G0-T0's yacht can't escape with the interdictors there and all the Sith need to do is capture an Hk-50 droid and get it to tell them where the yacht is, via torture, they are not totally loyal, they do give up information, case in point:

Once one of the droids do give up it's position or a rendezvous point, the Sith cruisers will turn that glorified pleasure yacht into just another hollow vessel joining the graveyard of Malachor V.

I'm not sure anyone really knows how to torture droids other than droids. I mean, I'm just saying, EV-9D9 was a droid too. But I see your point.

However, there won't be a rendezvous point. G0-T0 figures they'll be killed in the blast. Also, Interdictors only prevent lightspeed travel in that system. G0-T0 can easily fly out farther from the planet and to the edge of the solar system, then escape.

Traya's Assassins create paranoia. G0-T0's HKs do not because of the simple fact that Traya's servants are bound to her and consumed by darkness.

What?

If G0-T0 says "Hey look everybody! You know that one series of assassin droid, you know, the most dangerous in our galaxy? Yeah, I've actually been mass producing those for years! Anyone want out?" I think that's gonna make people think twice about betraying G0-T0.

They have no idea what Traya's assassins are, and frankly they seem more like a myth than anything. The threat of HKs is all too real and something underworld figures know to fear.

*Rubs temples*

 

I am trying to be pleasant, but you're being awfully abrasive.

 

I did bring this up early on in this Kaggath, and I suppose I will again. This is the least biased evaluation of the HK unit's power you will ever find. I promise.

 

---

 

We can compare the HK-50s to the HK-51s:

 

 

So the HK-51's were upgraded versions of the HK-50s in accuracy and defense. (Which doesn't mean the HK-50's weren't plenty good in both already.)

 

So any abilities the HK-51's have in SWTOR can be translated to the HK-50's here, with a debuff to accuracy and a lower armor rating. That's what I got for their combat effectiveness.

*rubs temples*

According to wookie, that quote is from TSL cut content, not SWTOR, so any abilities they had in TSL are what they have, not what HK-51s have in SWTOR.

2) Follow me here: it took 4 PCs from SWTOR to take on HK-47. Companions suck compared even to PCs, maybe 1/2 or 1/3 of their strength. 4x3=12, 4x2=8, so it could take anywhere between 8-12 51s to beat someone not even of Kreia's power but a comparable example. But we're not talking 51s, we're talking 50s, meaning it would take quite a few more for Kreia to even break a sweat.

I'm not sure anyone really knows how to torture droids other than droids. I mean, I'm just saying, EV-9D9 was a droid too. But I see your point.

The Hk-51 didn't seem to be enduring the pain exactly when my Inquisitor blasted it with force lightning

However, there won't be a rendezvous point. G0-T0 figures they'll be killed in the blast. Also, Interdictors only prevent lightspeed travel in that system. G0-T0 can easily fly out farther from the planet and to the edge of the solar system, then escape.

There is only one way in or out of the Malachor system(Which has no sun and only three planets), that's partly why the Mandalorians chose it to make their final stand.

In-fact one of the tactics that was reported was the Mandalorians trying to close off the one way hyperspace route with interdiction vessels of their own, so they could trap as many Republic vessels as possible and destroy them in the system.

*rubs temples*

 

According to wookie, that quote is from TSL cut content, not SWTOR, so any abilities they had in TSL are what they have, not what HK-51s have in SWTOR.

 

2) Follow me here: it took 4 PCs from SWTOR to take on HK-47. Companions suck compared even to PCs, maybe 1/2 or 1/3 of their strength. 4x3=12, 4x2=8, so it could take anywhere between 8-12 51s to beat someone not even of Kreia's power but a comparable example. But we're not talking 51s, we're talking 50s, meaning it would take quite a few more for Kreia to even break a sweat.

Note Blaze, I wouldn't use game mechanics and saying 4 guys are needed to take on one droid. That just seems sort of ridiculous, there is no doubt that in the lore 4 guys confronted HK-47 but...4 of em are just overkill especially when 2 are powerful sith lords.

What?

 

If G0-T0 says "Hey look everybody! You know that one series of assassin droid, you know, the most dangerous in our galaxy? Yeah, I've actually been mass producing those for years! Anyone want out?" I think that's gonna make people think twice about betraying G0-T0.

