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DISCUSSION: So what, exactly, is a GSF Ace?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Galactic Starfighter
DISCUSSION: So what, exactly, is a GSF Ace?

Sidenti's Avatar


Sidenti
03.22.2014 , 09:00 AM | #1
Back on the Hawk, we have a neat little thread depicting who we believe are the server "aces". One of my characters is on that list (I'm flattered), but here's the thing:

I don't believe I deserve to be on there because I don't believe I'm an Ace.

In Meatspace PvP, a combat aviator is considered an "ace" once they hit five confirmed kills. Now, obviously, in order to do that the pilot has to stay alive to hit five kills, so we're looking at a minimum kill/death ratio of 5:1.

My so-called "ace"? Has a K/D of just over 1. (Yes, he's Imperial. How'd you know?)

Now, there's a cat on the Republic side of the Hawk that has a K/D of almost 10:1. THAT is an ace. Without question. But the best I can manage is a 3:1 in a bomber. So clearly - at least, to me, anyway - the product of my efforts in GSF doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same class as Acey McGee.

I seem to be in the minority on this one, however. So, I'm asking you, the piloting community at large:

Just what the heck constitutes an Ace in your mind? -bp

Verain's Avatar


Verain
03.22.2014 , 09:06 AM | #2
You can farm KDR if you don't care about the objectives. Ace has been used to mean a top tier of pilot- it doesn't really have a definition. But I'd much rather have someone willing to dash themselves into a rock to get on the right ship for the job than some joker hanging out in a cave with his harem of mines, waiting for pugs to walk over and feed.

KDR is easy to stoke, if you are into it. I'd rather have an actual ace who wants to win the game.

-Streven-'s Avatar


-Streven-
03.22.2014 , 09:10 AM | #3
We've beat this subject to death in the aces thread but in answer to your question I believe predominant thought is that an ace is "whatever you think an ace is".

Altheran's Avatar


Altheran
03.22.2014 , 09:20 AM | #4
An Ace, is IMO more than K/D ratio. That ratio is too easily influenced by some variables such your team and your ennemy team composition, how fast you learned to fly or started a character after have learned how to fly.

For example, depending on the ennemy team I can end with a 15/12/0 K/A/D ratio or a 2/1/5 ratio. If I were to wisely choose my flying times my ratio would skyrocket. And even if I'd were to do that now, my ratio has been stained once and for all.

So the only way to judge if someone is an ace, it's with guts. If you feel that a player is especially deadly, that he will be a major contributing pilot, you can assume he's above average.
Then whether he's an ace or not... Each one his own standards of what is good, and what is exceptional.

AceFirstCav's Avatar


AceFirstCav
03.22.2014 , 11:19 AM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Sidenti View Post
Just what the heck constitutes an Ace in your mind? -bp
Actually you should use definition from real world, which is also used in GSF. As "ACE" is recognized anyone who shot down 5 enemy planes. Thatīs all. So probably almost each GSF player can rightfully use title Ace

mr_sim's Avatar


mr_sim
03.22.2014 , 11:58 AM | #6
Try this on for size at least as a starting point

[(Kills + Assist/2) / Deaths] > 1 + Fleet Captain(Achievement) = Potential Ace

Now here is the key to the discussion. An "Ace' is not and "Elite" rather it's a person who:

- Is an asset in any match they join
- Has the experience to respond to shifting strategies
- Stands out among her teams, if the name is recognized in follow up matches and not simply because of clever name choice.

An Ace need not be:
- A vicious reaper of kills
- an insanely high win count
- have a presence of dread felt by her opponents

I feel my second list is what people are too often thinking about when they think "Ace." I would rather choose to call them "Elite" the next level higher then Ace. An "Ace" is simply a "Crack Player." the term "Crack" refers to usually teams or crews that perform at a high level of competence but there is no expectation of certain victory.

So if you join match and look at the other team and see a name and say "that is one to keep an eye on" that person is probably an Ace.

