No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

 

Which part are you finding most difficult, the first boss?

No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

 

I don't know what are you talking about, mate.

Run BoR yesterday - last boss was beaten with first try.

I guess you are addressing problem with adds on this boss.

I have to agree with you on this. Adds must be nerfed down. One thing that comes in mind is removing their bleed effect completely.

And this must be done simply becouse of bad design. Healers cannot cleanse this stuff. And this is gamebreaking mistake.

Combine it with EXTREMELY bad server updates (in order to survive you must jump like and idiot) and we have a clear sign that Bioware doesn't know what they are doing.

Don't forget some AoE markers from bosses are actually smaller than what is the explosion radius. I think Shae Vizla has this and some rockets in the last boss fight falls on the edge of the cross dealing damage outside the cross. It's not that much, but it can be the difference between life and death there.

No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

 

Ok, so first, please stop assuming that gear makes a difference in stuff like this. It doesn't. There are very very very very very few fights in the game where gear is a deciding factor. If you stand in evil circles and the evil cross, and ignore the adds as they kill your healer, it doesn't matter if you are in 224 gear or 22 gear, you are going to fail this fight. Assuming that gear makes a difference in anything other than basically NiM (and a very few of the HM operation bosses) is a sure-fire way to never try to improve yourself.

 

2nd, if you explain where you are dying, and what is causing your groups to wipe, people on here can help you. Is your healer strangely dying all of a sudden when the adds show up? It everyone losing 50% of their health in one hit? Or is everyone losing their health in 25% chunks, but about 3 or 4 seconds apart from each hit? If so, there are solutions.

1. Mess up the adds. Either use an aoe knockback, an aoe stun, or an aoe attack (mortar volley is great for the assasins).

2. Make sure people are getting out of the cross, and that they jump once they are out of it (forces the server to update).

3. Same as 2, get out of circles (as the fight goes on, more circles show up under peoples feet, so when that happens, people need to keep moving). May help to seperate the field into quarters so that people don't drop circles on each other. Also, thinks like entrench and hydrualic overrides don't work here. They may stop you from getting knocked down, but you will still take damage. Just get out of the circle!

 

Anyway, hopefully the above will help you, as I believe they are the 3 most common causes of wipes in Rishi HM. But if it is something else, let us know and we can help you with that too!

I don't have many issues in this FP but then again my groups usually have enough DPS so that the last boss only summons the "easy" adds that don't deal too much damage. And I have had to heal away plenty of damage from blue AOEs; if you die to that, it's a healer problem unless your group stands in every single blue area.

 

Not saying that the flashpoint is not overtuned; it is certainly among the harder flashpoints. BioWare has already nerfed Blood Hunt so they'll probably nerf this one and the final boss on Tython sooner or later as well. But until then, the flashpoint is beatable as long as you have players who know a little bit what they are doing.

No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

 

your first mistake is assuming that gear matters. it does not. "for the rest of you" they introduced bolster. i know that that it is not what you want to hear, but that is the plain truth of it. hm fp, especially the later ones, require skill and even the best gear will not substitute. knowing your rotation, attacking adds when they spawn, and not standing in stupid is all that is required to complete that flash point. it is one of the harder fp, and it requires everybody in your group to do the same, so if even 1 other player is not, then you are going to fail with them. beyond that, there isn't really much i can say here to help you, since your post is more rant than real ask for help. try telling us exactly when you fail, and you will probably get some specific help.

Edited August 12, 2016 by sumquy

I doubt the op wants to improve. He simply found something he is not able to faceroll through like the rest of the game, so it has to be bugged, imbalanced or whatever, obviously.

 

If that isn't the case, op, ask away and many people will be glad to give you advice, including me.

 

 

But seriously, this came up so often now that it's not even entertaining anymore. Back in 3.0 people claimed that you NEED 192 gear, at least, to do this. I have a video of me and a my guildies clearing this in 178 gear at that time. But well... bads searched for other excuses:rolleyes:

I just ran the flashpoint today, they really nerfed the first and second bosses. The red beams from the first boss only deal like 900 damage a piece, and the voids on the second boss deal 0 damage at all - they only stun you. What the hell?

 

Interestingly enough, the final boss is as hard as ever, so I'd say the problem is just that the final boss is too difficult compared to the rest. Before, at least the first and second boss could kill you if you did something stupid but now... I really hope that this is not what Ben Irving meant with making group gameplay more approachable to new players in this week's podcast interview.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Jerba

In my experience it often comes down to "I avoided most of the AoE attacks" vs "I avoided all the AoE attacks and killed the adds before they got the healer."

