so if there are only 4 members of my guild on atm, and we cannot run RWZ b/c we do not have the remaining 4 members online, we should log out of the game or find something else to do, rather than group and queue for regs?

No, you should have a separate queue and fight against the other premades.

No, you should have a separate queue and fight against the other premades.

And that queue is a bit over two months away.

No, you should have a separate queue and fight against the other premades.

No, we should not.

I think.. you can't force anyone to do anything.

 

What I would find more acceptable is 2man groups (not que-synched), but again, can't argue morality with anyone.

 

You would be wrong if you said that RWZ on Pot5 are <5%. You should know better.

 

 

AAAAAAAND.

 

I don't care about the conversion rate. Premades in reg queues should receive reduced rewards (even further reduced from RWZ) if you are opposed to splitting them.

youre arguments have devolved significantly.

there are between 15-20 guilds that are actively in the RWZ scene on Pot5. that is ~150, maybe 200 people. for that to be >5% of the population, there would need to be <4000 total people on Pot5. i think there are more people on the server than that...... maybe not at any one given moment, but certainly in total.

and based on your previous posts, that the evil RWZ 4-man groups are coming into regs to stroke their egos and demean other players, how is reducing the rewards going to discourage that behavior? short answer: its not; they arent there for the rewards, they are there "to get off" by beating the snot out of less skilled players (not my beliefs, yours). especially in the case of the evil RWZ group, who is able to progress faster to conq gear b/c they do RWZ.

you want to punish the average player just grouping with friends in order to get revenge against the evil RWZ 4-man groups.

And that queue is a bit over two months away.

THIS. and the irony is that nobody in this thread doing the whining about premades has notice how arenas will have a positive effect by removing some of those "evil" 4-mans from their precious regs.

No, you should have a separate queue and fight against the other premades.

Those big bad meany head premades!!!

Those big bad meany head premades!!!

/reported

Apparently all PUGs break CC because it requires telepathy not to. Or not. Watch as two people keep the enemy away while I cap the node. Then no one manages to respond so we lose it. Only to do the exact same thing later in the video and win. Yes, I backfilled into this and stayed btw. You don't have to watch until the end after the second time we capped, we won.

Nice because one match speaks for all matches that happen in all of PVP from now till the end of time.

Great logic.

Come back when you can either grasp the point that one video doesn't speak for every scenario or you finally admit that you only care about a certain group of people.

This is your response- "If my one video doesn't mean anything, then your scenario doesn't mean anything either hurr durr!".

So that I say, the difference is you are cherry-picking and I am offering a very possible and likely situation that should be addressed. Not only that, I can apply my scenario to multiple group tiers of people that will be ignored by you. Was this the bait and switch you were hoping to accomplish? Because it completely and utterly failed.

You have been debunked.

Come back when you can either grasp the point that one video doesn't speak for every scenario or you finally admit that you only care about a certain group of people.

how about you come back when you can admit that one experience where you get stomped by a premade does not represent every WZ ever either.....

No, we should not.

The argument is, "half my ranked team is offline, I still want to play, so I should be able to..."

Well you tell me, if not being able to play ranked is the reason you want to be in solo queue, which would be more like ranked: 4-man vs. 4-man ++ adds, or playing versus 8 solo players who (often) don't even have a healer? It would seem to me that if ranked is what you want, 4-man versus 4-man with no rank consequences would be ideal.

But that's not what premades want - they want to roll pugs who don't want anything to do with them. That's why 2.4's new rules for getting into ranked isn't going to do anything to alleviate the lowbrow bottom feeders problem in regs PVP.

youre arguments have devolved significantly.

 

there are between 15-20 guilds that are actively in the RWZ scene on Pot5. that is ~150, maybe 200 people. for that to be >5% of the population, there would need to be <4000 total people on Pot5. i think there are more people on the server than that...... maybe not at any one given moment, but certainly in total.

