Hey Folks,

 

After the feedback gathered here, I wanted to tack on 2 more things we are planning on doing for the next patch refresh. Please consider these when adding feedback from this point on!

 

* Shapeless Spirit will now additionally make Mass Mind Control grant the Assassin 15%/30% damage reduction for 6 seconds

* Haunted Dreams whirlwind cast time reduction will only apply if the Assassin is rocking Lightning Charge

 

 

I still sort of want to do something with standing near your own Phase Walk for Madness Assassins in raids, but I'm 100% sure what, yet.

We're getting a small survivability buff.

We're getting a small survivability buff.

 

30% DR is not small. Every 45 seconds is considerable when you tack on the extra damage madness is getting plus the insta whirlwind. Actually binding the DR to MMC is pretty ingenious. Usually when a good player gets taunted he switches targets, but now the player being taunted is forced to attack the assassin or switch and deal 30% less anyway.

Edited May 2, 2014 by AGSThomas

It's actually also a really nice addition to PVE for if something goes wrong and a dps needs to pick up the boss. Pop Deflection and AOE taunt, and you'll survive for at least 6 seconds, which is long enough for the tanks to get back into a good position to handle the boss again. It gives us a small ability to actually off-tank in Madness.

30% DR is not small. Every 45 seconds is considerable when you tack on the extra damage madness is getting plus the insta whirlwind. Actually binding the DR to MMC is pretty ingenious. Usually when a good player gets taunted he switches targets, but now the player being taunted is forced to attack the assassin or switch and deal 30% less anyway.

Considering Madness still has a ramp-up time, unlike Deception in conjunction with Blackout, which can burst in that time period - it is not as big as you think. Especially when tied to taunt.

I hope they actually remove the threat potion from our tauntfor DPS, a la jugg DPS, instead of making me aoe taunt everything into aggroing on me as a squishy DPS.

No matter how much reduction they give us, it will not be enough for this spec. It is a DoT melee with light armor. The TTK is too long for us to stay in melee range. They either need to make the TTK similar to deception, give us DCDs similar to marauder as well as some burst, or make us ranged like the sorc. Nothing short of those things will save this spec. If they don't want to do this, I would prefer they just raise the damage so we can use it in PvE and concentrate on perfecting deception. Any of these "feel good" changes are nothing more than a waste of everybody's time.

I'm curious to try this out. I'm sad insta whirlwind is only lightning charge, but I suppose it's still better to get it back for that tree than not at all.

 

Personally I would like to see a unique Maul proc added to Madness somewhere since they don't want to move Duplicity back down. I think adding a Maul proc would be fun, useful and help separate us more from Madness sorcs. I'm just not sure exactly what a unique proc to Madness should do. I'm better at playing the class than I am talking about what abilities should do or not do.

I hope they actually remove the threat potion from our tauntfor DPS, a la jugg DPS, instead of making me aoe taunt everything into aggroing on me as a squishy DPS.

 

Yea, i hope that works out like that too, it would be stupid if it didnt.

I like the detaunt with taunt aoe finally a drop aggro wihtout counting force cloak.

 

Btw nice buffs to balance, especially for assassinate at 30%+.

 

i have a question (never played balance):

 

looking on dulfy's guide on rotation they put:

 

force breach -> melee hit X -> sever force

 

why?

 

they both deal dmg over 18s so if if we start FB->SF we'll need to re-apply them on the same sequence: (FB->SF)

It's because the DoTs correlate to Force supression/death mark. Being it part of the main rotation, they're limited in what they can use. In its current form, there's no use for shock/project or maul/shadow strike.

 

So I believe it's more of having to use something, rather nothing.

we are able to burn all 15stacks of force suppression. didin't get your asnwer, sorry Edited May 2, 2014 by IInox

It's because the DoTs correlate to Force supression/death mark. Being it part of the main rotation, they're limited in what they can use. In its current form, there's no use for shock/project or maul/shadow strike.

 

So I believe it's more of having to use something, rather nothing.

 

I guess you have a point, but it's more a factor of this:

 

Imagine, if you will, an 18 second rotation. Every 2nd and 4th ability are Discharge and Creeping Terror. Death Field has a 15 second cooldown. Every 5 rotations, Death Field will return to its original position in the rotation, but it will otherwise rotate through every odd numbered move. Leaving the space between Discharge and Creeping Terror means you don't have to delay one to apply Death Field.

Hmmm I hope they can address that with a valid use of another move perhaps, that doesn't effect force usage so much.

