Jump to content

Same gender relationships clarifications?


elexier

Recommended Posts

I'm sorry, but are we so desperate for SGRA in the game that we'll grab whatever we can get?

 

Well I think the point is rather that the Sith Warrior character is open to a female-female relationship. Who cares what Vette thinks? For my FemWarrior, Vette will always be a slave to her master's whims.

Edited by HellbirdIV
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 5.5k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

You say the basic frame work is in, and then point to something that has unfortunate implications.

 

 

If I remember rightly (and I do, because I just looked up a youtube video of the conversation), Vette reacts badly, and you take a hit to her affection when you say that.

 

She says, and I quote,

(at about 0:45 in the video I linked). So she either thinks you're joking, or she is really embarrassed or uncomfortable with it (or both) - now I suppose it's arguable it's because Tivva is her sister, and not because it's two women, but it's not the best or most positive example of "subtext" in the game.

 

 

 

Umm.. *scratches her head* I'm sorry, but are we so desperate for SGRA in the game that we'll grab whatever we can get?

 

 

I'm imagining that the whole she's her sister thing is the reason she gets aggravated by the comment.

 

Edited by Rayla_Felana
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Umm.. *scratches her head* I'm sorry, but are we so desperate for SGRA in the game that we'll grab whatever we can get?

 

 

 

This is the first Vette has seen her sister, been in physical proximity to her, in literally years. Most of her life, in fact. The SW's choice is to be insensitive to Vette and her sister, Tivva, by asking to explore that option rather than to allow the two Twi'lek to bond.

 

Think of it this way, if Vette had been male and you had found Tivva after ten years of searching, and she had said "no threesomes", wouldn't m!Vette have reacted just as badly if your SW had then asked 'why not?'

 

I really don't think that scene has any homophobia in it, whether Unfortunate Implication subtext or not. If you take it out of context, of course! It's bound to be homophobic out of context. I think people who refer to this particular scene are taking it for granted that everyone knows that Vette has been searching for her family and has finally found her sister.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Umm.. *scratches her head* I'm sorry, but are we so desperate for SGRA in the game that we'll grab whatever we can get?

 

 

I haven't seen the scene in question and haven't watched the videos that were very kindly placed in spoiler tags, but maybe it's a subcontext within a context? Maybe Vette's jealous of the femSW's attentions and is covering it with faux disgust? :D

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But you all can see where I'm coming from with the unfortunate implications, can't you?

 

 

It isn't just Vette's reaction, it is the entire context in which that scene happens. If you're a LS Sith Warrior, it's definitely not the sort of thing you'd ask in front of Vette (out of respect, because Tivva is her sister). Plus Tivva is pretty blunt to begin with, so it would seem almost DS to follow it through (though it actually is just dropped as soon as Tivva realizes Vette is her sister).

 

The unfortunate implication I'm inferring from all of that is - Lesbianism is DS.

 

 

Edited by Zandilar
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The unfortunate implication I'm inferring from all of that is - Lesbianism is DS.

 

Dark side doesn't mean it's evil though, see Jedi Knight romance with Kira, which is a literal Dark side choice the first, oh, three times you flirt with her.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not that lesbianism is a Dark Side choice, it's that going through with something against a person's wishes is a Dark Side choice. In this case Tivva does not do lesbians things - forcing her to do lesbian things would be Dark Side. Likewise is Tivva were a lesbian forcing her to straight things would be a Dark Side choice.

 

It's more subtle than lesbian=bad just because one NPC is straight.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

having followed a hetero relationship on my JK I think it's pretty obvious that /sex/ is DS. Every time I slept with Doc I took a massive DS hit. This stands to reason as, by KOTOR/SWTOR standards, DS is letting passion of any kind govern your actions.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dark side doesn't mean it's evil though, see Jedi Knight romance with Kira, which is a literal Dark side choice the first, oh, three times you flirt with her.

 

But you have to take it in the context of ALL DS choices in the game, not just the ones you pick and choose... Plus, where I come from "no" means "no", and no negotiation should be entered into, unless invited to do so.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But you have to take it in the context of ALL DS choices in the game, not just the ones you pick and choose... Plus, where I come from "no" means "no", and no negotiation should be entered into, unless invited to do so.

