I'm very honest when it comes to balance within games I play. My main has been a Marauder since launch, and I have been supportive of a Rage/Smash damage nerf since 1.2. I have an Assassin and I think Deception needs a small damage nerf, or a change to their survivability cooldowns. This is the first time I've played a spec and said "This is 100% gamebreaking". I think this needs a quick response from the BW staff and an immediate change, it threatens an already hurting PvP community.

 

They'll probably come out with something along the line of: "changing 2 coefficients in a database is proving to be too challenging" (for their surviving dev team made by a charwoman and a cheap plastic toothpick maker).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_IKLCfqYhc&feature=youtu.be

this video about sums up today's patch in pvp

Its hard life for monkeys, sorcs and snipers begins...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_IKLCfqYhc&feature=youtu.be

this video about sums up today's patch in pvp

 

I don't see that being much different than if people teamed up a bunch of sins or even DPS ops before. Not much you can do when suddenly focused by 4 dps without a chance to even brace yourself. Only thing different is there are probably more stealth available to do this now.

And once again PVE'ers who waited so long for this buff will get screwed by pvpers whiners.

They simply did the change wrong, there were so many other ways to change it that didnt require a large dps gain to make it even more usable in pve

Its absolutely no different than middle line for assassins and shadows, yet everyone wants to QQ even though sins and shadows still have better defensive cooldowns

 

I am sorry to rain on your parade , but unfortunately , its not like that. I play an assassin and was and still am in favor of the dps changes made to concealment , but , and its a very big but , unlike assassins , you get the burst AND the sustained.

 

Don't get me wrong , I don't want any nerfs for operatives ( like you mentioned , ops need something towards defensive CDs , for the dps trees ) , i don't really have any problems with them on either my assassin Deception or on my vengeance juggernaut. What i would like , if possible , is for assassins , to get the sustained damage as well , just like you guys did and also , for people who don't play the class to throw in random assumptions about a class that they don't personally play ( i can deduce this from what you stated , you never played deception in ops runs , and i can safely assume you don't play the spec in pvp either ).

Edited February 4, 2014 by Kayriel
Typos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_IKLCfqYhc&feature=youtu.be

this video about sums up today's patch in pvp

 

Premades fighting PUGs in unranked and then bragging about how awesome they are? I'm pretty sure we've had that feature long before 2.6.

And once again PVE'ers who waited so long for this buff will get screwed by pvpers whiners.

 

For PVE, concealment spec should not be outparsing annihilation and marksman specs, and it is by about 10%.

They needed an autocrit to correctly match them with assassins as much as they alter the damage numbers Ops only have a chance to be as good as their force using counterparts. My point is they could have just nerfed Op DPS added an autocrit and made them viable as well as fair to fight against. Would it have been game breaking to say shiv and maybe lacerate automatically crits on targets effected by acid blade because if so we can just say if the Op wins its beause he got lucky not because he is good and oh wait, assassins used to get their crit from the Debuff and apparently that wasn't fair so they made it on the buff. So why doesn't acid blade auto crit backstab and hidden strike? HEY if its so OP why do assassins have it? we can apply this thinking to mercs to, why doesn't 5 stacks of tracer missile autocrit heat seekers? if its OP then the arsenal merc who wins just got lucky its a not skill class. and still if we replaced the damage buff on heat seeker its would hit as hard as thunderblast but need at least 3 casted tracers, yeah thats the same as an insta-casted DOT that thunderblast requires isnt it o_O

They’d love to do that at some point, but "technically very challenging and unlikely to happen in the near future."

 

I laughed

 

 

OP, all feedback on the PTS forum is ignored. PTS does not stand for Public Test Server, it stands for Preview Thenewpatch Server.

The problem simply is, they are still not viable for group ranked, but overly qualified to annoy people into quitting warzones. Imo, a survivability boost would have been better for everyone.

Two Operatives jump onto someone, and 3-4 globals later it's dead.

 

Shocking news! Two players focusing one enemy make him dead in 4 cooldowns!

 

Sure tow maras or two sins cant do that!

2 Maras or Sins are killing enemy in 2 cooldowns by focusfire

Shocking news! Two players focusing one enemy make him dead in 4 cooldowns!

 

Sure tow maras or two sins cant do that!

2 Maras or Sins are killing enemy in 2 cooldowns by focusfire

 

1 Carnage Mara can kill you in 4 cooldowns!!!!

I am sorry to rain on your parade , but unfortunately , its not like that. I play an assassin and was and still am in favor of the dps changes made to concealment , but , and its a very big but , unlike assassins , you get the burst AND the sustained.

 

...and still Assasins are doing more DPS in a WZ.

There is a huge difference, Spike is a low damage attack that requires a global which is required for control and to get an initial maul proc. Hidden Strike is a high damage Spike. One less global to control someone=more damage in same time span.

 

Sin:

Spike = 2 sec stun

Low slash = 4sec stun

 

Oper:

Hidden Strike = 1.5 sec stun

.....

 

 

So yeah... Sins are at disadvantage here

They needed an autocrit to correctly match them with assassins as much as they alter the damage numbers Ops only have a chance to be as good as their force using counterparts.

 

The trick here is the Bolster system.

The 46/46/46 Mh/Oh is not making big difference from 67/67/67 Mh/OH. not much anyway.

What made the abundance of «solid skill» opers in WZ is the fact you:

1. can get the MH/OH almost like the 67/67/67 one without any grind.

