Also the 3k vicious slashes, those are nice as well. The damage is acceptable because rage is very squishy. Gotta make up for it somehow.

squishy?! maybe as a jug but not as a marauder u still have the lol cloak of pain and rofl undying rage.

and yes i have seen smash monkeys crit me for 5 to 6k with smash followed by a 3 to 4k force scream.

Therein lays the problem. By allowing this to happen it skews their matrixes and renders any balance completely out of line. Min/Maxing should not be allowed. Armor, Mods, and Enhancements for each AC should be locked to that type. Example, a Force Master component will only work in the gear it came with or with all the components as a whole. They have the ability to lock the armor to each piece; they can do the same for all of it. Conversely, any time that you mix match these pieces in PvE gear, you lose the bonuses. Likewise, PvE components should not be allowed to work with any PvP components.

 

They designed these components for a reason, balance. All these components should be restricted to working together to obtain the bonuses, not just the armor. And now that EWH belts and bracers are modable, those can be included in this too. Players taking it upon themselves to exploit the numbers by min/maxing their gear should be penalized for doing so. Then I bet you’ll see the numbers coming more inline and help restore the balance between the classes better.

Yeah um no... The stock EWH Weaponmaster set would give me 519 crit. That's just silly. They don't make the gear the way they do because they consider that optimized, they purposely make it un-optimized to drag the grind out a little longer. I agree that when a particular spec can completely ignore crit, something is broken. But being forced to wear their horribly un-optimized gear as-is, is not the answer.

Yeah um no... The stock EWH Weaponmaster set would give me 519 crit. That's just silly. They don't make the gear the way they do because they consider that optimized, they purposely make it un-optimized to drag the grind out a little longer. I agree that when a particular spec can completely ignore crit, something is broken. But being forced to wear their horribly un-optimized gear as-is, is not the answer.

It is the answer because everyone is given one to wear. Developers don't design game mechanics and gear without a purpose behind it. The totality of it is balance. This balance is translated via gear each AC wears. When everyone wears the stock gear they will have the same stats as required for the chosen ACs. Tank gear for tanks, DPS gear for DPS and so on. This means their stats for PvP will be equal. Then it comes down to the player's skill and experience.

In the case of those LOLsmashers, they are exploiting the system by overloading their gear with power and surge while neglecting critical all because one ability auto-crits. Because they have overloaded on the two secondary stats, they have artificially increased the damage that was never intended to be. This is an exploit pure and simple, one that BW needs to address immediately. Therefore, they need to remove the ability to min/max armor in such a manner that anyone who does will suffer because of the loss of expertise and bonuses.

Some people believe that by reducing their expertise in favor of boosting main and secondary stats helps them by increasing their damage output. While that may be true to an extent, it does not help them with dealing with someone who has maxed expertise. Case in point, with wearing all augmented WH gear, EWH belt and bracers, and EWH artifacts, my Expertise is 1396, the maximum amount achievable. Comparing my stats to a guild mate’s Assassin, he discovered that I was able to mitigate more damage and cause more damage than his toon based on expertise alone.

My damage boost for PvP is 25.30% and damage reduction 20.19%. His expertise is 1050 with a damage boost 20% and damage reduction of 17%. Therefore, using BW own formula, my damage baseline damage ability in PvP is 8.30% without any of my mods from my tree. My damage reduction negates his damage boost before my damage reduction abilities from my spec. This is baseline, so when you add the boosts to the equation, my damage will be at least 8% higher or more and my damage reduction will eat into his damage ability because his damage boost is negated by my baseline. This is why I can stand up to any AC in a WZ one on one.

Today I was hit by a LOLsmasher Sentinel; his best sweep hit me for 4.3k after his build up. My Static Barrier absorbed that hit and went off. I opened range on him after hitting him with Affliction and Crushing Darkness and kitted him with FL, Shock, CL, and LS all before he was able to close range on me. When he leaped to me again, my Static Barrier was up again. I was able to force him off of me and run somewhere else because he could not kill me. This was one on one. I dare say had it be 2 on 1, I may have taken down one before going, but not both. I attribute this to my skill and my maxed level of expertise. I am sure had he not been in min/max gear, it would’ve been a different story.

It is a fallacy to believe that by lowering your expertise down to 950, 1050, 1100, or 1200 will give you the boost you need. What it does is give those who have the maximum level of expertise the ability to survive and do more baseline damage.

Min/Maxing gear bypassing design specifications the developers put into this game is an exploit, period. Therefore, it should be stopped. You do this by making all the armor, mods, and enhancements work in tandem to maintain the set bonuses. Furthermore, specific gear like War Lord, Vengeance, Mystic, Survivor, and so on, should be tied into the stance these players have active. If you’re wearing Vengeance armoring, mods, and enhancements in a War Lord armoring, they should not work because they are not in the original armor they came from and the stance active. The fact that the gear can be installed in orange modable gear isn’t a problem either. Because it is specifically assigned to an armor section and a specific stance and/or spec, min/maxing will negate the bonuses and frankly, cause a person to lose 50% of their total expertise, not just a little here or there.