 

I was in a group that failed to clear this, and consistently the 2 dps would eat a missile or cross and I had to spam heal them back up, well right after I got them back up from their mistake then the adds came out....

 

It's not that hard to avoid all the attacks Mr/Mrs damageismyreligion, all you have to do is be willing to cut a Ravage or some other channeled attack short. Can you do this? What, you refuse to stop treating the Walker like an Operations Dummy? You expect me to heal your Mara/PT through +100k damage over 20 seconds while healing the tank?

 

Do you ever do HM FPs or SM/HM Ops on your healer? You don't have a healer? <sarcasm> What a shock! </sarcasm>

In my experience it often comes down to "I avoided most of the AoE attacks" vs "I avoided all the AoE attacks and killed the adds before they got the healer."

 

I was in a group that failed to clear this, and consistently the 2 dps would eat a missile or cross and I had to spam heal them back up, well right after I got them back up from their mistake then the adds came out....

 

It's not that hard to avoid all the attacks Mr/Mrs damageismyreligion, all you have to do is be willing to cut a Ravage or some other channeled attack short. Can you do this? What, you refuse to stop treating the Walker like an Operations Dummy? You expect me to heal your Mara/PT through +100k damage over 20 seconds while healing the tank?

 

Do you ever do HM FPs or SM/HM Ops on your healer? You don't have a healer? <sarcasm> What a shock! </sarcasm>

 

Lol, that's been my experience trying to get this dumb FP done for the event (using a healer for it). I even got booted by a tank wearing a mishmash of sub 140 leveling gear and his dps buddy that kept thinking I should be able to heal both of them through standing in crosses and circles AND tank the adds myself. "cuz heals no good!@!!1"

The problem with this fight is the adds hit a little too hard, and the position checking is done server side(horrible decision ). People need to learn to jump once they are out of the aoe. Aside from that, this fight tests player competence. So when you fail, it is because someone in your group didn't do what they should. Gear has nothing to do with any HM flashpoint boss. Some fights can't be cleared in a group with lower levels, this is not one of them as the boss as no enrage timer and most damage is avoidable.

I agree with this, and I want the Devs to actually goto the last boss with a healer and 2 dps in 208 gear lvl 65 and a damn lvl 50 tank in crap 180 gear and do this boss. NO toon under lvl 65 should be able to que for HM FP's . HM FP'S ARE MEANT TO GET YOU OPERATION STARTER GEAR FOR STORYMODE OPERATIONS.

 

And a answer or reply to these messages would be nice Musco.

Edited August 13, 2016 by Berlain
adding

No, like don't get me wrong - if you have all-elite gear and an all-elite team, I hear that it *IS* win-able.

 

How about for the rest of us?

 

Like, I'm sorry - I have yet to get all-elite gear and sometimes my guild can't sport an all-elite team; Asides from this, can we make this HM FP win-able?

 

Sorry to ask after 2+ years with the same problem, but I actually *play* the game. Can we make it win-able?

 

NOT sorry for the test-players who can auto-gear themselves for this HM FP to win - but can the rest of us on the live-servers actually be given a shot, at this?

 

NOT sorry for anyone who has been able to perfectly win this HM FP since Day 1 with uber-gear; How about the rest of us?

 

 

 

I dont get these ppl. Im doing HM fps for achievments now and i mostly end up getting a pop for last boss Battle of Rishi ***! We then oneshot it and its done, I dont get it.

 

People need to level up, learn their class and the fight, its easy. I did it now even for the even with my healer, with empty xp gear, low hp, its easy as fck!!

NO toon under lvl 65 should be able to que for HM FP's . HM FP'S ARE MEANT TO GET YOU OPERATION STARTER GEAR FOR STORYMODE OPERATIONS.

.

 

Wot, sm is bolstered as well as hm fp... lol y would you need gear

It is winnable on HM. It's winnable on HM, even in a PUG.

 

So, lets be honest about the gear-thing without bragging about how "easy" it is. BoR final fight is not very mistake friendly. If you know the mechanics, you can clear it *cough* "easy." I doubt the people saying it is easy cleared it the first time they tried. They learned.

