The problem is that the source of the imbalance is not bad players or even lack of communication. It isn't even the absence of healers as you earlier suggested . . . it is gear imbalance, plain and simple. Of course, players who enjoy the success of premades would LIKE to believe its because of their superior skill -- social, tactical, strategic, or mastery of their class and understand of other classes -- and thus they come onto this forum and tell everyone to learn2play. But the reality is premades tend to be collections of players whose gear makes them elite, they then band together for the ultimate steroidal power trip. You see another elite player, you invite him to the group, and eventually you have a group of nothing but elite geared players reaping destruction upon anything in their path.

 

Give everyone the same gear, however, and really the whole phenomena of a group of elite geared players vs poorly geared players goes away, problem solved. Unfortunately, this won't happen because Bioware believes they need to have some system of reward in place so that players feel PvP is worth their time.

Nop. The real fix is real matchmaking too for regular warzones. People who often play on premade will be on top normally will be on top, and people who doesn't won't. You can also add a coefficient to multiply the average of the team queueing depending on the group size.

The problem is that the source of the imbalance is not bad players or even lack of communication. It isn't even the absence of healers as you earlier suggested . . . it is gear imbalance, plain and simple. Of course, players who enjoy the success of premades would LIKE to believe its because of their superior skill -- social, tactical, strategic, or mastery of their class and understand of other classes -- and thus they come onto this forum and tell everyone to learn2play. But the reality is premades tend to be collections of players whose gear makes them elite, they then band together for the ultimate steroidal power trip. You see another elite player, you invite him to the group, and eventually you have a group of nothing but elite geared players reaping destruction upon anything in their path.

 

Give everyone the same gear, however, and really the whole phenomena of a group of elite geared players vs poorly geared players goes away, problem solved. Unfortunately, this won't happen because Bioware believes they need to have some system of reward in place so that players feel PvP is worth their time.

The gear imbalance is next to nonexistent at this point. The differences between WH an EWH are extremely small. So the argument that it is a gear issue is a bad one, for the most part. I will say that those that are unwilling to augment their gear bring whatever pain is coming on themselves.

An organized PuG can, and they do, defeat premades all the time. What it takes are players that are willing to communicate, play to the objectives, and show some situational awareness.

The gear imbalance is next to nonexistent at this point. The differences between WH an EWH are extremely small. So the argument that it is a gear issue is a bad one, for the most part. I will say that those that are unwilling to augment their gear bring whatever pain is coming on themselves.

 

An organized PuG can, and they do, defeat premades all the time. What it takes are players that are willing to communicate, play to the objectives, and show some situational awareness.

Not a competent one, no. My premade was something like 99-2. And that was with us rotating players in and out constantly, until everyone got bored and quit this game.

OMG this thread....

Either premades make up the majority of the player base, and therefore jacking up their queue will make most of them leave. So you would be making PvP more enjoyable for the people who play it THE LEAST. Which is just not sound business strategy. (Neither is it the way adults should behave in regard to competition, unless they are running a pee-wee soccer league, but whatever)

-or-

Premades make up a very small portion of the player base, and therefore YOU CAN'T BE RUNNING INTO THEM EVERY MATCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Until someone can disprove that logic, then everything in this thread is BS.

I've followed this thread for quite some time while playing and seldom see people ask the question:

If a half premade is fully maxed out in gear, why do they continue to play in non-ranked warzones?

Shouldn't non-ranked warzone be a segway to getting picked up in a guild/team that will play ranked wz for Champion, Centurion, or Battlemaster comms? Accumulation of those mentioned comms can only be obtained in ranked war zones.

To use the Analogy of High school :

Imagine the seniors weren't allowed to graduate and decided to repeatedly keep down freshman, sophomores, & juniors that tried to progress. It's a very Darwinian thing happening currently in the warzones. A ceiling has been reached and instead of taking the harder road of doing ranked wz's these well established premades farm the non ranked wz's. Yeah we don't mind when we get on their team on the rare occasion but more often we are facing them as opponents.

