Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Practical or For Show?


Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
06.06.2014 , 02:28 PM | #1
One thing that has always bothered me over the years are the severe discrepancy where often times the things that look like they make sense tend to be beaten rather easily. On the other hand, some of the ones that look nonsensical manage to pull off crazy things that do not fit with their design.

I am talking vehicles, technology, armor, weapons, the whole armory.

Tell me about some of the things in star wars that fall under either of the two categories, Practical or For Show. Let us see why some crazy contraptions work so well, or why some mundane designs fall behind. Discuss, dissect, examine and explain your favorite pieces of star wars tech, after all, not everything is as it appears...

Practical:
DSD1 Dwarf Spider Droids #8-9
Shields Vs. Armor #14-15

For Show:
Holograms #10-12
Early TIE Series Star Fighters #23 and 24

Undecided:
Infantry #15*end* and 19
Corvettes # 18, 20-22
Imperial MK-I vs. Venator *standard load outs* #25-32

Sarcastic:
Beniboybling - For Show
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
06.06.2014 , 05:05 PM | #2
Wait...I'm kinda confused about this. :/ I can't think of anything.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
06.06.2014 , 05:37 PM | #3
What I mean is express your thoughts on tech in star wars that either works well due to its design and why you think that is, or essentially odd tech and despite what would seem like design flaws, proves to be devastatingly effective.

Short Example:

AT-AT: All Terrain Attack Transport

Despite its apparent heavy armor it would seem to have severe disadvantages due to its inability to cover its flanks or rear. Not to mention the fact that it could be tripped by strong cables. Yet despite these obvious weaknesses it still manages to out do and decimate most opposition due to its "FORWARD FIREPOWER!" While not quite an ordinary design, it is not the most out there that I have seen before.

vs.

AT-TE: All Terrain Tactical Enforcer
Small, compact, heavily armed and armored. Its adequately equipped to defend itself in most situations and is able to scale sheer cliffs. A very practical vehicle with adequate usability in the field as well as being able to function in many adverse conditions. While it is not nearly as heavily armored than the AT-AT that it is the predecessor for, it does have much better agility when it comes to maneuvering.

Both are great machines, yet the AT-TE has vastly better practical use whereas the AT-AT is more of a weapon to instill fear into their enemies. Yet why did the Imperial engineers come up with such an odd design? Not sure, though I will attempt to stay out of the way of a AT-AT, their feet do not take kindly to critics.

The intent of this thread is to talk/discuss about the practicality or the design quality of vehicles/weapons/armor/tech we see in an environment where people won't be shunned *Curse you real life!* as well as allow us to see each other s opinions on our favorite vehicles.
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
06.06.2014 , 08:19 PM | #4
Walkers in general are typically impractical imo for a society capable of repulsorlift technology. I mean, aside from the STAHP artillery or the clone scout walkers I can't name a single manned walker I'd WANT in battle. Basilisk war droids (flying, heavily armored and armed combat mounts that provide extreme mobility and versatility) are freakin amazing! But walkers... nah, I'll stick to a Juggernaut or repulsor tank.

How about droids! if you can make assassin droids as ****** as HK-49, HK-51, IG-88 etc.. what exactly is stopping one of the great powers in the galaxy from developing the perfect commando droid and mass producing it? Why didn't the Seps just convert all production of B1's into Commando droids? I mean, they can easily kill 4-5 clones a piece and capture Venators GUARDED BY JEDI seemingly effortlessly and not only that, they are expendable so a suicide mission isn't actually that bad, like one droid needs to make it to their reactor core and blow the whole damn ship. I like the YVH droids they are exactly what I'm referring to, I'll miss them, wish they'd been expanded on.

Eh, that's my rant for a while I'll be back to this thread soon enough though
"We're more than just a people or an army, aruetii. We're a culture. We're an idea. And you can't kill ideasóbut we can certainly kill you."

Mandalore the Destroyer

Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
06.06.2014 , 08:53 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
Walkers in general are typically impractical imo for a society capable of repulsorlift technology. I mean, aside from the STAHP artillery or the clone scout walkers I can't name a single manned walker I'd WANT in battle. Basilisk war droids (flying, heavily armored and armed combat mounts that provide extreme mobility and versatility) are freakin amazing! But walkers... nah, I'll stick to a Juggernaut or repulsor tank.

How about droids! if you can make assassin droids as ****** as HK-49, HK-51, IG-88 etc.. what exactly is stopping one of the great powers in the galaxy from developing the perfect commando droid and mass producing it? Why didn't the Seps just convert all production of B1's into Commando droids? I mean, they can easily kill 4-5 clones a piece and capture Venators GUARDED BY JEDI seemingly effortlessly and not only that, they are expendable so a suicide mission isn't actually that bad, like one droid needs to make it to their reactor core and blow the whole damn ship. I like the YVH droids they are exactly what I'm referring to, I'll miss them, wish they'd been expanded on.

