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ETIQUETTE - a guide to group behaviour and etiquette in flashpoints and OPs

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Flashpoints, Operations, and Heroic Missions
ETIQUETTE - a guide to group behaviour and etiquette in flashpoints and OPs

Elear's Avatar


Elear
03.18.2013 , 09:35 AM | #11
You missed most imporant piece of whole issue - if you have problem with something someone else is doing - say it, and be open for discussion.

While what you've wrote here is more or less fine and true, it's not one and only rule to be obeyed by everyone. It's only things you personally have problem with. Each person has his own opinion, and some are more willing than other to see reason. For example, you might not like someone breaking CC with AoE, but maybe your group really can deal without CC just fine. Speak, discuss, and if neither of you can accept opinion of other one, best let rest of group decide or change group.

abokado's Avatar


abokado
03.18.2013 , 09:43 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Kaos_KidSWTOR View Post
Ok im completely going to say DONT, Shield the Melee DPS next to the boss. Heres the reasoning.

1. Healers build a crap ton of threat. I think thats cut and dry enough.
No, they don't. They generate the least threat. The only reason that you are being attacked by mobs is because neither the tank nor the dds attacked said mob so the only threat he gets it that little amount generated by your heals.
So even when you get guard NOTHING is gonna change. Sure, you generate even less threat, but you are still going to get attacked either way. Because the problem is not you generating so much threat is that on one is picking up the mob. Guard isn't going to change that. Which is why in most cases guard on a heal is pretty useless, especially if the dds know what they are supposed to do. Whereas yes it can happen that a dd pulls off the tank and if he is unlucky the tank's taunt is on CD and can't do anything about it so the dd needs to tank for a few secs which is much more work for you because dds can't take much.
It's really just in your best interest not to have guard in most cases.

Hylentor's Avatar


Hylentor
03.18.2013 , 10:48 AM | #13
Also a 50 merc, and I'd rather have the marauder guarded, given a choice. If everyone is doing their job, the healer shouldn't be picking up much aggro.

I've actually been yelled at for NOT releasing... even though I know full well that me running back in would reset the boss (Athiss, anyone?) *sign* can't win...

The only things I would add is to the occasional ToaMs you get (Tank on a Mission)... I get that you want to get through the FP as fast as possible, and that we really have enough gear to not worry about cc's... But make sure your healer is following you to the next group and not still using his OOC heal to bleed heat off from having to max it... The 2nd thing (for ALL classes) is your OOC heal... use it, love it - why should your poor healer deplete reserves to top you guys off just to either have to stand and use it himself anyway, or have you guys go on before they're ready...?

ChicagoBearsFan's Avatar


ChicagoBearsFan
03.18.2013 , 11:06 AM | #14
What Abokado said. Guard the best MDPS or RDPS if no melee. Throwing guard on the healer is the surest sign that you are a noob tank or don't really understand how agro and guard works in PVE. Healers draw agro from mobs with an empty agro table, not the ones being beat on. Guard (by reducing threat) will not help healers as they are the only one on the agro table of the mobs attacking them. The 5% damage reduction is trivial and the 50% damage redirect to the tank works only in PVP. Just guard the DPS so they are not pulling mobs off the tank. A good tank will be sure to tag or AOE each of the mobs that are not CCed so the healer stays safe.

On more point to mention on etiquette, is it really necessary to quote the OPs when it is a mile long? Just quote the recant parts and not 20 paragraphs. (ya I know, it's supposed to be etiquette about FPs and not the forums but it needed to be said )
Bearsfan - Commando Healer / DPS
Chicago - Shadow Tank
BeÓrs - Scoundrel Healer
<The Jedi of Camelot>JawaSpanker Legacy ~ POT5 Server

LarryRow's Avatar


LarryRow
03.19.2013 , 07:41 AM | #15
How the heck can you write an etiquette guide about the LFG without mentioning spacebar and trash/boss skipping?

Spacebar and skipping trash are the norm for all hard modes. If you are not spacebarring in a hard mode, that is your right, but you're being a jerk. In my view it is impolite to insist on spacebar or skipping in a story mode.
A classic sig that should not be lost:
Quote:
Stunned , pew pew hack slash , stunned , running backward circles, stunned cannot move, pew pew, break stun, 30 second snare, wha?!?!!? stunned, knockdown, ...less stun more pew pew and hacknslash please.

Dezsa's Avatar


Dezsa
03.19.2013 , 07:44 AM | #16
This post is one of the best and most productive GUIDE i have read about this subject. And its obvious purpose is to make flashpoints etc work better and be more enjoyable for everyone involved. I think that is and should be the highest priority for all players playing a multiplayer online game.

Soxbadger's Avatar


Soxbadger
03.19.2013 , 01:26 PM | #17
Great read, the few things I can add are this. (From a sorc point of view)

1) Dont guard me as a healer, unless you whisper me and ask me if I think that the dps are not handling aggro properly. Most encounters I can handle my aggro easily. If 1 mob is on me I can either wipe threat or I can cc it. If multiple mobs are on me, that just means something is not working properly because the order of shield/hot and then waiting for aggro to build before using 2nd hot, should give plenty of time for aggro. If it hasnt, that means either a mob wasnt spotted or people are just doing things wrong. Healers almost never actually pull aggro, there are some mobs that have random attacks not based on threat, but generally a healer will not out threat dps/tanks.

