I'm not certain if the mechanic is working as intended in 16m, but in 8m Hardmode the fearful mechanic in this fight is completely bugged.

When Toth jumps to Zorn, ranged dps should not be affected by fearful so long as they're 30 meters (max range) from the impact radius. However, this is simply not the case. Our Sorc DPS died constantly last night, while at max range every time. Due to receiving fearful when he shouldn't have been. Thus his DoT's killing him because they were already on Zorn prior to the leap.

This bug has also been confirmed by numerous guilds over at sithwarrior.com

(located here: http://mmo-mechanics.com/swtor/forums/Thread-EC-Zorn-and-Toth-Hard-Mode)

Please fix this. It's incredibly frustrating. And requires any non-sniper ranged to constantly run beyond 30 meters, resulting in a significant loss of Dps on Zorn throughout the fight.

I'm not certain if the mechanic is working as intended in 16m, but in 8m Hardmode the fearful mechanic in this fight is completely bugged.

 

When Toth jumps to Zorn, ranged dps should not be affected by fearful so long as they're 30 meters (max range) from the impact radius. However, this is simply not the case. Our Sorc DPS died constantly last night, while at max range every time. Due to receiving fearful when he shouldn't have been. Thus his DoT's killing him because they were already on Zorn prior to the leap.

 

This bug has also been confirmed by numerous guilds over at sithwarrior.com

 

(located here: http://mmo-mechanics.com/swtor/forums/Thread-EC-Zorn-and-Toth-Hard-Mode)

 

Please fix this. It's incredibly frustrating. And requires any non-sniper ranged to constantly run beyond 30 meters, resulting in a significant loss of Dps on Zorn throughout the fight.

We were seeing this last night in 16man HM... what I saw was that the fearful debuff would be applied BEFORE Toth jumped... so if we were within 30m of Zorn when Toth turned to jump to Zorn, we would get debuff... The way we worked around that was to have our melee call out when Toth was 1-2% above jump threshhold (i.e. 92%) and Ranged would move out well beyond 30 m BEFORE he turned to jump... The adverse effect is that we were running into enrage timers mainly because Ranged spent more time off target......

We were seeing this last night in 16man HM... what I saw was that the fearful debuff would be applied BEFORE Toth jumped... so if we were within 30m of Zorn when Toth turned to jump to Zorn, we would get debuff... The way we worked around that was to have our melee call out when Toth was 1-2% above jump threshhold (i.e. 92%) and Ranged would move out well beyond 30 m BEFORE he turned to jump... The adverse effect is that we were running into enrage timers mainly because Ranged spent more time off target......

Indeed we were running into that same problem as well. Ranged DPS (minus a sniper in our case) were losing valuable DPS having to constantly run out.

I guess it's both 8m and 16m that are bugged. I'm hoping they fix this asap, but I guess I shouldn't be holding my breath.

We were seeing this last night in 16man HM... what I saw was that the fearful debuff would be applied BEFORE Toth jumped... so if we were within 30m of Zorn when Toth turned to jump to Zorn, we would get debuff... The way we worked around that was to have our melee call out when Toth was 1-2% above jump threshhold (i.e. 92%) and Ranged would move out well beyond 30 m BEFORE he turned to jump... The adverse effect is that we were running into enrage timers mainly because Ranged spent more time off target......

This has always been the case. Zorn can cast Fearful before Toth leaps. Watch the health percentages.

I have experienced this on a sorc as well in 8m HM. I am glad to see that other people are seeing this. Was getting a little tired of people saying "No, your doing it wrong, L2P and stay 25+ meters back."

There is another thread about this too.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=431448

Yep we experienced the same bug regarding Fearful. It seems quite dodgy, like if you stay around the max range it seems to work in favor of avoiding it but if you move out of the range of Fearful by a large margin you will still sometimes get it.

Another bug I have noticed is, that Mental Anguish and Weakened were applied even though the boss was turned around to the wall with his backside facing the raid group when he was doing his Shriek. It feels a bit like Bonethrasher's 3D model not actually facing in the direction the gaming logic is actually calculating with all over again.

Edit: we were doing 8man HM.

We saw some very wonky things too.

As others have said, it seemed like getting MORE distance seemed to almost guarantee ranged would get hit.

We tank Zorn by the tree and Toth at the cave mouth and I noticed when i tank Zorn with me facing Toth we seem to more reliably avoid the debuff. When I stand between my ranged/healer as one person pointed out, we almost always get 1-2 people hit by the debuff.

I don't mind the tight mechanics regarding positioning, but something is strange and it feels like with heals as short in this game as they are, shortening the distance of the abilities could help some with this "weirdness".

We had some issues with this too, both tonight and on tuesday 16man and 8man.

Some said it can be down to the game not updating your position, and a jump or little strafe can help update your psotion. I dont really understand, it's just what I'm told.

Nonetheless the fact that so many are having this issue - something is definitely wrong.

In the end we sort of worked around it by tanking Toth so that he's further behind on his side of wall, so that when he jumps he jumps behind Zorn (even further away from the ranged than Zorn himself). This seemed to work, as on those attempts none of the ranged got the debuff.

The downside is that this kinda ****s with overall raid positioning, making life a bit awkward when it came to healers and ranged dps having to take the yellow circle to Toth during his mini-enrages.

We had some issues with this too, both tonight and on tuesday 16man and 8man.

 

Some said it can be down to the game not updating your position, and a jump or little strafe can help update your psotion. I dont really understand, it's just what I'm told.

 

Nonetheless the fact that so many are having this issue - something is definitely wrong.

