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The Scrapper's Handbook: A PvP Guide

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Smuggler > Scoundrel
The Scrapper's Handbook: A PvP Guide

randiesel's Avatar


randiesel
07.08.2013 , 07:57 PM | #211
Quote: Originally Posted by Nieky View Post
hey Ran,

Just curious if you are intending to continue to update this guide? I'm finding it very useful, but would definately appreciate further guidance.

I've been PvP'ing with my scoundrel quite a bit lately and am really enjoying it.
Well, it's Miyke's guide, so technically I'm just adding my $0.02 here and there. Just poke in from time to time when I'm bored.

Actually, I haven't really been playing lately, actually pretty much bored with pvp as a whole. I figured xfers would bring new life to the game, but it's not the playerbase, rather the content which needs to be addressed.

Anyhow, if anything I've ever posted (positively) can be of use or helpful in some way, I'm glad I could help. The basic thing with scrapping is the same across all my posts: I personally gear for power/surge with all cunning augs (that one should be obvious) and that'll help you hit as hard as you can.

Actually, a guy just whispered me the other night asking what I did different than him in a VS where I almost doubled his damage, said he plays medic as his main spec. I told him basically flat out, just do as much damage as you can out of stealth. Everyone becomes too dependent on their Shoot First opener to give them the Upper Hand (see what I did?) and it's too situational that you'll actually get one to go off, given AoE and whatnot. Plus, I've had bugs keep me in combat, long after I've died/respawned and you're just simply stuck, so I choose to fight (and die like an idiot, likely).

TL;DR: If you want to excel - 1. Work on your 1v1, solely for the purpose of you being called upon to stealth steal a node and may not have the opportunity to sleep > cap the node. Most ppl you play in regs should be easy enough if you play the class well. 2. Group combat, just try to lock down the healer or double up on a good opponent who needs to be taken down ASAP when you see it's time. Stick to your rotation, keep your energy in check, and anticipate you're going to get focused/killed very quickly. You're easy to kill outside of stealth; it sucks, you'll get laughed at and focused a lot when ppl know you're the easy target, but it's the price you pay to play the spec. Playing with a premade team helps that last part, though.

ktkenshinx's Avatar


ktkenshinx
07.15.2013 , 01:42 PM | #212
Quote: Originally Posted by Nieky View Post
hey Ran,

Just curious if you are intending to continue to update this guide? I'm finding it very useful, but would definately appreciate further guidance.

I've been PvP'ing with my scoundrel quite a bit lately and am really enjoying it.
Hello there!

Just started my new job so work has been really crazy, but I was honored to get a nomination from you guys to possily represent the Scrapper class as a "class rep" to voice issues to the powers that be. This was such an honor that I am going to have to get back to updating this guide and keeping it current; my fellow Scrappers deserve all the info they can get to succeed.

So in the spirit of that, I am starting an update right now. Will continue to update throughout the month.
The Outlaw Miyke Fink: Scrapper, Prophecy of the Five
See you, space cowboys!: Formerly of Brown Coats
---THE SCRAPPER'S HANDBOOK: A PvP Guide---

Halom's Avatar


Halom
07.15.2013 , 05:02 PM | #213
Well Miyke, I came up with an askmrobot character a few pages back if you need a "base" character with augments on every piece and everything. I don't know, might save you some time on the gearing section. But I look forward to the debates that come up and the updates that come!
<Halom> Operative Heals/DPS
<Prophecy of the Five>
<Professional Nerfherders> We provide only the finest Nerfherders
<Master of Secrets> I know where Hallow hides

JaysoTohl's Avatar


JaysoTohl
08.22.2013 , 02:06 PM | #214
I was hoping someone could explain to me the reason(s) for the rotation you recommend as well as the recommended stat priority.