 

 

and based on your previous posts, that the evil RWZ 4-man groups are coming into regs to stroke their egos and demean other players, how is reducing the rewards going to discourage that behavior? short answer: its not; they arent there for the rewards, they are there "to get off" by beating the snot out of less skilled players (not my beliefs, yours). especially in the case of the evil RWZ group, who is able to progress faster to conq gear b/c they do RWZ.

 

 

you want to punish the average player just grouping with friends in order to get revenge against the evil RWZ 4-man groups.

 

 

 

THIS. and the irony is that nobody in this thread doing the whining about premades has notice how arenas will have a positive effect by removing some of those "evil" 4-mans from their precious regs.

MY arguments haven't devolved, they've changed based on my experiences as of late (one could say that your arguments have also devolved, and based on Doom's last post.. the same could be said of her).

I don't want to punish friends playing together on the weekend. You know this already.

And Arena's will do nothing. The cream will rise and dominate, and all those who went to play will come back and do the same thing they're doing now. It happened with Rated, it will happen with Arenas. It will provide a moment's relief, but thinking it will do anything beyond that is wishful at best, delusional at worst.

Nice because one match speaks for all matches that happen in all of PVP from now till the end of time.

 

Great logic.

 

Come back when you can either grasp the point that one video doesn't speak for every scenario or you finally admit that you only care about a certain group of people.

 

This is your response- "If my one video doesn't mean anything, then your scenario doesn't mean anything either hurr durr!".

 

So that I say, the difference is you are cherry-picking and I am offering a very possible and likely situation that should be addressed. Not only that, I can apply my scenario to multiple group tiers of people that will be ignored by you. Was this the bait and switch you were hoping to accomplish? Because it completely and utterly failed.

 

You have been debunked.

#burned

#dunkedon

#superdebunked

oh, looks like some of this thread just disappeared.

 

 

and for those that missed it:

 

 

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=6398419

 

cross server is a no-go. its not even worth discussing.

You should re-read the quote because they didn't flat out say "no-go". They said it for 2.4, yea it's called context, try it sometime.

I love how you guys quit on cross-server queue's so easily, it's clear you don't even care about this issue and are just trolling at this point. Since cross-server queue's is the only thing we can agree that will help, that is what you should be pushing for. But hey, it's a "no-go" so let's just talk about oranges or something, right? It's easier than actually trying to improve the game.

Let the troll live on.

But that's not what premades want - they want to roll pugs who don't want anything to do with them. That's why 2.4's new rules for getting into ranked isn't going to do anything to alleviate the lowbrow bottom feeders problem in regs PVP.

EDIT: It's not going to work because PREMADES are not going to go. They're not going to go because 4-8 man premade in regs is the #1 surest way to win. That's really the basis for the whole problem in this game's PVP, and this thread.

Bioware has stated that they have no intentions of releasing cross server anytime in the near future. Here is the most recent dev post I can find on cross server queues.

 

 

A *significant* challenge would indicate that, as I stated earlier, if they have plans on doing it will be a long time off (think capitol guild ships).

And here we have another person easily giving up.

Yea usually if there is a big enough outcry from a customer for a change they want- the company will take notice. Since you decided to just troll this thread instead....well it just speaks for itself now doesn't it?

Damn, that was pretty good, I just made two trolls openly admit they are trolling and I debunked their matchmaking theory in one day. Not to shabby.

MY arguments haven't devolved, they've changed based on my experiences as of late (one could say that your arguments have also devolved, and based on Doom's last post.. the same could be said of her).

 

I don't want to punish friends playing together on the weekend. You know this already.

