Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

We Need Clarification

First BioWare Post First BioWare Post

grombrinda's Avatar


grombrinda
07.07.2013 , 03:44 AM | #341
Quote: Originally Posted by Helig View Post
It wasn't the traditionalist approach. It was poor maintainance and development. It is financially viable if the game is good enough to hold those subs. When content is bugged, and half of "new" content is rehashed old content, making people pay for shiny things is the only way to make it profitable.

Which isn't a bad thing to boost the cash - the bad thing is that the development focus seems to be moving away from actual content towards more Cartel BS. It takes them a year to release content that other developers/titles spat out every 4-6 months (EQ2, WoW, just to name a couple), and I always have to assume that the content that is finally released is either horribly bugged, poorly balanced, or, in worst cases, downright unplayable or exploitable. *THIS* is why the game goes F2P, *THIS* is why it bleeds subs. *THIS* is why the community deteriorates. I was practically forced to "downgrade" my playstyle from hardcore to casual because of how little actual endgame content there is and how poorly it's often designed. PvP is pretty much the only thing, gameplay-wise, that keeps me subbed. I play because I'm a Star Wars fan, and because there isn't a better Star Wars MMO on the market.
QFT...sad that many will just try and throw cash at a problem to fix it.
We didn't start the Star Wars,They were already fightin' em,since George was writing them!!

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
07.07.2013 , 04:17 AM | #342
Quote: Originally Posted by Helig View Post
It wasn't the traditionalist approach. It was poor maintainance and development. It is financially viable if the game is good enough to hold those subs. When content is bugged, and half of "new" content is rehashed old content, making people pay for shiny things is the only way to make it profitable.

Which isn't a bad thing to boost the cash - the bad thing is that the development focus seems to be moving away from actual content towards more Cartel BS. It takes them a year to release content that other developers/titles spat out every 4-6 months (EQ2, WoW, just to name a couple), and I always have to assume that the content that is finally released is either horribly bugged, poorly balanced, or, in worst cases, downright unplayable or exploitable. *THIS* is why the game goes F2P, *THIS* is why it bleeds subs. *THIS* is why the community deteriorates. I was practically forced to "downgrade" my playstyle from hardcore to casual because of how little actual endgame content there is and how poorly it's often designed. PvP is pretty much the only thing, gameplay-wise, that keeps me subbed. I play because I'm a Star Wars fan, and because there isn't a better Star Wars MMO on the market.
It's hard to believe that the subscription model is profitable these days because, well, how many big western MMOs have it?

Subs dropped ridiculously after the first month, and then continued to plummet over the course of the next 2-3 months. Even if the game launched with say unbuggy EV and KP, a group finder and no other major issues. I don't think there's any way that the subs would have stayed high enough to provide a strong enough financial platform to continue developing new content.

Casuals who like to buy pretty stuff in shops far outweigh hardcore gamers in volume and value.

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
07.07.2013 , 04:25 AM | #343
Quote: Originally Posted by Hessen View Post
It's hard to believe that the subscription model is profitable these days because, well, how many big western MMOs have it?

Subs dropped ridiculously after the first month, and then continued to plummet over the course of the next 2-3 months. Even if the game launched with say unbuggy EV and KP, a group finder and no other major issues. I don't think there's any way that the subs would have stayed high enough to provide a strong enough financial platform to continue developing new content.

Casuals who like to buy pretty stuff in shops far outweigh hardcore gamers in volume and value.
It seems some people have already forgotten why the game went F2P and want to blame the subs for losing interest in the game.

Was the fact that the game was essentially unfinished when it was launched already forgotten?

Do you remember the green texture lines on planets? The random black flickering? That when your companion healed you, you started glowing green until you relogged? The absolutely horrible, intolerably ridiculous ability delay? Tons of bugged quests, including class quests that you could become stuck on? Sorcerers and Operatives stacking Surge and critting for 9k? Imbalanced classes in warzones and no open world PvP to speak of? The nonsensical gear and commendation system, where you had to rely on random drops from bags?

