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Some dark side options don't seem "bad" or "evil".

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Some dark side options don't seem "bad" or "evil".

cartersumpter's Avatar


cartersumpter
06.14.2014 , 09:58 PM | #1
I'm thinking of a few instances:

Spoiler


Also, there are some other light side options that seem to hurt the good guys more than not.

I don't know, maybe I'm viewing alignment wrong. Any thoughts?

Darkelefantos's Avatar


Darkelefantos
06.15.2014 , 12:38 AM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by cartersumpter View Post
I'm thinking of a few instances:

Spoiler


Also, there are some other light side options that seem to hurt the good guys more than not.

I don't know, maybe I'm viewing alignment wrong. Any thoughts?
Spoiler

Yes. How would you disagree? Exposing criminals is a righteous thing to do, and thus light side. Whether the decision "hurts the good guys" is completely irrelevant, light side options are generally intended to be morally correct, above all else. You know, putting yourself in harm's way to protect others (especially civillians), exposing criminal activities, being merciful to your enemies or destroying some sort of super weapon that would destroy the planet it's on for good. That kind of thing.

The dark side is a bit more complex. Sometimes the choice is greedy, sometimes just egoistical, sometimes completely psychotic and downright murderous (to the point where some of them would be stupid to pick under real circumstances). It's probably save to assume that some DS options might even be morally correct. So basically the DS is more chaotic while the LS is more straight forward. The DS isn't always "evil" or "bad", but if you think about it, the choices are generally not morally correct.
This place has been an empty wasteland for a long time. No longer.

"In a world without gold, we might've been heroes!"

Amien's Avatar


Amien
06.19.2014 , 02:19 PM | #3
I agree OP. There's a mission on Taris, where the lightside choice is to encourage republic troops to go AWOL.
Obviously, the morally right and honorable thing would be to convince them to go back, which you do with the DS choice.
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can you make sword in box light sword so sword come out when opened? then if sword is back after sword, use light saber on box, and saber will be boxed after sword is out.
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AlrikFassbauer's Avatar


AlrikFassbauer
06.20.2014 , 09:53 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Amien View Post
Obviously, the morally right and honorable thing would be to convince them to go back,
Yes and no.

What people often forget that there is a cultural difference in determining what is a "moral good choice" across countries. Just remember George W. Bush and his Iraq war. Several European countries didn't follow him and his righeous war, because they didn't his war to be righteous. And I know many civil voices explicitely stating that "he was only after the oil". Needless to say that he coined the countries that didn't follow him "The Old Europe".

Or just take a look ar ancient empires. Slavery wasn't a bad thing, then. And there might still be cultures in this world where Slavery STILL isn't considered to be a bad thing - by those who exploit slaves.

Or just read Caesar's war-book. Eradicating whole landscapes was a "morally right" thing for him to do in order to get this area for his empire.

And even for Fanatics of ANY kind, some decisions might actiually be considered "morally right", meanwhile for non-fanatics they are not.

And SWTOR was done by Bioware, so I fully expect cultural influences to be there. In the class stories, in the quests. For example a Trooper class story would be completely impossible if SWTOR had been done in Germany : Because great parts of Germany's public are against wars - because of WWII. German's just aren't able ti understand how troopers are treated in the U.S. .
But on the other hand, Germany is also a huge exporter of war machines. And that's a thing that seems to be "morally totally wrong" for those who believe that because of WWII, Germany should NEVER meddle with warts, EVER. And the number of people who believe so is not small. We Germans have learned from WWII : The guilt of being those who started WWII and almost eradicated all Jewish culture in contionental Europe has made us Germans a "moral voice" against war and against cultural discrimination. What does not mean that Germany still struggles, because in any country, there are people having a variety of opinions. And some politicians nudge them into one or into another direction.