 

 

And Arena's will do nothing. The cream will rise and dominate, and all those who went to play will come back and do the same thing they're doing now. It happened with Rated, it will happen with Arenas. It will provide a moment's relief, but thinking it will do anything beyond that is wishful at best, delusional at worst.

my argument hasnt changed since the first day i posted in this thread: the majority of people whining about premades are bad, dont know that they are bad, and refuse/dont know how to improve. they also refuse (for some unknown reason) to find in game friends to queue up with to make their own premade (tho preamdes dont give special powers, if youre bad you stay bad). this entire problem goes away if the average player would work on improving one thing each time they played. that is way too much to ask of the average player tho; theyd rather come to the forums and whine for bioware to nerf the better people somehow.

you say you dont want to punish friends playing together, but you JUST SAID you wanted to reduce rewards from premades in regs..... what is it you want to suggest?

skill based matchmaking. it aint rocket science.

At what point did I say ANY of that?

 

I said.. as an accepted fact of psychology... Behavioral Patterns do not have a toggle switch.

 

Sexual assault is NOT a behavioral pattern. It is a result of those patterns, just as alcoholism isn't a personality defect, but rather an indicator of an addictive personality.

 

Please.. educate yourself before you make assumptions on my intentions.

When you say that a person is correct, you are agreeing with them. The statements made by the poster have clearly been wild in nature and completely inaccurate including comparisons to assault. Know what you are supporting before you support it.

so if there are only 4 members of my guild on atm, and we cannot run RWZ b/c we do not have the remaining 4 members online, we should log out of the game or find something else to do, rather than group and queue for regs?

 

you seem to believe that anyone that premades is simply in it to "stroke their ego". you couldnt be more wrong. the RWZ community is <5% of the total population. at best maybe 100-150 people per server, give or take. the overwhelming majority of premades are just people that want to play with friends/guildies.

 

 

and fyi, premades that are in regs and not RWZ *DO* receive fewer rewards.... RWZ comms = WZ comms x3

There you have it, ranked groups aren't really a concern, since there are so few. Yet casual premades will run into these groups all the time if they split the queue's. But hey, solo pugs never run into these ranked pvp guys because well....just go along with it guys!!!!

Oh the circle logic is amazing from these three.

You should re-read the quote because they didn't flat out say "no-go". They said it for 2.4, yea it's called context, try it sometime.

 

I love how you guys quit on cross-server queue's so easily, it's clear you don't even care about this issue and are just trolling at this point. Since cross-server queue's is the only thing we can agree that will help, that is what you should be pushing for. But hey, it's a "no-go" so let's just talk about oranges or something, right? It's easier than actually trying to improve the game.

 

Let the troll live on.

Cross servers queues is something that has been brought up since launch, not just in this thread. It was a hot topic back when servers were dying off, then they did mergers, then they released ranked, ranked started dying, Cross servers were brought up again, then that post was made by the devs.

Did they say 'no cross servers ever'? No. But they are implying heavily that it is going to take a lot of work to implement which will take time and with 0 time frame to work with it is a good bet it will be a ways off...if ever.

And here we have another person easily giving up.

 

Yea usually if there is a big enough outcry from a customer for a change they want- the company will take notice. Since you decided to just troll this thread instead....well it just speaks for itself now doesn't it?

 

Damn, that was pretty good, I just made two trolls openly admit they are trolling and I debunked their matchmaking theory in one day. Not to shabby.

'Two trolls openly admit they are trolling'

Cash and I are stating facts. They have no plans or time table for cross server queues.

Also debunked. You say that word as if you know the meaning of it.

Oh and see the highlighted portion. If anything you said had a hint of truth this thread would not exist.

Where is "Half of a Ranked Team" suppose to go when they don't have their other half?

 

I've also agreed as yet -another- compromise for the casual PuG, that rewards for Group vs. PuG could get a negative adjustment. I think that's been the point of the last few pages. Over and over there have been any number of changes proposed, compromises offered, etc... and a select few of the "Solo-bracket" refuse to even consider anyone else's side/happiness/fun/whatever. Worse they insult, lie, deceive, and out right "damn" things that use to be *********** virtues (like investment, self-improvement, hard work, dedication, team-work, etc...). I'm sorry, but if this is the general direction of the MMO crowd (waiting for data on that) then **** this.