So that is my 2 cents. It doesn't insult anyone only puts a clear perspective on the current demographic of non-ranked warzones.

Devs: Embellish the reward/medal content of ranked and you will see threads like this fade away.

I still solo Pug, and I still love going against premades. Today Had a great voidstar in a pug vs a 4 man Unicorn Stampede. We got to the 2nd room like 20 seconds before them. Most of my most fun warzones come against premades. If its true that they are getting rid of premades from solo queue warzones It will destroy all the fun in solo queuing. I mean you learn way more from playing good players then you ever will from playing against bads.

Just my opinion but premades are needed in regular warzones.

Jenna'syyde

this thread just needs to die

It lives IGOR!!!! It LIVES!!!

this thread just needs to die

It cannot and will not go away until Bioware implements cross-server queues and a proper match-making system. Until then, you'll just see frustrated puggers come here and complain about their losses.

But Bioware brought this on itself really.

It cannot and will not go away until Bioware implements cross-server queues and a proper match-making system. Until then, you'll just see frustrated puggers come here and complain about their losses.

 

But Bioware brought this on itself really.

fully agree, PVP became a matter of luck because if i get with a premade group from a good guild then its a win otherwise its 90% a lose so why should i bother even PVP.

have you tried getting good? problem is no one cares. they are not going to stop people from getting in a group in a MMO. if you cant win against a premade make a premade and l2pvp correctly

making a premade vs. not doing so has nothing whatsoever to do with pvping correctly. fyi: there be some horrid premades that definitely don't pvp "correctly."

have you tried getting good? problem is no one cares. they are not going to stop people from getting in a group in a MMO. if you cant win against a premade make a premade and l2pvp correctly

Guessing you got a good group of friends that you pvp with. That is nice. But, not all have the same advantage... L2pvp correctly?.. You can be the most skilled player and have the best gear..but not even you can do anything against a group of 4 or 5 that are locking you down stomping you..Targeting people one by one..Organized kill list

You make me laugh.. No one cares? Theres alot of threads on this same subject and this thread is get close to 3000 posts..But yea no one cares..lol

 

Guessing you got a good group of friends that you pvp with. That is nice. But, not all have the same advantage... L2pvp correctly?.. You can be the most skilled player and have the best gear..but not even you can do anything against a group of 4 or 5 that are locking you down stomping you..Targeting people one by one..Organized kill list

I got crappy friends, thats why I solo queue. That way when my 7 strangers end up being horrible I have no issues blasting them for it. If I queued with my friends I'd feel bad for yelling at them. Personally I don't care about someones actual game playing ability, Just their complete lack of wanting to win or trying to win.

I also like to Solo queue over premades so I can quit if I load into a warzone with people on my do not play warzones with (sort of like premading I guess) But seriously If they remove premades from the solo queue it will ruin solo queue pvp. Maybe thats OK with you but its not for me.

I'm a bit of a DICK so it can be hard for me to get 3 other equally determined players to queue with. And I will refuse to queue up only with the bads who cry aboot premades. I mean I dread to even think aboot how bad the solo queue league would be if they removed the premades.

Jenna'syyde

Why do you guys make posts like this? There is no such thing as a "premade" in this game. If i'm rolling with a group of 4 friends and we are the best players on the server.. and we get grouped with 4 of the worst players on the server... - we aren't going to do much facerolling. How is that a "premade"? The game simply allows friends to group together.

They aren't changing this. Confirmed personally to me by bioware. Stop whining.

It cannot and will not go away until Bioware implements cross-server queues and a proper match-making system. Until then, you'll just see frustrated puggers come here and complain about their losses.

 

But Bioware brought this on itself really.

might i suggest one of the following:

- get better

- make friends

- join a PvP guild

else, you are going to continue to be sorely disappointed

Why do you guys make posts like this? There is no such thing as a "premade" in this game. If i'm rolling with a group of 4 friends and we are the best players on the server.. and we get grouped with 4 of the worst players on the server... - we aren't going to do much facerolling. How is that a "premade"? The game simply allows friends to group together.