In my experience (which I will admit is far less than most of the people on this thread, but still includes a crap ton of WZs lol) I've found that my rotation works better like this: Pugnacity>SF+FR>BB>DK>SP>SP>SP(If Round Two procs)>BW>SP>SP(If Round Two procs)>SC>TD and repeat from BB if needed. This rotation usually lets me get off SF and BB (our 2 highest dmg abilities) uncontested, keeps the target out of the fight longer (the extra GC allowed by using BB inbetween SF and DK), and maximizes the use of SP, as well as makes use of the extra UH and alacrity from Pugnacity. This rotation usually puts enemies in the respawn area in under 10 secs for me, but I'm sure there's a reason why you have yours the way you do and I'm looking to learn and improve if I can.

Now for stats, I've been using a pure Power and Alacrity build since lvl 35ish (lvl 47 now) and I LOVE it. The alacrity really helps put targets down quickly, and all my power gives me better sustained dmg without relying on crits for anything. It should be said that I am a little hesitant to use crit on any of my toons, I just don't like it. As I've heard it explained and seen for myself, crit is only a useful stat IF you crit. All those times when you don't crit are times when those slots would've been better spent on Power, and power works on EVERY hit, not just a certain % of them. Again tho, I'm sure you know what you're doing better than I do and I'd love to know if anyone else has tried a build like mine and could compare notes with me...?

Like I said, I'm looking to learn and improve if I can. Thanks! =)
The Tohl Legacy
Rohl - Sith Juggernaut | Nohl - Sith Sorcerer
Jayso - Scoundrel | Hawk-i - Commando
Server - Jung Ma

Racter's Avatar


Racter
08.22.2013 , 03:27 PM | #215
Quote: Originally Posted by JaysoTohl View Post
I was hoping someone could explain to me the reason(s) for the rotation you recommend as well as the recommended stat priority.

In my experience (which I will admit is far less than most of the people on this thread, but still includes a crap ton of WZs lol) I've found that my rotation works better like this: Pugnacity>SF+FR>BB>DK>SP>SP>SP(If Round Two procs)>BW>SP>SP(If Round Two procs)>SC>TD and repeat from BB if needed. This rotation usually lets me get off SF and BB (our 2 highest dmg abilities) uncontested, keeps the target out of the fight longer (the extra GC allowed by using BB inbetween SF and DK), and maximizes the use of SP, as well as makes use of the extra UH and alacrity from Pugnacity. This rotation usually puts enemies in the respawn area in under 10 secs for me, but I'm sure there's a reason why you have yours the way you do and I'm looking to learn and improve if I can.

Now for stats, I've been using a pure Power and Alacrity build since lvl 35ish (lvl 47 now) and I LOVE it. The alacrity really helps put targets down quickly, and all my power gives me better sustained dmg without relying on crits for anything. It should be said that I am a little hesitant to use crit on any of my toons, I just don't like it. As I've heard it explained and seen for myself, crit is only a useful stat IF you crit. All those times when you don't crit are times when those slots would've been better spent on Power, and power works on EVERY hit, not just a certain % of them. Again tho, I'm sure you know what you're doing better than I do and I'd love to know if anyone else has tried a build like mine and could compare notes with me...?

Like I said, I'm looking to learn and improve if I can. Thanks! =)
Your rotation in incorrect for a couple reasons, the biggest being you're screwing yourself out of 6s of uptime on FR, though you would be able to maintain the armor pen buff like this it's still not a good idea. The other thing is this spec is total trash without high crit rating, even now after the crit nerfs I (along with all other "serious" scrapper concealment players I know) am running 28% crit. When you get out of lowbies this will make more sense, but if you don't get a crit SF or BB (and often both), you're going to get stunned and ********ed before you kill anyone.

Wainamoinen's Avatar


Wainamoinen
08.23.2013 , 03:47 AM | #216
As Racter said, you're screwing yourself out of Flechette Round uptime.