 

I refuse to get into another conversation of what makes a Bully and a Victim. I've seen victims, I've been with them and I've been one. Even the worst day on the losing side (and yes, I've been a "PuG" vs. Premade) of a lopsided match is nothing compared to the pain, suffer, and long term effects of abuse. If someone thinks so, they need to grow a *********** tougher skin.

 

Or do what they always tell "Non-Casuals" ... realize it's a *********** game.

This thread is what, up to 500ish pages?

Yea keep in mind, doom stopped using insults at around....page 400. Just sayin'

But those dang casuals always throwing insults at poor doom grrr

I love the word compromise as well.

Doom- "Listen we been trying to work with the casual basta--pugs all this time! We even are willing to take a hit on our rewards!."

Pug- "...So what about the lopsided matches we gotta deal with?"

Doom- "Stop with the crazy talk!!! #@%#"

Pretty much how it plays out.

When you say that a person is correct, you are agreeing with them. The statements made by the poster have clearly been wild in nature and completely inaccurate including comparisons to assault. Know what you are supporting before you support it.

Let's hear your rebuttal, I don't think you can do it. You want to act like the suggestion is so outrageous that you just... shouldn't... have to... counter it... However, that is not a valid form of debate. What you're putting forward is a sorry substitution for an argument that you appear unready to actually participate in.

Go ahead - free try - rebut:

The potentials of human behavior don't have an 'on/off' switch that's deactivated the minute a person logs into an MMO. You're making a false argument. People are capable of the same extremes of behavior inside a game that they're capable outside the game. In fact, these extremes are probably more outsized than they would be in real life the same way LOTS of behavior is amplified over the internet, minus the consequences of actually having to be accountable for our transgressions. Depending on the team, there are a lot of parallels. The nature of behavior doesn't change just because it occurs in a digital format. There is a lot of seedy and sh**y behavior going on on a regular basis, committed in the case of premades by people who are taking advantage of a broken queue; looking for pugs to roll because the watchers aren't watching and they get off on it; they say a lot of degrading **** over the general/say channels, as their goal is to ruin other peoples experience, because that's the behavior they are allowed to enjoy.

 

I feel there's no valid basis for disagreement with the above.

how about you come back when you can admit that one experience where you get stomped by a premade does not represent every WZ ever either.....

and you ignored my entire counter-point to that. I already addressed that, nice job with horrible reading comprehension though.

Troll will be Troll, I guess.

You should re-read the quote because they didn't flat out say "no-go". They said it for 2.4, yea it's called context, try it sometime.

 

I love how you guys quit on cross-server queue's so easily, it's clear you don't even care about this issue and are just trolling at this point. Since cross-server queue's is the only thing we can agree that will help, that is what you should be pushing for. But hey, it's a "no-go" so let's just talk about oranges or something, right? It's easier than actually trying to improve the game.

 

Let the troll live on.

i dont know if you are trying to be optimistic, or just trying to be a general a-hole.

cross server queuing has been suggested on this forum since the very first time RWZ was announced by the devs (before 1.2). RWZ was originally toted as including cross server at some point, but the devs flat out lied about that. so for you to come here and claim that none of us want cross server queues just shows how blindly ignorant you are.

you are late to the party. cross server queues would need to be built 100% from the ground up; this game was not designed in anyway for cross server functionality. it would require a huge time and financial investment; things which EA clearly is not interested in.

i would like to see cross server as much as the next guy. it would be a huge improvement for everyone, at all levels of play. but the reality is it is not coming. so rather than continuing to hold out hope for something that is never going to happen, id rather offer up suggestions that may actually be actionable for bioware.

When you say that a person is correct, you are agreeing with them. The statements made by the poster have clearly been wild in nature and completely inaccurate including comparisons to assault. Know what you are supporting before you support it.

this. and comfter has stuck by those accusations that premade groups are akin to sexual assault; not once has he denied it.

 

Also debunked. You say that word as if you know the meaning of it.