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Did Mace Windu really die?


Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
09.18.2013 , 05:02 AM | #41
Quote: Originally Posted by Doctoglethorpe View Post
Maul didn't need to come back either. What kind of argument is that?

This is a trope of SW now, dead characters come back. This series recycles ideas and characters more then Family Guy.

Sooner or later it will probably happen.
Darth Maul was a relatively unexplored yet popular character who appeared only in one Star Wars film for a very short time. Essentially he was a whole lot of wasted potential. The Clone Wars capitalised on that potential and produced and excellent, fresh and interesting character responsible for, in my opinion, some of the best episodes in the series. And of course fantastically voice acted by Sam Witwer.

If Windu were to come back their would be no place for him, the character has been explored considerably both in the books, the movies and TCW series. There is no further place for him in the Star Wars universe, hence why he is dead.

As a side note the same can be said for Boba as can be said for Maul, pretty much completely unexplored character who barely said a word and then went and died. I can't pretend the like the fact that he crawled out of a Sarlaac pit three times. But heck, at least the character got the exposure he deserved.

So essentially, it doesn't matter if its possible or not. Anything is possible in Star Wars. What matters is what can be gained from brining him back? The answer is nothing. He is therefore not going to come back. End of.

Doctoglethorpe's Avatar


Doctoglethorpe
09.19.2013 , 08:58 PM | #42
So to sum up, Maul died too early, Mace died just right?

That's both entirely subjective and entirely besides my point. It doesn't matter when a character is taken off the stage, this series has proven time and again if a writer decides they want to bring them back, they will. Its the same rehash mentality that gives us repeated reflections of plot elements from the movies, like how popular carbonite freezing apparently is through the galaxy long before (and shortly before) Han was supposedly the first to ever be subjected to it.

Did Sidious need to come back either? One could argue both ways, as they could for Mace or Maul or anyone. The single exception is Vader who Lucas has been pretty adamant in dictating he stay dead (hence not even a false copy-cat being in Dark Empire)

Personally I thought Maul lasted exactly as long as he needed to. He was just an expendable assassin, not a real Sith, his Darth title was a joke and Sidious knew it. He served his usefulness and then got replaced. Done. Bringing him back only diminished Qui-Gon's sacrifice and Obi-Wans first real triumph in order to bring out a laughably short-sighted and short-lived rise only to fall right back off his horse the minute it reached a gallop. He isn't and never was an interesting character imo, I really don't get what people see in him. He's a dummy, a jock of a force user only good as a weapon not as any kind of thinker or leader. And thats exactly what Sidious raised him to be. He didn't want a real apprentice, somebody who could one day threaten his reign, he wanted a tool.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
09.20.2013 , 06:16 AM | #43
Quote: Originally Posted by Doctoglethorpe View Post
So to sum up, Maul died too early, Mace died just right?

That's both entirely subjective and entirely besides my point. It doesn't matter when a character is taken off the stage, this series has proven time and again if a writer decides they want to bring them back, they will. Its the same rehash mentality that gives us repeated reflections of plot elements from the movies, like how popular carbonite freezing apparently is through the galaxy long before (and shortly before) Han was supposedly the first to ever be subjected to it.

Did Sidious need to come back either? One could argue both ways, as they could for Mace or Maul or anyone. The single exception is Vader who Lucas has been pretty adamant in dictating he stay dead (hence not even a false copy-cat being in Dark Empire)

Personally I thought Maul lasted exactly as long as he needed to. He was just an expendable assassin, not a real Sith, his Darth title was a joke and Sidious knew it. He served his usefulness and then got replaced. Done. Bringing him back only diminished Qui-Gon's sacrifice and Obi-Wans first real triumph in order to bring out a laughably short-sighted and short-lived rise only to fall right back off his horse the minute it reached a gallop. He isn't and never was an interesting character imo, I really don't get what people see in him. He's a dummy, a jock of a force user only good as a weapon not as any kind of thinker or leader. And thats exactly what Sidious raised him to be. He didn't want a real apprentice, somebody who could one day threaten his reign, he wanted a tool.
No its not subjective. The fact of the matter is that Maul was a far far less explored character than Windu, and he therefore has more potential as a character - simple as. It is as I said my opinion that Maul did good for the Clone Wars series, but I don't expect everyone to agree on that. But what you can't disagree with is that Maul was a little explored character, and much of his potential was wasted' as there was much much more he could contribute to the franchise. Whether you think those contributions ended up good or not is a matter of opinion.

Though it continues to baffle me how people have so much angst for the franchise when its much more fun to just go ahead an enjoy it. I admit it has flaws but come on people, lighten up. But that's besides the point.

So again, its not ' just a matter of time' before Windu comes back. Because like you said yourself, it will only happen if the writer's want it and because Windu has been so heavily explored and expanded upon, and there is really no place for him in post-ROTJ continuity, he lacks exploitable potential. Its therefore highly unlikely that a writer will sit down and say "hey lets bring Windu back." And if they do I will facepalm.

Did Sidious need to come back? Well he certainly didn't have that much screen time and until the release of Darth Plagueis has been a pretty unexplored character. I can see why I writer would want to bring him back for various reasons i.e. to provide Luke with a powerful villain and to see what the Emperor was capable of i.e. potential.

