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Gamebreaking behaviour within hardmode flashpoints


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Gearing up through FPs is waste of time anyway. Grab your recruit set and hit up the SM ops. More level 56 than you can shake a lightsaber at.

 

I always want to have fun while I play, and doing flashpoints is fun to me so it is not a waste of time.

 

I dont think that it is intended to hit level 50, cash out recruit MK-2 and then only sign up for OPs without gearing up through heroics first. If that is the case someone has failed miserably with the gearprogression in this game.

 

Flashpoints is a combination of fun while playing and fun when it rewards someone, might it be myself or a guildee or a complete stranger. The enjoyement is still there when someone gets happy :tran_grin:

 

Now players are focusing on their darn tokens and have no interest in playing the flashpoint the way it is intended to be. With a natural disappointment to those who signed up to have fun and to have a chance to get gear from all bosses.

 

I don´t have to remind you how long a DPS usually waits until the flashpoint actually starts using groupfinder, and to be dissapointed after that long time over and over again is what I call gamebreaking.

 

Bioware needs to look into this if it actually is working as intended or if it is a designflaw, because nowdays the heroics is not working. Not the way they were designed to be played atleast.

 

Do you agree or is it fair that some players that needs gear has to step aside and hope that the next flashpoint wont be the same with egos steamrolling through?

Edited by Icestar
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Gearing up through FPs is waste of time anyway. Grab your recruit set and hit up the SM ops. More level 56 than you can shake a lightsaber at.

 

And people call me a retarded, undergeared noob for wanting to try a few SM ops with BM/WH gear ...

 

That's it, EAware, it's time you allow us to transfer to a server of our choice ...

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And people call me a retarded, undergeared noob for wanting to try a few SM ops with BM/WH gear ...

 

That's it, EAware, it's time you allow us to transfer to a server of our choice ...

 

Pretty sure SM ops are balanced for tionese, which is "on par" with recruit to say the least. If you know the fights, you will be totally fine. Better than fine with a little BM, WH, columi, and black hole, which you will probably be able to cash in for when you hit 50.

 

Those players insisting on a better level of gear are the bads in Rakata who die on the first boss of EV story mode while my dps scoundrel in recruit gets the kill.

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There has always been some kind of mobskipping in either small or large scale in flashpoints but the latest trend is simply wrong.

 

It seems that teams doing flashpoints skip some of the bosses and have no respect for the ones that are signing up to get better gear.

 

Please respect the players that join flashpoints with groupfinder to gear up, it is enough to wait for ages for them to pop.

 

Alternatively Bioware could make the flashpoint not complete unless all bosses are dead (the way it should be)

 

Thoughts?

 

Is it fair to ignore players in the team that needs gear and steamroll through the flashpoint not listening at all?

 

First of all that "loot"" you're after that drops on skippable bosses is WORSE then the FREE recruit set every single 50 gets these days.

 

Anyway on the subject - here's my thought - how about you learn to respect the people who are there to get their daily 5 comms and have outgeared those encounters months ago ? If the majority of the group wants to skip through the conversations and bosses ... then you either go with them or leave ( get kicked ).

 

If you want to kill everything THAT badly find a group of likeminded people and stop QQing on the forums. You already have the option to kill everything, why should the rest of us NOT have the option to SKIP ?

 

Are you THAT special ?

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I hate when people skip. There are a dozen reasons not to:

 

1.) Daily comms drop off most mini bosses and some main bosses. Right now, almost everyone can benifit from daily comms. The list of things to buy and why are just to many to list.

 

2.). Every boss drops at least tionese crystals. Off hand weapons are cheap, 14 comms and 20 crystals (I think) and sell for 12.5k. Most runs will net you enough to buy at least 2. That's 25k, more than you get for the daily it's self.

 

3.). All the trash loot that can be sold to boost your income. With alot of playerd complaining about being poor, I don't know why more people are maximizeing thier credits potential.

 

4.). BoEs that can be sold from bosses and trash loot. Not to mention chances on Columi implants and ear pieces that can be dropped. Could be sold or go to companions. I personally love to send them to alts. Help get them into flashpoints without being a leeching scrub in recruit gear.

 

5.). Legacy xp. I know, some people don't care. But some do.

 

You see, there are alot of reasons to do all the bosses and clear the content. Notice that those are all selfish reasons and helping people gear up wasn't even mentioned. The next time you want to be selfish, at least do it right. And o yeah, bio and scavaging can get mats in the runs that they can either sell or make crafted goods for use or resale.

 

My #1 reason to not skip: needless wipes thwt cost me credits. >:(

 

Name ONE flashpoint which drops 14 Tionese Commendations ( or actually 28 as you claim ) per RUN.

