to each player to figure our the risks of whatever actions they might take and they'll eventually figure out what to do and what playstyle to adopt based on their allies and enemies.

 

I find that Solo Ranked, with equally skilled players in both teams, is much more rewarding player experience-wise and skill-wise compared to a Group Ranked.

Solo ranked with equally skilled players in proper comps happens about every 1 game in 50 though those ARE fun... if it was good games all the time i'd queue up more but... it really isn't the case its usually down to bads on your team with no gear and no clue queueing, working like mad to carry them through it hoping for a win, being facerolled... or the other team having that and you facerolling them.. usually with 4 dps vs 4 dps.. If it isn't that wins/losses are usually down to some other stupid reason like one of the teams havinga tank which the game considers there spec to be dps while the other team doesnt.. hybrid healers.. i could go on.. i don't see the fun in it really..

Not to mention the massive faction imbalance and having one faction with all the ranked activity..

Foreword: I've been playing SWTOR since launch, first got into pvp during the recruit gear era. I consider myself a pvp player first and foremost (if not for pvp, I would have quit this game long ago), but I don't do ranked. Being that I don't do ranked, please forgive and correct me where I am mistaken. I am thinking on conceptual basis only - I don't pretend to have specific details worked out.

---------------------------------------

 

With all the banter on these forums related to the recently announced ranked rewards, I can't help but wonder: what is the point of solo queue ranked warzones? Other than increased rewards and tracking wins and losses, what differentiates solo queue ranked warzones from regular warzones? Is the level of competition supposed to be higher? Based on all of the complaining about noobs in ranked, I tend to doubt it.

 

It seems to me that what people really want is balanced competition, even if for no other reward than the thrill of a good match. This can be achieved by two teams agreeing to face each other in an arena (forgive me if I am ignorant, but I believe this is what happens in group ranked). If two teams really enjoy competing against each other, they can do it over and over. This sort of atmosphere creates the potential for setting up pvp tournaments, which if EA/Bioware really want to make some pvp players happy, they could organize it, set up a live stream (for people around the world to watch), and have some unique prizes (sore subject, I know).

 

Now, the issue of ranked commendations. I don't see why we even need them. It's fine to have a second tier of gear, but just make the second gear tier cost more regular comms. Obviously, the potential for win trading is always there, but that can be eliminated if the only rewards are the thrill of a good match. Yes, I am saying get rid of rewards from group ranked, other than credits. If you want to gear up, run regular warzones. If you want good matches, get friends, put together a team, and go for ranked against teams that you know are on your level.

 

I'm sure that I have botched some details, but I really don't get ranked solo. Please enlighten me. Thanks!

 

TL;DR

I don't get solo queue ranked. Why not eliminate it, give the players the ability to set up matches that are for fun only, make it so that comms can be earned via regular warzones only. Set up tournaments, huttball leagues, etc and we may really have something! Give UNIQUE rewards to team winners of tournaments.

This sounds like absolute hell. Eliminate more pvp content? You must be trolling.

Is there any part of your brain that honestly believes that a system where people just go around asking other people trying to find "good competition" would ever function in the environment of an mmo? Sry ain't gonna happen.

Personally I do ranked solo because

a) The stats are tracked. You wins and loses are tracked. How good you are is no longer a nebulous concept that is 80% a fictional manifestation of your own ego trying to come to terms with how much worse you really are than you believe. Obviously solo queue has a massive amount of randomness associated with it but good players tend to (but not always) rise to the top.

b) It's a lot harder than you'd think to find a good group of guys/girls who both get along and can compete at a decent level against other 4 man teams. Not to mention 4v4 queues aren't always reliable

c) It IS much much higher competition that wzs could ever be. I find that players doing solo ranked genuinely do care about playing at a high level and therefore putting 4 randos together usually (but not always) ends up fine. Sorry but to a lot of players 8 man warzones just aren't that fun.

Taking content away from a game imo is never a good idea. I'm actually a little upset that you would even bring this up. Even a whisper of taking away solo queue might drive the crazies at bioware to do something rash. If there's one thing they love more than putting inane crap on the GTN, it's taking things away from pvpers

Solo ranked with equally skilled players in proper comps happens about every 1 game in 50 though those ARE fun... if it was good games all the time i'd queue up more but... it really isn't the case its usually down to bads on your team with no gear and no clue queueing, working like mad to carry them through it hoping for a win, being facerolled... or the other team having that and you facerolling them.. usually with 4 dps vs 4 dps.. If it isn't that wins/losses are usually down to some other stupid reason like one of the teams havinga tank which the game considers there spec to be dps while the other team doesnt.. hybrid healers.. i could go on.. i don't see the fun in it really..

 

Not to mention the massive faction imbalance and having one faction with all the ranked activity..

I dunno the situation on ToFN but on The Shadowlands (lol PvE-server) the games are usually tight...I mean, we may all be bads, that's totally possible but usually (70% of the matches) people have a clue as to what to do.

Solo Queue actually tests your skill level in a spontaneous situation. It forces you to adapt to whatever situation you may face and also forces players to generally become better at making decisions that will affect the match. In Group Queue, you can tell people and warn them about what you plan on doing, in Solo Ranked it's up to each player to figure our the risks of whatever actions they might take and they'll eventually figure out what to do and what playstyle to adopt based on their allies and enemies.

 

I find that Solo Ranked, with equally skilled players in both teams, is much more rewarding player experience-wise and skill-wise compared to a Group Ranked.