 

They have no idea what Traya's assassins are, and frankly they seem more like a myth than anything. The threat of HKs is all too real and something underworld figures know to fear.

While G0-T0 can make his own people fear him, he can't do the same to Traya's forces. Traya on the other hand can make the Exchange fear her (or at least her assassins).

The threat you can't see is greater than the threat you can, in this battle at least. The 'anonymity' of the Assassins is a boon to the fear factor in my opinion. You don't know where they are, you don't know what they are, and they could kill you at anytime. That would certainly freak me out.

In addition to this, the fact that G0-T0 could use the HKs as a tool for intimidation makes betraying him sound like a more beneficial prospect. Not many people like to be ruled by an Iron Fist, especially criminals. If G0-T0 starts going around saying "Work for me or die!" people won't respond well. Like you and Garfield have noted in the past, criminals and underworld types want to be free. If G0-T0 starts putting pressure on them, guys like Visquis will be easier to recruit for Traya. All she has to do is say that the Sith will leave the Exchange be if Visquis/other Exchange cohort helps her take down G0-T0. And Traya is quite the manipulative witch, convincing a few criminals shouldn't be too difficult for someone like her.

Note Blaze, I wouldn't use game mechanics and saying 4 guys are needed to take on one droid. That just seems sort of ridiculous.

no, it's a valid and comparative way to scale their power. None of the main PCs' companions are as strong or are ever depicted to be as strong as the PCs themselves.

And it's not just any droid but the infamous jedi-killing assassin droid of Revan's design, who accompanied Kreia and the Exile and definitely was no pushover.

hold on, Warren, let's pretend for a moment that your HK quote is canon. That's the assessment of HK-51s when the HK factory is found, not when they're developed and produced (and eventually lost) alot of things can change in 200-300 years with a droid model.

Do you have an alternative source? If not, we can assume this is cannon, because, despite it being cut content, it is still cannon.

The whole point is that the HK-51s were lost for like hundreds of years and then found on Ilum....

You asked for my unbiased evaluation of the HK's battle effectiveness. I gave one. What's yours?

no, it's a valid and comparative way to scale their power. None of the main PCs' companions are as strong or are ever depicted to be as strong as the PCs themselves.

And NPC mobs, including Sith lords and the like, are not as powerful as companions. So by your logic, HK-50s can defeat pretty much every foot soldier. War droid. And Sith. Huh.

And it's not just any droid but the infamous jedi-killing assassin droid of Revan's design, who accompanied Kreia and the Exile and definitely was no pushover.

That's the same droid that was remade out of HK-50 parts....

In addition to this, the fact that G0-T0 could use the HKs as a tool for intimidation makes betraying him sound like a more beneficial prospect. Not many people like to be ruled by an Iron Fist, especially criminals. If G0-T0 starts going around saying "Work for me or die!" people won't respond well. Like you and Garfield have noted in the past, criminals and underworld types want to be free. If G0-T0 starts putting pressure on them, guys like Visquis will be easier to recruit for Traya. All she has to do is say that the Sith will leave the Exchange be if Visquis/other Exchange cohort helps her take down G0-T0. And Traya is quite the manipulative witch, convincing a few criminals shouldn't be too difficult for someone like her.

But unless someone has an example of when these Sith Assassins have actually done anything, they'll remain just a myth. G0-T0 can easily claim that any death caused by the Sith Assassins was actually just him eliminating someone who joined Traya's side. Traya isn't exactly a propanganda machine. G0-T0 knows how to rule a crime syndicate.

And G0-T0 doesn't have to say "Work for me or die." He can stage a betrayal, have his HKs kill the traitor, and plaster it all over Nar Shaddaa. In other words, don't betray the Exchange. And these people in power are unlikely to give up their positions in the first place. They have power and want to keep it.

And I don't think Traya meeting with anyone in person is such a great idea.

That's the same droid that was remade out of HK-50 parts....

yes because the HK vocabulator is really what did those protocol droids on the Harbinger over

no, it's a valid and comparative way to scale their power. None of the main PCs' companions are as strong or are ever depicted to be as strong as the PCs themselves.

 

And it's not just any droid but the infamous jedi-killing assassin droid of Revan's design, who accompanied Kreia and the Exile and definitely was no pushover.