Eh, that's my rant for a while I'll be back to this thread soon enough though
True, though the reason I prefer walkers is their universality. Repulser vehicles can be shut down completely if the enemy has the correct type of jammer or the planet has wonky physics like Jabiim. Then again, I also tend to prefer the more heavily armored craft so that might be part of it.

Over all good details concerning walkers vs repulser craft. As for the droid thing, I think it had to do with Palpatines plan which caused major PIS. If the CIS had *and it could have* done that full scale it would have won swiftly. It could have just been a cost thing though, neither the CIS or the Republic were fitted for mass production of war products in a intense clash. Granted, the CIS was much better situated than the Republic, but near the end both sides were desperately getting loans from the banks.

Btw, when you said STAHP are you sure you didnt mean SPHA? Those things wreck, SPHA-T lasers
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
06.06.2014 , 09:31 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Silenceo View Post
Btw, when you said STAHP are you sure you didnt mean SPHA? Those things wreck, SPHA-T lasers
Yes, yes I did. Long day and I was pretty much on auto-rant for some of that, figured I'd get the acronym wrong...

Also, I realize the cost issue for the Seps, but honestly had they completely converted just the B1 production alone to Droid Commandos they could probably keep up with Clone production easily while producing a droid superior to most clones and still having a standard trooper in the B2 for the times they need a presence on the open battlefield. Using the Commandos in boarding actions (which, lets be honest, happens ALL THE FREAKIN TIME in TCW) would practically decimate the Republic fleet. As for the lack of a massive army, the Seps ran around the Outer Rim and used locals to fight much of the time anyways so aside from a delay in any massive campaigns to take Republic aligned worlds, I think the Seps could afford to turtle and hide for a few weeks as production swung around.

Lets face it, TCW neutered your basic clone troopers and made Droid Commandos waaaayyyyy too ****** I mean, we SHOULD see the clones mowing down droids all the time, but they are fodder to anything but a B1.

Now, you mentioned Sidious's plan. Yeah that's why they didn't, but what annoys me is that they COULD have crushed the Republic. I mean, the Republic was LITERALLY shooting itself in the foot AND THEN RELOADING FOR ANOTHER SHOT throughout the war with no help from Sidious.
"We're more than just a people or an army, aruetii. We're a culture. We're an idea. And you can't kill ideasóbut we can certainly kill you."

Mandalore the Destroyer

Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
06.06.2014 , 10:33 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
Yes, yes I did. Long day and I was pretty much on auto-rant for some of that, figured I'd get the acronym wrong...

Also, I realize the cost issue for the Seps, but honestly had they completely converted just the B1 production alone to Droid Commandos they could probably keep up with Clone production easily while producing a droid superior to most clones and still having a standard trooper in the B2 for the times they need a presence on the open battlefield. Using the Commandos in boarding actions (which, lets be honest, happens ALL THE FREAKIN TIME in TCW) would practically decimate the Republic fleet. As for the lack of a massive army, the Seps ran around the Outer Rim and used locals to fight much of the time anyways so aside from a delay in any massive campaigns to take Republic aligned worlds, I think the Seps could afford to turtle and hide for a few weeks as production swung around.

Lets face it, TCW neutered your basic clone troopers and made Droid Commandos waaaayyyyy too ****** I mean, we SHOULD see the clones mowing down droids all the time, but they are fodder to anything but a B1.

Now, you mentioned Sidious's plan. Yeah that's why they didn't, but what annoys me is that they COULD have crushed the Republic. I mean, the Republic was LITERALLY shooting itself in the foot AND THEN RELOADING FOR ANOTHER SHOT throughout the war with no help from Sidious.
Same logic could be applied to the Empire crushing the Rebellion. Though, not as great of a movie if all of the heroes die to an Evil Empire as if they never stood a chance.