Solo ranked has nothing to do with skill, even less than normal WZs. You will get PvE geared, clueless and leavers. This "adapt to situation" is nice, but how can you adept to an ally sorc healer with 27K HP and 1,700 expertise, and the other side has a fully decked ops healer. I played around 30 games in solo rnked and winning is nothing but cheer luck of which team has less idiots. Skill only factors in when the games are competitive, and out of 30 games I played, these were less than 5.

You want high rating? Play on the faction that is winning on your server so you get less clueless on your team.

So based on the assumption that BW doesnt have one team for Arena and one for 8 vs 8 I'd say that the resources would come to better use in 8 vs 8. Add ranked and rewards to what the majority actually like and play instead of forcing them into grinding a game mode that is a pain, regardless of outcome.

 

We tried that! Did you? Did you ever try solo queue 8 vs 8 ranked? No, no one ever did. And let me tell you, it would be far more balanced than yolo Q Arena, where it's extremely hard for one talented player to carry but at the same time ridiculously easy for a clueless person to throw the game.

Haha. Just a quick warning. There will be 10x as much QQ on the forums about bads in 8v8 Solo Ranked than there ever will have been in Solo Ranked Arenas. The bads in normal-type warzones are 10x as bad in arenas. And EVERYBODY will want to join those.

/wrist

Rating (and rewards) should only be given to group Q ranked.

Agreed.. or at least if they are going to rate it.. change the system so they rate it on individual player performance relative to the other players on the team so i don't have to worry about losing 20 rating because of being on a team with 3 26k sages... and give seperate rewards for solo and group.

Rating (and rewards) should only be given to group Q ranked.

This.

YOLOQ should just be a way to get comms if you dont like warzones or want to try out alts.

Haha. Just a quick warning. There will be 10x as much QQ on the forums about bads in 8v8 Solo Ranked than there ever will have been in Solo Ranked Arenas. The bads in normal-type warzones are 10x as bad in arenas. And EVERYBODY will want to join those.

/wrist

It doesnt really matter what you meant because one of the biggest flaws with Arena is that ELO doesnt work, due to the fact that only a few like it. 8 vs 8 ranked wouldnt have that problem. Hell, it might just have replaced normal 8 vs 8, in terms of being the "go to queue".

I always thought it was just meant to be a quick way to get ranked comms.

Almost solely this.

But also to practice your ability to carry.

There is now (and always has been, more or less) almost twice as many people on the solo ranked leaderboards as there is on the group ranked leaderboards. I don't think I'm mincing words when I say that doing away with solo ranked matches would be the mother of all bad ideas.

The simple truth is that we tried a fashion of group ranked before and it was a complete and dismal failure. Forcing players to form their own groups and schedule matches against an opponent is quite frankly more hassle than most players are willing to undertake. Some might say that the addition of four-man ranked has alleviated that inconvenience and they're not entirely wrong, however again I cite the numbers of players on each leaderboard. Even assuming some overlap, you would be ostracizing at least half of the ranked player base by removing that queue.

Yes, I understand that some people will complain about being teamed with bad players. That will always happen; it's a form of psychological coping. However, the answer is not to do away with a whole queue. The answer is to suggest that those players unhappy with the talent pool in the solo queue form their own premade instead. They will more than likely be much happier with a close-knit team of players who they can trust. If, however, it turns out that they can't or won't join a premade of their own . . . well, that is an answer in and of itself. The truth of the matter is that the odds of them always ending up with bad players and their opponents good players is unlikely. Hopefully, they'll learn to communicate better with their teams -- the best way to improve your talent pool is to teach and hope those lessons get passed on.

Haha. Just a quick warning. There will be 10x as much QQ on the forums about bads in 8v8 Solo Ranked than there ever will have been in Solo Ranked Arenas. The bads in normal-type warzones are 10x as bad in arenas. And EVERYBODY will want to join those.

/wrist

And again the proper response is, "Make your own premade." Everyone has an equal chance of getting stuck with a bad player or a good player. If they don't like that they can join a group of their friends and play with people they trust.

My intent was not so much to make any suggestions on changing things (although I implied it by making specific suggestions...sorry about that), I was mainly seeking understanding. I think that I better understand why many people like solo queue ranked now, so thank you all for your input.

I am still inclined to stay away from ranked, because if I really want to track stats, I can do it myself. I could take a screen capture of the results of every regular match and have very detailed stats. I've been thinking about doing this, actually, and compiling a spreadsheet over time - could be interesting.

There may be improved competition at times in ranked, but it sounds like it can just as often be an extremely frustrating experience. I can get the same thing from regular warzones (good matches at times, frustrating at others).

The only remaining carrot is the ranked comms. I can still get those by doing a 3:1 trade with regular comms, although it means that I will spend three times longer getting gear. I have some obroan on three different characters, never managed to go all the way with any of them. As it stands, I will probably never have a full set of top tier gear, but I am OK with that. I like the short queue times of regular warzones and I am more comfortable in a slightly more casual environment. I get the feeling that the atmosphere in ranked is more hardcore, which I am not. That's not to say that I am bad and don't want to get better. I'd just prefer to not care as much if I am having an off match or if my teammates are being ID-ten-Ts.

To each his own.

Despite raging at the bads in Solo Ranked, even though we're a rare breed some of us simply like ranked arena more than regular warzones.

This!