Very little endgame to speak of, one Operation that was so bugged that bosses kept resetting below 10%? And where you could randomly die for no reason? And the pylons that were so buggy that it took 2 hours to solve them? And falling through the floor in the Soa encounter?

Then in 1.1.5 the fact that all Valor levels were essentially invalidated and Rep base camps farmed in 1 FPS Ilum OWPvP? And 1.2 broke some classes so severely that they remain inferior to this day (Operative DPS, Commando Healer etc.)?

These were the very legitimate reasons the subs quit over and I can hardly blame people who are not hardcore Star Wars fans for leaving. The fact that the game had to go F2P is hardly the subscribers' fault. It's EA's fault for pushing it out for Xmas, when the game in many aspects was nowhere near finished.

EDIT: Had this game been launched with the 1.3 features, I'd bet that it never would have had to go F2P.
BEING A GOOD SOLDIER COMES DOWN TO ONE THING, ONE SINGLE QUESTION:
WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO SACRIFICE?

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
07.07.2013 , 04:30 AM | #344
Quote: Originally Posted by CommanderKeeva View Post
It seems some people have already forgotten why the game went F2P and want to blame the subs for losing interest in the game.

Was the fact that the game was essentially unfinished when it was launched already forgotten?

Do you remember the green texture lines on planets? The random black flickering? That when your companion healed you, you started glowing green until you relogged? The absolutely horrible, intolerably ridiculous ability delay? Tons of bugged quests, including class quests that you could become stuck on? Sorcerers and Operatives stacking Surge and critting for 9k? Imbalanced classes in warzones and no open world PvP to speak of? The nonsensical gear and commendation system, where you had to rely on random drops from bags?

Very little endgame to speak of, one Operation that was so bugged that bosses kept resetting below 10%? And where you could randomly die for no reason? And the pylons that were so buggy that it took 2 hours to solve them? And falling through the floor in the Soa encounter?

Then in 1.1.5 the fact that all Valor levels were essentially invalidated and Rep base camps farmed in 1 FPS Ilum OWPvP? And 1.2 broke some classes so severely that they remain inferior to this day (Operative DPS, Commando Healer etc.)?

These were the very legitimate reasons the subs quit over and I can hardly blame people who are not hardcore Star Wars fans for leaving. The fact that the game had to go F2P is hardly the subscribers' fault. It's EA's fault for pushing it out for Xmas, when the game in many aspects was nowhere near finished.
They didn't exactly flock back after those issues were sorted though. The game went F2P way after the core of the game was fixed and pretty solid.

And I don't think a couple of bugfree operations and a bit more balanced WZ PvP would have majorly affected the subscription rate. As has been seen in other MMOs.

There's a huge amount of MMO jumping about these days. Buy a new MMO, maybe sub for a month, blast through content then moan there's nothing to do. That's not just the real hardcore gamers, but any gamer with a decent amount of time on their hands. Endgame offers nothing new, it's the same sort of carrots with the same gating.

CommanderKeeva's Avatar


CommanderKeeva
07.07.2013 , 05:01 AM | #345
Quote: Originally Posted by Hessen View Post
They didn't exactly flock back after those issues were sorted though. The game went F2P way after the core of the game was fixed and pretty solid.

And I don't think a couple of bugfree operations and a bit more balanced WZ PvP would have majorly affected the subscription rate. As has been seen in other MMOs.

There's a huge amount of MMO jumping about these days. Buy a new MMO, maybe sub for a month, blast through content then moan there's nothing to do. That's not just the real hardcore gamers, but any gamer with a decent amount of time on their hands. Endgame offers nothing new, it's the same sort of carrots with the same gating.
That's the thing about this game. The class stories offer incredible replay value. I played WoW for about idk 7 years and in that time I had two max level characters (one for each faction) because it was just so incredibly boring to do the same thing over and over again. Here, I had 7 max level characters in December, in just one year and now it's up to 10 characters between 50 and 55.