There are a number of things they can do to stop the exploitation going on by players that do not except the design specification put out by the developers. It comes down to cheating the system because you can. That is wrong and it needs to be addressed immediately. You and other may not want to hear this, but the truth of the matter is you are exploiting this to gain an advantage where the developers never intended to be. Simply put, you are cheating the game with this exloit because you can. That, in my book, is inexcusable and wrong.

OVER 9000.

 

Nah but seriously. Given your stats, right on average. My toon could whack you for over 7.

 

 

 

Why don't you counter by popping hydraulic overrides to kite him, tag him with a thermal detonator while you have distance, jet boost back in and finish him off with an auto crit 90% armor pen free railshot?

 

But srsly again. A full power stacked rage mara has about a 21% chance to crit you with his force scream and a 36% chance to crit with his vicious throw. So the chance of a 6k smash + 4k scream + 5k execute is about 7.2% not taking into account all other factors. It's kind of like when you get lucky and get a 5k railshot + 5k thermal det + 2k flameburst + 5k railshot.

I see some stacked adrenals and other cds there and the sorc has no cds up not saying it was but alot of these big numbers are padded..

squishy?! maybe as a jug but not as a marauder u still have the lol cloak of pain and rofl undying rage.

 

and yes i have seen smash monkeys crit me for 5 to 6k with smash followed by a 3 to 4k force scream.

You mean I don't have an lolcamo to wait out the cloak of pain and an lolstun to counter undying rage? Say it isn't so!

The force cream isn't a guaranteed crit though. You're thinking of combat/carnage.

I can't remember the exact number but I was smahed for between 6,9K and 7,0K in 1396 expertise (I believe it was something like 6924). On top of this we have dispatch for 4,8K and a bunch of other crazy big hits in more or less every game. Giving away WH just made things worse because now we're getting smashed for +6K by every mara on the field. There used to be some balance through gear disparity, which is a horrible way or balancing but really helped sorcs, but that's gone now.

Also the 3k vicious slashes, those are nice as well. The damage is acceptable because rage is very squishy. Gotta make up for it somehow.

And sage/sorc isnt? Or is having to put 19 points into a tree no pvp sorc/sage is interested in for an ability that everyone hates making up for it?

I can't remember the exact number but I was smahed for between 6,9K and 7,0K in 1396 expertise (I believe it was something like 6924). On top of this we have dispatch for 4,8K and a bunch of other crazy big hits in more or less every game. Giving away WH just made things worse because now we're getting smashed for +6K by every mara on the field. There used to be some balance through gear disparity, which is a horrible way or balancing but really helped sorcs, but that's gone now.

 

And sage/sorc isnt? Or is having to put 19 points into a tree no pvp sorc/sage is interested in for an ability that everyone hates making up for it?

Sages and Sorcs have 30m range. Melee leaps to you simply stun or slow, then kite them. Too many players of these ACs like to get in everyone's face, you're not melee. This isnt pre nerf where you could facetank everyone. Use your range you have it for a reason. Smash bombers don't have range so they will have higher burst to compensate for their squishiness. You have tools for survival, use them.

Wow, love those 31/31/31 specs.

You do realize that the big force scream hits come from carnage/combat, and that a hybrid of carnage/rage that could acquire the big force scream hits, would be gimped in smash/sweep damage and set-up? (They would lose the top 2 talents of the tree, force crush for shockwave build, and resonance for increased force crit damage. So they could only really use force choke to build shockwave then, and would do overall less damage even when they finally did smash.)

 

Everybody should agree that smash/sweep needs an adjustment, just as bubble-stun does. But presenting inaccurate data as your facts does nothing to help your cause. I am also pretty sure we didn't need another "nerf smash" thread, the other 3000 are more than enough....

ive hit my storm at 3.8k while focus and wm. bs on combat is what 20% more? i forget

bs/scream still hits hard if it crits. ive seen juggs scream at me for 5k. pretty sure they dont have a combat tree

Sages and Sorcs have 30m range. Melee leaps to you simply stun or slow, then kite them. Too many players of these ACs like to get in everyone's face, you're not melee. This isnt pre nerf where you could facetank everyone. Use your range you have it for a reason. Smash bombers don't have range so they will have higher burst to compensate for their squishiness. You have tools for survival, use them.

You do not have a ranged class and fought against 2+ coordinated smashers. That's when the spec's imbalance begins to show.

but exploiting CC is totally fine, 2 or more targets with improved bubble on them, can shutdown multiple players just by timing it with vent. CC as in every MMO i have played in is the big thing. Oh my GOD we can't take mods and enhancements out of gear that we have farmed for forever; but a spec where i can just right click a buff, gimmie a break... most players that actually pvp know who to target after playing them enough and know not to cluster together... tons of MMO's have their, "cleave," teams but no one thinks to question the assassins/shadows with their ability to totally ignore tech and force abilites which includes stuns and damage based on, or sorcs/sages with their bubble spec's which chains cc with little added to your resolve, lets just target an ability that can't be spammed just because they have too much burst. The most ironic of this is smash's radius is tiny compared to most abilities and lag will save you from it, if you are actually stupid enough to, "go there." Really? If you are good, it is avoidable, especially when there is an objective.

