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Players with a sense of entitlement

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Players with a sense of entitlement

ImpactHound's Avatar


ImpactHound
08.27.2013 , 12:40 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by DOHboy View Post
Yes 8 unique "single player" stories, and two classes per story, along with 3 different trees per class as well as 3 different "options per story" (light/dark/neutral) make this a true single player game that is played once and never picked up again.
Playing the Operative twice, once as concealment in beta & again as lethality in release was not a refeshingly different experience. There's replayability to a point, but not 48 unique playthroughs accounting for every iteration of talent trees. Yes, there's a difference levelling healer over DPS. Arguably there's no reason to replay a class twice unless you want to treat a companion like Vette differently(if you class even has one). I never wanted to play all 8 stories, just like I never wanted to play every gender/race/social point of Dragon Age 1. It's fair to judge the game on one complete playthrough.

Corsiero's Avatar


Corsiero
08.27.2013 , 12:44 PM | #12
Only if you believe the customer is always right. Some customers are stupid and demand the most outrageous things and expect them immediately and chuck a tantrum if they don't get it. These are the customers that should be ignored. I prefer that they get fired out torpedo launch tube into the vaccuum of space where they implode.

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
08.27.2013 , 12:51 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by AGSThomas View Post
TL/DR The sense of entitlement is justified.
1) As players, we are entitled to play the game under the game producers conditions, features, rules, and commercial requirements for as long as we choose to do so and are not banned from the game.

2) As players, we are free to choose not to play the game at any time, for any reason, for as long as we choose.

3) As players, we are entitled to return to the game and play it again if we so choose at a later date.

That is the full extent of player entitlement in MMOs. True Story.

SENSE of entitlement by some players =/= actual player entitlement to play an MMO.

This concludes a surface exploration of reality vs fantasy in the context of players playing MMOs.
Forum disputatio ------> est completum ineptias.

MSchuyler's Avatar


MSchuyler
08.27.2013 , 12:55 PM | #14
Your whole post begs the question of whether Bioware wants you to keep playing. I'm not sure they do. Players go through their own cycles. Just to keep it simple, a player starts out as a newbie who does not understand the game. The amount of newbieness varies, of course, depending on whether the player is completely new to mmorpgs or just new to this game.

After playing awhile a player becomes an experienced player, a journeyman who knows how to play the game, has explored a goodly percentage of it, and has reached so-called "end-game" with one or more characters. In the third stage a player gains expertise. He is VERY good at the game and begins exploring the nuances. This is when a player discovers that certain classes are "out of balance" or that +20% XP is actually +18.5% XP because of a basic math mistake. And of you allowed a shorter cool down for Death from Above that would counter the advanced AOE attack of a Sith Marauder, which is otherwise unfair. And, BTW, if you changed the skill tree of a hybrid BH, then this would provide a 1% bonus rate for blah.

In short, you become a pain in the butt. You are so skilled that you have narrowed your focus to minutiae that, if the developers actually paid attention to you, would effectively ruin the game because they would be paying attention to these non-essential items no one cares about instead of the experience of the journeyman level players, the vast majority of whom don't really care about these issues. Nobody cares how many angels fit on the head of a pin. They care about a new planet.

But you complain about it loudly and vociferously as if your louder voice entitles you (there's that word again) to a greater say in how the game ought to change and be run. In short, you think pretty highly of your expertise and can't understand why the developers don't hang on your every pronouncement, and perhaps wash your feet at the same time. In acting this way you have essentially priced yourself out of the market.

I think this situation comes about because of a misunderstanding of the phrase, "The Customer is always right." This has been used to browbeat and harass providers of products for centuries. The amount of abuse taken by just retailers alone is legendary, but it is a misperception. The phrase means, "The Customer knows what he wants to buy" so if you don't have it, he will go elsewhere.

And I think that's okay. A lot of SWTOR fans don't seem to understand where they are in the SWTOR Life Cycle. They seem to feel that they are going to be around forever and when they retire, forever more. They don't seem to realize what comes after "end game" is something else that is "not here." To think that the Expert Level player can be satisfied with this game for years to come is completely unrealistic. The developers need to realize this as well and not get sucked into interminable arguments on the number of angels on the head of a pin. They are prone to do this, too, because they are, after all, experts in how this game works.

