Sorry Helig.

Guardian main, Vigilance in regs, tank in rateds, Smash while doing dailies.

Smash isn't quite as good as you're trying to make it sound. Its main purpose is clearing packs during dailies and stomping players who don't know how to counter it. No trouble against Smash on my alts, unless Lightning sorcs and Gunnery commandos are suddenly Smash counterclasses, along with Snipers...

Smash requires at least 3 abilities to do that.

Ooh, three.

Ooh, three.

You can't do 10k+ with 3 button presses? On what dps class/spec?

You can't do 10k+ with 3 button presses? On what dps class/spec?

0/0/0 spec level 10 Sage

To be fair, Smash frontloaded damage is very good - especially if not handled properly by the opposing team. The only instant autocrit alpha strike spec there is. Offset by multiple factors, of course - factors that contribute to its coutnerability.

0/0/0 spec level 10 Sage

Pretty sure 3x lightning with bolster will exceed 10k

Guardian main, Vigilance in regs, tank in rateds, Smash while doing dailies.

 

Smash isn't quite as good as you're trying to make it sound. Its main purpose is clearing packs during dailies and stomping players who don't know how to counter it. No trouble against Smash on my alts, unless Lightning sorcs and Gunnery commandos are suddenly Smash counterclasses, along with Snipers...

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

That's stupid...

No it's not.

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

Any set of good players with dps classes will stomp a team full of bad players. Bolster has not fixed this yet.

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

Teamwork should be countered by teamwork. Guard, Taunt, CC, positioning. Granted, you can't expect that reliably in regs, but coordinated Smashers also aren't really a common sight there. Not to mention that 90% of PuG smashers are FOTM, meaning they aren't really good, to say the least.

Between Smashes, the only real threat from this spec, damage-wise, is Ravage which hits like a truck thanks to the 9% post-Smash buff (even more for Juggs, thanks to the 10% talent), followed by a Scream, which isn't half as scary as Carnage scream. And Ravage is not hard to stop. Other than that - utility. Juggs/Guards get free AoE slows after jumps, Marauders get single target slows, and cone slow dual LS throw, group buffs or taunts respectively.

Seriously, a good Carnage player is a lot more dangerous, in my experience. Relatively easy to CC but pretty hard to get away from, and he's not limited by Smash cooldown to cut you down - and he is no longer limited by Gore cooldown, because of execute+gore reset procs.

So tired of easymode in this game.

Wait!! There is a hardmode? Let me know what it is cause these MMOs have very little skill involved compared to FPSs. I've maxed every AC and there is no class that is hard. I think smash monkeys are very diffucult. Cause it is a melee class and when people kite you there is little chance to win. So a smashmonkey needs to outwit every ranged class when they kite. The only class that never beat me 1v1 was a sage/sorc. But with elecrtic binds and bubblestun, I bet you could beat me pretty easily.

But lets be constructive. The best way to kill them is to play as one. You will learn so many techniques on how people will kill you and learn it isn't an "easy mode" after all. You will also learn what abilities they have and their cooldowns. I had to because my I was getting wrecked Pre2.0 by them.

Wait!! There is a hardmode? Let me know what it is cause these MMOs have very little skill involved compared to FPSs. I've maxed every AC and there is no class that is hard. I think smash monkeys are very diffucult. Cause it is a melee class and when people kite you there is little chance to win. So a smashmonkey needs to outwit every ranged class when they kite. The only class that never beat me 1v1 was a sage/sorc. But with elecrtic binds and bubblestun, I bet you could beat me pretty easily.

 

But lets be constructive. The best way to kill them is to play as one. You will learn so many techniques on how people will kill you and learn it isn't an "easy mode" after all. You will also learn what abilities they have and their cooldowns. I had to because my I was getting wrecked Pre2.0 by them.

Disagree about FPS requiring more skill than MMOs. And I've been a Counterstrike, and Quake II-III city champion back in my day. Different skillsets, different types of awareness, etc.

But I do otherwise agree on the second part of this post. A lot of people just don't know how to counter smashers. The easiest way to learn how is to play one yourself. Get your arse handed to you a couple of times, learn the shortcomings of smash, learn to use them to your advantage.

Just a reminder:

Can't really take someone's post about "OP" abilities seriously when they refuse get better/use proper tactics.

"Rise to our opponents" Pfft bite me.

I've got plenty more of those. /end thread

Here is an idea, learn to counter smash. I play gunnery commando and operative lethality, I fear no smasher. I don't know enough specifics about the other classes so I won't make any conjectures there, but as a commando, even if they leap to me and get a smash in, i've got a solid chance of getting away or killing them. Here is the basic model for countering smash assuming worst case scenario for both classes:

Gunnery Commando:

1) get leaped and eat a full force smash for 10k

2) Turn on shield

3) stock strike root

4) turn on advance the line and run backwards away while ignoring any slows

5) activate tech overrides, pop a medical probe followed by a grav round + demo round while on the run

6) electronet

7) full auto

8) begin standards rotation, if you did this right you're 20m away and they are at half health. A good smasher will pop his reflect move, just cast another self heal while he gets to stand there and look stupid. Vs. Marauders keep your finger on the stealth scan, the instant they vanish drop it on them to not let them escape. This isn't a surefire way to kill a smasher but it gives you fighting chance

Lethality operative:

1) eat a leap + 10k smash

2) debilitate

3) start casting heals, most smash monkeys will break your cc to interrupt.