 

So here is where gear comes in... BoR isn't very forgiving of mistakes and there's not a lot of reaction time when you need to do something (like... get the adds or get out of the blue circles). When you make a mistake, it hits pretty danged hard. As a healer who pugged this one for DvL, I will just say that your gear level makes a difference when you make a mistake. It makes a difference whether or not I need to burst or HoT you back to health, which makes a difference in my resource management, which makes a difference if another person makes a mistake soon after yours.

 

I'm not talking about "elite" gear. Just... not empty shells with empty slots in a PUG. I don't care if people queue in empty gear in Athiss or Hammer... but when we're talking about gear in this thread and others, let's be honest about the less-forgiving FPs. Unless you are executing the mechanics FLAWLESSLY, that extra bump from gear allows you some room to recover. So if you're queuing for BoR, BH or Manaan... just get the recommended gear-level already, which I think is 208. What else are you going to spend all those common crystals on?

 

As for BoR... IMO, it's actually a really fun fight, both on dps and healing (I haven't tanked it, so I don't know about that one.) But, as I said, it is unforgiving and people shouldn't panic over one or two wipes, as long as your group is a) recognizing where the mistakes are b) fixing them.

Lol, that's been my experience trying to get this dumb FP done for the event (using a healer for it). I even got booted by a tank wearing a mishmash of sub 140 leveling gear and his dps buddy that kept thinking I should be able to heal both of them through standing in crosses and circles AND tank the adds myself. "cuz heals no good!@!!1"

 

What!! You mean gear does make a difference like someone else stated it did not. I am shocked! Sarcasm off!!

I just ran the flashpoint today, they really nerfed the first and second bosses. The red beams from the first boss only deal like 900 damage a piece, and the voids on the second boss deal 0 damage at all - they only stun you. What the hell?

 

Interestingly enough, the final boss is as hard as ever, so I'd say the problem is just that the final boss is too difficult compared to the rest. Before, at least the first and second boss could kill you if you did something stupid but now... I really hope that this is not what Ben Irving meant with making group gameplay more approachable to new players in this week's podcast interview.

Yes, the final boss is the source of frustration for us "retarded noobs". I've never beaten it since I returned to this game. Whenever I take all the adds while tanking the boss, i got melted and the healer can't heal me through. If I let the dps deal with em, the healer didn't last 3 seconds. Idk if it's my fault or the healer, or even the DPS anymore.

 

The first two bosses however, we could beat it even with my lv 50 Theron as the healer.

Whenever I take all the adds while tanking the boss, i got melted and the healer can't heal me through. If I let the dps deal with em, the healer didn't last 3 seconds. Idk if it's my fault or the healer, or even the DPS anymore. .

 

Just use aoe stun on them and let the blue cross do the rest of the job. Use pulls, pushes/knockbacks on them and you'll be fine.

Yes, the final boss is the source of frustration for us "retarded noobs". I've never beaten it since I returned to this game. Whenever I take all the adds while tanking the boss, i got melted and the healer can't heal me through. If I let the dps deal with em, the healer didn't last 3 seconds. Idk if it's my fault or the healer, or even the DPS anymore.

It's definitely the fault of the healer. Now, a tank can make a healer's job easier but any healer who can't survive longer than 3 seconds from add damage doesn't know how to use his cooldowns.

It's definitely the fault of the healer. Now, a tank can make a healer's job easier but any healer who can't survive longer than 3 seconds from add damage doesn't know how to use his cooldowns.

 

I can't think of any adds in HM boss fights that are as hard-hitting as these ones. They don't drop in the same places, sometimes they're a little weaker but more numerous, sometimes they're those two really strong ones. The healer can only do so much when they have to panic heal both the tank and dps that take circle/cross damage (healer's fault?), and THEN deal with the adds immediately targeting them (because they're panic healing, getting too much threat because of slow or non-acting dps (healer's fault?)) I can heal through almost everything in HM FPs, even with derps, except this fight unless all three players absolutely know what to do and what not to do (Vizla in BH being the only boss in HM I've been unable to get through with a pug).

I can't think of any adds in HM boss fights that are as hard-hitting as these ones. They don't drop in the same places, sometimes they're a little weaker but more numerous, sometimes they're those two really strong ones. The healer can only do so much when they have to panic heal both the tank and dps that take circle/cross damage (healer's fault?), and THEN deal with the adds immediately targeting them (because they're panic healing, getting too much threat because of slow or non-acting dps (healer's fault?)) I can heal through almost everything in HM FPs, even with derps, except this fight unless all three players absolutely know what to do and what not to do (Vizla in BH being the only boss in HM I've been unable to get through with a pug).