I never said anything about companions, the 4 PC's confronted HK-47 yes...but to say all 4 of them were needed to kill him? No. It doesn't matter that HK-47 is a jedi killing assassin droid, he is still a droid and besides his track record hasn't been steller thus far. Infact, what Jedi has he killed anyway that is proof, hard proof names and all? He has knowledge of hunting them yes, but any droid can be downloaded with information and spew it out like a computer.

Do you have an alternative source? If not, we can assume this is cannon, because, despite it being cut content, it is still cannon.

 

The whole point is that the HK-51s were lost for like hundreds of years and then found on Ilum....

 

You asked for my unbiased evaluation of the HK's battle effectiveness. I gave one. What's yours?

what are you talking about? HK-51s under the Empire's control were lost for a decade and then turned up on Belsavis. How were these 51s constructed? how much tweaking would have been possible within those 300 years? do you really, honestly believe that if someone found the HK-51 schematics they wouldn't try to make some improvements before producing a shipment of them -for the Sith Empire-?

kotor 2 is my unbiased evaluation of the HK's battle effectiveness. They got roflstomped at every turn.

You say what Sith Assassins do is a myth, yet what have HK50s done besides pose as a protocol droid to stalk 1 jedi? nothing, lol. They're not nearly as powerful as you think, especially if the HK-51s are anything to go off of.

You say HK-47 was reconstructed from HK-50 parts. That's true, HK-50 parts were compatible and in some cases the same as HK-47. Were they as strong as HK-47? Undoubtedly no.

And yeah, an HK-50 could probably take a couple of goons. that's about it.

what are you talking about? HK-51s under the Empire's control were lost for a decade and then turned up on Belsavis. How were these 51s constructed? how much tweaking would have been possible within those 300 years? do you really, honestly believe that if someone found the HK-51 schematics they wouldn't try to make some improvements before producing a shipment of them -for the Sith Empire-?

The HK-51s were already done and being made in KotOR II, were they not? They is no evidence they chaged during that time. What I believe doesn't matter. There's no evidence to the contrary.

kotor 2 is my unbiased evaluation of the HK's battle effectiveness. They got roflstomped at every turn.

Grade-A analysis right there. Dat logic.

You say what Sith Assassins do is a myth, yet what have HK50s done besides pose as a protocol droid to stalk 1 jedi? nothing, lol. They're not nearly as powerful as you think, especially if the HK-51s are anything to go off of.

They're built to be the deadliest assassin droids in the galaxy. And G0-T0 has eliminated his opponents, or those that don't support the Republic's growth, before. Whether that was through HK-50s or not I don't know. But regardless, they're well known and intimidating.

You say HK-47 was reconstructed from HK-50 parts. That's true, HK-50 parts were compatible and in some cases the same as HK-47. Were they as strong as HK-47? Undoubtedly no.

And why not, then? They are upgrades of HK-47, right?

And yeah, an HK-50 could probably take a couple of goons.

Thank you sweet baby Jesus.

They're built to be the deadliest assassin droids in the galaxy. And G0-T0 has eliminated his opponents, or those that don't support the Republic's growth, before. Whether that was through HK-50s or not I don't know. But regardless, they're well known and intimidating.

They're not well known! How could they be? The way they do their job is by being secretive and posing as harmless protocol droids. One was being carried on a Republic cruiser under this guise, it's how they work.

HK-50s may talk about wanton slaughter, and delight in death, but they are not battle droids. They are capable of killing, but under controlled circumstances. They can shoot down unarmed shuttles with rockets, gas helpless miners, kill their target with a sniper rifle, or sneak into a facility and sabotage it from within, but they do not storm the breach and go in guns blazing when they can help it.

Their obscurity is the reason for their effectiveness as assassins, they are only known to those few who have employed them. Which would be the Sith and G0-T0 after he found them... so he's pretty much facing the only other people in the galaxy aware of their nature.

If he goes around showing them off and using them as a cudgel to intimidate his goons, that essentially ruins their effectiveness as assassins, and he might as well just use them as door guards at that point.

.

 

 

They're built to be some of the deadliest assassin droids in the galaxy.

Some of not THE.

Some of not THE.

What, during this time, is deadlier?

They're not well known! How could they be? The way they do their job is by being secretive and posing as harmless protocol droids. One was being carried on a Republic cruiser under this guise, it's how they work.

 

If he goes around showing them off and using them as a cudgel to intimidate his goons, that essentially ruins their effectiveness as assassins, and he might as well just use them as door guards at that point.

