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Other Classes Getting "DPS" Cooldowns

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Other Classes Getting "DPS" Cooldowns

Keleus's Avatar


Keleus
06.04.2013 , 01:18 PM | #1
Stupid question, really truly utterly stupid, but one that should be asked anyway, especially since I've noticed that Sentinels get a lovely little cooldown that increases their damage, and thought "I wonder why the other classes that are regulated to one form of damage, if any others, don't get that?".

That said, what are the other classes that get a sort of cool down that quickly but potently increases DPS/Damage done, and why the hell do the other classes not have that, especially if it can be used to aid their tanking and/or or healing ability as well.

Don't flame, this is mostly my dumb *** being curious.
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Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
06.04.2013 , 03:41 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by Keleus View Post
That said, what are the other classes that get a sort of cool down that quickly but potently increases DPS/Damage done
Sages have Mental Alacrity (20% increase alacrity for 10 seconds), Shadows get Battle Readiness (doubles stance proc damage/healing and increases proc chance by 35%), both Consular ACs get Force Potency (50% increased crit chance with Force powers until you get 2 crits), Vanguards get Battle Focus (25% increased crit chance for 15 seconds), Gunslingers get Smuggler's Luck (100% crit chance on next Charged Burst) and Illegal Mods (30% increased accuracy and 15% arpen for 10 seconds), and Scoundrels get Pugnacity (15% alacrity for 15 seconds).

There are also a number of abilities that provide a burst of resource generation that indirectly increases damage/DPS by allowing you to burn through more resources in the same period of time (Combat Focus for Guardians, both Smuggler ACs get Cool Head, both Troopers get Reserve Powercell for a free cast and Recharge Cells).

Everyone gets *something* that allows them to do some burst damage, whether it's by directly buffing their damage/rate of attack or by allowing them to burn through/generate resources faster.
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Keleus's Avatar


Keleus
06.04.2013 , 08:01 PM | #3
I know about Combat Focus, but in comparison to everything you just listed, that sounds weak as hell, especially since you can build up Focus so damn fast as a Vigil Specced Guardian it's ridiculous. But yea, last I remember Sentinels get Inspiration but that goes for the whole group, and well, Guardians get crap lol.

But thanks for the reply.
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Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
06.05.2013 , 02:36 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by Keleus View Post
I know about Combat Focus, but in comparison to everything you just listed, that sounds weak as hell, especially since you can build up Focus so damn fast as a Vigil Specced Guardian it's ridiculous.
What you're not considering is that Combat Focus allows you to replace 2 uses of Strike with Slash (or any other Focus burner you have available) or allows you to use Focus burners before you would otherwise be able to according to your normal resource generation model. Rather than averaging it out, Combat Focus lets you frontload and burn all of your consumers without having to generate as much in between.

Quote:
But yea, last I remember Sentinels get Inspiration but that goes for the whole group, and well, Guardians get crap lol.
Inspiration is less impressive than you might think: it's on a 5 minute CD and prevents the Sentinel from gaining Centering stacks for the duration. 15% damage for 15 seconds every 300 seconds amounts to all of .75% increased damage over time (so your 2500 DPS gets pushed up to all of 2518.75 with the use of Inspiration). While solo, a Sentinel is probably better off not using Inspiration at all and just using Zen. In a group, it's only really useful for burst DPS or burn scenarios, especially since it only affects the local group, not the entire ops group, so the DPS increase will be minor, at best (less than 100 DPS for the entire raid, which is going to be less than the variation attributable to proper rotation and lag).

Of course, if you're discussing Inspiration (which is better described as a raid utility than a short term personal DPS increase like the abilities I mentioned), it would be appropriate to bring up the whole "armor debuff" aspect that Guardians bring. Yes, it's brought by other classes/specs as well, but that single debuff contributes a *helluva lot more* than Inspiration will (~6-8% more DPS for everyone). Inspiration is less "DPS cooldown" than it is raid utility in the form of increased burst DPS for a portion of the ops group that ends up doing next to nothing over the long term.
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Korse's Avatar


Korse
06.10.2013 , 03:52 PM | #5
The higher level concept to which you're referring is class imbalance. Some classes get multiple dps cooldowns while others really don't. The distribution of personal and group cooldowns (damage, survivability, or resource generation) has been an ongoing debate since release and appears as though it will never get fixed.