One last thing, High kill counts in almost every case are are due to a player standing on the shoulders of his team mates. The highest kill numbers are done by GS and bombers, both classes require the support of other ships to perform and are individually poor choices when there is no team support. The only exception is when facing inferior experienced opponents who do not fly intelligent at all. We saw much of this during 2xXP weekend when NonGSF players qued up to farm XP. Where I was doing some of the best scoring in GSF ever and was in a completely unmodded ship ta-boot. For this reason I do not believe inflated kill counts are an accurate measure of player quality, at least not when trying to determine ACEs.

Odds really are that the lists on the Aces thread should be expanded by a factor of 3-5. Also an Elites thread should be opened and have very high minimum meters based on hard numbers and achievements for players to get on it.
Striker Pilot - Jedi Covenant - Imperial Forces

<Roving Guns>

Armonddd's Avatar


Armonddd
03.22.2014 , 12:38 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by mr_sim View Post
Try this on for size at least as a starting point

[(Kills + Assist/2) / Deaths] > 1 + Fleet Captain(Achievement) = Potential Ace
As a computer programmer, I have no idea how to interpret this.

If (kills + half assists)/death ratio is greater than one plus total matches played...?
Space Ace of <Death Squadron>, <Black Squadron>, <Eclipse Squadron>, and <solo da>

Pilgrim_Grey's Avatar


Pilgrim_Grey
03.22.2014 , 01:38 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Altheran View Post
An Ace, is IMO more than K/D ratio. That ratio is too easily influenced by some variables such your team and your ennemy team composition, how fast you learned to fly or started a character after have learned how to fly.

For example, depending on the ennemy team I can end with a 15/12/0 K/A/D ratio or a 2/1/5 ratio. If I were to wisely choose my flying times my ratio would skyrocket. And even if I'd were to do that now, my ratio has been stained once and for all.

So the only way to judge if someone is an ace, it's with guts. If you feel that a player is especially deadly, that he will be a major contributing pilot, you can assume he's above average.
Then whether he's an ace or not... Each one his own standards of what is good, and what is exceptional.
I had a horrendous K/D ratio the other night (for me, anyway). 0 Kills, 3 deaths. But I had 15 assists and the third highest damage of anyone, and bunch of medals. I think it's pretty important to look at more than a few numbers, like you did.

Personally, there are very few Aces out there, but quite a few good pilots that will give you a run for your money in any ship and be solid contributers. It's nice to have an Ace on your team, but as I've seen in more than a few rounds, a win means having a few solid players to go with an Ace... they can't do it all on their own.
Ithyrn (Guardian), Malachais (Gunslinger), Ez'kiel (Commando)
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Gavin_Kelvar's Avatar


Gavin_Kelvar
03.22.2014 , 01:53 PM | #9
I'd largely agree with mr_sim with a few additions of my own:

an Ace is someone who knows how to play the objective. This does not mean that they have 500 objective points at the end of the match but rather a player who knows how to identify where they are needed most on the field and regardless of ship type can and will assist the team at that location. I've seen too many supposed "aces" sit in their bomber at the team's only sat during a domination round, get 3 or less kills/assists combined, wrack up 400-500 objective points but ultimately have been a major contributor to the team's loss by not lifting a finger to help the team win.

An Ace also understands their ship's role. This means that when they're flying a striker they understand that their priority is taking out armored targets such as bombers. Likewise if they're in a scout they know that they should leave bombers to the strikers and focus on the escort fighters first. Ultimately it's distinguished by the pilot's ability to triage targets based on what their ship is best suited to handling and not becoming hell bent on focusing on specific ship types regardless of what ship they're flying.

QuinMantha's Avatar


QuinMantha
03.22.2014 , 04:41 PM | #10
*shakes his head*

Aces are pilots whose skills I respect, that are consistently demonstrated across matches, to the point where I remember their names.

The numbers don't mean much to me. There's definitely a numerical way to calculate the best pilots on a server, but that's not how I do it. The best pilots, in my estimation, are the ones who show me they're good, either by showing up consistently and performing well, knocking my socks off with a massive stat rackup, or generally being someone I can count on in a fight.
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