 

In the end we sort of worked around it by tanking Toth so that he's further behind on his side of wall, so that when he jumps he jumps behind Zorn (even further away from the ranged than Zorn himself). This seemed to work, as on those attempts none of the ranged got the debuff.

The downside is that this kinda ****s with overall raid positioning, making life a bit awkward when it came to healers and ranged dps having to take the yellow circle to Toth during his mini-enrages.

Our problem is even when our Sorc backed off before jumps he still was sometimes hit with the debuff and then hits DoTs would smoke him. We had positioning that alleviated some issues, but during the red circle rock phase the tank has no choice but to dance and if Toth Jumps before positioning is perfect again the ranged are oft0en -hung out to dry. I'd be fine with just really tough mechanics, but our sorc has made sure to stay at 28+ yards with his range finder and still getting hit.

Sigh.

People still aren't listening. It's not bugged. Ever since we adjusted our strategy we've never had a single person "randomly get it".... Unless they were running from red ground reticules and got too close to the bosses. (Essentially, unless someone screws up, they won't get it.)

The caviot is that the debuff is applied based on WHERE TOTH LANDS, not where Zorn is. You have to design your strategy so that you control where Toth lands, and make it look something like this.

.........(ZORN)(TANK)............

...............................................................................Ranged DPS

..........XXXXX..........

.........(ZORN)(TANK)............

...............................................................................Ranged DPS

XXXX -- TOTH LANDS HERE

If you do this, you will never get the debuff.

For reference, I posted our positioning here near the bottom of the page:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=425701&page=6

We were running into the same problem on 16 Hard Mode as well. However we changed up our strategy a bit and are not having any problems. We didn't down it the first week but we've killed them the last 2 weeks using our new strategy.

Edit: Wanted to add that the last two weeks we have killed it on 16 man hard mode with no deaths on Toth/Zorn.

Edit 2: Just noticed what Zenofire above my post said. That's what we started doing as well and it's working fine. I don't think the fight is bugged.

We had this "issue" but fixed it easily, just split the DPS into two groups and have them all target switch when fearful is cast. works all the time

Kinda difficult with DoT's still up on one of the bosses.

I find this as a tank one of the best fights in the new content. Guild I am in has downed this every week on Hard mode since 1.2 released. We've had no bugs, if you're failing it's a L2P issue. Don't mean to sound cocky or arrogant, but really this fight isn't bugged. It took us 3 nights of 6 hours attempts to learn this fight, now we go in and 1 shot this, tanks and minesweeper boss every Tuesday night.

Video of us downing it:

We had this "issue" but fixed it easily, just split the DPS into two groups and have them all target switch when fearful is cast. works all the time

This is a waste of time.

Get better positioning and it's not necessary.

Dots that are up on the boss before he casts fearful will not trigger the damage. Any dots cast after fearful is up will.

Also

Most dps have those BIS trinkets that have a chance to proc damage on hit. The damage from that trinket will return fearful damage to you, and the trinket can proc from dots put up on the boss before fearful was cast.

the trinkets will also cause wipes on firebrand and storm caller. BIS trinkets are a hindrance/Liability in the first 2 fights in the new instance....Great design bioware.

yes, you can position your raid to avoid the fearful debuff all together, but the debuff shouldn't be killing anybody if the get it.

There are bugs in this fight regarding this debuff no matter how good your positioning is. Just because you don't see them in 3 weeks doesn't mean they don't exist.

Last night, our tanks started getting rooted in place, had their buffs removed, and couldn't attack until the boss did a knock-back. First time we'd seen it in a month of tries. Stop trying to sound cool and start trying to help.

There are bugs in this fight regarding this debuff no matter how good your positioning is. Just because you don't see them in 3 weeks doesn't mean they don't exist.

 

Last night, our tanks started getting rooted in place, had their buffs removed, and couldn't attack until the boss did a knock-back. First time we'd seen it in a month of tries. Stop trying to sound cool and start trying to help.

Bioware can tell you that many of the "bugs" reported are people just being ignorant of mechanics. There are going to be a few occasions where someone has something buggy happened, but unless they can post a combat log or a video to prove it, it's most likely just them sucking and lying about it... or just being ignorant.

Ever noticed how many times people have posted that the first boss in EV nightmare mode is bugged because occasionally a non tank gets one shot? These same people don't know you need to control the top of the threat table. It would seem like a bug without that knowledge, but I assure you, the debuff for zorn and toth is working fine. When someone in your raid says "I got the debuff" when they're attacking Zorn, it means either your positioning is bad or that player made a mistake.

Bioware can tell you that many of the "bugs" reported are people just being ignorant of mechanics. There are going to be a few occasions where someone has something buggy happened, but unless they can post a combat log or a video to prove it, it's most likely just them sucking and lying about it... or just being ignorant.

 

Ever noticed how many times people have posted that the first boss in EV nightmare mode is bugged because occasionally a non tank gets one shot? These same people don't know you need to control the top of the threat table. It would seem like a bug without that knowledge, but I assure you, the debuff for zorn and toth is working fine. When someone in your raid says "I got the debuff" when they're attacking Zorn, it means either your positioning is bad or that player made a mistake.

This guy is full of win. Can I join your guild?

Its not bugged, just like when someone derps and supposedly lags during every red circle. After we benched all the players who couldn't master that mechanic we killed him easily. If someone gets fearful its due to bad positioning, either on the tanks side or the dps side (Rethink strat / positioning time imo.)

We run 2 raid groups, 8 man and 16 man, and have been killing these guys on both since the first week of 1.2 on live, and also in both operations on the PTR for weeks before that.

We have never had someone get the debuff who was doing what he was supposed to be doing. Ever.

It sounds to me like your sorc doesn't want to admit he messed up and is trying to blame it on a nonexistant bug.