I guess you have a point, but it's more a factor of this:

 

Imagine, if you will, an 18 second rotation. Every 2nd and 4th ability are Discharge and Creeping Terror. Death Field has a 15 second cooldown. Every 5 rotations, Death Field will return to its original position in the rotation, but it will otherwise rotate through every odd numbered move. Leaving the space between Discharge and Creeping Terror means you don't have to delay one to apply Death Field.

 

aaa now i got it just on last try at dummy I saw that sometimes I had to reapply fb then FIb up. thanks.

Someone on the PTS ended up parsing Madness: http://www.torparse.com/a/662042

 

Someone else did it in the 86(?) gear and hit 4100 I think.

Someone on the PTS ended up parsing Madness: http://www.torparse.com/a/662042

 

Someone else did it in the 86(?) gear and hit 4100 I think.

 

M-Nightraider (Buff-Shadows Plz) did a parse in a mix of Dread Forged and Dread Masters gear on his Balance Shadow in went just over 4k dps. Later on we found that the buffs to Mind Crush (Crushing Darkness) aren't actually happening, cheating him out of 250 dps...

 

However, the devs have promised the Assassinate Proc + 100% proc chance for Raze, so I expect that the DoT boosts are going to be toned down a little, considering Balance Shadows, when they get their bug fixed, with the RNG on Raze procs, and without the assasinate proc, are on par with Watchman Sentinels -_-

I hope they actually remove the threat potion from our tauntfor DPS, a la jugg DPS, instead of making me aoe taunt everything into aggroing on me as a squishy DPS.

 

What is the point of attatching it to the aoe taunt?? I could maybe see them not wanting to give force camo to juggs, but I see NO reason for them to be doing this to assassins... Instead they can give assassins the same ability sorcerers have as an aggro drop(cloud mind I think?) and attatch any specced into damage reduction to that instead(they did this for powertechs long ago) it would offer all possible playstyles, but doesn't restrict anything like it would to add it to your aoe taunt would

What is the point of attatching it to the aoe taunt?? I could maybe see them not wanting to give force camo to juggs, but I see NO reason for them to be doing this to assassins... Instead they can give assassins the same ability sorcerers have as an aggro drop(cloud mind I think?) and attatch any specced into damage reduction to that instead(they did this for powertechs long ago) it would offer all possible playstyles, but doesn't restrict anything like it would to add it to your aoe taunt would

 

Well, now MMC drops agro, so problem solved.

Edited May 3, 2014 by DarthSylar

Well, now MMC drops agro, so problem solved.

 

No that, was my entire point now you can't use it for a taunt anymore and it restricts game play

No that, was my entire point now you can't use it for a taunt anymore and it restricts game play

 

ah, ok, I get it now. keep in mind, it's tied to our AOE taunt, but we still have a singe target taunts for those O ****! moments.

No that, was my entire point now you can't use it for a taunt anymore and it restricts game play

 

How often do you really use your AoE taunt in PvE as a DPS Sin right now?

In my progression group guardian DPS has to stance switch a lot for AOE taunting in tricky situation. Shadows cannot practically switch stance while in combat. It's just stupid taking away AOE taunts from DPS specs limiting possibilities of creative gameplay.

How often do you really use your AoE taunt in PvE as a DPS Sin right now?

 

 

It will be extremely rare, but one good example is on second set of dismantlers in Draxus fight. DPS may need to AOE taunt of the tank there depending on tactics and DPS levels.

It will be extremely rare, but one good example is on second set of dismantlers in Draxus fight. DPS may need to AOE taunt of the tank there depending on tactics and DPS levels.

 

Then adjust your tactics and get your DPS up to where it should be.

 

You're seeing it too much as a given, while really what you're doing at that point is just cheesing out the boss.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Evolixe

force breach -> melee hit X -> sever force

 

why?

 

they both deal dmg over 18s so if if we start FB->SF we'll need to re-apply them on the same sequence: (FB->SF)

 

Force in Balance has a 15 s cooldown. So, relative to the two dots, it moves two spots earlier in the 12 GCD (= 18 sec) rotation each time. You can put an open spot for it between the dots so you never have it come off cooldown exactly when you're going to refresh one of the dots. (Of course, this is only relevant if you're doing a steady rotation for more than a minute and fifteen seconds.)

 

Edit: Oops, didn't realize this was from a few pages back and was already answered.

Edited May 3, 2014 by cxten