The HK series is plenty well known... I assume. I don't know, maybe they're not. But they very well could be if G0-T0 shows them off.

G0-T0 has no reason for HK droids to become protocol droids anymore. Traya obviously knows about them, and the one Revan used, HK-47. So revealing them to be the assassins they are will keep his forces in line. Assassin droids don't need to be secretive to do damage. And if they do? Stealth tech.

Or, say he does keep them secret. Except now every Exchange boss has a brand new protocol droid. That solves the issue of backstabbing even better. If Traya makes a deal with that boss? The HK planted there will kill him off before he can do anything stupid. Actually, I like this scenario better.

Okay, sorry everyone, I'm on edge for some reason. I'll try to filter from now on, I guess I'm just getting caught up in the debate. Apologies for any rude or condescending comments I've made.

What, during this time, is deadlier?

Oh you were meaning of the specific time period, then nvrm ya that is right.

The HK series is plenty well known... I assume. I don't know, maybe they're not. But they very well could be if G0-T0 shows them off.

They're definitely not well known unless G0-T0 chooses to try to make them well known, but that would cripple their usefulness as infiltrators.

G0-T0 has no reason for HK droids to become protocol droids anymore. Traya obviously knows about them, and the one Revan used, HK-47. So revealing them to be the assassins they are will keep his forces in line. Assassin droids don't need to be secretive to do damage. And if they do? Stealth tech.

 

Or, say he does keep them secret. Except now every Exchange boss has a brand new protocol droid. That solves the issue of backstabbing even better. If Traya makes a deal with that boss? The HK planted there will kill him off before he can do anything stupid. Actually, I like this scenario better.

Traya's assassins would know to tip off the Exchange boss about his new "protocol droid", which then causes the Exchange to even feel grateful to the Sith for revealing G0-T0's treachery. Traya could easily play that into helping her turn G0-T0's minions against him.

Traya's assassins would know to tip off the Exchange boss about his new "protocol droid", which then causes the Exchange to even feel grateful to the Sith for revealing G0-T0's treachery. Traya could easily play that into helping her turn G0-T0's minions against him.

Do assassins even talk?

And how will Traya know about them? Sure, she knew about HK-47, but as you have stated, no one knows that G0-T0 has secretly been making HK-50s.

And if these assassins are holding the Exchange bosses at pike-point when they tell them this, I think, more likely, the boss-person will ask the HK for help. Then it plays hero, saves the day, BOOM, more loyalty to G0-T0.

Even if that doesn't happen, the HK would simply kill that boss as soon as the assassins reveal themselves. It doesn't matter if that boss likes the HK or not, cause he's dead.

Do assassins even talk?

 

And how will Traya know about them? Sure, she knew about HK-47, but as you have stated, no one knows that G0-T0 has secretly been making HK-50s.

 

And if these assassins are holding the Exchange bosses at pike-point when they tell them this, I think, more likely, the boss-person will ask the HK for help. Then it plays hero, saves the day, BOOM, more loyalty to G0-T0.

 

Even if that doesn't happen, the HK would simply kill that boss as soon as the assassins reveal themselves. It doesn't matter if that boss likes the HK or not, cause he's dead.

The assassins and Sith would probably notice the HK in the process of conducting reconnaissance, and then destroy it before beginning their "discussion" with the Exchange boss.

And even if the HK were present, how would it "play the hero" ? By firing wantonly and killing the Exchange boss and maybe one or two assassins before being destroyed?

EDIT: I think they would notice the identical but recolored assassin droids that just happened to all get delivered to the Exchange bosses...

EDIT: I think they would notice the identical but recolored assassin droids that just happened to all get delivered to the Exchange bosses...

But that's the thing. The assassins scout everything out and see grey protocol droids. Nothing strange about that. They will have no idea they're assassin droids, because, as you have said, they are not well known.

Would Traya know about their true nature? Well, maybe. But she wasn't actually fighting with Revan, and showed no signs of recognizing HK-47 in KotOR II (did she?). So Traya probably doesn't even know. And if she does, it wouldn't make sense for her to be like "Oh, by the way, look out for an assassin droid that I thought was one of a kind and now disappeared, because, you know, their might be more exactly like it but a different color out there."

Just as the assassins will remain hidden until they make their first strike, so too will the HK-50s.