As for the CIS being able to just turtle while they built more droids, heck, they could just protect the factories alone and nothing else and come out on top. Due to just how few clones there were comparatively they would be unable to break any dedicated defense. Its things like this that make me love stories, and vehicles, that have a solid build that makes sense *for example, if the CIS had played it smart and used their massive numbers to their advantage, and using air strikes where they had none. Instead of sending swarm-tactic droids into buildings one at a time in a slow march to get gunned down...*

What are your thoughts on the DSD1 Dwarf Spider Droid? Seemed like a decent light/scout vehicle with a good amount of fire power backing it up if it needed to fight. Though, its agility leaves something to be desired as well as its programming. *Heck, a lot of the CIS droids could use a boost in programming...*
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
06.07.2014 , 12:41 AM | #8
Magna Tri-droids are my personal favorite (Got stolen from me in this next Kaggath though )

Dwarf spider droids I think actually have a neat story consering how they were developed and then pressed into service. They'd be an example though of how a droid walker would work were a maned walker might be less helpful. If they were faster and smarter I'd say they'd be leaps and bounds better than clone scout walkers.

I have to say, TCW portrayal of Clone Scout Walkers has me giving them far more respect though. If Dwarf spider droids could more almost as quick and nimbly as them I'd say the Dwarf Spider droids could be hands down the best scout. But I'm not sure about the dwarf spider droid as is... it is a little too clunky, maybe if it was more heavily armored or had multiple turrets.
"We're more than just a people or an army, aruetii. We're a culture. We're an idea. And you can't kill ideasóbut we can certainly kill you."

Mandalore the Destroyer

Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
06.07.2014 , 03:21 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
Magna Tri-droids are my personal favorite (Got stolen from me in this next Kaggath though )

Dwarf spider droids I think actually have a neat story consering how they were developed and then pressed into service. They'd be an example though of how a droid walker would work were a maned walker might be less helpful. If they were faster and smarter I'd say they'd be leaps and bounds better than clone scout walkers.

I have to say, TCW portrayal of Clone Scout Walkers has me giving them far more respect though. If Dwarf spider droids could more almost as quick and nimbly as them I'd say the Dwarf Spider droids could be hands down the best scout. But I'm not sure about the dwarf spider droid as is... it is a little too clunky, maybe if it was more heavily armored or had multiple turrets.
Well there is the Heavy Dwarf Spider Droid which essentially tripples its firepower. Then there is also the Advanced Dwarf Spider Droid which has capital ship grade armor *its weakness is its eye* so it goes both ways, more firepower or more armor. Yet to see a dwarf spider droid with both sadly. Though, while Dwarf Spider droids may not be as fast as a AT-RT, there is the fact that they can move on any solid surface that can't be matched by most scouts. Even the standard version though has some pretty decent armor and alright firepower. Not to mention they have an almost probe droid like ability to send and receive data. Making them great for essentially *vanguard* units.

I give the AT-RT the edge in long range scouting, but I give the DSD1 the edge in terrain navigation as well as armor strength. Weapon wise they are some what equal since the AT-RT has a rapid fire and some times mortar launcher. The DSD1 only has its one cannon, but it can be set for either rapid fire or anti-vehicle fire. Besides, DSD1 doesn't need a pilot, they literally pilot themselves. Seems to me almost like comparing a speedy rabbit against a relatively fast tortoise that could climb walls. That rabbit might reach the wall of the ravine first, but the tortoise will go right up that wall. Not as great as an airborne scout, but then again, those tend to get sniped down quite fast as well as lack armor/weapons.

What do you think would have happened if the CIS had managed to update all of their droids integrated droid brains with a bit more efficiency/better targeting programs?

Side Note: I am not sure why, but I sometimes imagine the DSD1 almost as a sniper vehicle, though that might just be the long barrel and the ability to scale ceilings talking.
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

Warren-Stride's Avatar


Warren-Stride
06.07.2014 , 07:05 AM | #10
For Show: Holograms

Holograms, in my opinion, make no sense. Facetime, Skype, and other long-distance video technology we already have seems more sophisticated than holograms. Don't get me wrong, they can be useful for tactical readouts, observing a battlefield, or getting a 3D picture, but for the purposes of communication they seem pointless.

Princess Leia could have gotten the same point across by using a regular video camera installed in R2. Obi-wan, when he's on Geonosis and about to get captured, could have just face-timed for backup. Or, heck, most of the time those visual images aren't necessary at all! Why not just send a voice recording of a message?

Same thing can be said for Jedi Council members. Sure, it's cool that when one's away they're replaced by a hologram version of themselves so it looks like they're there. But really, a monitor on the wall that shows their face and allows them to see the room would be just as effective.

The only reason why holograms might be more practical is because maybe(?) they are able to travel interstellar distances faster than regular video? That might make sense? But really, no matter how you spin it, talking in real-time with someone light years away is impossible anyways.

I don't know, Holograms just strike me as 'for show' when it comes to communication. At least among parties that don't need to read body language to interpret what the other means by what they say.
~~ AiR ~~
What are you more afraid of?
A weapon that could destroy you?
Or a weapon that could turn you into a monster?