Lets not forget that the game has objectives in it. And just because a class has one ability that can automatically crit once every, what how many seconds, yes folks it ain't spamable doesnt break any team. And last I checked there isn't a king of the hill mode in SWTOR. OMG I don't have the gear to cope with a rage spec jugg or maddie, well maybe you should have saved cc or got ready for it. CC stops people from capping or from taking a node or from defending a node: cc slows the enemy from grabbing what you already taken but lets not talk about that, it isn't game breaking... awesome community.

BUT THEY HIT ME SOOO HARD, dude there are abilities in this game that aren't fixed at all, such as a merc's jet boost it doesnt hit people above them or below them but a sorcs/sages punt can... interesting. That is NEVER exploited in this game. Anyways rants are *********** hilarious but why do we need to beat a dead horse. Nubs have been talking about this forever and honestly if they are going to nerf a class why can't it be a bubble specced sorc/sage, or a i'm not effected by anything but normal attack assassin/shadow. Honestly I can see a reason to fix bugs like i suggested but there is a lot of things that could be nerfed or buffed, i would just enjoy people just playing because it's fun and understand that if they hit you that hard they spent a ton of time collecting what they needed to do it.

Sages and Sorcs have 30m range. Melee leaps to you simply stun or slow, then kite them. Too many players of these ACs like to get in everyone's face, you're not melee. This isnt pre nerf where you could facetank everyone. Use your range you have it for a reason. Smash bombers don't have range so they will have higher burst to compensate for their squishiness. You have tools for survival, use them.

It's, atleast in a warzone with other players in the mix, harder to maintain the gap than to close it so a kiting class is not at an advantage. Hence, it's unreasonable that the melee has 2-3 abilties, one of the being an AOE (to make things worse), that hit harder than the hardest hitting ability of the ranged.

yes it makes sense that a melee class with less CC than a ranged class has a little more burst than the norm because guess what, he wont be able to do anything. If you are ranged and can't kill melee, that means A) you already killed one. B) You are stupid and are just pushing buttons and keybindings that look ROFL KICK *** or C) or hey i already CC'ed two melee'ers now i'm g01ng f0r m4 th14d.

Honestly, if a ranged player can't take out a melee'r then he needs to think, does he out gear me? does he out spec me? does he out class me? Almost every class has a decent spec for pvp, and almost every player has an ohh that is perfect for me spec just use one or the other. If you are out classed, learn from it, if you are out geared, you will get there; and if you are beaten by graphic lag, get a better computer; if you are beaten by cheats, just report it.

yes it makes sense that a melee class with less CC than a ranged class has a little more burst than the norm because guess what, he wont be able to do anything. If you are ranged and can't kill melee, that means A) you already killed one. B) You are stupid and are just pushing buttons and keybindings that look ROFL KICK *** or C) or hey i already CC'ed two melee'ers now i'm g01ng f0r m4 th14d.

 

Honestly, if a ranged player can't take out a melee'r then he needs to think, does he out gear me? does he out spec me? does he out class me? Almost every class has a decent spec for pvp, and almost every player has an ohh that is perfect for me spec just use one or the other. If you are out classed, learn from it, if you are out geared, you will get there; and if you are beaten by graphic lag, get a better computer; if you are beaten by cheats, just report it.

OVER 9000.

 

Why don't you counter by popping hydraulic overrides to kite him, tag him with a thermal detonator while you have distance, jet boost back in and finish him off with an auto crit 90% armor pen free railshot?

 

.

Gonna just assume this is a joke and go about my day.

You do not have a ranged class and fought against 2+ coordinated smashers. That's when the spec's imbalance begins to show.

Two coordinated smashers will kill anyone. It's not just ranged. You shouldn't have a problem with just one however, they're squishy.

You do not have a ranged class and fought against 2+ coordinated dps

Fixed.

Are you by any chance playing this game in Narnia? You must be since everything is seemingly coming to a halt as you are kiting melees in warzones. In the real world, where I play, I'm instantly slowed, stunned or cc'ed by a second enemy if I'm being seen running around. The alternative is to run away from the objective and whatever I was doing and then we're back to how melee, most often a smasher, expects everyone to leave as a counter measure to what they can do.

I guess you're not in reality either, most people focus fire the meleer, usually because he is the closest and first thing they saw, or because he attacked a healer. You don't play in the real world, you want a class that beats two on one? Well why don't you design one.

6k...that's nothing.

Yeah my buddy the other night in a rated warzone hit a merc with a force sweep for 8500. 6100s are pretty standard tbh.