Flechette Round not only does c. 500 per second dot (average, can get over 1k on a crit) in addition to whatever else you're hitting them with, it applies a 30% armour penetration debuff that means your other abilities hit harder. You want this up as long as possible. You can only apply it with Shoot First or Back Blast, and Shoot First only works out of stealth. It lasts 6 seconds and the global cooldown on abilities (ignoring alacrity) is 1.5secs, that's why the most efficient rotation goes:

SF > ability > ability > ability > Back Blast > ability > ability > ability

Applying FR again in prep for BB is off the GCD, so you can do it without missing other attacks.

Also, you've left Sabo Charge until way too late. It's damage is comparable to BB and you want it up front for maximum burst, I put it straight after DK before the BB. Dropping to cover is off the gcd again.

Stats. You don't go into enough detail for me to know whether this is an issue, but Cunning is your best stat, stronger than Power.
Power gives 0.23 bonus damage. Cunning gives 0.2 bonus damage plus some crit chance.
However, standard talents and buffs mean every point of Cunning on gear is buffed by 14%. This means every point of Cunning on gear gives you (0.2 * 1.14) = 0.228 bonus damage, which is only a whisker behind Power's 0.23. Plus, Cunning gives you that essential crit chance you need to actualy kill anyone. Point for point, Cunning always beats Power. All augments should be Cunning, though mods that give you more Power for only a small Cunning loss (End loss not mattering) are worth it.

From the viewpoint of sustained damage, Crit is blurgh, Power gives more damage for any reasonable stat level. But in a sustained toe-to-toe fight, as scrapper you'll probably lose, so you want to get a crit on your big-hitting burst. That's why I think a bit of Crit at the low end, where you get the most return, is probably worth it. I'm wary of talking about % levels, because that also depends on how much crit chance you're getting off main stat.
It's a small world and it smells funny, I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money.
Ilmarinen 55 Scoundrel (Red Eclipse)

JaysoTohl's Avatar


JaysoTohl
08.23.2013 , 05:47 AM | #217
i apologize, I should've given more detail on my stats, probly would help you answer my question lol. My priority has been Endurance>Cunning>Power>Alacrity. I've only stacked End over Cunning while I'm leveling and I don't plan to continue that after hitting 55. I don't currently have any Crit or Surge on my gear, nor any augments, so my stats look like this:
Lvl 47
Cunning 920
End 1161
Power 362
Alacrity 243
My crit rating comes to 18% from base+smuggler buff+cunning (7%)+1% that I can't figure out where it's from... Lol
Surge is at base 50% since I hav none on my gear
Don't know if you'll need it, but my ranged bonus dmg is 302, tech bonus dmg is 483
Anything else you need me to include just tell me.
Side note: should I hav my gear augmented at this lvl?

Edit: been trying the new rotation out in WZs this morning and it's SOOOO much better lol, I can take targets down noticeably faster.
The Tohl Legacy
Rohl - Sith Juggernaut | Nohl - Sith Sorcerer
Jayso - Scoundrel | Hawk-i - Commando
Server - Jung Ma

ekimmak's Avatar


ekimmak
10.03.2013 , 06:37 PM | #218
I think this guide needs a bit of an update.

There's nothing on non-pyro Powertechs at all, and I see more than a few advanced prototypes hanging around.

I think madness sorcerors deserve a better spot than green/blue. I recall a well played balance sage I fought recently, where she would stun me instantly, run in the opposite direction, hit me with the force root, and when that wears off she would hit the slows. That is a long time with only rifle shots and explosive probe for damage, and nothing is cleansable without evasion.

Don't Smashers have obliterate to get out of close range roots?

And finally, I'd like to see info on arenas. That's all.
Best way to end Smuggler Act 1 is
Spoiler

You can't make up stuff like that.

Sir_Galapagos's Avatar


Sir_Galapagos
12.19.2013 , 08:57 PM | #219
you said it is unforgivable for a scraper to not pop evasion against a sniper root. however triage also removes the sniper root and u can save evasion for their aimed shot or other huge hitters.
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