 

So... what I said was wrong?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So... what I said was wrong?

 

No, you weren't wrong at all.

 

But... what was I trying to say? I am starting to get confused, which is a sure sign I've been over thinking things.

 

I think that that one scene is not "framework" for SGRA (as one poster put it), you know? I don't think Tivva will suddenly not say "no women" - plus the context in which it happens (talking to a SLAVE) is pretty troublesome. Since the Sith continues with a "lets negotiate" after a flat no... I know MY Sith wouldn't do it (She's Myren the Pure, after all!), though she almost certainly would take up a female non-slave's voluntary offer of sex (paid for or otherwise, I think at this point... poor Myren!).

Edited by Zandilar
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome! Hopefully you'll meet some awesome people here.

 

 

 

I've heard of him being described, basically, as Bruce Campbell with a kolto obsession.

 

lol that actually sounds pretty cool, i love bruce campbell! =D

and thank u!

 

 

 

 

 

Welcome! You've picked a good place to start. Not that I'm biased or anything. Not at all. :p

 

 

Yah, Kira's one of my big hopes for SGRs as well. It was really difficult for me to stop playing my JK, but I felt like I was missing out on so much by not being able to romance her with my female character.

 

If you've looked through the thread a bit, you might know that news on SGRs is pretty scarce, but the latest is that they're coming this year. Many of us are really hoping SGRs will be added to current companions, but we won't know until BioWare says so. Any other characters in particular you're hoping for? My other big hope is Mako; play a Bounty Hunter for, like, 10-20 minutes and you might agree. :D

 

the 2nd paragraph i totes agree with!

 

3rd paragraph, i'll have 2 check bounty hunter out. JK was my first class and character so i have a lot of exploring to do yet! lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Slave boy was announced at the Guild Summit, so it should be in the game Soon. And yes, my gorgeous Roro will be wearing it :3.

 

Really?

 

Now every time I see Kira in a slave girl outfit on the Fleet, I vow to place one of my male companions in a slave boy outfit for the sake of equality!

 

Which means all male companions for all my toons (Imp and Pub side) will have lovely little matching slave boy outfits in a day or so,

Link to comment
Share on other sites

having followed a hetero relationship on my JK I think it's pretty obvious that /sex/ is DS. Every time I slept with Doc I took a massive DS hit. This stands to reason as, by KOTOR/SWTOR standards, DS is letting passion of any kind govern your actions.

 

It's not universal, though. My consular didn't get any dark side points for having a relationship with Nadia. And for certain in other classes, even seducing strangers were sometimes LS choices. It has to do with a number of factors about you, the person, and the situation.

Edited by chuixupu
Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, you weren't wrong at all.

 

But... what was I trying to say? I am starting to get confused, which is a sure sign I've been over thinking things.

 

I think that that one scene is not "framework" for SGRA (as one poster put it), you know? I don't think Tivva will suddenly not say "no women" - plus the context in which it happens (talking to a SLAVE) is pretty troublesome. Since the Sith continues with a "lets negotiate" after a flat no... I know MY Sith wouldn't do it (She's Myren the Pure, after all!), though she almost certainly would take up a female non-slave's voluntary offer of sex (paid for or otherwise, I think at this point... poor Myren!).

 

I may be off-base but I think that the point being made was the 'framework' per se isn't related to Tivva accepting, nor does it even really have anything to do with Tivva. Instead I think it's related directly to the fact that the female Sith Warrior is implied (if you choose that option) to have interest in other females (which theoretically is the case irrespective of Tivva's or Vette's opinions on the matter). That implication is free of unfortunate...ness, it's simply the context it's placed within that (probably intentionally) makes it a bit wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not universal, though. My consular didn't get any negative affection for having a relationship with Nadia. And for certain in other classes, even seducing strangers were sometimes LS choices. It has to do with a number of factors about you, the person, and the situation.

 

I suppose there's a need to take artistic license and world management into account. I mean if the devs approached it from a direct viewpoint of Passion = DS for everyone then they'd need to comb through every bit of dialogue and go, 'Is that passionate? DARK SIDE POINTS FOR YOU!' and everyone would be running about throwing Force Lightning at people, choking accountants and having little Sith-babies all over the place.