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First of all that "loot"" you're after that drops on skippable bosses is WORSE then the FREE recruit set every single 50 gets these days.

 

I have seen players need and equip things those extra bosses drop several times, they does not always drop blue stuff. Sometimes it is very useful items way better then the recruitarmour they are wearing.

 

 

Anyway on the subject - here's my thought - how about you learn to respect the people who are there to get their daily 5 comms and have outgeared those encounters months ago ? If the majority of the group wants to skip through the conversations and bosses ... then you either go with them or leave ( get kicked ).

 

Respect works both ways. I always ask in the beginning of instance and trying to set some "ground rules" what will be valid throughout the flashpoint. Do not be surprised that most of the players that lack respect are those "fast runners". Those players can come up with all sorts of insults and bad language without any actual reason. The flashpoint might take 5-10 minute longer then expected due to either one or two extra bosskillings, but some like to start a drama instead ending in getting themselves kicked. To help is always good, to whine less good.

 

They also do not express in advance that all the cutscenes are to be spacebared through, they simply start screaming "SPACEBAR" sometime in the middle of the flashpoint and is obviously upset about how "noobish" everyone is that cant find a spacebar on a keyboard.

 

To answer your statement about "learn to respect", I respect all players and I expect the same in return. Luckily the team does not vote out the one asking for a extra bosskill, it is usually the jerk behaving badly that gets the boot.

 

If you want to kill everything THAT badly find a group of likeminded people and stop QQing on the forums. You already have the option to kill everything, why should the rest of us NOT have the option to SKIP ?

 

Are you THAT special ?

 

Read my original post again and please come back with a more constructive answer. I do not know how to begin to answer what you just wrote.

 

 

Remember that flashpoints is a team effort, one cant just run away skipping mobs and one cant solo the heroic boss alone. There needs to be some kind of understanding from the start unless it is going to end with someone getting upset, because they EXPECTED the group to work in a certain way. What I talk about is that the community needs to be aware that some actually thinks that "fast runs" and "boss skipping" are standard nowdays and I would like to point out that in my post.

Edited by Icestar
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I as a tank can understand the skipping especially now a days.

With the new hk questline alot of people are doing foundry hm, you can skip a boss there and if im there i skip it, why?

Cause if done the place over and over again the last weeks ( useing random gf so cant shut it out wont get my comms) if i can go true it as fast as possible i will do that.

 

On the otherhand if some 1 needs the drop i always kill the boss then but 90% skips it without a word cause the recruit gear you get for free is alrdy bttr then most drops.

 

And at icestar

 

Remember that flashpoints is a team effort, one cant just run away skipping mobs and one cant solo the heroic boss alone.

 

im an assassin tank full campaigne dread gear , you have no idea how much i can solo.

Edited by NrDLeipe
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I am also annoyed by this, jumping over crates, walking over ledges, running to get past a droid/group that takes 15 seconds to kill, only to be raged upon if you pull it by sneaking around. I mean come on enough with the lazy behaviour. If you are so worried that something gets pulled kill it. As for bosses they need to be killed period. I don't understand why Bioware did not create a mechanic that requires you to kill all.

 

A while back i did a Black Talon HM run on a fresh 50 alt, already had a lot of custom gear and 50 mods, but needed more upgrades. The tank didn't want to kill all bosses so we skipped two. I really wanted to kill them as i needed the crafting mat. The tank said he didn't need it, yet when we killed the last boss and the mat dropped there, he needed on it. Have people gone mad?

 

Seriously this is an MMO, a social game, please stop being selfish.

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im an assassin tank full campaigne dread gear , you have no idea how much i can solo.

 

Then dont use groupfinder, go your own way and solo what you like but if you use groupfinder it is a team effort

Edited by Icestar
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As for bosses they need to be killed period. I don't understand why Bioware did not create a mechanic that requires you to kill all.

 

A while back i did a Black Talon HM run on a fresh 50 alt, already had a lot of custom gear and 50 mods, but needed more upgrades. The tank didn't want to kill all bosses so we skipped two. I really wanted to kill them as i needed the crafting mat. The tank said he didn't need it, yet when we killed the last boss and the mat dropped there, he needed on it. Have people gone mad?

 

Seriously this is an MMO, a social game, please stop being selfish.

 

Yes that is why I write here, I have seen this disturbing behaviour a while now. Players that expects "fast runs" from the start in heroic flashpoints and when they dont get that they either leave or start a drama about it. What is 5 extra minutes compared to a good upgrade for a player.......