So, from the point of view of someone living in an anti-war culture (so to say), the morally right choice is to help them NOT to go back. Especially if their lives will be "verheizt", as we Germans say, on Taris (German "verheizen" means "to burn" in the sense of putting coal into a oven).
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction. (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)

NightEngine's Avatar


NightEngine
06.20.2014 , 12:56 PM | #5
One quest Sith-side strikes me as odd, Comrades in Arms, a heroic on Balmorra.
Spoiler
"My craft is death."
Darth Rubric, Sith Marauder

Darkelefantos's Avatar


Darkelefantos
06.20.2014 , 06:00 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by NightEngine View Post
One quest Sith-side strikes me as odd, Comrades in Arms, a heroic on Balmorra.
Spoiler
Step 1: Alignment is independant from the Force, in this case. Connection to the Force and such are irrelevant, what counts are things like morality.

Step 2: The droid is supposed to be reprogrammed because his "emotions" stop him from completing their mission as was originally intended. He doesn't want to continue without his "comrade". Morally speaking, you override the droid's free will and force him to do something he didn't want to do before. Hence why reprogramming is DS while repairing is LS.


On the point of the quest "AWOL": The morally correct choice is clearly not to send them back into the fight against their will. If you listened to them, basically they've been through hell for the past 5 years and their commander is a *****. They basically have a PTSD and aren't even of any use in the field in their condition anyway. Sending them as far away from Taris as you can and getting them psychological treatment is what should be done with them.

Although I have to point out that one of them is potentially infected by the rakghoul virus, meaning both options are somewhat dangerous
This place has been an empty wasteland for a long time. No longer.

"In a world without gold, we might've been heroes!"

errant_knight's Avatar


errant_knight
06.21.2014 , 01:31 PM | #7
The most inexplicable choice is in the Cadimimu fp when
Spoiler

OddballEasyEight's Avatar


OddballEasyEight
06.22.2014 , 10:04 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by errant_knight View Post
The most inexplicable choice is in the Cadimimu fp when
Spoiler
Hardly:

Spoiler


Actually, this whole thread reminds me of a similar thread during the early days of the game where one guy was very (and I mean VERY) upset that the game was "forcing" him to do the wrong thing and go against his own morals to get light side points.
The problem? That guy on coruscant who's wife left him and you can either force her to go back or you can tell him that she's left him.
Yeah... this guy actually said it was "wrong" of her to leave him because a wife had a duty to stay with her husband no matter how bad it got.
(and this guy in the game, you find out that he only looks at her as a posession and a trophy and was extremely jealous).

It's pretty easy to figure out the wrong/right choices in the game.
1: Don't kill in cold blood. Like, ever.
2: Don't torture. There is no good reason to inflict pain on another creature.
3: Don't force people to do things they don't want to.
4: Don't get emotional (usually just for jedi).

As for the killing you do in the game, sure, it's plenty and you're not really picky.
BUT, that's for gameplay reasons.

errant_knight's Avatar


errant_knight
06.22.2014 , 10:24 AM | #9
Good points and a good assessment of the reasoning.
Spoiler

NightEngine's Avatar


NightEngine
06.23.2014 , 05:25 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Darkelefantos View Post
Step 1: Alignment is independant from the Force, in this case. Connection to the Force and such are irrelevant, what counts are things like morality.

Step 2: The droid is supposed to be reprogrammed because his "emotions" stop him from completing their mission as was originally intended. He doesn't want to continue without his "comrade". Morally speaking, you override the droid's free will and force him to do something he didn't want to do before. Hence why reprogramming is DS while repairing is LS.


On the point of the quest "AWOL": The morally correct choice is clearly not to send them back into the fight against their will. If you listened to them, basically they've been through hell for the past 5 years and their commander is a *****. They basically have a PTSD and aren't even of any use in the field in their condition anyway. Sending them as far away from Taris as you can and getting them psychological treatment is what should be done with them.

Although I have to point out that one of them is potentially infected by the rakghoul virus, meaning both options are somewhat dangerous
But droids don't have free will, aren't living things, and therefore, I don't see how it's the more moral option. In fact, looking at it from the perspective of the harm principle, the choices as they are should still be reversed.

It causes more harm to others to repair the droid and less to reprogram, ergo, repairing should be dark side and reprogram light.
"My craft is death."
Darth Rubric, Sith Marauder