Nearly all of my WoW guild came over to this game but I was left here alone in January, when they all went back to playing WoW due to the astounding amount of bugs and broken PvP and operations. Later, when these bugs were indeed mostly fixed (emphasis on mostly since some persist to this very day), it was too late to restore the reputation of the game, for it was forever sullied.

No one knows what would have happened if EAware allowed this game to be properly tested and completed. I know this for certain because I was beta testing from August to December in 2011 and nearly all the bugs and issues we reported went unfixed into the live edition.

They had a chance to win big but their own ineptitude and greed made them fail. Like I said, the subs are not to be blamed for this.
BEING A GOOD SOLDIER COMES DOWN TO ONE THING, ONE SINGLE QUESTION:
WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO SACRIFICE?

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
07.07.2013 , 05:40 AM | #346
I disagree. I don't think for most people the story offers replayability and was never going to retain a large amount of subs unless all future content was focused on it. The bugs on launch were not that major apart from Endgame being rubbish and a bit of PvP imbalance.

And if people try an MMO on launch and it's buggy, and either don't subscribe and fund it's development or return later on to try it again after the initial bugs are cleared. Then they are, frankly, utter morons.

Makillda's Avatar


Makillda
07.07.2013 , 06:15 AM | #347
Quote: Originally Posted by Hessen View Post
And if people try an MMO on launch and it's buggy, and either don't subscribe and fund it's development or return later on to try it again after the initial bugs are cleared. Then they are, frankly, utter morons.
Terrible grammar and punctuation aside, are you sure this collection of words means what you think it means? First you state that modern MMOers are flighty, game-hopping ADHD patients then say that people are morons for not investing time and money in a buggy game on the hopes that it improves. I sense a contradiction.

People gave this game a chance in the beginning for 2 reasons: It was a Bioware title and it is Star Wars. Those same people, the ones who've stuck it out and invested all this time and money in the game are the ones who are ticked off and disappointed in this decision and the path the game is currently on. Catering to the "mememe, nownownow" crowd will not generate long term viability. Those are the people who will jump ship for the next shiny new game because the box/ad/whatever "looks awesome."

Meanwhile, those of us who've remained loyal, who've stuck it out for the long haul and generate a dependable, steady revenue stream via subs and occasional CM purchases, we're the ones who are being ignored and spat upon when things like the ship parts debacle, Life Day and Treek happen. We want the game to survive and thrive, so much so that we pay our subscription fee each and every month. Unfortunately, the game that we're helping fund (and have been for quite some time) has changed in ways that are contrary to our interests. We want to play the game and earn stuff, even if it takes some time. EAware would rather cater to the Mememes and grab the quick dollar.

I don't blame them, it is a business. Unfortunately, as time goes by, it's a business that a number of players are finding hard to support. But we will continue to support the game, at least for the short term future, for similar reasons why we endured the terrible launch: it is Star Wars and the flicker of hope that this Bioware somehow, someday "gets it."

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
07.07.2013 , 06:17 AM | #348
Quote: Originally Posted by Makillda View Post
Terrible grammar and punctuation aside, are you sure this collection of words means what you think it means? First you state that modern MMOers are flighty, game-hopping ADHD patients then say that people are morons for not investing time and money in a buggy game on the hopes that it improves. I sense a contradiction.
Why a contradiction? Both are true.

Royox's Avatar


Royox
07.07.2013 , 08:47 AM | #350
Quote: Originally Posted by astrobearx View Post
1 mil isn't hard to get, in fact i have 3 lvl 50-55s and run dailies everyday, i can make 1 mil within a week (5 days at least). beside, are you guys the "we got to earn it" cword? i would assume you working hard and saving a 1 mil for treek would be rewarding because after all, you worked so hard to get it,right?

But I worked SO HARD to get Legacy LVL 40...now I have to work hard AGAIN to be able to pay 1.000.000 credits.

The casual player only has to "click" and they will have it. I really hope the eewok to cost 5.000 CC to see all of you crying about the price.


Again...what's the point of being legacy lvl 40 if now I have to pay 1.000.000??