2) If you are a dps and you pull a mob off me, you will be the first dps healed every time. Why? Because I can heal 3 people as long as I am clean, as soon as mobs are banging on me, then Im being stunned, my rolls are being messed up and Im having to heal myself, to then try and heal others.

3) Try and burn weakest to strongest. The more mobs that are dead, the less damage, the less healing.

4) Pay attention to CC. Use CC. Understand CC. A lot of nonsense battles can be easily won if you just CC 1 or 2 guys to start.

Totaltrash's Avatar


Totaltrash
03.19.2013 , 01:32 PM | #18
OP - great post, great advice and a nice effort!

However, it would have been more appropriate for any given MMO 10 years ago.
SWTOR doesn't have a community and the modern MMO player does not care about etiquette, just him/herself.

Margoth's Avatar


Margoth
03.19.2013 , 02:56 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by NimazDK View Post
Ninja looting***
These are the guys i hate more than anything in the world of gaming!!
my god it pisses me off when some smuggler needs on a saber or even worse, people needing on items for their
class, when they are allready wearing same item, or better. /RAGE!!!!
personally i instantly vote people who ninja loot.
It gives everyone a bad experience of the game..it gives the game ITSELF a bad rep!
"so how is that SWTOR game?" - - "it stinks!!! people ninja loot like maniacs, dont play it"
thats not good for anyone. Quit ninja looting!!
I'll generally speaking agree with most of what you said. However, I have no problem with me or anyone else needing on a modable item that has mods they can use for their class.

For example, chest piece drops with L40 mods I can use. I already have L40 mods in my chest piece. But I have L32 mods in my legs. No reason to not need on the chest piece, rip the mods out and upgrade the legs. On my alts I grab modable social armor as early as I can for my toons and then just upgrade the mods. To me a chest piece, a leg, a head piece etc are all the same. They are a source of mods.

The rest of what you said I'll agree with for the most part. Especially the part about letting tanks get aggro.

I could also quibble about healers just healing. Especially when I'm leveling up a healer alt, I'm generally able to keep the tank and the party healed, while still doing more than my fair share of the DPS. But that's because I try to keep my gear up to date (see comment about mods above).

Some other comments to add to your guide:
1. Aforementioned comment about spacebar and skipping conversations.
2. Wear level appropriate gear. Nothing ticks me off more than people being in FPs with gear way too far below level. If you're in a L50 HM FP with L23 green relics you shouldn't be there. If you're L35 and you have no relic or L12 greed implants you need to update your gear. It's not fair to your fellow players to expect them to just carry you through.
3. Addendum to "Do your role". The Group Finder has a mechanic in it where if your AC can Heal/Tank/DPS and there is no Heal/Tank/DPS it will assign you to Heal/Tank/DPS even if you don't select that role. So check your role before you accept. If you are not willing to do that role don't accept. If you do accept do that role. If you popped queue as a DPS then DPS don't decide you are heal spec and the game made a mistake so you are just going to heal anyway.
4. Respect your other players. Don't go AFK for 20 minutes. Don't trash talk them.

taxidermis's Avatar


taxidermis
03.19.2013 , 03:23 PM | #20
Great post OP. would be great if everyone saw this lol.
As a Swtor player for the last 10 months, I have had the privelidge of meeting many great folks, and some that weren't so great. A few things I would add.

1. As a tank, guard whoever u want before first pull. After first couple of pulls, switch it to whoever generates the most threat. Also. Watch your healers health bar. U have other threat generators than your taunts. On my 50 assassin tank, I open trash pulls with overload. ((only if it won't break cc)). Then single taunt the strongest mob, wait 5 sec, area taunt. If fight lasts longer, I re-use overload, single taunt, shock ((this generates a ton of threat)), and force pull for distant mobs that like to shoot at healer. ((also, force speed isn't just for speeding up, it's great for grabbing that pesky healer killer when pull is on cd)). Other tank classes can all keep aggro as well, it's just about knowing your class.

2. As dps, DONT break cc or try to tank. Let tank build aggro, then go in. If you are gaining aggro, please use your threat drop, your healer will love you. Sent/Mara are the worst for aggro stealing. On my 50 Mara, if my health drops below 50%, I pop force camo, it drops threat instantly, and is great, but I only see a few plp use it. And if your group is struggling,, all near death, and the healer is burning heals as fast as possible on tank, and u die, but tank wins the fight,, for heavens sake don't cuss out the healer, he just saved the group from wiping by keeping tank alive. This is the main reason that the ignore list on my 50 commando healer is so big, and why a lot of healers/tanks only run with friends and guilds. Dont blame the tank/healer for a wipe that a dps caused by stealing aggro from tank, ignoring cc and healer health bar, refusing to use aggro dump, and wasting time screaming for a heal when you should have been dps-ing your heart out.
If the healer is any good, he will throw a heal your way, once ((and only after)) the tank and himself are safe.

3.