 

I'm guessing it's a contextual thing. The Force is life, but one of the primary motivators to maintaining the existence of a species is inherently Dark Side? I don't think so. I think it's more a matter of it being DS when your passion overrules your greater sense of balance, or when it sways you from a more inherently LS path (which probably still doesn't explain the no-DS-for-snogging-Nadia thing).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a reminder, we previously suggested a shift in focus in your questions. As development plans are always subject to change, questions about future features will often get vague answers which can be repetitive and sometimes annoying. With that in mind, the development team is more interested in questions about current in-game features or systems, or questions about why development decisions were made. You’re still welcome to ask questions about future features and we’ll continue to answer them where appropriate – just expect the occasional ‘soon.’

 

I feel like they are trying to tell us something =(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

sorry, that quote is from the intro to the latest Q&A

Eh, that quote has been at the top of the Q&As for a long time. Looks like they first mentioned it back in the one from March 23. So, no, that doesn't mean anything.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I may be off-base but I think that the point being made was the 'framework' per se isn't related to Tivva accepting, nor does it even really have anything to do with Tivva. Instead I think it's related directly to the fact that the female Sith Warrior is implied (if you choose that option) to have interest in other females (which theoretically is the case irrespective of Tivva's or Vette's opinions on the matter). That implication is free of unfortunate...ness, it's simply the context it's placed within that (probably intentionally) makes it a bit wrong.

 

The most worrying thing is the SW can decide not to take "no" for an answer, and pushes the issue. Now, whether that's a "just messing with you" thing or a serious inquiry thing is up to each individual player to decide from the tone of the SW's VA.

 

But having looked at the male version of the scene... well, that's got the same deal (he can push on the "no couples" part - though she still tells him "no women"). So yeah, ok, I went off half cocked. Don't mind me, I'll just sit over here and shut up now. ;) (Crazy SWTOR player channel turned to mute.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm guessing it's a contextual thing. The Force is life, but one of the primary motivators to maintaining the existence of a species is inherently Dark Side? I don't think so. I think it's more a matter of it being DS when your passion overrules your greater sense of balance, or when it sways you from a more inherently LS path (which probably still doesn't explain the no-DS-for-snogging-Nadia thing).
As far as I know, for the Jedi of this era, it's not so much about sex as it is attachments - Jedi aren't supposed to form them, as they supposedly can lead to stronger emotions/feelings toward one person, and that can lead to the Dark Side.

 

Remember, there's that one mission on Tython where choosing to hide the fact that two padawans are in a relationship gets you DS points. And on an JK mission, saying you care very strongly for Kira gets you DS points, though it also gets you affection with Kira, so I'd say it's an even trade. :D Totally playing my JK as grey because I know I'll be getting DS points for romancing Kira, assuming she's SGR-able.

 

Also, the new Q&A thread is now open. Yes, I know the odds of getting an answer about SGRs there seems slightly less than becoming a millionaire just by going to Las Vegas, but if you don't have any other crucial question to ask, might as well ask about SGRs. Can't have BioWare forgetting we're here, can we? :)

 

(Crazy SWTOR player channel turned to mute.)
Please don't take this the wrong way, but I would totally hug you for that if I could. :p Edited by MusedMoose
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can't have BioWare forgetting we're here, can we? :)

 

Actually, I'd say that's fairly important. If SGRs are implemented, you can bet that BioWare will receive some flak over it. Thus if they receive flak for adding them, but no flak for leaving them out (i.e. supporters of SGR are quiet) then the choice to leave them out becomes easier.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The most worrying thing is the SW can decide not to take "no" for an answer, and pushes the issue. Now, whether that's a "just messing with you" thing or a serious inquiry thing is up to each individual player to decide from the tone of the SW's VA.

 

I do see your point on this and in part I agree. Though to me a more worrying thing would be if the SW could take it PAST the inquiry and Force the matter. If it's just a matter of, 'You can bend your policy for me, can't you? No? Oh well,' then I see that as being benignly dodgy for the most part rather than malevolently dodgy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...