I would avoid listening to anyone that quotes you numbers outside of what the actual skill says it does. To think that Bloodthirst/Inspiration is a minimal dps gain means that person isn't using it correctly. To give a flat % increase based on armor debuff isn't entirely accurate as it depends on the build and skills being used per class as some abilities ignore armor anyway. The number of classes that have armor debuffs relative to evenly distributed group and personal cooldowns isn't a fair comparison. I've tried to participate in a number of threads about giving all classes some type of raid utility, but those threads usually receive substantial negative feedback from the classes that have all of the raid utility because they think any conversations are about nerfing them.

As a Juggernaut/Guardian, all of your cooldowns are based on the assumption that you're tanking, which is poor class design. The community as a whole doesn't really care because the currently accepted solution is that you can roll a Marauder or Sniper.
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Korse
06.10.2013 , 03:56 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Kitru View Post
What you're not considering is that Combat Focus allows you to replace 2 uses of Strike with Slash (or any other Focus burner you have available) or allows you to use Focus burners before you would otherwise be able to according to your normal resource generation model. Rather than averaging it out, Combat Focus lets you frontload and burn all of your consumers without having to generate as much in between.
Whoa, whoa, whoa...two uses of Slash instead of Strike? Talk about overpowered. How is the entire community not in an uproar about all that ridiculous damage.
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Kitru
06.10.2013 , 04:00 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Korse View Post
Whoa, whoa, whoa...two uses of Slash instead of Strike? Talk about overpowered. How is the entire community not in an uproar about all that ridiculous damage.
Once every minute, that's not too bad. Of course, as you indicated, it's not a huge boost either. I never said it was a *huge* increase to DPS/damage, but it *is* an improvement of a kind.
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GeckoOBac
06.10.2013 , 07:09 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Kitru View Post
Once every minute, that's not too bad. Of course, as you indicated, it's not a huge boost either. I never said it was a *huge* increase to DPS/damage, but it *is* an improvement of a kind.
Also, in most cases, the offensive cooldowns aren't "huge" increases in dps either. Say, the autocrit on snipe for a sniper, or the additional 30% armor penetration... They are all small boosts. Probably the single biggest boost is inspiration if coordinated with the group to align all offensive cooldowns there, but as you said it's raid utility more than a proper offensive cooldown.
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Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
06.10.2013 , 07:34 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by GeckoOBac View Post
Probably the single biggest boost is inspiration if coordinated with the group to align all offensive cooldowns there, but as you said it's raid utility more than a proper offensive cooldown.
My vote would actually go to Battle Focus: 25% crit rate for 15 seconds every 120 seconds is a surprisingly large amount. Depending on your interpretation of it (whether you think it's a standard use ability or a CD), Zen could easily be considered for that position. Inspiration is hampered by the 5 minute CD (and inability to generate Centering stacks for the duration), which really hurts it in my opinion.
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GeckoOBac
06.11.2013 , 04:21 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Kitru View Post
My vote would actually go to Battle Focus: 25% crit rate for 15 seconds every 120 seconds is a surprisingly large amount. Depending on your interpretation of it (whether you think it's a standard use ability or a CD), Zen could easily be considered for that position. Inspiration is hampered by the 5 minute CD (and inability to generate Centering stacks for the duration), which really hurts it in my opinion.
I'd say Zen is much closer to a normal rotational skill.
Battle Focus is indeed impressive, but It's only one person, and as offensive cd it probably is one of the best if not the best.

Inspiration is a bit different. Sure, the CD is long, but it used properly as a raid tool, you can really push dps there, with preparation. After all it's a % bonus over damage, and it will be on top of whatever other cooldowns/adrenals/relics the other people are using, plus whatever burn techniques they have available.
The specific bonus inspiration may give depends largely on the raiders, as preparation for the burst phase will make inspiration itself much more worth it.

It would be interesting to see though if it's worth using "on cd" (though ofc with said preparation) or to keep it for just burn phases (where burst dps is more important than the sustained dps of the whole fight). But due to it being strictly tied to teamwork (and working off each class's burst potential), I don't think this is something easy to model.
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