You can synch queue with another group of 4 and most times you'll all get into the same WZ together. There's also those times when a good group of 4 will get paired with another good group of 4. For PUGs, that's usually a disadvantage they can't overcome.

Just thought I'd drop my 2 cents in on this topic.

To clear a few things up:

*I am part of a PvP guild

*I solo queue most nights until about 10pm my time (as that is when kids are in bed and I am able to play for a while without AFKing)

*I regularly see people from other PvP guilds solo queueing almost as often as I see them in groups.

This is my perspective on this whole issue, but feel it has been lost somewhere in the QQ about premades. The main reason why I joined a PvP guild and like grouping with like-minded people is not because I like to 'roflstomp' people or make their gaming experience a nightmare but it is because playing on the team of the god awful mouthbreathers is like smashing my face against a brick wall; not fun in the slightest.

I honestly believe most genuine people who play and enjoy PvP do it for the challenge; but those same people when they are forced to group with the absolutely atrocious won't continue to play. And, I am sad to say it, but most people who complain about 'premades' (case in point this one from last night while PuGing someone thought it a great idea to comment 'Damn those XXXXXX [insert premade group's guild name] cross-healing each other' - as if healing is a no-no or something) are the terribads that those in premades are trying to avoid.

Logically, if they are running in a group of 4 they only need to worry about carrying 4 of the bads instead of 6-7.

Additionally, many of you are likely wondering 'Why don't you just do ranked?'. Couple of reasons, really: time, harder to have 8 people of the right class balance and make-up to form a team (yes, certain classes / specs are preferable over others ... it's not all get 8 people and run rated situation), no teams to go up against - on my server there are few PvP guilds that do rated anymore as the player-base is so low and there is no cross-server queues so pride gets in the way after a few losses.

TL;DR Sometimes people run in 'premades' or groups of friends, as I like to call them, because they are trying desperately to minimize their chances of playing with the inept to save themselves the frustration.

Fine pionts Attrum but regardless of skill, etc. those people have just as much right to have fun as you do. As it is now the average casual player can not have fun.

To make matters worse, the skilled player with a decent irl has a lot of issues as well. This person can either make a good premade and just have very little challenge most of the time, make a premade with friends of random gear/classes, or pug and face a lot of premades with great gear and most importantly great class composition.

The first option would quickly get boring for most competitive pvpr's with a decent irl (happened to me for example).

The second option is what I spend a decent portion of time on and I enjoy it a lot (I am still playing far too much so I obviously do lol) but again most decent players that want competition don't want this type of premade all the time as they want to have.....COMPETITION!

The final option is what I spend the majority of my time doing and I enjoy it but it can get annoying and if you are just an average player or someone who doesn't believe in dropping the obvious super q vs. 3+recruit matches it can get very tedious very fast.

What we really need is a good system of premade matching. Something where the wait time for premades does not go over 10minutes but the system at least tries to find premades first.

Failing this we need a solo only option and also an option for ranked teams of 2-8. To make the ranked teams work better it would also allow solo q'rs a ranked option.

The rank option for solo q'rs would have a stat requirements and 2 tiers of stats. It would also take a few tiers of ranking into account. If you solo q'd rank you would also be in the regular solo q, however if a ranked team only needs 1 more to fill it up the system would search these q'rs and try to find someone with the highest in both of these categories. The ranked system after a few minutes could also pick up more than one from the dual solo q'rs.

I am rather sure this could work on most populated servers most of the time. It would be great for casuals and for pvpr's that want good competition.

You can synch queue with another group of 4 and most times you'll all get into the same WZ together. There's also those times when a good group of 4 will get paired with another good group of 4. For PUGs, that's usually a disadvantage they can't overcome.

So you're suggesting they make this game where you can't queue with your friends.

............................right.

The whole BG problem comes down to "leagues not yet invented here". Champions elite premades vs. random back yard noobs - oh noez, why oh why would the elite guys always win? Dear Cpt. Obvious, seems we finally got you a job at bioware.

The way it's now, the only winning move is not to play.