Edited by Icestar
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My alt just reached 50 the other day, and I wanted to progress him vs hust handing him a stack of legacy gear. Call me silly but I enjoy having loot drop I actually can need on. I was vote kicked on last boss on directive 7 today for asking to kill the boss prior. Not to mention all the lovely noob bashing I was getting for working on my rotation, so glad I wasted 40 minutes just to get kicked, has everyone forgot what it was like to be a fresh 50?
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My alt just reached 50 the other day, and I wanted to progress him vs hust handing him a stack of legacy gear. Call me silly but I enjoy having loot drop I actually can need on. I was vote kicked on last boss on directive 7 today for asking to kill the boss prior. Not to mention all the lovely noob bashing I was getting for working on my rotation, so glad I wasted 40 minutes just to get kicked, has everyone forgot what it was like to be a fresh 50?

 

Then you are one among the many that gets in the way of this stupid behaviour of "elitists" only chasing comms.

 

I am sorry you had a bad experience, hopefully the next one will be less painful. Remember to report EVERY insult or harrassment they might pull off, that kind of behaviour does not belong in this game.

 

I wish good luck with your next teams, hopefully they are more decent players and understand :tran_cool:

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I skip as much as possible, doing hm fp's is booring enough. want my comms then enough with it already.

 

If you guys want to kill all the bosses/trash w/e find a group using the chat that wants to do the same.

 

So according you you group finder tool is reserved for speed runs. Why don't you use gen chat for your comm runs and let us find a group. Pretty sure that's what it is used for...

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For every group you get that wants to skip all of Battle of Ilum, I get Directive 7 or False Emperor where you basically have to kill it all. Just deal

 

Gearing up through FPs is waste of time anyway. Grab your recruit set and hit up the SM ops. More level 56 than you can shake a lightsaber at.

 

This is assuming someone has a guild or group to run with. I've tryed getting a jump on one of my toons this way, and news flash, if yoj think group finder is filled with noobs, hop into story mode ops sometime. Its got twice as many, takes 3 times as long and most of the time isn't even completed. And every tom, blank and harry are in there with recruit gear and it has fail written all over it. There is a thread on these forums about the increase of people with recruit gear queing for LI HM and the headaches that is causing. Why would someone want to do this, specially if people can't be bothered to down bosses in hm fp?.

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And if you factor in the weekly comms as well, its like 1 on the fifst daily with extras, 2 on the second with extras and then almost 3 on the third after daily and weekly comms gained. averaged out, 2 per run, give or take...

 

And of coarse, you have to do the bonus boss as eell ;)

Edited by AidanLightwalker
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This is assuming someone has a guild or group to run with. I've tryed getting a jump on one of my toons this way, and news flash, if yoj think group finder is filled with noobs, hop into story mode ops sometime. Its got twice as many, takes 3 times as long and most of the time isn't even completed. And every tom, blank and harry are in there with recruit gear and it has fail written all over it. There is a thread on these forums about the increase of people with recruit gear queing for LI HM and the headaches that is causing. Why would someone want to do this, specially if people can't be bothered to down bosses in hm fp?.

 

But I don't think Group Finder is filled with noobs. Wipes are extremely rare, and I can't remember the last time we didn't complete the content (maybe LI HM pre patch)

 

Last time I used GF for story mode ops, it was fine. Sometimes groups fall apart when people DC, or people are just not coordinated enough to do the droid boss in Karaggas, but the risk/reward is worth it IMO. Plenty of people queue who don't need gear because they like the content or want the comms. Plenty of guilds use it when they don't have 8 people and you can sometimes piggy back with them.

 

Just put yourself in the queue while you are running all those missions on Belsavis, Ilum and Black Hole as a new 50 and you will get a pop. More than likely you will walk out with some gear.

 

And it doesn't change the overall fact that it's more efficient and more polite to skip unnecessary content in HM FPs

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But I don't think Group Finder is filled with noobs. Wipes are extremely rare, and I can't remember the last time we didn't complete the content (maybe LI HM pre patch)

 

Last time I used GF for story mode ops, it was fine. Sometimes groups fall apart when people DC, or people are just not coordinated enough to do the droid boss in Karaggas, but the risk/reward is worth it IMO. Plenty of people queue who don't need gear because they like the content or want the comms. Plenty of guilds use it when they don't have 8 people and you can sometimes piggy back with them.

 

Just put yourself in the queue while you are running all those missions on Belsavis, Ilum and Black Hole as a new 50 and you will get a pop. More than likely you will walk out with some gear.

 

And it doesn't change the overall fact that it's more efficient and more polite to skip unnecessary content in HM FPs

 

 

Larry, thats because there are people like you and me running around in those groups sometimes. We are the exception and not the rule. We have to play over the top to compensate for noobs. You know it, I know it, and every decent player out there who's had to do it knows it as well.