What the developers SHOULD do (imho) is think of the player base as a moving target of people cycling through the stages where there are always newbies entering and always the experts who have reached end of game leaving. The concentration ought to be on making sure people make this trip from newbie to journeyman find the trip enjoyable.

In other words, it's okay to quit.

ImpactHound's Avatar


ImpactHound
08.27.2013 , 12:56 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
1) As players, we are entitled to play the game under the game producers conditions, features, rules, and commercial requirements for as long as we choose to do so and are not banned from the game.

2) As players, we are free to choose not to play the game at any time, for any reason, for as long as we choose.

3) As players, we are entitled to return to the game and play it again if we so choose at a later date.

That is the full extent of player entitlement in MMOs. True Story.

SENSE of entitlement by some players =/= actual player entitlement to play an MMO.

This concludes a surface exploration of reality vs fantasy in the context of players playing MMOs.
Stop trying to be a master linguist and have the last word. "Entitlement" has a dictionary definition and anything beyond that is posturing and pointless wordsmithing that distracts from real issues, like the state of Assassins. Posting your personal idea of "entitlement" is a major perception problem.

CosmicKat's Avatar


CosmicKat
08.27.2013 , 12:59 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by DOHboy View Post
Yes 8 unique "single player" stories, and two classes per story, along with 3 different trees per class as well as 3 different "options per story" (light/dark/neutral) make this a true single player game that is played once and never picked up again.
That's the marketing spin version.

The reality though is slightly different.

- There's 1 single railroad track per faction in TOR. It starts with 2 spur lines (force user, non-force user) that converge at planet #2 and stay linked till the end. 90+% of all stations (missions) on that line are identical, no matter which of the 4 classes per faction you are.

- Gameplay for all classes is near identical. It's ultra-easy godmode for all. Which tree you pick is going to make near zero difference in any solo PvE. Whatever you sacrifice, you have a companion to make up the slack.

- There are no racial differences. All races are identical to each other in all respects except cosmetics.

- Light/dark/neutral choices make no difference to anything except dialog options and emails from NPC's with a coupon for a buck off a Space Big Mac.

DOHboy's Avatar


DOHboy
08.27.2013 , 01:00 PM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by ImpactHound View Post
. It's fair to judge the game on one complete playthrough.
See thats where things tend to fall apart. You get a sense of the game maybe as far as leveling, overall feel. But to say it was one and done is to leave alot of the content undefined. Playing as a Counselor (arguably one of the least involved stories) and NEVER playing either a JK or Operative (some of the Best stories) is not sufficient to say you can call it a one and done.

I too played DA:O just about every class with different endings and romances. And there was some commonality, but each time it still felt fairly unique enough to keep things fresh.

If you never play any of the other classes you are missing out on the very best parts of the game. The Stories.

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
08.27.2013 , 01:01 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by ImpactHound View Post
Stop trying to be a master linguist and have the last word. "Entitlement" has a dictionary definition and anything beyond that is posturing and pointless wordsmithing that distracts from real issues, like the state of Assassins. Posting your personal idea of "entitlement" is a major perception problem.
REread my post, in the context of an MMO... not Websters.

You are confusing "entitlement" with "sense of entitlement". I do not know if that is deliberate on your part or not. But there is a difference between what you are entitled to in playing an MMO and what your "sense of entitlement" is. They are different. You have consumer and commercial rights to the first, you have no rights to the second.. only feelings. The feelings are yours.. and they carry no commercial or consumer rights.
Forum disputatio ------> est completum ineptias.

Benfynyn's Avatar


Benfynyn
08.27.2013 , 01:07 PM | #19
There's Entitlement, Sense of Entitlement, and False Sense of Entitlement. Nothing wrong with the first two.
Quote: Originally Posted by JovethGonzalez View Post

After some investigation, it appears that there was some miscommunication between teams and this patch note was not intended to be included in this last patch.

MillionsKNives's Avatar


MillionsKNives
08.27.2013 , 01:08 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by MSchuyler View Post
snip
If they are not to listen to the skilled players then why do they create content for them? What's the point of NiM, which is supposed to require mastery of your class, if the problems that it exposes are not to be fixed, because the average player doesn't care?