 

in a general sense no healer should ever be panic healing. In that regard, if a healer is panicking it's definitely something they can improve upon. Add management is also something a healer should be well versed in from how to use their defensives, to how to survive ( example being on a scoundrel: stealth out, flash bang, dirty kick, leg shot roll away or who their target should be for trick move). In a similar vein DPS should be well aware of how to deal with adds quickly, how to crowd control, how to stun, how to do mass damage. All players should understand the value of not getting hit by "stupid".

 

It is a fight where you can't have people who just simply ignore mechanics. The fight requires people to hold themselves accountable. If team members can't, then they should be removed from the group. It's a crappy solution, but if all else fails (letting them know what they did wrong, to just simply not having the numbers) it becomes the only solution.

Edited August 15, 2016 by Shwarzchild

in a general sense no healer should ever be panic healing. In that regard, if a healer is panicking it's definitely something they can improve upon. Add management is also something a healer should be well versed in from how to use their defensives, to how to survive ( example being on a scoundrel: stealth out, flash bang, dirty kick, leg shot roll away or who their target should be for trick move). In a similar vein DPS should be well aware of how to deal with adds quickly, how to crowd control, how to stun, how to do mass damage. All players should understand the value of not getting hit by "stupid".

 

It is a fight where you can't have people who just simply ignore mechanics. The fight requires people to hold themselves accountable. If team members can't, then they should be removed from the group. It's a crappy solution, but if all else fails (letting them know what they did wrong, to just simply not having the numbers) it becomes the only solution.

 

You're right, generally. And panic healing doesn't come from the healer just wanting to panic heal, it comes from more than just the tank taking massive amounts of damage. Instead of dropping what I'm doing and screaming into chat at the dps and sometimes tank for doing dumb things, I try to heal through it, and offer suggestions afterwards. The primadonna healers are kind of like that--they'll start screaming before the fight's over. I've been through so many situations where panic healing still got through all the derp. This happens to be a fight you simply can't expect the healer to heal through everyone ignoring mechanics, as you said.

 

I'm in favor of keeping the mechanics as they are. People should learn them and I don't believe they should be changed. But again, this is the only fight in HMFPs where the adds hit as hard as they do. And maybe it wouldn't be an issue if the adds on opposite sides of the platform spread out their initial threat, instead of dogpiling the healer if they don't get touched the very micro-instant that they touch the ground.

You're right, generally. And panic healing doesn't come from the healer just wanting to panic heal, it comes from more than just the tank taking massive amounts of damage. Instead of dropping what I'm doing and screaming into chat at the dps and sometimes tank for doing dumb things, I try to heal through it, and offer suggestions afterwards. The primadonna healers are kind of like that--they'll start screaming before the fight's over. I've been through so many situations where panic healing still got through all the derp. This happens to be a fight you simply can't expect the healer to heal through everyone ignoring mechanics, as you said.

 

I'm in favor of keeping the mechanics as they are. People should learn them and I don't believe they should be changed. But again, this is the only fight in HMFPs where the adds hit as hard as they do. And maybe it wouldn't be an issue if the adds on opposite sides of the platform spread out their initial threat, instead of dogpiling the healer if they don't get touched the very micro-instant that they touch the ground.

 

It's not just adds dogpiling the healer, it's adds dog piling the healer after someone barely makes it to the shield (usually because they run the wrong way) and because someone hesitated before moving out of the blue cross.

 

If both dps are at 20% health when the adds come up, I can either heal them and let the tank die, or heal the tank and hope they don't take anymore damage.

 

Of course, they would only be at 20% if they screwed up... so it's really a matter of all the other HM FP final bosses being too easy and creating a laziness enabling environment.

I might have an issue with the phrase "panic healing" since that implies, to me at least, over reacting. When things go haywire, I don't consider what I do at that point panicking. Maybe it's just a word usage thing. I just kind of go down my list and say "ok haywire situation 1: do this...things still wonky? do this. Things still wonky? do this." If I get to that level then I just know there's nothing to do but accept the wipe and go into the next pull. It's also about prepping for me though. If the adds are coming out, I'll make sure I'm ready to get to it asap. If blue circles are what's coming I have a plan in place already. If it's cross, plan implemented. The biggest thing I see with healers is they react to the damage instead of proactively get ahead of it. And, that philosophy doesn't change regardless of difficulty level of content. Edited August 16, 2016 by Shwarzchild