4) flash grenade.

5) Apply poisons (doesn't break flash nade)

6) apply explosive probe (doesn't break flash nade)

7) apply orbital strike

8) adrenaline probe to recover energy

9) restealth

10) preform the most unholy opening burst in the game 3k probe + 3k orbital first hit + 3k hidden strike followed by 2-4 3-7k culls

11) laugh maniacally

Here is an idea, learn to counter smash. I play gunnery commando and operative lethality, I fear no smasher. I don't know enough specifics about the other classes so I won't make any conjectures there, but as a commando, even if they leap to me and get a smash in, i've got a solid chance of getting away or killing them. Here is the basic model for countering smash assuming worst case scenario for both classes:

 

Gunnery Commando:

1) get leaped and eat a full force smash for 10k

2) Turn on shield

3) stock strike root

4) turn on advance the line and run backwards away while ignoring any slows

5) activate tech overrides, pop a medical probe followed by a grav round + demo round while on the run

6) electronet

7) full auto

8) begin standards rotation, if you did this right you're 20m away and they are at half health. A good smasher will pop his reflect move, just cast another self heal while he gets to stand there and look stupid. Vs. Marauders keep your finger on the stealth scan, the instant they vanish drop it on them to not let them escape. This isn't a surefire way to kill a smasher but it gives you fighting chance

 

Lethality operative:

1) eat a leap + 10k smash

2) debilitate

3) start casting heals, most smash monkeys will break your cc to interrupt.

4) flash grenade.

5) Apply poisons (doesn't break flash nade)

6) apply explosive probe (doesn't break flash nade)

7) apply orbital strike

8) adrenaline probe to recover energy

9) restealth

10) preform the most unholy opening burst in the game 3k probe + 3k orbital first hit + 3k hidden strike followed by 2-4 3-7k culls

11) laugh maniacally

THIS right here is the problem. Have you ever played a ranked warzone? Feels like all classes are balanced around 1v1 in reg warzones...

THIS right here is the problem. Have you ever played a ranked warzone? Feels like all classes are balanced around 1v1 in reg warzones...

1v1 smashers are at a disadvantage vs most specs of most classes. Many smash haters do not understand this. Still others pay lip service to it without believing it (because they may have lost a 1v1 vs a smasher at some point - smashers do not automatically lose every 1v1). One of the tradeoffs of the weak 1v1 performance is that in team games with support and vs groups that refuse to spread out smashers can (but do not always) top the damage boards (as can mercs, sorcs, snipers, etc). I don't see the problem and I could probably write a book about the argument from either pov.

15% damage and healing for 15 sec and speed buff + defense buff sound pretty good to me.

that's not specific to focus though

THIS right here is the problem. Have you ever played a ranked warzone? Feels like all classes are balanced around 1v1 in reg warzones...

I do not play ranked because I have neither the gear, time, nor team for it. That said, I play with some guildies in normal every once in a while and we face premades that like to stack 2-3 smashers very often. I never have a problem with them. Like you said, spread out, or spread them out, and its no big deal. Honestly, i'm more scared of a team that has 2-3 good sneaks than a team that has 2-3 good smashers. I hate to say it but it seems to me that smashers are only good for countering 3 things, sage healers, commando healers, and bads.

THIS right here is the problem. Have you ever played a ranked warzone? Feels like all classes are balanced around 1v1 in reg warzones...

Problem? Where? Some specs are more 1v1-oriented, others are more team-oriented. Working as intended, I believe.

5 pages for the trolliest mcbadbad QQbebe on these airwaves..

/bravo

and for those that actually might be serious about this

/l2kitetheezestspectokite

I might actually get serious about this if anyone has a real reason why, in the post 2.0 world, sweep/smash is OP'd. I have yet to hear one...

I might actually get serious about this if anyone has a real reason why, in the post 2.0 world, sweep/smash is OP'd. I have yet to hear one...

It slaughters noobs. Retribution Paladin syndrome. Quite enough to cause public outcries.

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

Shame force healers can't speed around, use an immunity barrier, or self-heal. And Meds/Sawbones, they drop from just an angry emote, poor souls.

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

Your problem isn't that smash is "OP" it is that you are not smart enough to move out of the range of smash. When I see a bunch of smashers crowding me on my sorc take a guess what I do. OVERLOAD AND RUN AWAY!!!! If you stand there and try to heal through it you deserve to go down fast. Learn to play the game that exists now instead of hoping they will change the game to your playstyle. That is just childish.

It can be OP when its a team of smashers playing ring-a-round the healer = big smash bomb ever 3-5 seconds from one of them.

so in equal numbers its fine

when focused one one squishy target, it's op!

WHO WOULDA FIGURED