2. You can have the 2set PvE bonus (crit chance of BackStab/BackBlast +15%) without any «PvP» penalties.

Edited February 5, 2014 by Missandei

It resulted in over 4,000 DPS OPS dummy parses on a class with great raid utility (higher than any parse by a Marauder - which is a pure-damage melee class with no self-cleanse, off-heals, or revive ability), and hilariously high burst and sustained damage in PvP.

 

So OPs will totally rock the PvP againts lots of dummys? BEWARE FOUL DUMMYS!!!! (and don't you dare to bite back!)

 

Oh, I forgot: Hello Dave!

This is the first time I've played a spec and said "This is 100% gamebreaking". I think this needs a quick response from the BW staff and an immediate change, it threatens an already hurting PvP community.

 

 

lmao! So Concealment ops are game breaking, but deception sins aren't?

 

the survivability of concealment ops is still a million times worse than a deception sin. In addition, maul can be spammed, backstab cannot. Maul hits a lot harder than backstab or hidden strike, discharge hits harder than them as well. In addition, Deception sins have an execute ability, concealment ops do not.

 

Give concealment ops an execute ability and remove the cooldown of backstab completely, then we can talk about it being overpowered/equal to deception sins.

Sin:

Spike = 2 sec stun

Low slash = 4sec stun

 

Oper:

Hidden Strike = 1.5 sec stun

.....

 

 

So yeah... Sins are at disadvantage here

 

both are NOT stuns but a disable and a mezz, wich break on dmg.

both are NOT stuns but a disable and a mezz, wich break on dmg.

 

So by your logic Opers have no stuns at all? (we are clearly not talking about the electrocute)

 

as a Sin i can make two attacks durimg the LowSlash is in effect.

4 sec duration is enough to position yourself behind the target, cast the CrushingDarkness and then hit the victim with the Maul.

Concelament operatives do not have such ability

Edited February 5, 2014 by Missandei

the survivability of concealment ops is still a million times worse than a deception sin. In addition, maul can be spammed, backstab cannot. Maul hits a lot harder than backstab or hidden strike, discharge hits harder than them as well. In addition, Deception sins have an execute ability, concealment ops do not.

 

Spamming Maul bottoms out your resource and leaves you 100% boned. Is it worth the attempt to get dat Maul crit? Not at all, considering once every 5 seconds or so you should get a free Maul. Lacerate is completely spammable with TA stacks (EZ mode with Shiv), using Stim Boost, and if you screw your energy, LOL ADRENALINE PROBE. Execute doesn't honestly hit that hard, it's essentially filler. Won't argue the survivability of Assassins is better, but come on. At least be objective and say the damage of the Conceal Op is comparable to Sins if you're not willing to concede it's outright better than Sins. I have both, I played both yesterday, Operative had a lot more lulz and a lot more >90% HP solos.

 

Sin:

Spike = 2 sec stun

Low slash = 4sec stun

 

Oper:

Hidden Strike = 1.5 sec stun

 

Let's just ignore Debilitate and ST root, and completely forget about Flashbang. Those don't exist at all. I'm done discussing class balance here, let's objectively argue but ignore the full spectrum of information on the debate. That's how it works right? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

 

Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwdokPvCPDk&feature=youtu.be

Edited February 5, 2014 by countpopeula

So by your logic Opers have no stuns at all? (we are clearly not talking about the electrocute)

 

as a Sin i can make two attacks durimg the LowSlash is in effect.

4 sec duration is enough to position yourself behind the target, cast the CrushingDarkness and then hit the victim with the Maul.

Concelament operatives do not have such ability

 

Both operatives and assassins have one (1) hard stun.

 

Assassins

-Electrocute...Hard stun (60 second can have CD reduced 5/10 seconds)

-Spike...2 second knock down (talented to use out of stealth)

-Low slash...Talented 4 second mezz breaks on damage (weapon based CC so is subjective to defenses 15 second cooldown)

-Whirlwind...2 second casted 8 second mezz (60 second cooldown)

-Sap...Stealth mez

 

Operatives

-Debilitate...hard stun (45 second default CD can be reduced 7.5/15 seconds)

-Flash bang...AoE mezz (60 second cooldown)

-Hidden strike...Talented 1.5 second knockdown (can deal moderate amount of damage)

-Sap...Stealth mezz

 

So while assassins do have more CC than operatives they are comparable given they can (CAN) talent their hard stun for a 30 second cooldown and that their KD actually deals damage and their 2nd mezz is an AoE and instant. Don't kid yourself both deception and concealment both have great CC. The only difference is that most assassins don't use WW do to it's long cast time.

Edited February 5, 2014 by cycao

 

So while assassins do have more CC than operatives they are comparable given they can (CAN) talent their hard stun for a 30 second cooldown and that their KD actually deals damage and is an AoE. Don't kid yourself both deception and concealment both have great CC. The only difference is that most assassins don't use WW do to it's long cast time.

 

Hmm, I don't know the KD is AoE..... I think meant flashbang here.

But yeah in terms of CC both (Deception and concealment) are even, just with different accents. And yeah, i really wonder why so few assassins actually use WW. It has 30m range is great for taking a healer out of the equation for a bit.

Hmm, I don't know the KD is AoE..... I think meant flashbang here.

But yeah in terms of CC both (Deception and concealment) are even, just with different accents. And yeah, i really wonder why so few assassins actually use WW. It has 30m range is great for taking a healer out of the equation for a bit.

 

Always some bonehead who will be tunneling that will break it. Its the same with flashbang. "Oh, you just CCed the entire group so we can finish capping? Nah. I can kill them all much faster to be sure they don't use their breaker."