But I don't agree with it. Just like you don't agree with Maul, but potential is potential and Sidious had it.

P.S. Carbon-freezing had been used before Han Solo correct. However Vader didn't invent it originally either (he's powerful but he's no scientist) what he wanted was the Ugnaunts to modify the current freezing plant that was designed to freeze tibanna gas, so it could work on humans. This is a common misconception

fellblade's Avatar


fellblade
09.20.2013 , 06:57 AM | #44
Quote: Originally Posted by Doctoglethorpe View Post
So to sum up, Maul died too early, Mace died just right?

That's both entirely subjective and entirely besides my point. It doesn't matter when a character is taken off the stage, this series has proven time and again if a writer decides they want to bring them back, they will. Its the same rehash mentality that gives us repeated reflections of plot elements from the movies, like how popular carbonite freezing apparently is through the galaxy long before (and shortly before) Han was supposedly the first to ever be subjected to it.

Did Sidious need to come back either? One could argue both ways, as they could for Mace or Maul or anyone. The single exception is Vader who Lucas has been pretty adamant in dictating he stay dead (hence not even a false copy-cat being in Dark Empire)

Personally I thought Maul lasted exactly as long as he needed to. He was just an expendable assassin, not a real Sith, his Darth title was a joke and Sidious knew it. He served his usefulness and then got replaced. Done. Bringing him back only diminished Qui-Gon's sacrifice and Obi-Wans first real triumph in order to bring out a laughably short-sighted and short-lived rise only to fall right back off his horse the minute it reached a gallop. He isn't and never was an interesting character imo, I really don't get what people see in him. He's a dummy, a jock of a force user only good as a weapon not as any kind of thinker or leader. And thats exactly what Sidious raised him to be. He didn't want a real apprentice, somebody who could one day threaten his reign, he wanted a tool.
All Sidious' Apprentices were the same in his mind
In the book of Sith he mentions Maul, Dooku and Vader in the same breath saying that they were ALL expendable tools and he also said that he had no intention for ANY of them (or anyone ever) to be his successor.
Sidious was obsessed with Immortality and lasting forever....

I think when Maul came back he showed a bit more to himself - and managed to get himself a powerbase from starting with nothing (he had installed himself behind the scenes as the ruler of Mandalore) - Sidious took matters into his own hands to stop this momentum.

Mace is ok but I think that he is a bit too much of an attempt to make a 'bad-***' Jedi - when Jedi don't really need to be bad-asses - it's just not what they are about or strive to be or what is cool about them.
Although I wouldn't mind seeing him as a force ghost.

Maul's popularity probably comes from his look and the fact that he was easily one of the most impressive on-screen fighters in the movie (the fight with him Qui Gon and Obi Wan are many peoples favourite of the entire movie franchise) and some were unsatisfied with what came after....

As someone that likes Maul - I didn't think that they should have brought him back either - but I have to agree that Maul/Savage Opress' was one of the best story arcs of the clone wars series...

Strangely however , with Sith I kind of find them more interesting and mysterious in some ways - the less I see or know about them.....
Quote: Originally Posted by Barringer View Post
Tulak Hord is only an unknown because he killed anyone that has ever seen him fight.

SitHamster's Avatar


SitHamster
09.21.2013 , 04:11 AM | #45
"If dat mother****er Darth Maul managed to came back from the motha****er death, i can *********** do it!"

ilifus's Avatar


ilifus
09.21.2013 , 01:08 PM | #46
Quote: Originally Posted by Slowpokeking View Post
He went to lead the Avengers.
rofl lol
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Foreignobjects's Avatar


Foreignobjects
10.11.2013 , 12:13 AM | #47
Quote: Originally Posted by Lordmird View Post
Just face it, there were just too many snakes on his plane.
Electric Snakes on his plane

Isaacone's Avatar


Isaacone
10.11.2013 , 12:38 AM | #48
Mace Windu hit his head and rendered uncouncious, when he woke up he found himself dared and confused on earth as a man named Jules Winnfield who was partnered up with Vince Vega. After experiencing a near death he somewhat came to his senes so he sent out sent out to find a better life which made him change his name Neville Flynn there after he became an FBI agent and got stuck on a plane with a bunch of snakes on it.
The blow to the head turned him from a ****** jedi to an absolute mother****ing ******.
that made absolutely no sense at all did it.

SitHamster's Avatar


SitHamster
10.11.2013 , 03:19 AM | #49
No, he lived a long life and was later killed by the clone of Fett, in Jango Unchained

UltimateKrucible's Avatar


UltimateKrucible
10.11.2013 , 03:19 PM | #50
I always thought it would have been better if Mace had survived ... but had been mortally wounded.

That way, when Obi and Yoda get to the temple, instead of a short holo showing Anakin figting kids (which they could still have seen later), they are greeted by a dying Mace who tells all that's happened - leaving no doubt about Anakin's treachery and giving Mr Jackson the death scene he deserved.....

Mind you, there's an awful lot I'd change about the prequels......
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Funny post! The nine circles of SW:TOR PvP hell