 

I was just in a D7 with 3 noobs the other day. All jacked up gear, poor group skills and pvp mind set written all over them. They all died at least 4, thats 4 times! I never died onced. I aas on my sentinel (all campaign with some dread, 20k plus hp). I killed numerous groups that they pulled and wiped on while trying to skip. I cced droids and killed thrm myself lol. I acted as the tank on at least 2 of the boss fights. The vangaurd tank started every pull with motar volley (so slow and lol what? I have a geared vangaudd tank as well).

 

Fact of the matter is, thdse people are every where and It's not fun to have to throw them on my back and carry them through. Maybe if people stopped skipping soooo much, these people would actually learn how to play.

Edited by AidanLightwalker
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First off, if someone asks, I won't skip bosses. I will always insist on skipping trash and bonus at level 50, since it doesn't really drop anything good.

 

As a person who has 5 level 50s, I really don't want to do all of the bosses, nor do I have the time. I want to get geared with Columi, not Xenotech. I have no issues running HM after HM getting the gear at the end.

 

Be happy that people are really only wanting to run these for comms. You do realize that, generally, that leaves the drop at the end for you to Need on when everyone else Greeds, guaranteeing you better gear than all of the gear that could have dropped. In fact, that means that you might only have to run 6-8 Flashpoints to get fully geared with Columi pieces.

 

I would suggest a "carrot" instead of the "stick" that everyone keeps saying of making the FP only complete if the bosses are all dead. Make the bosses worth killing. Make them drop even better items or a ton of cash. Heck, upgrade the HM FPs with the mini-bosses dropping Columi and the final boss dropping Rakata. Might as well match the power creep. Or just stick the awesome crafting materials in the mini-bosses. Anything to incentivize the player instead of penalizing them.

 

Fact of the matter is, thdse people are every where and It's not fun to have to throw them on my back and carry them through. Maybe if people stopped skipping soooo much, these people would actually learn how to play.

 

This is true, but unfortunately, you will just wipe on the trash or the extra bosses, instead of just wiping on the un-skippable bosses over and over again.

 

So according you you group finder tool is reserved for speed runs. Why don't you use gen chat for your comm runs and let us find a group. Pretty sure that's what it is used for...

 

It all comes down to the fact that the GF is not meant to merge all playstyles. If you want people of your playstyle specifically, then the best thing is to advertise for it on Fleet and then queue using the GF to get the comms at the end.

 

Now as to what the general feeling should be on the speed runs vs. the full runs, you have to just feel that out for your group. I have been lucky generally that people want to go ahead and speed run it. I would just encourage people to be courteous. Period.

Edited by GalnarDegana
Xenotech =/= Exotech
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Fact of the matter is, thdse people are every where and It's not fun to have to throw them on my back and carry them through. Maybe if people stopped skipping soooo much, these people would actually learn how to play.

 

This. So many players are decked out in bh, or columi gear just from dashing through the dailies (I did the same thing myself on my first toon, and you can really tell) withought ever learning how to do pulls properly, or really getting the team is supposed to function, or how to pay attention to boss mechanics while fulfilling their rolls. A little practice would do wonders.

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This. So many players are decked out in bh, or columi gear just from dashing through the dailies (I did the same thing myself on my first toon, and you can really tell) withought ever learning how to do pulls properly, or really getting the team is supposed to function, or how to pay attention to boss mechanics while fulfilling their rolls. A little practice would do wonders.

 

I have been in groups where almost everyone is in at least bh gear cause they all had 18k plus hp and decided to try the bonus boss (droid) in koan under seige. Now, I KNOW how to do this fight, did it with the guild when I was in all columi, but this group wipe twice on him before saying forget it, lets just finish this thing. You know how sad that is?

 

These people got carried through flashpoints by people who where over geared and just wanted to run through the instance. And it's happened so many times that they too have some black hole gear from daily run comms. As long as there are rewards for people who out gear an instance, we will continue to see this trend. Cause in the end, why should the person who out gears the instance care about anything in there or the other people in there? The prize for them is at the end of the race and thats all they care about. It's a shame because all this does is hurt the people who really need to be there.

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And I knew this was going to happen when they introduced the group finder. Before the group finder, people who brought the group down where either kicked from the group or had to figue out how to actually play. Once the group finder got here and bioware dangled the carrot in front of everyone, the daily bh comms, and people where forced to carry everyone else through them. People are so tired of carrying everyone through them, that they rush and skip everything. Its a vicious cycle. People are either going to have to make a conscientious effort to change this, or this cycle will just continue...
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I beleive its 2 per boss and in combination of completing the daily. You get close. Don't really want to much effort into thinking of every boss in all the fp, but you get the just.

 

You 're mixing up tionese COMMENDATIONS and tionese CRYSTALS .. the latter you get plenty of .. commendations you get ONE for completing a HM flashpoint.

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